MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog

[archaeolept]

hi y'all

since i didn't manage to make it into the Last game i started, here's another one.

Settings: Indies 9, sites 55, Inland map HOF 15, renaming enabled. Looking for 12 players.

Hosting interval: will start out at 25 hours quickhost. at turn 30 i'll change it to two days QH. if that's too short come the late game, I could increase that to 3 days.

Rules: No Caelum or Ermor except broken empire. No watchtowers or mausoleums.

Victory Conditions: there should be 75 VP, so the first to 35 wins. as a consequence of capitals being worth VP, they will show up as crowns on the map.

Due to the lack of water on this map, taking Atlantis would be a very bad idea.

Never having played Mictlan in MP, i'd like to give them a try. If someone else has there heart set on the micts, I could be presumed upon to change. Mind you, I don't know how the feeble micts can expand against lvl 9 indies http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[ July 31, 2004, 03:10: Message edited by: Zen ]

[Agrajag]

Hmmmm...
I'd really like to participate in a multiplayer game, but being a newb...
Im not sure if thats such a great idea for me...
I guess I can either fill in an unfillable slot for you or just provide comic relief in-game :/
I just HAD to respond, so Im sorry if you consider this post a waste of time...

[archaeolept]

no that's cool. having some newbs in game is always fine. that's the way to learn.

[Cainehill]

Hmmm. I think I'll claim ... the Jotuns. Been a while since I played them.

[The_Tauren13]

im in as mictlan

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by archaeolept:
no that's cool. having some newbs in game is always fine. that's the way to learn. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">If thats the case I think I'll give Pan a chance.
Im not sure exactly why, I don't have much expirience with them, but I like them almost as much as I like AE ermor =P (not as much play with them though).
Do you think I could take the Carrion Woods theme (not sure if I want to, but I might =P)

[archaeolept]

tauren, I had already claimed mictlan before you posted (I had originally thought of vanheim, but the micts are funny). If you really want mictlan though, i can change to vanheim.

edit: ehh, i'll just take vanheim then http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

agrajag: sure, CW is fine if you want

[ July 30, 2004, 17:42: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[The_Tauren13]

actually your origional post had still said vanheim when i posted, but its ok cuz im out, so you can be mictlan

[archaeolept]

nah, must have been keeping the thread unrefreshed. but really, that's cool. I'm as interested in vanheim as mictlan, so no probs if you want it.

[Ozymandias]

Actually, if you are still desiring Mictlan I would like Vanheim. If you are firm on Vanheim I could play Man if there was a slot for me.

[archaeolept]

oh lol now i'm getting confused http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

here's what i suggest: tauren mict, me van, ozy man

if tauren doesn't want in, me mict, ozy van


all up to tauren http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Ozymandias]

Sounds fair.

[The Panther]

Hey, if there is room for yet another newbie, I would like to take a shot in this game. I do not care about myrace in the slightest so I will take whatever is left over. Not water, though, as there is not much water on this map.

I note that Norfleet went and took Ermor already without posting in here. Is Broken Empire more balanced than either of the other two destructive themes ? Those other two seem heavily unbalanced to me. But then again, I am a newbie, currently playing on turn 6 in my first attempt at MP.

[archaeolept]

ermor is pretty strong, but broken empire is basically just a fairly normal nation. I'm not sure what's up w/ Norfleet - he uploaded a pretender before I had finished figuring out the game or starting the thread. I wouldn't say the two undead themes for ermor are terribly unblanced, but i'm a bit tired of them.

anyways, you're welcome to join. just pick a nation.

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by The Panther:
Hey, if there is room for yet another newbie, I would like to take a shot in this game. I do not care about myrace in the slightest so I will take whatever is left over. Not water, though, as there is not much water on this map.

I note that Norfleet went and took Ermor already without posting in here. Is Broken Empire more balanced than either of the other two destructive themes ? Those other two seem heavily unbalanced to me. But then again, I am a newbie, currently playing on turn 6 in my first attempt at MP. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">As far as my newb knowledge goes, AE and SG are pretty powerful, BUT certain anti-undead strategies cut through undead like a hot knife through butter, certain spells can destroy an entire undead army in one cast (provided you cast them before Protection of The Sepulcher kicks in, and even then...).
I'd say AE and SG are most unbalanced and overpowered against the AI...
But thats just me...
...

[Truper]

I'm in. I'll take Pythium.

[archaeolept]

Ozy: just so we get this a bit clear, since others are joining, I'll leave mict open (for tauren or whomever), play vanheim (i'd go w/ Man, but i'm playing them in my other game) and you get Man (which sounds like you're fine with).

so, currently:

Me: vanheim
Cainehill: Jotunheim
Agrajag: pangaia
Ozymandias: Man
Truper: Pythium
djtool: t'ien chi

Norfleet: ermor, but this could change as he claimed the slot before the rules were listed

Tauren: wanted mictlan, but w/drew, so mictlan is currently open.

[ July 30, 2004, 18:17: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[Ozymandias]

What I've seen of BE Ermor their Principes are just as stout as Pythium's. Plus they have Body Ethereal pre-researched and only modestly priced Thaumaturgs, so early expansion ought to be pretty cheap. Aside from their excelent nether dart ability though, they are lacking in later magical potence. I may be underestimating the might of death and astral though.

[djtool]

i'll give tien chi a shot.

[KroolDeath]

I'm going to take a spot, let me peek at what's left and I'll post it here (tonight).

Indie 9's, eh? wow

Krool

[ July 30, 2004, 18:23: Message edited by: KroolDeath ]

[Boron]

may i participate as pan cw ?
would be nice to see if my ideas in my humble attempt for my pan cw guide prove working in mp http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
indep 9 will help me http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Boron]

oh someone already claimed pangenea http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

because you excluded ermor anyways i think the rule would apply for pan cw anyways right ?

pan cw is basically ermor with vq ^^

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by Boron:
oh someone already claimed pangenea http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

because you excluded ermor anyways i think the rule would apply for pan cw anyways right ?

pan cw is basically ermor with vq ^^ <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">If you'll give me some good advice for another nation (good advice as in, good tips + good nation) I'll switch with you =P

[The Panther]

Just a note on Taruen. He withdrew because I expressed an interest in this game. But we have only one CD key between us, so we can both play only as hot seat, I believe. Which would be a pain since we can't each play on our own computers.

I am currently in my first MP game and Tauren is currently in two. That was why he was relinquishing his spot to me.

But I am trying to get a second game (that I am in) going again. If that is the case, and the people in this game think it would not be fair for my son and I to both be playing in a game, then I will give the slot back to The Tauren.

By the way, we are both total newbies to MP.

