MP Game - Back to the Fray (noob/int game)-running

[Thufir]

mosehansen.dk port 2318

? map, Indy 7, magic sites 50
renaming enabled, HOF 15
25 hour quickhost
12+ players
house rules: no watchtower/mausoleum
victory conditions - standard or mutual consent

I set the map as Orania, since I'm thinking it'd be cool to have lots of players, but I was also considering Zen's cradle. If we decide to start with fewer players, then we can scale back on the map size. Anyhow, discussion/suggestions on our map choice is welcome, as I've never played MP on either.

I've been thinking I'd play Man, but if someone's hot to take that I'd be fine with another nation.


As for what defines an intermediate player, this is what I've used before:

<= 10 mp games
And never came in 1st or 2d in a mp game that included experienced players

Or if you don't qualify for the above, but feel you are not speeding through the Dom2 learning curve (perhaps because you've got a life? then use your own judgement and jump in).

Please note that it is a requirement to sign on to the game on this thread, and in any case of conflict between someone uploading on mosehansen and someone having claimed a position in this thread, the thread claim takes precedence. Also, everyone must claim the position on mosehansen (no anonymous players allowed).



For those that don't know already, here are the startup instructions:

1) Post in this thread to reserve your position
2) Design your Pretender standalone
3) On the main/entry Dom2 menu, choose Network
4) Enter "mosehansen.dk" for server
5) Enter "2318" for port
6) Choose the nation for the Pretender which you have designed.
7) If you haven't already, register on mosehansen at: https://www.mosehansen.dk/cgi-bin/dom2.pl
8) Then go to: https://www.mosehansen.dk/cgi-bin/dom2.pl?page=BrowseGamePage&game=BackToTheFray
If you've successfully uploaded your pretender, you'll see your nation listed as Anonymous, check the "That's me" box.

That's it - you're done! Once all players have done this, I'll start the game.


Edit:
One more thing, this will be a ladder game on Battlefield. This means that all players will need to register on the Battlefield site, which takes all of 2 minutes, although we can start the game before everyone is registered.

Here are some links for Battlefield:
The Battlefield is at:
http://www.the-battlefield.com
Battlefield Dom2 Page:
http://www.the-battlefield.com/index.php?page=dom2main&game=dom2
Battlefield Dom2 Forum:
http://www.the-battlefield.com/forum/index.php?showforum=27


Current Player List:
Pangaea - jeffr
Marignon - bleach168
Abysia - Edi
T'ien Ch'i - Anatoli
Pythium - Boron
Vanheim - Breslau
Jotunheim - bluebird
Ulm - Soapyfrog
Atlantis - odd_enuf
Man - Thufir
Ermor - Cheezeninja

[Bluebird]

There is a similar game opened by Soapyfrog and still looking for players, why not first fill this one?

[archaeolept]

lollerz - soapy's game is using the "nasty edition" of the map. it has been a while since i've seen the adjective "similar" so innapropriately used http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Soapyfrog]

True enough! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Thufir]

archaeolept said:
lollerz - soapy's game is using the "nasty edition" of the map. it has been a while since i've seen the adjective "similar" so innapropriately used http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif



You've got that right!

I'm also not so very interested in the 5 page list of house rules that soapyfrog ascribes to. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Soapyfrog]

Oh hey now, its not SUCH a big deal. Nothing wrong with trying a new set of house rules, you never know it might *gasp* improve the game and if it doesnt, well, it was a worthy experiment.

[Cohen]

I'm Intermediate, I've more than 10 games, but in none except 1v1 I managed to win or have 2nd position.

I'd like to play Arcoshepale.

However before to upload my pretender I'd wait for Thurfir acceptation.

[Boron]

I would be interested too .

I have now about 10 games played/playing so i am more an intermediate now than a newb i think .
If this is ok i would like to try pythium never played them before in a mp game .

[Thufir]

Cohen said:
However before to upload my pretender I'd wait for Thurfir acceptation.



I'm sorry, Cohen, but in my judgement you are better than intermediate (perhaps you are just into veteran territory while Boron is not quite there yet). I know I haven't seen you in endgame play, but your out of the gate performance in Newbiegame3 was pretty impressive. The way you combined almost immediate two province/turn expansion with top notch research for a non-researching nation like Abysia was what I would characterize as veteran play.

[Cohen]

Was a combo of mercenary and alchemize.
However as you wish ^^

[Soapyfrog]

I could be interested. I have perhaps 5 MP games, with only one small one completed thus far (I didn't win).

I'd like to try playing Ulm...

[Thufir]

Soapyfrog said:
Oh hey now, its not SUCH a big deal. Nothing wrong with trying a new set of house rules, you never know it might *gasp* improve the game and if it doesnt, well, it was a worthy experiment.



Nothing wrong at all! But I personally like minimal house rule lists for newbie games.

[Edi]

I might take a stab at this. I'll give BF Ulm a try, though this will be my first MP game, so I expect to get seriously spanked in short order...

Late tonight now, so I'll reg on Mose's server and upload a pretender tomorrow morning.

Oh, I'd like to play on Zen's cradle, too big a game and I'll be really intimidated (not to mention thoroughly squashed before I can even try to get started...)

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Oh so my previous claim on Ulm means nothing! HA! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Thufir]

Edi said:
I might take a stab at this. I'll give BF Ulm a try, though this will be my first MP game, so I expect to get seriously spanked in short order...

Late tonight now, so I'll reg on Mose's server and upload a pretender tomorrow morning.

Edi



Soapyfrog has got dibs on Ulm, would you care for any other positon?

Here's our list so far:
Pythium - Boron
Soapyfrog - Ulm
Man - Thufir?

[bleach168]

I'd like to reserve a spot in this game. This would be my third MP game ever. Not sure what race I want yet, I'll let others pick first.

[Cheezeninja]

I'll play as Ermor... I feel my intermediate credits are in good order, although i've probably gone over the 10 game mark at this point (like 15 maybe) I've been clobbered in nearly all of them.

[Edi]

Ah, crap! I'll take Abysia then, and expect the spanking to be even quicker...

Edi

[Thufir]

Edi said:
Ah, crap! I'll take Abysia then, and expect the spanking to be even quicker...
Edi



Perfect! That means that bleach won't be taking Abysia, which improves my chances in this game tenfold! (Since bleach, as Abysia, is spanking my butt big time in Live and Learn).

Are you an expert in Ulm, Edi? For me so far, Abysia has been the easiest nation to play successfully in MP.

