Sea conquest

[chtronk]

How is it possible to conquer sea provinces without playing R'lyeh or Atlantis ??

[Arryn]

Water mages can bring troops underwater with them. There are also magic items that allow commanders to bring troops underwater. Do a forum SEARCH on "water breathing" for more info ...

[chtronk]

Originally posted by Arryn:
Water mages can bring troops underwater with them. There are also magic items that allow commanders to bring troops underwater. Do a forum SEARCH on "water breathing" for more info ... <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Ok thanks.
R'lyeh and Atlantis seem to be very powerful : they can attack everywhere without being threatened.

[Tricon]

Most undead are amphibious (although poor ones), and water breathing magic items are quite numerous. As are water creature summoning spells (sea trolls , anyone?). R'lyeh and Atlantis are strong nations, no doubt, but they have no "safe haven" in their own realm - especially in MP. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ March 10, 2004, 15:03: Message edited by: Tricon ]

[chtronk]

Is it possible to win against R'lyeh or Atlantis, without playing Ermor, and without using water magic ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

[Master Shake]

Another way to get access to water provinces is my conquering a land province with Ichthyids. If you see an indy province with these units, you will be able to recruit them when you conquer the province. Also, there are Shambler recruiting sites on land provinces as well.

Rlyeh is tough because of the Illithid mind bLasts. However, mass fodder can overcome these units. Remember, Illithids cost 5.5 times as much as a basic infantry unit.

[PDF]

Originally posted by Master Shake:
Another way to get access to water provinces is my conquering a land province with Ichthyids. If you see an indy province with these units, you will be able to recruit them when you conquer the province. Also, there are Shambler recruiting sites on land provinces as well.

Rlyeh is tough because of the Illithid mind bLasts. However, mass fodder can overcome these units. Remember, Illithids cost 5.5 times as much as a basic infantry unit. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Shamblers (Shambler Reef site, level 0)require you get yourself an amphib commander. OTOH they are however quite stronger than Ichtyids.

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally posted by chtronk:
Is it possible to win against R'lyeh or Atlantis, without playing Ermor, and without using water magic ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Its harder but it can be done if done carefully. Most nations can get some undead. You dont have to be Ermor. There are shoreline land provinces which can make units able to do both land and water. There are also watery mercs you can hire.

Once you get a water-province then you can build water units. You can make a lab and do water summons. But its hard because you cant build water defense or fortresses.

You can also build an anti-Rlyeh or ant-Atlantis Version of your nation if you know that you are going up against them in a multiplayer game. Jotunheim with "Water Cult" theme for example, or having a combat pretender who can enter the water so you can get an early foothold

[Taqwus]

Imprint Souls also works, and actually -- between mercenaries, amazons, magic-site-mages, the probability's pretty good you can get a water mage if you try.

[Chazar]

Not that I've ever really fought against an underwater nation so far without ichtyds and watermages...

...would it not be a resonable strategy to simply push an underwater nation of the shore into the depth whence they came from, keeping them there, and building temples all along the shore in order to wipe them out by dominion?

I know that it seems hard to win by dominion rather than by military force on land, but I think it might be much different with underwater nations:
Underwater provinces tend to be big, but less numerous. But the size of a province does not affect the spread of dominion itself! So it is much easier to cover the ocean with your dominion than all the dry land.
(Am I right here or does it depend on the population? I do not recall that population was mentioned in Ceremony's document on that topic...)

In addition, the ratio between water provinces where your enemy may built temples compared to the neighboring coastal provinces where you can built temples is also in your favor!


But I guess this is merely a theological question http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif , since I would assume that the game is already over if you can manage to wipe out all the fishes on the dry lands...

[ March 10, 2004, 16:43: Message edited by: Chazar ]