[Boron]

Originally posted by Agrajag:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Boron:
oh someone already claimed pangenea http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

because you excluded ermor anyways i think the rule would apply for pan cw anyways right ?

pan cw is basically ermor with vq ^^ <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">If you'll give me some good advice for another nation (good advice as in, good tips + good nation) I'll switch with you =P </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">lol thnx http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

guess archaeolept simply forgot to exclude pan cw though http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

archaeolept could you please clarify these rules :
- pan cw allowed or not ?
- research setting : normal or something different ?

so i would like to try abysia if research is not higher than normal http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
because the settings are very interesting http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by Boron:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Agrajag:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Boron:
oh someone already claimed pangenea http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

because you excluded ermor anyways i think the rule would apply for pan cw anyways right ?

pan cw is basically ermor with vq ^^ <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">If you'll give me some good advice for another nation (good advice as in, good tips + good nation) I'll switch with you =P </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">lol thnx http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

guess archaeolept simply forgot to exclude pan cw though http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

archaeolept could you please clarify these rules :
- pan cw allowed or not ?
- research setting : normal or something different ?

so i would like to try abysia if research is not higher than normal http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
because the settings are very interesting http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Quote from page #1 "agrajag: sure, CW is fine if you want"
In response to me asking if CW is a valid theme for Pan.
Do you still want to use abysia?
Because Im getting more and more attached to Pan as time passes by and I realize that even though Im not that good with them, I will suck a lot worse with other nations.

[archaeolept]

research is normal, so I'll put you down for abysia.

pan CW I allowed, but partly because i forgot to disallow it, and partly because it was a neophyte player who wished to use it. I'd rather CW only be played by a newb, so to speak.

Panther: that makes sense. It doesn't bother me if both you and your son are in the game, though.

currently:

Me: vanheim

Cainehill: Jotunheim
Agrajag: pangaia
Ozymandias: Man
Truper: Pythium
djtool: t'ien chi
Boron: abysia

Norfleet: ermor, but this could change as he claimed the slot before the rules were listed

Tauren: wanted mictlan, but w/drew, so mictlan is currently open.


that's 7 slots taken, not including tauren, so 5 more left, or so.


edit update: norfleet is no longer in, so BE ermor is open. however, to kick him i need to kick all anonymous slots, so djtool if you could please claim your slot on the mosehansen page :_

https://www.mosehansen.dk/cgi-bin/dom2.pl?page=BrowseGamePage&game=hard_slog

double edit: took care of it

[ July 30, 2004, 18:58: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[Agrajag]

Well, I officialy claimed the Pan spot in the server.
I hope I'll do nicely, surviving past the 10th turn would be nice =P (as far as the rules of diplomacy go, being the noob means that I won't have much control over provinces and no alliance will rise up against me, whoopie! ...)
I wonder how my pretender will do =P
He's a bit bizzarely built =P

[Boron]

Originally posted by Agrajag:
Well, I officialy claimed the Pan spot in the server.
I hope I'll do nicely, surviving past the 10th turn would be nice =P (as far as the rules of diplomacy go, being the noob means that I won't have much control over provinces and no alliance will rise up against me, whoopie! ...)
I wonder how my pretender will do =P
He's a bit bizzarely built =P <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">hehe curious if you took pan cw .
if so don't read my humble attempt for a pan cw newbie/advanced guide http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[The_Tauren13]

ok well i guess i will take mictlan

[The Panther]

I will take Arco then.

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by Boron:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Agrajag:
Well, I officialy claimed the Pan spot in the server.
I hope I'll do nicely, surviving past the 10th turn would be nice =P (as far as the rules of diplomacy go, being the noob means that I won't have much control over provinces and no alliance will rise up against me, whoopie! ...)
I wonder how my pretender will do =P
He's a bit bizzarely built =P <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">hehe curious if you took pan cw .
if so don't read my humble attempt for a pan cw newbie/advanced guide http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Wouldn't it be more fun if you'd have to wait 'till the game started to see?
Anyway, I can assure you that wether I took CW or not, Im going to use a strategy of my own, it might or might not be similar to yours in case I did choose CW.
Im just pulling your strings.

BTW, just a little something about myself as a player diplomacy wise - I don't backstab anyone no matter what.
I don't cheat/lie/betray/fool/decieve or any kind of those dishonest "activities".
And I expect everyone to behave the same way (though Im too realistice to think that other players will live to my expectations).
You could say "I don't play the diplomatic game"

[Aku]

May I take Marignon please?

I am a semi newbie also. This will be my third game with one of them in the turn mid 30s while the other one is with panther and we are on turn 7 or something. I never played marignon before but want to give it a shot.

Aku

[Klatu]

I am a newbie also, may I play Ulm? Klatu

[The Panther]

Originally posted by Agrajag:

BTW, just a little something about myself as a player diplomacy wise - I don't backstab anyone no matter what.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This reminds me of my roommate named Craig back in college. In our first game of Risk, Craig made a deal with someone (whom I can no longer remember). Some time later, that other person broke the alliance unannounced. Craig then made a quick temporary alliance with every other person in the game and proceeded to shuffle every army he had to the front with the truce-breaker. He then crashed everything he had in a glorius battle against the guy. Both my roommate and the truce-breaker were quickly eliminated from the game, needless to say.

And then, it got even worse. The very next game, Craig did the same thing to the truce-breaker. Craig attacked the guy exclusively until they were both gone yet again. Afterwards, Craig asked if he learned his lesson. The truce-breaker agreed that he surely did. In fact, we all did. No one ever broke a truce with Craig after that. We got good at it, for you could make a temporary truce, saying for example, we will not attack each other until X occurs or Y turns. Or give a three turn notice to ending the truce. All this was perfectly acceptable to Craig, as long as you were true to your word.

Anyway, it is amazing that I still remember that Risk game from so long ago but it sure stuck with me through the years.


The Panther

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by The Panther:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Agrajag:

BTW, just a little something about myself as a player diplomacy wise - I don't backstab anyone no matter what.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This reminds me of my roommate named Craig back in college. In our first game of Risk, Craig made a deal with someone (whom I can no longer remember). Some time later, that other person broke the alliance unannounced. Craig then made a quick temporary alliance with every other person in the game and proceeded to shuffle every army he had to the front with the truce-breaker. He then crashed everything he had in a glorius battle against the guy. Both my roommate and the truce-breaker were quickly eliminated from the game, needless to say.

And then, it got even worse. The very next game, Craig did the same thing to the truce-breaker. Craig attacked the guy exclusively until they were both gone yet again. Afterwards, Craig asked if he learned his lesson. The truce-breaker agreed that he surely did. In fact, we all did. No one ever broke a truce with Craig after that. We got good at it, for you could make a temporary truce, saying for example, we will not attack each other until X occurs or Y turns. Or give a three turn notice to ending the truce. All this was perfectly acceptable to Craig, as long as you were true to your word.

Anyway, it is amazing that I still remember that Risk game from so long ago but it sure stuck with me through the years.


The Panther </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You'd be amazed at what you can remember over the years.
I still regret thrashing my cool police car toy back when I was ~ 3-5 (you usually don't remember how old you are in those cases =P).
Basically, I wouldn't go to the extent of thrashing the other guy in the second game, but I would go through a lot of trouble to revenge a truce-breaker.