[Thufir]

Cheezeninja said:
I'll play as Ermor... I feel my intermediate credits are in good order, although i've probably gone over the 10 game mark at this point (like 15 maybe) I've been clobbered in nearly all of them.



Now there's the best credential of all - getting clobbered! Well, we certainly are doing that together in L&L, maybe we can avoid that fate this time around.

Current player list:
Pythium - Boron
Soapyfrog - Ulm
Man - Thufir?
Ermor - Cheezeninja
Abysia - Edi
? - bleach168

[Edi]

Thufir said:
Perfect! That means that bleach won't be taking Abysia, which improves my chances in this game tenfold! (Since bleach, as Abysia, is spanking my butt big time in Live and Learn).

Are you an expert in Ulm, Edi? For me so far, Abysia has been the easiest nation to play successfully in MP.


No, not an expert on any nation or any strategy by any stretch of imagination, I've got very limited SP experience only, and out of those, I've been most comfortable with standard and BF Ulm (I hate IF Ulm). Abysia is one I've always liked, even if I've always had crappy luck with it, but maybe I'll have a good break this time. It's also similar enough to Ulm in some respects that it's not so far removed as Pangaea would be, for example.

Edi

[Thufir]

Oh - I forgot to mention one thing.

Special house rule for Boron:
Prior to turn 20, posting in the Dom2 forum is not allowed while a turn here in BackToTheFray is left unplayed. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Schmoe]

Man, I would love to join this game. So many games, so little time... I'm really interested in trying Vanheim, Caelum, or Pangea, but I think I'm going to have to stick with the Live and Learn game for now.

[Bluebird]

Sign me up for Jotunheim, please ...

[Boron]

Thufir said:
Oh - I forgot to mention one thing.

Special house rule for Boron:
Prior to turn 20, posting in the Dom2 forum is not allowed while a turn here in BackToTheFray is left unplayed. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif


Ok agreed http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif .

[odd_enuf]

i'll take atlantis

odd_enuf

[bleach168]

Put me down for Marignon, thanks!

[Soapyfrog]

I'm all uploaded and ready to go!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[anatoli11]

I'd like to do tien chi - only 4 MP games, none complete (except for your Last game that I got drubbed in...)

[Thufir]

anatoli11 said:
I'd like to do tien chi - only 4 MP games, none complete (except for your Last game that I got drubbed in...)



OK, Tien Chi, no problem. This time you might consider focusing on indies until they're all gone, before attacking players (even if you are close to a player). Of course, I've violated this sage advice myself more than once http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif


Here's our current player list:

Pythium - Boron
Ulm - Soapyfrog
Man - Thufir
Ermor - Cheezeninja
Abysia - Edi
Marignon - bleach168
Jotunheim - bluebird
Atlantis - odd_enuf
T'ien Ch'i - Anatoli

[Edi]

I'm all set up (to take a fall, in all probability...), so we can begin anytime you guys are ready.

Edi

[Bluebird]

Just a small comment: In the top-most posting the text states the URL of "Back To Fray", but the underlying link is to "Pandemonium". Stumbled of this alread a couple of times, could you correct this, please? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Thufir]

Fixed.

BTW, would someone care to tell me what lollerz means?

[jeffr]

I'll take Pangaea please. I'll sign up on Mosehansen and the Battlefield and upload my pretender tonight.

I started MP on Sunday, and am still learning. I'm in two games that started as blitzes, one of which is around turn 30 (where anatoli is laying down the undead smack on me) and the other one is having technical difficulties (karanian_conquest).

In both I got in early wars that I probably should have avoided.

I also signed up for two other MP games, but they haven't started yet.

[Soapyfrog]

Where is this "Battlefield"... ???

[Thufir]

Soapyfrog said:
Where is this "Battlefield"... ???



All the links are in the initial post.

[Soapyfrog]

Got it!

[Breschau]

I'd like in as Vanheim.

Not sure how many games I've played mp, but it can't be far from 10 (maybe a couple less or a couple more). I've yet to win one, though a couple were close. I'm not a newbie, but I'm definitely not a veteran either.

[Thufir]

You're in!

Pythium - Boron
Ulm - Soapyfrog
Man - Thufir
Ermor - Cheezeninja
Abysia - Edi
Marignon - bleach168
Jotunheim - bluebird
Atlantis - odd_enuf
T'ien Ch'i - Anatoli
Pangaea - jeffr
Vanheim - Breslau

This brings us up to 11, and so we're getting close to the desired 12 players. With one more player, if everyone uploads today, we could be starting as early as tonight. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I'd like to get some more opinions on maps. So far Edi has voted for Zen's Cradle, which does look like an interesting map, to me. Any other votes? And along with the map question, you might want to comment on how many players we should shoot for.

[Boron]

I vote for cradle because i haven't played it so far http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Soapyfrog]

The cradle sounds great... never played it and besides I am already hosting an Orania game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Edi]

Cradle is going to be a tight fit, max recommended number of players for that map is 12, and it starts getting real congested already with 10 players, 8 or 9 is best for it, so I say we just go ahead and get cracking with it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Edi

[Thufir]

Edi said:
Cradle is going to be a tight fit, max recommended number of players for that map is 12, and it starts getting real congested already with 10 players, 8 or 9 is best for it, so I say we just go ahead and get cracking with it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Edi


OK - so Zen's cradle it is, I've closed the game, as it looks like we've got enough players. I think we'll be fine with 11 players, that works out to 20 provinces per player, which is actually quite sparse (at least compared to what I'm used to).

I'll do another post in a little bit with instructions on naming files, but in the meantime, if everyone can get to work on their uploads, we'll be off and running!

[Thufir]

We're almost all uploaded now, just me and Cheezeninja left to go. I'll start as soon as everyone's up there.

jeffr, Boron and odd_enuf, you still have to claim your positions on mosehansen. No anonymous players allowed!

[Thufir]

Everyone will need to get Zen's Cradle, and make sure that it's named in the same way as it is on mosehansen.

To do that you can go to the Illwinter site:
http://www.illwinter.com/dom2/index.html

Go to the map section, and download the original Cradle, direct link:
http://ulm.illwinter.com/dom2/cradle.zip

In this file, rename "cradle.tga" to "cradlez14.tga" and copy it to your maps directory under dominions2. Then, on the initial post I've attached the map file, download that and take the unzipped cradlevz14.map and put that in your maps directory, and boom! you're done!

Edit:
Corrected the name of the .map file to: cradlevz14.map.

[Thufir]

We're running!

