what is the best "paint" program to work with maps? (in windows)

[numskully]

any info would be great.

thanks

[Edi]

Gimp.

http://www.gimp.org/~tml/gimp/win32/

[numskully]

thanks!

[Gandalf Parker]

There is no best, there is only pros and cons.

You didnt say which windows. The paint program that comes with winsows might be enough for you but you would need a converter to/from the TGA format. Such as IRFANview.
http://www.irfanview.com

PhotoShop is a good program but it costs money.

GIMP (GNU Image Manipulation Program) is free, runs on Windows Linux and MAC, and its what Illwinter uses. In fact its fast becoming the program of choice for programmers in general (O'Reilly has a book on it. In my world that fact alone tells me alot). The drawbacks is that its a monster truck of a paint program. Its not the easiest one to learn. There are web sites of tutorials, and books on the subject. People LEARN Gimp like they learn a programming language.
http://www.gimp.org/

[Edi]

I suppose I should have said best FREE paint program for Windows, given everything that can be done with GIMP, but it's rather daunting at first.

Edi

[Mortifer]

Haha. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
I own Adobe Photoshop and Corel 11 as well. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally posted by Mortifer:
Haha.
I own Adobe Photoshop and Corel 11 as well. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Oh sorry about that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
Gandalf Parker

[Arralen]

I know Neopaint since the DOS Version, and it has allways been very simple and intuitive to use:

http://www.neosoftware.com/npw.html

30 days testing, 60$ with CD, 50$ "electronic delivery"

I am using The GIMP now ...

A.

[ November 28, 2003, 14:43: Message edited by: Arralen ]

[Gandalf Parker]

Does NeoPaint do targa files? And I guess some sort of tool for "painting with a clipart" or able to use captured brushes (to make it easy to place mountains and trees)

Im wondering what kindof features would be useful to doing Dominins maps. Rather than buy a program it would seem that a free converter for TGA files would be all thats needed.

Im looking more in the area of random map generators. There are many out there which do amazing results but I havent found one yet that I like.

[ November 28, 2003, 15:00: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

[Arralen]

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Does NeoPaint do targa files?<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Supported File Types:

BMP- Windows Bitmap
CAR - NeoBook Cartoon
CUR - Windows Cursor
GIF - CompuServe (supports both transparent and animated formats)
ICO - Windows Icon
JPG - JPEG/JFIF
NPM - NeoPaint Mask
PAL - Palette File
PCT - Macintosh PICT
PCX - ZSoft/PC Paintbrush
PNG - Portable Network Graphics
PSD - PhotoShop 3
RAS -Sun Raster
ST - NeoPaint Stamp (DOS format)
STW - NeoPaint Stamp (Windows format)
TIFF - Tagged Image Format
TGA - Targa

And I guess some sort of tool for "painting with a clipart" or able to use captured brushes (to make it easy to place mountains and trees)<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Stamp Pad: Quickly assemble pictures using collections of clip art and stamp images. Create, edit, rename and delete stamps. Stamp images may even be used as custom multi-colored brushes.

... Rather than buy a program it would seem that a free converter for TGA files would be all thats needed. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">IRFANWVIEW http://www.irfanview.com/ was already mentioned ..
AFIAK it's even scriptable ... .


A.

[ywl]

Originally posted by Edi:
Gimp.

http://www.gimp.org/~tml/gimp/win32/ <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Most of the program requires you to pay, especially Photoshop. If you're need a program just for hobbist purpose, it may be better to just use Gimp. Powerful and cheap (free of charge).

Downloading and installation could be a hassle. It's simple on Linux though I've never used the Windows Version. But unless a program comes in the OS, buying and installing it need a little bit work anyway http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif .

[PhilD]

Originally posted by ywl:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Edi:
Gimp.

http://www.gimp.org/~tml/gimp/win32/ <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Most of the program requires you to pay, especially Photoshop. If you're need a program just for hobbist purpose, it may be better to just use Gimp. Powerful and cheap (free of charge).

Downloading and installation could be a hassle. It's simple on Linux though I've never used the Windows Version. But unless a program comes in the OS, buying and installing it need a little bit work anyway http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif . </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hmm - Last time I installed a Linux distrib, it came with the Gimp already installed. I'd say, if you installed Linux in the past 2-3 years, it's probably included - especially if you clicked on the "OK, install everything and don't bother me anymore" button sometime.

Of course, installing Linux, in itself, requires a little bit of work (and, mostly, worrying whether it will work correctly in the end). But now that most of my gaming time is being spent on Dominions, I only ever boot up Windows when I want to sync my PDA http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

[ywl]

Originally posted by PhilD:
Hmm - Last time I installed a Linux distrib, it came with the Gimp already installed. I'd say, if you installed Linux in the past 2-3 years, it's probably included - especially if you clicked on the "OK, install everything and don't bother me anymore" button sometime.

Of course, installing Linux, in itself, requires a little bit of work (and, mostly, worrying whether it will work correctly in the end). But now that most of my gaming time is being spent on Dominions, I only ever boot up Windows when I want to sync my PDA http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif [/QB]<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Sorry. Extremely off-topic: ranting of a Linux-geek http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif .

The Linux Version of Gimp is of course easy to install http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif . I just didn't know anything about the Windows Version of Gimp.

Installing Linux is not hard for me neither, I've been doing it in the Last year on more than 10 machines http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif . In the era of Redhat 5.1 (two years ago), things were more difficult and you always had to prepare for problems. But now it's so easy that I often can't even believe when it's done (20 minutes for a fresh install of Mandrake!).

Ha! For PDA, I used Agenda, which even run its own Linux distribution. I don't even need to boot into Windows to sync http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif . Top this http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif !

But to give Microsoft some credits, Windows installation is in general easier (though much slower). But I've never install Windows on unsupported machine, so, it's not a totally fair comparison.

[numskully]

gimp is a very nice program, thanks all.

in the script area there are 2 random map generators, good ones in fact.

thanks again all!

[Johan K]

Which scripts do you use to generate random maps?

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally posted by Johan K:
Which scripts do you use to generate random maps? <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Actually there are 3 of them. I thought you used them as a base. They look pretty close. Sorry but I didnt notice this post and started another thread that was gimp specific. I mention the scripts there.

[ December 04, 2003, 17:09: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

[Johan K]

Thank you!

I wonder how I have managed to never notice those all this time. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally posted by Johan K:
Thank you!

I wonder how I have managed to never notice those all this time. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Im looking forward to what we will get now that you know. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Now if we could just get someone to write a script-fu to do an overlay layer with province lines.

[Gandalf Parker]

A very interesting generating program Ive found called Fractal Terrains. Check out this little "quick start" file. I especially liked the "skull world" and what that implies for importing images to seed off of.
http://www.profantasy.com/library/files/demo/FTQuickstart.pdf
Im checking out the demo now. Not sure if I will buy it.

EDIT: Interesting but I think not worth the price. Very easy to use to get interesting maps. Easy to create, and save settings, for colors and land patterns which work well. But I think I will shift attention back to the GIMP scripts

[ December 06, 2003, 13:18: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

[Pymont]

For random terrain generation, try Wilbur. It was made by the same people who did Fractal Terrains. It's probably not as sophisticated as Fractal Terrains, but it's free.

Get it at:
http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/~jslayton/software.html