[archaeolept]

currently:

Me: vanheim

Cainehill: Jotunheim
Agrajag: pangaia
Ozymandias: Man
Truper: Pythium
djtool: t'ien chi
Boron: abysia
Tauren: mictlan
Panther: arcos
aku: marignon
klatu: ulm

still another slot or two open

remember guys, this is w/ indy-9, which is pretty crazy sometimes. pls expect to have your main army crushed and your pretender stomped sometime fairly early in the game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[ July 30, 2004, 20:51: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[KroolDeath]

I'll take C'Tis.

Krool

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by archaeolept:
currently:
remember guys, this is w/ indy-9, which is pretty crazy sometimes. pls expect to have your main army crushed and your pretender stomped sometime fairly early in the game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Well, hopefuly I'll have atleast one province :\
Anyway, Im just reminding you guys Im on GMT+2.
So how does that work for hosting times etc. ?
Its 00:08 here now BTW...

[Cohen]

What's still open?
Ryleh and Machaka?

[ July 30, 2004, 21:20: Message edited by: Cohen ]

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by Cohen:
What's still open?
Ryleh and Machaka? <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">BE Ermor as well... :\
EDIT: this is assuming that archaeolept wouldnt mind going over the 12 player limit he thought of originaly (Im not sure how rigid that limit is, so you might still have a chance =P

[ July 30, 2004, 21:34: Message edited by: Agrajag ]

[Cohen]

Well I'll see to try Ryleh.

[ July 30, 2004, 21:54: Message edited by: Cohen ]

[archaeolept]

we currently have 12, but could probably squeeze in another one.

agrajag: its 25 hour quickhost, which means that whenever the Last person turns in his move, it will automatically host, and then host again 25 hrs later unless everyone gets in their moves prior to that. It is very easy and functional - even if you're the Last guy to get in a move you'll have 25 hrs to get in the next one.

that said, its nice to try to push a good pace in the easy early part of the game.

[Cohen]

Is the 300 gold underwater castle forbidden too?

[Boron]

Originally posted by archaeolept:

Rules: No Caelum or Ermor except broken empire. No watchtowers or mausoleums. .
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">ooops i almost overlooked that . was pretty content with my pretender just 7 points left and castle watchtower LOL .

luckily i have some points to spare in scales as abysia http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Boron]

Originally posted by Cohen:
Is the 300 gold underwater castle forbidden too? <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yeah because above sea it is a watchtower and has the same stats .
would be betrayal than .

if this is allowed i see no reason why i may not take watchtower too .
so i vote for forbid that 300 gold castle .

[archaeolept]

no 300 gold castles except wizard's tower

game is now full. figure out your pretenders, upload them, and claim your slot on the mosehansen page. I'll start the game probably tomorrow afternoon, as long as people have gotten their pretenders in.

[odd_enuf]

I took absia, didn't see it claimed when i did it, there were only 3 players on it then.

[Boron]

Originally posted by odd_enuf:
I took absia, didn't see it claimed when i did it, there were only 3 players on it then. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">so what to do now ?
i claimed it most likely before you here in the thread and that matters .
can't you take any other nation ?
i really would like to be in that game with abysia .
and according to first come first serve abysia belongs rightfully to me too .

i looked on mosehansen too and only 2 pretenders were uploaded so i thought just register here and take your time designing the pretender .
most likely almost at the same time i registered here you loaded up your pretender on mosehansen .

i have only 2 games running so far on mosehansen + 3 months holidays and the settings of these game i really like .
so lets let archaeolept decide .
i myself have really strong motivation though to be in this game because of the above mentioned arguments .
so it would be fair if you don't want to be in that game as passionate as me to let me play abysia .
and i think i was a bit earlier than you too .

[ July 30, 2004, 23:15: Message edited by: Boron ]

[KroolDeath]

If it will make matters easier, and someone is interested, I will give up my position of C'tis so both Boron and odd_enuf can play. Thats assuming someone wants C'tis.

Otherwise, I'm uploading my Pretender tonight (because I am interested in playing as well but as a newb, there will plenty of other opportunities and I can afford to give up a slot).

Krool

[archaeolept]

no. boron had already claimed abysia, and i had posted that the game was full. odd_enuf, pls set your pretender on the mose page to anonymous (check the "that's not me" box and submit) so that i can delete it.

its not a good system to let positions be taken out of the thread. the page on mosehansen specifically says to come here to register. pretenders need not be uploaded until tomorrow.

krool_death, we are one over, so if you don't want to play that's ok, but otherwise stay in.

[ July 31, 2004, 00:11: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[archaeolept]

double post

[ July 31, 2004, 00:10: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[Boron]

thnx archaeolept
and thnx odd_enuf for setting it on anonymous .

i guess i was only 5-10 minutes earlier claiming abysia than you odd_enuf .
perhaps you even uploaded your pretender while i registered here first .
it is 2.45 am here i will be Online 15 more minutes if abysia isn't deleted then i will upload my pretender tomorrow morning . so in about 11-12 hours .


abysia was one of my first nations i tried and they are one of my 3 most liked races so far http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
at the moment i have some insane ideas and am tensed how they turn out http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif .
further interesting will be if the no watchtower turns out as a slight handicap or as a blessing http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[archaeolept]

thank you odd_enuf for goin anonymous.

kicked his pretender so you can upload at your leisure boron.

[Boron]

my sweet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif belkelel is up http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

lets see how i do so far i am content .
if i am still content with my pretenderddesign tomorrow morning this is a good sign http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[archaeolept]

Tauren, are you registered on mosehansen as "bite_me", because that's who seems to have the slot?

[Aku]

ok my pretender for Marignon is up

[Cainehill]

Originally posted by archaeolept:
no 300 gold castles except wizard's tower

game is now full. figure out your pretenders, upload them, and claim your slot on the mosehansen page. I'll start the game probably tomorrow afternoon, as long as people have gotten their pretenders in. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'll have my pretender in sometime before tomorrow afternoonish, depending on what time zone. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Still working on my setup, since I haven't played Jotuns in ages.

(And 65 turns with luck 3 gave me a whopping one national hero, while I'm trying to find out who other than the goblin and the huge hag can show up.)

[Norfleet]

Originally posted by Cainehill:
(And 65 turns with luck 3 gave me a whopping one national hero, while I'm trying to find out who other than the goblin and the huge hag can show up.) <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I think that's it. Those are your two Jotun heroes. The goblin is less than impressive, but Angerboda is one of the best heroes out there.

[Sheap]

I think Sporsnjall exists only to balance out Angerboda by reducing the likelihood that she will show up. He's got to be just about the most useless hero out there.