Good luck to all. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Thufir]

BTW, I don't know if this is important to anyone, but there's a bit of a tiff going on the battlefield over what should or should not be done in a ladder game. As a result I've offered to make this a non-ladder game, since we have house rules, and I've restricted the game to non-veterans, both of which are probably bad ideas for ladder games. So, this may or may not be a ladder game, depending on how the argument shakes out.

For any that cares (and I don't care a whole lot, myself http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif ), here's the thread:
http://www.the-battlefield.com/forum/index.php?s=55416f087fd5a65da5c5ca0b7deb6b6a&showt opic=255

[jeffr]

Thufir - I followed your zen cradle map instructions, but the unziped cradle map file you have attached to your post is named cradlevz14.map not cradlez14.map. Is this correct?

It seemed to work when I created a test sp game. I used cradlevz14.map and didn't rename it to cradlez14.map for this sp test game.

[Thufir]

jeffr said:
Thufir - I followed your zen cradle map instructions, but the unziped cradle map file you have attached to your post is named cradlevz14.map not cradlez14.map. Is this correct?

It seemed to work when I created a test sp game. I used cradlevz14.map and didn't rename it to cradlez14.map for this sp test game.



You are correct - my bad.

To make matters worse, the .tga file should still be named "cradlez14.tga". Not my naming convention - I swear!

I'll edit my original instructions to note your correction.

[Thufir]

Just waiting on Cheezeninja.

I was hoping to crank through a few of our opening turns this weekend <sigh>. Well, some of us just never stop dreaming. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Edi]

Thufir said:

Just waiting on Cheezeninja.

I was hoping to crank through a few of our opening turns this weekend <sigh>. Well, some of us just never stop dreaming. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif


If we didn't have to wait for him, you would have had to wait for me, as I was out all of today (Saturday), I just barely had time to play the first turn at around 7.30 pm, so. Thing is, I'm less available on weekends than on weekdays, the result of being unemployed (though that will hopefully change in the near future).

Edi

[Thufir]

Edi said:
Thing is, I'm less available on weekends than on weekdays, the result of being unemployed (though that will hopefully change in the near future).
Edi



Me too - only in my case I am hoping that will change in the more distant future http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Cheezeninja]

oh shart, be wary of long hours, they dull the mind and then cause you to upload pretenders and forget to confess, which causes you to look at your mose welcome screen and think "huh, i dont have any turns that need doing, that new game must not have started yet." because of course, mosehansen's wonderful server doesn't know your in the game because you never bothered to tell it because you were tired because you were working too much. I blame capitalism and our consumer society, and myself for joining the military....sorry for taking so long.

[Thufir]

no worries - just happy you didn't stale - it's turn 2 and we're off with everyone on board!

[Thufir]

Waiting on Breschau.

[Breschau]

breschau was waiting on getting home from work http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

on weekdays i'll be logging on to run my turn(s) between 6 and 7pm (uk time, i forget if we're gmt just now).. but I'll sometimes be able to log on around 7am too.

[Thufir]

Breschau said:
breschau was waiting on getting home from work http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

on weekdays i'll be logging on to run my turn(s) between 6 and 7pm (uk time, i forget if we're gmt just now).. but I'll sometimes be able to log on around 7am too.



Sorry to harass http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif - I'm just used to the idea that the first 10-20 turns go relatively quickly. But that's an ideal to aspire to, not a requirement. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Edi]

Looks like the pace has been picking up quite a bit. Goddamn #$!£& indie crossbowmen just killed my best commander (one of the two in the hall of fame) who was about to become my prophet as soon as I could spare a turn...

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Its ok you arent the only one with problems http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif, my main army was crushed almost to the Last man by barbarians on turn 10... how embarrassing.

[Breschau]

I'm out. To avoid giving anything away at such an early stage - somebody rushed me which I was not expecting, so I got stomped. With maybe 4 provinces (no capital) and no troops and my attackers still as strong as when they attacked it seemed pointless to keep going, so I turned AI for the mop-up.

[Soapyfrog]

I got the Messages that Vanheim was toast... doesnt bode well!

[Thufir]

Breschau said:
I'm out. To avoid giving anything away at such an early stage - somebody rushed me which I was not expecting, so I got stomped. With maybe 4 provinces (no capital) and no troops and my attackers still as strong as when they attacked it seemed pointless to keep going, so I turned AI for the mop-up.



Nothing to give away there, it's clear from the graphs that it was Pangaea that rushed you. BTW, good job Pangaea, so far in my newbie games I've seen far more failed rushes than successful ones.

[Thufir]

Waiting on Boron.

[Soapyfrog]

As usual http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[jeffr]

I'm Pan in this game. I just sort of lucked out, I think. I was expanding and came across his capital without many troops around.

I really like the Zen Cradle map. I just started playing MP, and I'm in a game on Faerun Small. There are no province boundries on that map, and I have a tough time trying to figure out what is going on.

[Thufir]

Waiting for jeffr - you're just a little more than 2 hrs from a stale here Jeff, are you out there?

[Soapyfrog]

Didnt he stale (or almost) Last turn too?

[jeffr]

Damn, yeah I staled. I probably missed it by 1/2 hour or so. I've only staled once, though.

The weekends present a bit of a problem for me with the 25 hour hosting. I like the fast turn around, but I sometimes am away on the weekends. I'll do my best.

[anatoli11]

Something triggered the cheating thingy on me. Any ideas? I didn't get any extra cash, or random events.

The only thing I can think of is that I cashed in some fire gems using the alchenist's stone... Which I am doing again this turn to see if that is what is causing the message:(

[Thufir]

anatoli11 said:
Something triggered the cheating thingy on me. Any ideas? I didn't get any extra cash, or random events.

The only thing I can think of is that I cashed in some fire gems using the alchenist's stone... Which I am doing again this turn to see if that is what is causing the message:(



I do believe there is a known bug related to using the alchemist's stone for cashing in gems.

Edit: And thanks for letting us all know what's going on promptly! I was just getting ready to send you a PM to find out.

[Thufir]

Less than 2hrs till hosting and we're waiting on Cheezeninja - hope you make it in there!

[Thufir]

Anyone know if Ermor (Cheezeninja) played his turn Last night? Cheezeninja - are you out there? Unfortunately we are hosting at about 1am my time right now, so that makes it hard for me to detect a stale.

While Ermor might be in trouble, it seems to me that Ermor is in a quite pivotal position, and I'd really hate to see two consecutive stales here. I'm considering holding the game for 12-24 hrs in order to give Cheezeninja some time to show up. If I don't get confirmation that Ermor is active, we can set him to AI, but I'd like to do it w/o the 2 consecutive stales (as usually seems to be the way this happens).