[Agrajag]

I RE-Uploaded my pretender because the Last one was a bit... bizzarely built.
Im still not to happy with my design...
And I still wonder wether just taking the slot again after designing the pretender is enough for it to be replaced :/

[Boron]

Originally posted by Cainehill:

(And 65 turns with luck 3 gave me a whopping one national hero, while I'm trying to find out who other than the goblin and the huge hag can show up.) <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">according to unitattributes.xls that 2 are jotuns only special heros .

hopefully you don't take niefelheim they are so scary . guess i would have taken jotun if i would have been fast enough myself in this game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
with my abysia i have a very simple minded strat now i am tensed how it turns out http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by Agrajag:
I RE-Uploaded my pretender because the Last one was a bit... bizzarely built.
Im still not to happy with my design...
And I still wonder wether just taking the slot again after designing the pretender is enough for it to be replaced :/ <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Bleh, after a bit of expirimentation with SP I realized that the concept of my pretender was (yet again) bad, I think Im on to a winning pretender now though, I'll create a new one (yet again) and upload it (yet again) in a couple of minutes.
Just for common knowledge...
Oh, and I got stung by a jelly fish (a very little sting, but it BURNS), just some more common knowledge... :\

[archaeolept]

And I still wonder wether just taking the slot again after designing the pretender is enough for it to be replaced :/ <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'm not sure. did the MD5 checksum change?

to be safe, if you disown the slot (go anonymous) I could kick you, and then you could re-upload.

also, Panther or Tauren, could you tell me whether "Bite_Me" who is occupying the Mictlan slot is Tauren or not?

edit: i see from another game that Tauren is most likely the same person as bite_me. ok, then.

[ July 31, 2004, 15:16: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[The_Tauren13]

Originally posted by archaeolept:
Tauren, are you registered on mosehansen as "bite_me", because that's who seems to have the slot? <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yes

guess i should have regestered in mosehansen with the same sn to avoid confusion, but at the time i made it i didnt know the shrapnel forums were so closely tied in with mose hansen's server

[ July 31, 2004, 16:55: Message edited by: The_Tauren13 ]

[Cainehill]

Okay, I'm in, and I think I'm the Last (12 players).

May the best giant, er, person win!

[archaeolept]

ok i'll wait a few hours to see if agrajag wants to reupload his pretender, and then i'll upload mine, and start it - probably around 6 pm EST

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by archaeolept:
ok i'll wait a few hours to see if agrajag wants to reupload his pretender, and then i'll upload mine, and start it - probably around 6 pm EST <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Im pretty sure the md5 # changed, and I'd rather not go through all the mess of going anonymous and being kicked and the likes.
I'll also have to recreate the pretender all over again since I used the Pangaea slot for some testing =P.
WCS (Worst Case Scenario) I get stuck with a not-so-good-unless-I-put-a-lot-of-effort-into-it pretender.
I guess it doesnt matter much since I'll be gone pretty quickly http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
Though the old (and not so good) pretender has advantages over the Last (and slightly better) pretender.
I guess time will tell!
And 6PM EST is, iirc, 2AM here =P
EDIT: just posting and edit, just in case, I'll be sure to upload my latest pretender by 2AM EST in case I decide to change him (yet again).
EDIT II : Did anyone here check my Email (probably at mosehanson) and add me to his MSN messenger?
If not I have someone to "ban" :/

[ July 31, 2004, 19:49: Message edited by: Agrajag ]

[archaeolept]

ok, the game's afoot

[ July 31, 2004, 22:31: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[archaeolept]

Victory Conditions update:

basically, it turns out that I had a different understanding of how VP worked than did the mosehansen server
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

as such, there are 33 crowns (i believe). technically, victory according to the server rules is now set at getting 40 of those http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

so, when it gets down to it, the contenders will have to keep track, since it is the first person to get a majority (ie. 17) of these crowns who will win.

[ August 01, 2004, 01:18: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[Ozymandias]

Cainehill just connected to mosehansen, so turn three ought to be right on the way.

[Aku]

turn 6 is now up

[Agrajag]

Just for common knowledge:
My suckier pretender is the one that is in the game, oh well!

[archaeolept]

ahh, so mosen did manage to get it to work that way. shoulda kicked you first http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by archaeolept:
ahh, so mosen did manage to get it to work that way. shoulda kicked you first http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Pfft!
Nothing to it...
I got a sucky pretender...
A sucky starting point...
Bad luck...
Noobness...

Doesn't matter, as atleast I'll get some MP gaming expirience =P
BTW, I see some people here are real brutes, you got 3+ provinces already? =O

[Aku]

I just noticed score graphs were on myself and I was like omg people are rampaging already. Looks like a bunch of us are going to have very short lives lmfao.

[Agrajag]

I hate it when a stealthy commander leading stealthy troops won't attack the province Im telling it to go to even thuogh another commander is attacking it >_<
Major troop loss >_<
>_<
Should have remembered that crap >_<

[Cainehill]

Originally posted by Aku:
I just noticed score graphs were on myself and I was like omg people are rampaging already. Looks like a bunch of us are going to have very short lives lmfao. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Console yourself with the thought that those people are the ones who don't have a long range strategy, so they have to rampage early. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[archaeolept]

heh, i'm rampaging because every single province near me is a piece of crap, like 12 gp/turn type crap http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Truper]

I, on the other hand, am scared of just about everything around me.

[KroolDeath]

Truper...I know the feeling.

Krool

[Aku]

I am in the same boat with you as well truper.

[Boron]

hm i got a serious dominionstrengths loss but have no idea what that could be .

is there a GE arco in it with a atheist or how the special unit is called which reduces faith ?


i am surrounded by barbarians not so nice when there are 80 of them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[Agrajag]

Originally posted by Truper:
I, on the other hand, am scared of just about everything around me. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I managed to overcome that fear, only to be smashed to bits by an army twice its "Information" size and with half my dumb army, hoorah!
Maybe in a few turns I'll manage to take it :\

[The Panther]

Originally posted by Truper:
I, on the other hand, am scared of just about everything around me. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">So true. There are so many powerful neutrals around me that it is hard to do anything. My god already has an affliction. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

This game seems to be yet another indication that the VQ is grossly overpowered and must be nerfed (or eliminated) in the next patch. Look at Vanheim taking level 9 provinces with a single god and no army. He is now also taking additional provinces with his real army (getting two in the Last turn).

This just does not seem right to me. No god should ever be able to take a level 5 or above neutral province without troops, for it messes up the basic structure of the game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[Cainehill]

Originally posted by The Panther:
This game seems to be yet another indication that the VQ is grossly overpowered and must be nerfed (or eliminated) in the next patch. Look at Vanheim taking level 9 provinces with a single god and no army. He is now also taking additional provinces with his real army (getting two in the Last turn).

This just does not seem right to me. No god should ever be able to take a level 5 or above neutral province without troops, for it messes up the basic structure of the game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Excuse me? "No god should ever be able to take a level 5 or above neutral province by itself"? Almost any but the combat-useless human rainbows can take independent-6 or higher provinces all by themselves. Some require more magic research than others, or a magic item or two, and it may require some cherry picking of provinces, but it's easily doable.

I guess maybe I'm not playing the same Dominions 2 you're playing? The only major thing wrong with the VQ is that immortality is overpowered because of free recuperation. It'd also be nice if the VQ had a fire susceptibility to balance its strengths (and also because it's thematic - crosses, stakes, sunlight, fire, holy water - traditional banes of vampires).

Marignon with a Phoenix can take indies 6 or higher right out the gate - sure, it dies a few times, no biggie.

Pangaea's Carrion Dragon - alteration 2 or 3, enchantment 1, rips through independents 6 and higher, barring knights and some mage types.

PoD : With heavy armor and a shield, ditto; easily doable for Ulm, some Vanheim themes, etc.

In fact : Vanheim might easily be doing this with their VQ : Full Black Plate, 18 armor etherealness, by turn ... 5?

Great Wyrm, Cyclops, Shedu, Niefel Giant, Ghost King - there's a whole list of pretenders capable of soloing independents at 6 or above.

If you want to slam the VQ as still being overpowered, please come up with some more compelling reasoning and logic.

(And I'm not even a VQ fan.)

[KroolDeath]

If you want to see real Pretender problems right out of the gate, go look at mine in the Hall of Fame. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I'm C'Tis.

Krool

[archaeolept]

This game seems to be yet another indication that the VQ is grossly overpowered and must be nerfed (or eliminated) in the next patch. Look at Vanheim taking level 9 provinces with a single god and no army <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">huh? my VQ has taken two provinces - since all the provinces around me are crap, its not too difficult. This Last turn she took out 55 light infantry and militia. anything can do that. I think perhaps you just haven't seen many SC's at work yet.

Frankly, I'm not that impressed w/ her potential as my dominion hasn't bothered to spread much at all. A VQ is definitely a contender though, and since I had refused to play her before the nerf, I thought I'd give her a go again. Any reasonable SC could have been taking bunches of 40-50 infantry, militia, and archers w/out breaking a sweat. The only major thing wrong with the VQ is that immortality is overpowered because of free recuperation. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yeah, that's my take on it too. its not very germaine to the present situation though, since my VQ has had to attack non-dominion provinces http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Vanheim might easily be doing this with their VQ : Full Black Plate, 18 armor etherealness, by turn ... 5?
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yeah, i'm vanheim, so black plate is a go http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

For instance, Panther, for 150 pts less than i spent on the VQ you could have had a Nataraja w/ A4 W3 E3, which is a true indy smashing monster (w/ Alt-3 and Ench-1), especially as it gets healed by Arcos' priestess.

[ August 04, 2004, 17:56: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[The Panther]

Yeah, one should keep their mouth closed and have people suspect you as a fool instead of opening it and proving it like I did. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Obviously, I am a rank newbie. But what I actually said is that no pretender OUGHT to be able to kill level 5s and above striaght out of the box. The VQ is just one of many such problems against this obviously wistful notion.

When I first started playing SP in this game, one of the best features I found was that you had to get lots of varied commanders and troops to do anything useful. It was as far removed from Heroes of Might and Magic as it could be. The HMM series was all about creating the ultimate power hero. Dominions was a pleasant change from that.

But then I get on line and discover that Dom2 is all about getting the ultimate SC. The fact that ANY super commander can take the highest level of indy all alone without breaking a sweat is simply a sign of this problem. Level 20 indys? Level 30? Level 100??? How high would it need to go to stop this from happening?

I should talk, for my god is actually #1 in the HOF. But I am too ignorant and/or chicken to send him in alone. So I have been losing troops taking the powerful indys. And will continue to do so, for I am surrounded by knights and heavy calvary and dark vines other such toughies.

I suspect the truth of the matter is that I do not know all that much about the deep secrets in this game. And it obviously has a steep learning curve, as do ALL complicated games.

But it sure is fun and addicting! The fact that I have about a 0.01% chance of winning this game does not bother me in the slightest. It will be an enjoyable experience and I will go down fighting to the bitter end.

[Truper]

Keep in mind that we are talking pretender *gods* here. So the idea that they ought not to be able to smack down a bunch of poor joes with swords and spears just doesn't fly.

And on the subject of the VQ, yeah, she works great, but these days she's expensive. You've really got to accept some compromises in terms of scales, castle and dominion strength in order to build a real vq monster. As it should be.

[Sheap]

Panther:

I think you should take heart. While gods and other supercombatants are extremely good at busting independents, the game isn't really about fighting the independents. Once you get later in the game and start fighting the other players, who have powerful summons and/or magic in battle, the lone supercombatant stops working quite so well. You still use them, obviously, but only as a component of your overall strategy.

Cainehill:

Removing recuperation from immortality would just nerf all the other immortals. But since the VQ has built in regeneration it would hardly hurt her at all.

[Boron]

Originally posted by Sheap:
Panther:

I think you should take heart. While gods and other supercombatants are extremely good at busting independents, the game isn't really about fighting the independents. Once you get later in the game and start fighting the other players, who have powerful summons and/or magic in battle, the lone supercombatant stops working quite so well. You still use them, obviously, but only as a component of your overall strategy.

Cainehill:

Removing recuperation from immortality would just nerf all the other immortals. But since the VQ has built in regeneration it would hardly hurt her at all. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yep totally true .
sc pretenders excel at indy killing but later in the game they are only a part of your strat .
dominions is very different from heros of might and magic because you have so many options .
and in homm a hero only dies when all his troops are wiped out while a pretender god can be killed or get afflictions http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

indies 9 are tough i had to fight 90 barbarians Last turn they got through my mistform + mirror image the suckers hehe *G
i had 10 hp left then they routed so i almost lost my pretender against them but was lucky http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Cainehill]

Originally posted by Sheap:
Removing recuperation from immortality would just nerf all the other immortals. But since the VQ has built in regeneration it would hardly hurt her at all. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Removing, or rather modifying, the recuperation from immortality would put some limitations on the others, yes. But still - what I proposed is that immortals heal all wounds when coming back from the dead via immortality. The immortal simply needs to die to heal those wounds.

Also - all the _OTHER_ pretenders live without recuperation (with the exceptions of the bulls, carrion dragon, etc). The immortals can surely live without it also.

And I disagree about the VQ hardly being effected because of her regeneration - she has tiny HPs, _and_ is in melee quite often, meaning a lot of opportunity for wounds. Many if not all of the other immortals tend to be artillery, not getting hit that often as a result, so not getting as many opportunities for wounds.

[Cainehill]

Originally posted by The Panther:
Obviously, I am a rank newbie. But what I actually said is that no pretender OUGHT to be able to kill level 5s and above striaght out of the box. The VQ is just one of many such problems against this obviously wistful notion.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You could always go down Cohen's path and insist on playing games with very difficult magic research, limitting pretender choices to human or immobile pretenders, and other complicated rules intended to make the game play the way you want it to, instead of the way the game designers designed it to be played.

But, bad news : even human pretenders, and immobiles, can take independent provinces all by their lonesome before turn 20. The immobile can teleport in and clean house.

The human can either hurl enough magical artillery to devastate medium sized armies, or have enough death magic to simply summon skeletons upon skeletons upon skeletons until the enemy is wiped out.

And not infrequently, the immobile or human pretender dies trying to do so.