[Edi]

I'm fine with having the game on hold for a while. Ermor is really pivotal right now, from what I've seen, so better to hold the game than have him stale.

Edi

[Thufir]

Well, still no sign of Cheezeninja - if we don't hear from him before I go to sleep tonight, I'll reset the timer on the game. Then, at 12pm PST tomorrow, I'll set him to AI.

[anatoli11]

I have to go away at short notice Early Wednesday until Friday afternoon - I am hoping you can hold the game until then.

Sorry, Thanks

[Thufir]

anatoli11 said:
I have to go away at short notice Early Wednesday until Friday afternoon - I am hoping you can hold the game until then.

Sorry, Thanks



I don't see any problem with holding the game - I'll make sure it doesn't host w/o you having submitted until Friday 8pm, your time. Are you just one hour ahead of us, here in California?

If possible, it would be cool if you could get one more turn in before you go, but if that's a problem - no worries.

[anatoli11]

Got my turn in tonight - I am 1 hour ahead of you.

Thanks - I really appreciate it (even though you are pounding me right now :{)

[Thufir]

anatoli11 said:
Got my turn in tonight - I am 1 hour ahead of you.

Thanks - I really appreciate it (even though you are pounding me right now :{)



Cool - thanks for getting your turn in. Sometime after 8pm (your time) tomorrow, I will set it to 48h QH, then after your back Friday, I'll set it back to 24h QH.

BTW, we are at a point where it is reasonable to go to 48h QH - my personal preference is to stay at 24h, but if others want to go to 48, I'm fine with that.

As for pounding you, Anatoli, it's nothing personal. Honest. And you're a brave man for playing TC S&A - it's one of my Favorites, but it certainly is not an easy one to win with. Not only do you have plenty of weaknesses to exploit, you're a very good gem searcher, meaning you make quite a tempting victim! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

[Thufir]

Game set to 48H QH.

[jeffr]

I noticed that Ermor is now AI. Ermor just attacked me with his pretender that I thought I had killed two turns ago. Does AI Ermor get an advantage in resurrecting his god?

A bit off topic, but what time zone are the post's times diplayed in ? EST (i.e. NY) ? For example, Thufir's post above is 1:17am and I think he is in California, which would be 10:17pm EST.

[Bluebird]

I am away over the weekend. I will be back on monday morning CET. I don't have a problem with skipping a turn, but it would be nice if nobody would attack me during that time ;-)

Bluebird

[Thufir]

Bluebird said:
I am away over the weekend. I will be back on monday morning CET. I don't have a problem with skipping a turn, but it would be nice if nobody would attack me during that time ;-)

I'll keep it on 48h QH till monday. If you should manage to get in one more turn before you leave (we host tonight, or earlier if Anatoli gets his turn in), then I think you'd be virtually guaranteed not to stale.

[Thufir]

I'll be resetting the clock tonight to avert having Bluebird stale. I'll set it to 25h QH such that the next forced hosting will be Monday evening (~8pm) Pacific Time (GMT -8?).

[Edi]

Whew, got my turn done with just 35 minutes to spare... That was close!

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

The peaceful land of Ulm has come under attack by the combined forces of Abysia and Pangea, two nation immensely greater in size and power, combined presenting an insurmountable challenge.

We fight tooth and nail, but he are driven back step by faltering step.

Therefore I appeal to all who would look to their own survival: when I go, surely one of you will be next on the chopping block, to be slain by the axe of this unholy alliance.

Pangea and Abysia must die! Do not let them run rampant, or the world will be doomed to an eternity of... of... flaming... plant life... er... or something. Anyway point being: we need to band together. Where is the love, my brothers??

[Boron]

I am at war with pangenea since about 3 turns too http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .
So at least pangenea shouldn't be able to attack you with full might .

[Soapyfrog]

He has about a billion maenads... but I am honestly maybe a bit more worried about Abysia.

[Thufir]

Boron said:
I am at war with pangenea since about 3 turns too http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .
So at least pangenea shouldn't be able to attack you with full might .

Hmmmm. So mighty Pangaea has opened up a two front war. I read something about two front wars in my history book... What was that they said?

[Boron]

Thufir said:

Boron said:
I am at war with pangenea since about 3 turns too http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .
So at least pangenea shouldn't be able to attack you with full might .

Hmmmm. So mighty Pangaea has opened up a two front war. I read something about two front wars in my history book... What was that they said?



Sometimes they are won , e.g. seven years war was still won by prussia even though they were attacked from france , russia + austria hungary .

And it depends on the definition of 2 front :
Had GB in WW 2 e.g. 2 fronts ? I think you could say so , 1 front in africa and 1 front in the pacific against japan .

[Boron]

Soapyfrog said:
He has about a billion maenads... but I am honestly maybe a bit more worried about Abysia.


I don't border them . But Last turn has shown some decline for Abysia in army strength too so it seems you are succeeding at the moment . Grats http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Soapyfrog]

Well killing lots of chaff no doubt about it, but he still has his truly dangerous toys, i.e. air queen, arch devil(s), king of banefire...

Same for Pangea. Easy to kill swathes of troops, its the commanders that are the problem.

[Edi]

Well, you did just off 15 mage commanders (and my prophet), along with 150 troops, so it'll take a while to replace those, and I lost a buttload of equipment as well. I was NOT a happy bunny...

Actually what I expect to happen is that after the current spates of conflict are resolved to their satisfactory conclusion, I'm going to get stomped flat. It's bound to happen sooner or later, because I'm not a very skilled player. This, what, my first MP game and I've been lucky with lots of things.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Well in that case... how about we return to our orginal borders? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Edi]

Certainly, Soapy, your original borders under the Aegis of the Abysian Empire will be just fine! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Don't worry, at least you will have the satisfaction of probably having drained me enough to make me vulnerable for somebody else, unless Pangaea has you in worse straits than I thought.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Hear that everyone? Abysia is WEAK! GET HIM!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Edi]

By the time you're dead, that is. Not yet, I'm not quite that inept. Nice try, though. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[jeffr]

I (aka Pan) attacked Ulm because Abysia was coming from one side, but also because I had a ton of maneads that were killing my economy. I didn't feel like marching them to the other end of the world, so I thought I'd get them killed off against Ulm.

I've read about the Staff of Storms, but since i'm new to MP, Ulm was the first one to use it on me. I nailed a Wraith Lord (who'm I'm assuming was supposed to Last long enough so that wrathful skies killed all/most of my army), but I still lost some valuable commanders. Next time, they'll be lightning immune.

He attacked my force before I stormed his castle and by killing the right commanders, caused my troops to be left out of the storming of the castle. I ended up storming the castle with 4 commanders and no troops !!!!

I really dislike the "one commander kills any army with wrathful skies/staff of storms" thing. That was actually discouraging.

Pythium (Boron) has attacked me, but all of those former ermor provinces int the south aren't worth much, except for a gem site here and there.

This game has been a lot of fun (although occasionally discouraging -- i.e. a bunch of mages endlessly casting ethereal false horrors. Ah well, you live and learn.)

[Boron]

jeffr said:
This game has been a lot of fun (although occasionally discouraging -- i.e. a bunch of mages endlessly casting ethereal false horrors. Ah well, you live and learn.)


This wasn't intended http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif . But the spellcasting Ai loves to use false horrors . My communion slaves died all against ermor and i hadn't the time to replace them but normal theurgs really seem to cast false horror 80% of the time http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif .

It is live and learn for me as well . I was shocked when my theurgs did cast nothing else then false horrros http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif .

Your voul vapors + living statues combo was nice i haven't seen it before . It worked imo well and i was lucky that at least most of my mages survived .

[Thufir]

jeffr said:
I (aka Pan) attacked Ulm because Abysia was coming from one side, but also because I had a ton of maneads that were killing my economy. I didn't feel like marching them to the other end of the world, so I thought I'd get them killed off against Ulm.

It is kind of weird to get freespawns that cost maintenance. That's enough to scare me off Pangaea, although I gather there are some players out there that do well with Pan.



I've read about the Staff of Storms, but since i'm new to MP, Ulm was the first one to use it on me. I nailed a Wraith Lord (who'm I'm assuming was supposed to Last long enough so that wrathful skies killed all/most of my army), but I still lost some valuable commanders. Next time, they'll be lightning immune.

Good move! Planning out immunities is certainly key. As I understand it from Boron, your use of foul vapors certainly exploited Boron's lack of any kind of poison immunity (in my limited MP experience, people are more likely to be prepared for fire or lightning than they are for poison).



He attacked my force before I stormed his castle and by killing the right commanders, caused my troops to be left out of the storming of the castle. I ended up storming the castle with 4 commanders and no troops !!!!

I really dislike the "one commander kills any army with wrathful skies/staff of storms" thing. That was actually discouraging.

Well, as you may have read, there are a great many Posts where people argue intensely about whether single heroes/demigods (read SCs) should be able to take on entire armies. IMO, part of what makes Dom II great is that such arguments are so insolveable. There are various ways to tweak the game such that militaristic tactics and national troops take on more importance, and SCs are harder to create/equip. Someone out there started a few "low magic" games, where as I understand it, national troops were pretty much the main thing going for the entire game.

Personally, I like the "high magic" style notion that a single heroic figure can take on entire armies, given the appropriate circumstances. And again, given Dom II's complexity/richness it's not as if SCs exclusively rule the day. I am a huge fan of battlefield magic, and IME, I've been able to wipe out numerically superior (even numerically and quality superior), armies via careful scripting of mages, combined with superior research.



Pythium (Boron) has attacked me, but all of those former ermor provinces int the south aren't worth much, except for a gem site here and there.

But the gem sites can be quite key - so be sure not to ignore them. Typically, as the game goes into the endgame, cash becomes less important, while gems become more important.

Edit: Also, don't forget Acashic Record. This is easier for some nations to cast than others, but it is especially useful for a large nation (such as yours http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif). It's my guess that Ermor was not in the game long enough to have done a thorough job of site searching (although you should also keep in mind that it can be a bad idea to cast this on provinces near the front).



This game has been a lot of fun (although occasionally discouraging -- i.e. a bunch of mages endlessly casting ethereal false horrors. Ah well, you live and learn.)

I certainly have been having a ton of fun! T'ien Ch'i has been at the short end of the stick in our war (he was out-resourced from day 1, and any man who takes on playing TC has my respect!), but he's taught me more than a few lessons along the way (and delivered quite a bit of damage!).

I would say that discouragement is part of the Dom II learning curve. I know in my first MP game, I had the clear upper hand with me and Jotunheim allied against Abysia, until I started to encounter her Devil hordes, whereupon I discovered I had no clue how to counter Devils. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

As for False Horrors, if I had to vote today, I would probably vote for nerfing False Horrors. Zen's spell mod does nerf the False Horror spell, but perhaps not enough. But I have to say that Dom II is a tremendously complicated game, and I do not consider myself a qualified judge of game balance issues in Dom II.

[Soapyfrog]

jeffr said:
I've read about the Staff of Storms, but since i'm new to MP, Ulm was the first one to use it on me. I nailed a Wraith Lord (who'm I'm assuming was supposed to Last long enough so that wrathful skies killed all/most of my army), but I still lost some valuable commanders. Next time, they'll be lightning immune.


It was not a wraith lord, just a bane lord... I could not possibly afford a wraith lord at this point!! I was hoping he would Last longer, but oh well he did the job to some degree.

I really dislike the "one commander kills any army with wrathful skies/staff of storms" thing. That was actually discouraging.


Yes indeed it is discouraging! But when you are on a tight budget, like I am, you have to seek out the most efficient methods of inflciting death and mayhem.

Actually I have been a total failure in that regard. My wrathful attacks surely do kill a fair number of enemies, but unfortunately it has cost me a fully equipped commander each time. A rather well decked out golem (as you can see in the bug report thread), 2 bane lords with good equipment, and most recently, one of my wrathers... that is NOT cheap equipment!

I am thinking between those massive equipment & summons losses (probably 200 gems worth) and my mishandling of my longdead archers, and the destruction of my Ulmish national army, I figure I have, at best, broken even.

[jeffr]

I my PC to just went down, which really sucks. I'll try to fix it soon.

[Thufir]

jeffr said:
I my PC to just went down, which really sucks. I'll try to fix it soon.

Looks like you already got your turn in - good work! I was just about to reset the clock, to make sure you weren't in a position of staling, but glad I didn't have to.

[anatoli11]

Tien Chi Spring and Autumn has slipped into Winter...

Well played Man and Atlantis! Very enjoyable, but short-lived...

Good luck to those who remain in the game.

[Soapyfrog]

Ahh too bad... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Thufir]

anatoli11 said:
Tien Chi Spring and Autumn has slipped into Winter...