*shrug* Instead of crying out to nerf the VQ, or to nerf all SC pretenders, try figuring out how to use your own pretender and national troops to their fullest.

I've got the second highest number of provinces in this game - and my pretender only this Last turn budged from the capital, so it obviously wasn't my pretender.

You can use scales to your advantage - either giving your armies a boost, or enabling a mighty pretender, or facilitating potent blessings. You can use even puny mercenaries to allow your national armies to take provinces they would otherwise suffer great losses attacking, or you can come up with clever items to put on your national commanders that let them tip the balance of battle in their favor.

Or, you can always design and implement a game that does as you wish. But frankly, a game without the mighty magics and potent godlings probably wouldn't appeal to nearly as wide an audience.

Lastly : Write to Illwinter and ask them to put in some switches that put limits on the game - limitting research to level 2, 3, 4, etc, that force all people to use a human or an immobile pretender, etc. Fairly simple for them to do, albeit not very much fun either, but you can always ask.

[Boron]

**** why do i have so low dominion everywhere ?
grmml

[archaeolept]

hah. my dominion is lower than anyones! I'm actually losing provinces that were mine to a mictlan dominion push http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[The_Tauren13]

gotta love blood sacrifices...

[Boron]

Originally posted by archaeolept:
hah. my dominion is lower than anyones! I'm actually losing provinces that were mine to a mictlan dominion push http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">so lets all attack the evil mictlan http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

or at least i and archaeolept die because we have no friendly dominion left http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[Ozymandias]

Turn eighteen is up.

[Agrajag]

The next turn will be up soon, I figure (22 hours to go, but only 2-3 nations didn't take their turn).
But thats not why I posted this post, I just wanted to say the to my surprise Im really having fun, I expected to be brutally masacred, or atleast to be the absolutely worst player, but it seems Im still in the game and not the weakest nation (though Im not strong either &gt;_&lt;).
Thats it...
And check out my cool 2nd mod! =P

[Aku]

new turn is up!!!

[Aku]

turn 26 is up!!!

also our thread is really quiet

anyone have any interesting battles yet?

[Agrajag]

turn 26 is up!!!

also our thread is really quiet

anyone have any interesting battles yet?


1. Did you notice we joined at the exact same time?
I was the one who did the final turn and when I reconnected for my next turn I saw you were connected!
2. No interesting battles, but I heard someone else had one (Can't reveal my contacts http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif )

[Aku]

Well I was checking the server like every 5-10 minutes lmfao waiting for the turn to host. I had an interesting battle. It was one of those two armies collide accidently by both attacking the same province. It let me try out how my army worked out against a player army and not a independent one. First time playing Marignon and I am trying a certain strategy I never used before.

[Agrajag]

Well I was checking the server like every 5-10 minutes lmfao waiting for the turn to host. I had an interesting battle. It was one of those two armies collide accidently by both attacking the same province. It let me try out how my army worked out against a player army and not a independent one. First time playing Marignon and I am trying a certain strategy I never used before.


Lol, Im sorry I kept you waiting for so long, I just had a none-hostile takeover on my computer (which also caused me a stale turn earlier).
My sister's stupid boss &gt;_&lt;
Back to buisness - can you elaborate on that battle or is it confidential?
Im off to sleep now *yawn*

[Aku]

Well I am going to keep the battle information confidential. All I am going to say is that I like the results of my army.

[Boron]

agrajarg is in hard slog too right ?
i would vote to turn him ai because he published his password so please turn him quick ai before anybody logs in and sends all of agrajargs gems / gold / items to himself http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[Aku]

he is pangaea

i vote to turn him AI

[archaeolept]

sorry? what's this about his password? and why turn him AI? he hasn't staled except once

i must be missing something here.

If someone were to steal his gems it would be pretty easy to discover http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I've played 100 turn games w/out a password and not had anyone steal my gems or money. I would hope that all our players are honest. If they're not, eventually they'll be found out and drummed out of the community like Norfleet was, and all their "victories" will be shown to have been hollow.

[Aku]

he publicly posted his passwords to all his games in another thread because he cant play anymore because of internet problems

[Ozymandias]

That explains why he seems likely to stale in ten minutes.

[Cainehill]

In response to the in-game message - I'd be happy to see it go to 48QH now.

[archaeolept]

yah i'm thinking of putting it to 48 hrs

could someone pls link me to the thread where he did said he was having problems?

I may have to have him set to AI

[Aku]

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=287443&amp;page=0&amp;view=collap sed&amp;sb=5&amp;o=&amp;fpart=1

[archaeolept]

hmmm yah he should probably be set to AI. I'll wait till he's the Last player, and then I will have someone set him to AI, and check to make sure he wasn't pillaged Last turn http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[The Panther]

I prefer to keep it at 24 hours.

[Cainehill]

The Panther said:
I prefer to keep it at 24 hours.



Keep in mind that the very first post describing the game and its hosting said :


Hosting interval: will start out at 25 hours quickhost. at turn 30 i'll change it to two days QH. if that's too short come the late game, I could increase that to 3 days.



The game was supposed to go to 48QH already.

[archaeolept]

yah, the question isn't about whether this game will go over to 48 hr QH, but when; ie. whether to do it now, or wait a few more turns. Caine seems to really want it to go to 48 hrs, so I probably will do that then.

[Truper]

Probably a symptom of Too Many Games Syndrome. It can happen to anyone. You've been warned.

[Cainehill]

Oops - I think you should've waited to change to 48 QH until the _beginning_ of a turn; looks like it wipes / wiped out all the orders that had already been in, so people will need to take them again.

On the bright side - I think they can just connect to the game, select "Continue where I left" and have their orders uploaded intact. They might want to do something - rename a commander or whatnot - just to make sure their client knows there are changes to upload.

[archaeolept]

what?

that's messed up, but it looks like you are right. I didn't actually think it was going to apply till next turn.

oh well, sorry folks. everyone just has to connect and the turn they worked on will be re-uploaded.

archaeolept

oh, and just because we're going to 49 hr QH doesn't mean we can't do a move a day for as long as we can. I expect we shouldn't slow down that much. and as soon as everyone has put in this turn, I'll have Pan set to AI or forcehost.

Remember kids: just re-connect ;-)

[Aku]

So what is going on about agrajag(pangaea) or do we have to wait 38 more hours until it force hosts?

[archaeolept]

no, we have to wait for Boron, Ozymandias, and djtool to reconnect to the server, so that their turns are re-uploaded. For some reason, changing the hosting period reset the turn. so we're waiting on them, and then I'll either force hosts or set agrajag AI.

I've sent them all PM's, in case they check the board but not the thread.

[Aku]

thank you arch

[The_Tauren13]

ok so ive been sitting under siege in my capitol with nothing but a blind cyclops ever since wicked vanheim wiped me off the charts in 3 turns flat. anyone want to rescue me? or kill me... either way.

[archaeolept]

ok, now just waiting on ozymandias to connect and re-upload.

heh, and tauren, I was trying to end your suffering, but I've gotten enough suffering of my own to deal w/ ;-)

[archaeolept]

ehh ozymandias still missing in action. as soon as he ever shows, i can force a new turn.