Well played Man and Atlantis! Very enjoyable, but short-lived...

Good luck to those who remain in the game.

Well played, indeed! I attempted to send you an in-game message Last turn, but the turn hosted just before I got the change submitted. And I wouldn't say that you're position was short lived - we're on turn 61, after all. And besides, you left me (and all the troops + commanders present at that Last battle) with something to remember you by, so you've left a permanent mark behind in this game! (even if it is a "curse" mark - or actually, a great many curse marks! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif)

I'm hoping to do a screen grab or two of some of our battles - we had some really fun ones along the way. I think we both were into using battlefield magic and I've never seen so much intense magic in use and so many mages on both sides of the battle field.

All, in all, you played quite excellently. T'ien Ch'i S&A is a difficult nation to play, and I can't think of any major mistakes that you made - certainly nothing that could have overcome my resource advantage. I think it was a likely a good strategic move for you to send me towards Marignon, although perhaps your bad luck that they had been weakened just before I attacked them.

[Edi]

By the way, could we go to 36 hour QH? that would make it a bit easier to manage time, as right now I have sometimes had a difficult time getting my turns on time if there is the slightest kink in RL, the turns are starting to take that long for me to do. I don't think it would slow the game down very much, because everyone has been very good at getting done in 25 hours, but it would give a bit of extra safety margin.

Edi

[Thufir]

I don't have a problem with that. Other options would be to go with 48h QH or 24h fixed host.

Personally, I really love the fact that we are still cranking out 1+ turns per day, at such a late stage, but I think there does come a time when keeping up the pace is really going to put undo pressure on someone.

[Soapyfrog]

48 hour quickhost would be ok by me. I generally manage to do a turn a day, but they are quite complicated and it would be nice to have some margin for error http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Boron]

36 h Quickhost sounds good . Later we can maybe even stretch it to 48 hours http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Thufir]

Soapyfrog said:
48 hour quickhost would be ok by me. I generally manage to do a turn a day, but they are quite complicated and it would be nice to have some margin for error http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Soapy, could you live with 36h QH? That will still give you a margin of error, but still applies some pressure to keep the turns coming more frequently than every other day.

I will set to 36h QH (or if Soapy or others chime in, to 48), after this turn hosts.

[Soapyfrog]

Oh yeah sure, I am flexible.

[jeffr]

36 qh is cool with me. Maybe we could do 48h on the weekends? I've staled twice in this game on weekends because of real life commitments (the Last time was not cool).

This game has been fun. I'm seeing all kinds of advanced units and tactics. I've read about some of them on the forum, but until you've been "wrathful skied" and had your army killed by basically one guy or had your army obliterated by a mass of false horrors, you really can't feel the pain. Instant death by ghost riders is fun too (insert smiley face here). There really is a lot to consider in this game.

I thought I had something when I read the Arouse Hunger description. I tried Arouse Hunger thinking it might turn some of his own troops into ghouls that would then attack his mages. Sort of like a distant charming. Of course, this is not the way it works. Gotta love my optimistic interpretation of the spell description.

[Soapyfrog]

Yeah I used to think thats what it did too...

However it does create 10 free ghouls in a remote province, so actually its a pretty useful spell anyway!

[Thufir]

now set to 36h qh

[Thufir]

Does anyone have any suggestions on killing off Blackhawks?

You know, you try and you try, and they just keep coming back. It's like abaondoning a puppy in the woods, no matter how far you go, they always seem to find their way home http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Soapyfrog]

Well they can be countered by your own remote summons of course... and a sufficiently high province defence will beat them as well.

[Boron]

Drowning works probably as well but requires more effort then ghost ridering them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .

[Edi]

Slap them with Ghost Riders, Thufir, that should make short work of them. Attack Cavalry and watch them die...

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Cant seem to connect to the server... anyone else having problems?

[Soapyfrog]

I was able to connect with great difficulty... anyone else find the server is a little flakey?

[Boron]

Yeah i had difficulties as well .

Strangely thnx to a routing bug 50% of my mages died though i won the battle .
I broke a siege of my castle and won but my routing mages got the "had nowhere to retreat and died" msg and died ... .

[Soapyfrog]

Did you control any adjacent provinces?

[Edi]

I've had trouble with the server as well.

Soapy, it doesn't matter if he did, any troops from inside the castel being sieged that rout from a siege breaking attempt will always die, even if you control all adjacent provinces. That's how I think it works anyway.

Edi

[jeffr]

I can't connect either. I tried 4 or 5 times and was always stuck on the "wait info" screen.

[Soapyfrog]

I think the server needs restarting... Thufir will have to do it I think.

[Thufir]

Edi said:
I've had trouble with the server as well.

Soapy, it doesn't matter if he did, any troops from inside the castel being sieged that rout from a siege breaking attempt will always die, even if you control all adjacent provinces. That's how I think it works anyway.


In this case, I controlled all the adjacent provinces. I don't think it's a bug, per se, as much as a limitation in the routing rules/code. I really believe that the routing rules and code could use a major rewrite for Dom III.

Well, bug or bad rules, I will attest to the fact that Boron got screwed. He dealt me a major defeat while breaking siege from his capital, wiped out my forces (actually worse than that - he stole a bunch of them!), and then out of no where his mages decide to rout while victory was more than assured! Even if there was a good reason for them to rout, and even in the case where all surrounding provinces are unowned, I'd think it reasonable that forces breaking siege rout back into the castle (or at least mostly back in to the castle).

[Thufir]

I'm resetting the clock to 72 hrs for the holidays. I'll be playing more often than that, but just to be cautious I'm setting it to a long time. If anyone needs more, let me know. I'll reset to 36 hrs on Monday, unless someone objects.

[Edi]

No objections here.

[Soapyfrog]

Did the server get a restart to clear the login difficulties?

[Thufir]

Soapyfrog said:
Did the server get a restart to clear the login difficulties?

Yes

[Soapyfrog]

Geez jeffr your defence of your Last(?) fort is bleeding me white. Those are some nasty spell combos you are flinging about...

[jeffr]

hey soapyfrog - glad to help out http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

But really, it's the ai that takes over the casting after the first 5 spells. Is the ai influenced by the spells that you script?

The ai cast a few destructions (lowering the armor values) and then a few blade winds, which was nice. The ai also casts swarm, which considering there is a storm going on, is a waste of gems, in my opinion. Bugs don't fly in the storm.

I wish i had figured out how to take out your damn banelords a bit earlier in the game (like 40 turns ago).

Even on the losing end, this has been fun.