[archaeolept]

ok this is very perplexing, and somewhat irritating.

The game is about to host. during the 49 hours since the hosting schedule was changed, Man (ozymandias) has completely dissappeared. He hasn't even checked his turn, or else his turn would have been re-uploaded. If he's had any problem, he certainly hasn't notified anyone or checked this thread.

Basically, it looks like he will stale, and whatever move he originally submitted is lost. However, given the amount of time, he would have staled one, perhaps two, turns anyways.

I'm in a very difficult war w/ him, which will become much less exciting w/out him around to prosecute it. He certainly seemed sure of himself and his situation and not disheartened about the way the war was going.

if anyone has a way to contact him please do so.

thanks

[The_Tauren13]

i have his AIM sn, and ive sent him some chit-chat Messages during the past couple days, but he hasnt responded

[Aku]

did he make it in time or did he stale?

[archaeolept]

no he staled http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

even though its been 2 1/2 days since he Last submitted a move. hopefully just some temporary event has interfered w/ his playing. I changed one order in my moves that would have led to a large scale battle, since likely he would have moved his army out of that province instead of having me wipe it out. sent my pretender into my backlines instead to retake an indy.

If he hasn't shown up by the end of this turn, I'll find some capable forum veteran to temp sub the turn, and properly prosecute his war w/ me.

Tauren, please continue to try to contact him and find out what's up. Hell, if he can't play for some reason, you could sub him http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

as to pan, since man was staling I haven't had him set to AI, but I will have him by the end of this turn.

[archaeolept]

omg Ozymandias got in his turn. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I've set pangaia to AI.

Edit: [censored]. supposedly there's a known bug where if you set someone to AI using the master password, you can recieve a "CD key violation". I now need to have esben delete my .2h files, and I got a forced stale turn http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[The_Tauren13]

well at least that will level the playing field then with ozzy's stales... hehe

[archaeolept]

yah, but he only got one stale as well. and at least he deserved one http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

this bug, otoh, is a real pisser. in fact, i can't submit another move until Esben deletes the .2h files.

[The_Tauren13]

yeah that does suck... does this happen every time you set someone to AI? i could see why, because you log into their turn and and then yours, and since you have the same CD key as yourself, the game thinks that suddenly the player you set to AI has the same copy of the game as you do, thus violating the CD key policy. interesting.

[archaeolept]

yah, i think that's how it works. rather defeats the usefulness of having a master password. Lost my indy mercs too, which I actually rather needed.

[archaeolept]

Tauren has agreed to take over djtool's T'ien Chi, which is great. and i doubt the loss of mictlan to AI will change much http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Ozy did stale a turn, but the latest is in. hopefully this is just a temporary difficulty.

[Ozymandias]

I'm sorry about my stales, I've been moving and haven't had regular access to the internet. I only started two games on purpose, because I understand they can become time intensive towards the end game, but real life does intervene. It seems that you have cruelly punished me for my stales too. C'est la guerre. I just won't have to pay upkeep for those armies anymore. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Anyway if there is someone who could step into my spot (hopefully just temporarily) that might help in my struggle with you. Otherwise I'll soldier on as best I can.

[archaeolept]

well, you've only had two stales, as opposed to one for me, and the first of them I avoided trying to wipe out your army.

the second time however I wasn't so sympathetic... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

still an entertaining and difficult war all around, no doubt.

you could start a thread looking for a temporary sub, or ask around in #dominions on irc.gamesurge.net.

[Ozymandias]

Well it's my first real war in mp (belle_air has been surprisingly peaceful) and I'm still quite enjoying it.

[archaeolept]

there's some entertaining wars going on, no doubt. I think Boron should be difficult to stop though, as he has been unmolested the whole game, and likely has blood going strong, as well as his crazy castling.

However, the reason for this post is that Tauren still hasn't set Mictlan to AI, even though I was quite explicit in the PM's when he took over T'ien Chi a few turns ago. I know he probably feels mictlan is too minor for it to be a problem, but it really is illegitimate. I'm glad he's running t'ien chi, since t'ien still has a significant position in the game, but I'm going to have to have someone set Mictlan to AI for him.

sorry Tauren, but you can't reasonably play two nations in the same game. Now, luckily, the AI will probably continue doing exactly what you have been doing - building a small raiding force, and proceding to cause grief to the vans http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Aku]

Well Tien Chi is getting rampaged by myself(marignon) and pythium. I bet Tien Chi would die faster than mictlan lol. Just let him keep Mictlan, its not like he is staling his turns. It wouldn't be right to turn someone AI because they want to fight to the bitter end.

Tauren is never the Last person to do his turn so he isn't holding up the game at all so I don't see what the problem is. Yeah the AI can do the same thing and defend but if he is having fun doing what he is doing then let him play because either scenerio is the same for you arch.

[archaeolept]

well, its just generally not right to have someone control two nations. I wasn't aware that tien chi was being steamrollered though. i'm open to following the general will on this; its not like I would expect Mictlan to be able to do much differently as either played or AI.

[Aku]

yeah tien chi before tauren subbed went aggressive on pythium bec pythium and i our armies accidently collied and pythium took heavy losses

tien chi invaded pythium and i gave pythium aid by invading tien chi

tien chi has like no hope to winning, pythium and i both border tien chi's capital also now lol

tien chi = 0% chance survival

[Truper]

To me there are two priciples involved. The 1st is that one player doesn't play two nations in the same game. The advantages over other players are obvious. The 2nd is that if a player agrees to set a nation to AI as condition for taking over another nation in the same game, then that player ought to be true to their word.

As far as I know, the player involved hasn't responded at all to our host's attempts to get him to set Mictlan to AI as he agreed to do, and this is also objectionable.

I agree that the relative feebleness of both nations is a mitigating factor, but on balance, I think its beside the point. I wouldn't mind seeing both nations set to AI using the master password.

[The_Tauren13]

Truthfully i never agreed to set Mictlan to AI. I was just going to take over T'ien Ch'i as a favor to those who didnt seem to want them set to AI. If general concensus is that I shouldn't be playing two nations, which is indeed reasonable, then I will set T'ien Ch'i to AI, and continue playing Mictlan.

[archaeolept]

ehh as tien chi is on the way out, it seems, which i wasn't quite aware of, I'm certainly happy to have whatever people say should happen, happen.

and, while its true tauren never explicitly said he would go AI, he never denied it either in response to my PM's to him.

if tien chi is on the way down this is rather moot, but it is still an important general principle, so whatever http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[The_Tauren13]

archaeolept said:
if tien chi is on the way down this is rather moot, but it is still an important general principle, so whatever http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif



Because T'ien Ch'i is probably going to die before Mictlan even(!), i didn't think it was a big deal. But i agree that it is an important general principle. I am prepared to set T'ien Ch'i to AI if people want me to, as i am loathe to give up Mictlan.

[Aku]

i dont care if tauren controls both since both nations are going to die anyway

but if he is required to turn one AI and wants to keep mictlan then we turn tien chi to AI and leave it at that

[Cainehill]

Gee, can _I_ control two nations for several turns too? That'd be neat, having the opportunity to send gems and gold back and forth, forge items with one nation for the other and all. And it's okay, as long as one of the nations is going to die, right? Ooops - _all_ nations but one eventually die. Guess it's okay to run any two nations?

Feh.

[Aku]

well i try to at least hope that other players will be honest and not do the actions you just mentioned

[archaeolept]

hmmm i'm sorry i brought this up now; personally, my preference would be to ignore it, given t'ien chi's situation. And given that I encouraged tauren to take over t'ien chi I feel somewhat responsible.

i guess t'ien chi should be turned over, since that is the correct thing to do. sorry tauren.

[Cainehill]

Sheesh - gotta love when your own summons are the only thing that kill your troops in a battle. Maybe I've gotten too used to false horrors, and wanted to try out one of them artifact spears.

Script : Lesser Horror, Lesser Horroer, Lesser Horror, etc.

And watch those lesser horrors start chewing up my own troops. 14 troops lost in a decent if not large war party, fighting PD 1 or 2. I suppose there is _some_ way of using that spear's spell, but it ain't in a regular melee. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

( Probably a single mage using it, then retreating or better, casting a spell to get out. Possibly horror marking the enemy first, but from what I've seen, the horrors would ignore the horror marks until they were finished with the nearby 'friendly' food. )

[KroolDeath]

Guys, I will be out of town on SAturday so I will probably stale unless someone wants to go to a 48h for a weekend.

Krool

[Cainehill]

Heh. I thought we had been at 48 (or slower) for some time now? If not, we ought to be. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[KroolDeath]

May be we have been. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Aku]

yeah it is at 48hr quickhost and has been it has felt for weeks lol

[Cainehill]

I don't think it was ever mentioned, but it seems that the game has been restarted and is running Version 2.14 now. Is that correct, Archaeolept?

Edit: The reason I noticed this was a battle I won this turn, one of my commanders wound up with two wounds afterwards. Going through the battle replay in 2.12 (which I thought the game was still using) didn't show him getting any wounds. Going through again with 2.14, I saw where he got wounded.

So, if I'm correct, people want to use 2.14 to view battles or risk hallucinations. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Aku]

Yeah the game is on 2.14. I remember reading it somewhere though. It may have been notified in a general mose server thread saying all the games would be Version 2.14.

[Cainehill]

Nope - Esben said he'd updated the executable, but games would continue to be 2.12 until restarted by the game's owner.

[archaeolept]

when Man was set AI (by zen), that automatically moved the game to 2.14

[Aku]

It is always interesting to see THREE nations die on the same turn lol.

[Truper]

Yeah, I thought that was pretty funny myself. There are getting to be very few of us...

[KroolDeath]

Yea, that was something else!!!

[Cainehill]

I didn't do it! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Truper]

What, the heavy hand of Jotun is only used for holding olive...trees? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Cainehill]

Truper said:
What, the heavy hand of Jotun is only used for holding olive...trees? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



We call them ... Toothpicks. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Cainehill]

Nice to see that Boron is from the same school as Cohen - go AI with absolutely no notice, no attempt to get someone to sub, and screwing any neighbors he had long term treaties with.

[archaeolept]

ehh, i think he just got into the newbie "game overload" trap. he really has huge armies of good troops too, and they all seem to be pouring over my borders ;p

[Cainehill]

Still no excuse for not giving notice or trying to find a substitute player.

[Cohen]

For what I know, Boron had started to study heavily.
However this will not justify his going AI without warning or trying to find a sub.
I wanted only you know that he's real stuff, but I suppose a post of Boron would be better.

[Boron]

archaeolept said:
ehh, i think he just got into the newbie "game overload" trap. he really has huge armies of good troops too, and they all seem to be pouring over my borders ;p


Yeah i thought i wrote an ingame MSG to all explaining why i went AI . It really seems i forgot it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif .

Both Archeo and Cohen are right . I made the typical newbie fault going into too many games .
And i have to go to university now again so i had to make the tough decision either play all my games sloppily because of lack of time or to quit the ones which seem hopeless and continue the ones which seem not so hopeless .

In hardslog i was extremely disappointed cause as you caine + archeo probably both remember at the time hard slog started i was obsessed with my Vampire hoarding idea and used that in hard slog . It turned out as crappy as you have said .

I chose death 3 scale and now my blood income started to suffer heavily . My clamming was very poor too only about 20 clams i owned so i decided to quit .

I searched no sub because i stupidly used the same password for all my games and i use it even for my email so i thought it is no good idea to find a sub .

Sorry folks .

[Truper]

For the Last day or so, I haven't been able to log into the server - it freezes on the "waiting for game info" screen. Anyone else having that problem?

[Cainehill]

Yep - it seems to need a restart today.

Edit: After 3 tries I was able to get in, but it could probably use a restart as soon as possible after the turn runs (restarting sometimes causes it to lose or ignore turns already uploaded)

[archaeolept]

i'll restart as soon as the next turn hosts

[archaeolept]

game has been stopped and restarted. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Truper]

Seems to me we've about come to the end of this one - I at least have no clue how one fights under these conditions, and attempting to find out hasn't really been much fun. I vote we acclaim Arch the winner, and put this bad boy to bed.

[archaeolept]

what? you're viciously sieging one of my castles, and have a seemingly infinite supply of blood, gems, and wishes...

Well, as you know the micromanagement of my large late-game empire has been getting pretty boring. i'm certainly open to ending it, if Caine is amenable. it has been a hard fought game, no doubt.

[Aku]

I dont mind it ending. I am basically crushed anyway.

[Cainehill]

Doesn't matter to me - had some great battles.

[archaeolept]

I need one more victory point i think, going by the technical victory conditions, of which i should be getting 1 this turn and 2 next. so you guys need to take immediate action in order to delay me; not that VP are the be all and end all.

but, yeah, i had some desperate and interesting times, but i've gotten all i'm going to get out of this. i'll submit this move if you guys have, but I think we should call this a day.

gg everyone.

[Truper]

It was entertaining, and most interesting. I hadn't played a game out this far before. I learned some things, but I clearly have more thinking to do about how to prepare for and make the transition to the end game.

I think I'll pass on playing whatever turn is up - this is one map that I've stared at enough http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[archaeolept]

got me the technical 17th vp (i think that's what the victory conditions were. can't be bothered to search it out ;p). The most exciting battle of the turn was the huge repulse of the Last large Abysian force by the Last c'tis defenses.

it looks like krooldeath's c'tis would have outLasted aby http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[KroolDeath]

I don't know, I was pretty whooped. When Boron dropped the AI went crazy on me. I was never in a good position, surrounded by superpowers Vanheim and Abysia. I could only hope my insignificance would mean I was left alone. And then Boron dropped...I suddenly became significant to the AI!

Krool