[Soapyfrog]

Yeah the dust to dust, wither bones, and of course petrify all seem to be highly effective.

The blade winds are deadly... well its only a matter of time at this point, I suppose, but boy has it been expensive.

[Thufir]

Set back to 36hr QH

[Thufir]

Now whoever said wolves weren't awesome! Whoever did surely hasn't seen those D4 wolf mages that make the Last of the Tuatha theme so very deadly!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/315274-WolfDemilich.jpg


Well, seriously, I had 2 of these D4 wolves show up after a big battle with Pythium. This is a known bug in that they're reincarnated Pythian demi liches that died in the battle. If anyone cares, I can suicide them against someone elses PD, or I can just set them where they are w/ script to attack closest, in case someone attacks.

[archaeolept]

hey, its not an exploit. everyone has the same chance to luck out like that. just think of them as gifts from heaven. obviously the game itself considers your pretender to be the one true god http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Edi]

Has anybody else had problems connecting to the game lately? My Dom2 freezes completely whenever I try to access this one, but I've no trouble with the Faerun Pirates game. It's annoying as hell, because I'll get several stale turns in a row if this keeps up.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

The server needs a restart (again). Seems to happen to games on Mosehansen every so often. I find if I try to connect twice in quick succession I can 90% of the time get it on the 2nd try.

So Thufir needs to restart the server, and the problem should go away (for awhile).

[Thufir]

I will restart game now. This will change deadline as well, giving you more time to submit, Edi.

[Edi]

Okay, my turn is done. The 36 hour limit is just fine with me, I just get in trouble if the server starts acting up, because I can't try multiple connection attempts, my computer just freezes until I kill Dom2 from the Task Manager.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Has Thufir done his turn yet? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Thufir]

My apologies, but I reset the clock earlier this morning. I confess, but I am struggling a bit to keep up w/ this 36 hr pace. I'll try to keep up for the next turn or two, but I may request to move back to 48hr if I don't find a way to do my turns more quickly.

[Thufir]

This post is much belated, but hopefully Bluebird and Jeff will check out the old BttF thread once more. I just wanted to say thanks to all those who have given such a tough fight in this game. Bluebird, I know after an opening round where you were instructed as to the criticallity of maintaining a minimum of PD, you did field some impressive Niefel Jarls and wreaked some havoc among my SCS (iirc, you took out 2 AQs and some nicely equipped Tartarians, among other stuff).

And, recently of course, Boron you proved the power of astral magic in your initial victory over your capital. Your enslaved/charmed at least half my army, and had you not been screwed by an unfortunate (and totally unreasonable) rout, the outcome of the war was far from a certain Man victory.

Finally, Jeff, congrats (and thanks!) for a long fought war with Pythium. You were out resourced and out researched, but from everything I heard from Boron, and what I could see in the graphs you fought a very long war to very good effect. Its clear that you made an excellent use of tactics, and adapted to circumstances quite well, always varying tactics when something was proven ineffective. You certainly had a very positive effect on the game, and thanks for sticking it out!

This has been an awesome game, and thanks to everyone involved!

PS. I'm working on my turn now, and should submit before 7pm PST.

[Thufir]

One water queen down, two to go! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

OTOH, it seems that Atlantis has discovered the magical tartarian tree, supplying a never-ending stream of fully equipped tartarians http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Edi]

The server needs another reset, I'm unable to connect. AGAIN. This is getting bloody tiresome. I'd also like to move to 48-hour QH, if it's okay with everyone else.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Sounds good to me. And yeah the connection is flakey. Seems to be a symptom that increases in frequency as long-running games go on...

[Thufir]

Soapyfrog said:
Sounds good to me. And yeah the connection is flakey. Seems to be a symptom that increases in frequency as long-running games go on...

I believe this is correct.

I've now set to 48h QH and restarted

[Thufir]

Hey! Someone knocked down my GoH! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Thufir]

Sorry to do this again, but I'm going to reset the clock in order finish my turn. I should finish in the next hr or two.

[BF_Napoleon]

Hey Thufir !

Hows the game going ? Great that you made it a Ladder game !
Enjoy the game and good luck to all !

Nap

[Thufir]

I'm out of town from tomorrow through the 28th, so I'm going to reset the clock until the evening of the 29th. I hope to get in a turn or two during Christmas, but it won't be a sure thing, so we'll have to see how it goes.

Right now, we're on turn 96, and it's waiting on me and Edi. I'll get in my turn tonight, and so hopefully we'll see it host before I head out.

[Soapyfrog]

Still not hosted http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Edi]

It looks like you just killed me, Thufir. Wiped out most of my main army, but I didn't expect things to go much differently. I don't have ready access to cheap SCs like you do, so I'm eventually going to lose badly.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Surely Edi you can summon Bane Lords... or better yet summon Vampires. IMHO Vampire Lords are excellent cheap SCs, and immortal to boot so if you wind up fighting a defensive war they are outstandingly cost effective.

I know Abysia does not have many death casters, but surely by now you must have some indep mages with death and blood... and once you summon one Vampire Lord, they can summon each other quite easily... all you need is a ton of blood!

[Thufir]

Soapyfrog said:
Still not hosted http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Sorry about that! I'm working on my turn right now, and I'll reset to 48hr QH when I'm done (although be warned - it's taking me 3+ hrs to do a turn these days http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif )

[Thufir]

Soapyfrog said:

Edi said:
It looks like you just killed me, Thufir. Wiped out most of my main army, but I didn't expect things to go much differently. I don't have ready access to cheap SCs like you do, so I'm eventually going to lose badly.



Surely Edi you can summon Bane Lords... or better yet summon Vampires. IMHO Vampire Lords are excellent cheap SCs, and immortal to boot so if you wind up fighting a defensive war they are outstandingly cost effective.

I know Abysia does not have many death casters, but surely by now you must have some indep mages with death and blood... and once you summon one Vampire Lord, they can summon each other quite easily... all you need is a ton of blood!

Sorry to hear that Edi, if it helps any, I think that you've been doing a good job with your global spells, but clearly your army is in need of SCs (or SC chassis used as casters). Also, any of Soapy's suggestions are a good idea. I did (as may be obvious) take a page from a recent thread where Rain of Stones or Earthquake was a suggested spell vs. national mages. I actually had some difficulty employing the tactic, as I made a couple of errors in scripting/movement orders, but clearly the spell works quite well!

Personally, I don't think it's so much a question of how Abysia fares vs. Man, but rather Man vs Abysia plus Atlantis (plus Ulm, if you can, or have brought Soapy over to your side). Clearly, I out-resourse Abysia right now, maybe even Abysia plus Atlantis, but I don't think the outcome is a given if everyone is ganging up on me.

OTOH, if the game is no longer enjoyable for you, I would understand that. I don't think its outrageous to turn Abysia AI, or we can also look for a sub (especially if odd_enuf or Soapy thinks that that is important).

Let us know how you want to procede.

- Thufir


Edit:

I really hate to give my enemies any intel on what works against me, but I will tell you Last turn was a bad turn for me, and that both you and Atlantis contributed to the damage done. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Boron]

Edi said:
It looks like you just killed me, Thufir. Wiped out most of my main army, but I didn't expect things to go much differently. I don't have ready access to cheap SCs like you do, so I'm eventually going to lose badly.

Edi



The devils from horde to hell are excellent thugs .
Abysia has excellent access to SCs anyways http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .
Panther as Abysia has now all IDs and ADs in my new game , newbie slugfest . We are VH research there and on turn 58 now .
Imo Abysia , Mictlan and Jotunheim have the easiest access to lots of different SCs/thugs .
Despite common opinion Flames from the sky / afar kill also hidden troops . Thufir killed lots of my clamhoarders (scouts/black servants) with some FFTS .

P.S. What thufir says is true . You did quite some damage to him .

[Thufir]

My apologies for the many delays http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif - I'm working on my turn once again, however.

[Edi]

Soapyfrog said:
Surely Edi you can summon Bane Lords... or better yet summon Vampires. IMHO Vampire Lords are excellent cheap SCs, and immortal to boot so if you wind up fighting a defensive war they are outstandingly cost effective.


Bane Lords, yes, if I wipe out all of my death gems. Death income is and has been throughout the game my weakest point, I just got shafted in that department when sites were allocated. Vamp Lords, I might be able to, but it's difficult.


Soapyfrog said:
I know Abysia does not have many death casters, but surely by now you must have some indep mages with death and blood... and once you summon one Vampire Lord, they can summon each other quite easily... all you need is a ton of blood!


I'll see what I can do to salvage things.



Thufir said:
Personally, I don't think it's so much a question of how Abysia fares vs. Man, but rather Man vs Abysia plus Atlantis (plus Ulm, if you can, or have brought Soapy over to your side). Clearly, I out-resourse Abysia right now, maybe even Abysia plus Atlantis, but I don't think the outcome is a given if everyone is ganging up on me.


True enough, but if you can decimate me quickly enough, I'll be out of the picture, and if I can't counter your tactics, it's what will happen. We'll see.



Thufir said:
OTOH, if the game is no longer enjoyable for you, I would understand that. I don't think its outrageous to turn Abysia AI, or we can also look for a sub (especially if odd_enuf or Soapy thinks that that is important).

Let us know how you want to procede.


I'm not going AI, I'm sticking with this until the end. Who knows what might happen.



Thufir said:
I really hate to give my enemies any intel on what works against me, but I will tell you Last turn was a bad turn for me, and that both you and Atlantis contributed to the damage done.


Well, it's all part of the service! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Glad to hear that my efforts are not completely in vain then. I do like the tools I've got, and there's something to be said for being immune to Fire Domes...

Edi

[Thufir]

We are now reset to 48hr QH, but obviously, I've had some difficulty keeping up. I'll see if I can find a way to get my turns done more quickly, but I may have to back off to 72hr QH.

[odd_enuf]

I'd say it was bad, i alone killed off a wished for nataraja with 3-5 artifacts, a large army including a bunch of storm devils, and 25 commanders, including 6+ fully decked out titans, several who were enslaved minded

[Edi]

I don't know what I've done, but apparently Thufir's forging industry has suffered some setbacks due to long distance artillery I provided...

Edi

[Thufir]

Working on my turn now - this time my excuse is that I've had the flu since New Year's Eve http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif


odd_enuf said:
I'd say it was bad, i alone killed off a wished for nataraja with 3-5 artifacts, a large army including a bunch of storm devils, and 25 commanders, including 6+ fully decked out titans, several who were enslaved minded



odd_enuf, you exaggerate a bit methinks. However, simply killing my Nataraja was devestating enough. Your paralysis spam was a surprise, and a most excellent anti-SC tactic! I debated a long time whether to use the burning pearl or amulet of anti-magic in the Natarajas spare slot - I now am wondering how that battle would've gone had I chosen the amulet instead.

[Edi]

All right, I'm officially done for. I just lost six or seven provinces to ghostriders, had some of those taken over by blackhawks, had all of my SCs killed, or worse, charmed, and most of my remaining army destroyed.

My fire gem income has also been significantly cut due to Eternal Pyre being dispelled, I imagine Thufir was getting tired of having Skyfire raining down on his armies...

Anyway, the sum total of my situation is that what I can do from now on will be the feeble twitching of a near-corpse, and I certainly don't have anything capable of dealing with 6+ fully equipped Tartarians, a King of Fire, charmers, a Heliophagus and now two fully equipped Arch Devils (Ethanim and Furcas), and certainly not while having between three and six ghost riders or more cast at me every turn (because I hadn't managed to madcastle everything).

I'm not going AI quite yet, there's still some ways of hitting back and if nothing else, dumping my gems and items for someone who can make better use of them when I'm too far gone to do anything effective.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Ouch... somehow it didnt look that bad from my perspective!

[Soapyfrog]

Is this game dead? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Edi]

Seems that way to me, the hosting deadline has been repeatedly extended so that I haven't even bothered to check for the past three days. I'll play my turn when a new one becomes available, but so far it's been hanging on Thufir.

Edi

[odd_enuf]

yea, if thufir can't keep up a schedual, he should stop resetting the time and iethor accept the stales or go AI, its not fair to the rest of us.

odd_enuf

[Edi]

Hmm, this thread has not been active in a long time, but looks like the game is slowly but surely coming to a close. Odd_enuf is going to win this one, but I'm susprised I'm still even around. I imagine Soapy is not a very happy camper after what I've done to several of his armies that have poked their noses in through the wrong door...

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Heheh, well I am not unhappy per se. I have only slowly lost ground vs Atlantis, and managed to inflict some nice setbacks to him.

That said he has OBSCENE resources, and with Man idling and giving up all his territory to Atlantis I would give myself, overall, a snowball's chance in hell of victory.

Still its pretty fun to fling 600 devil armies around.

Thats a LOT of summer lions you have there Edi! Heheh very very impressive http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Edi]

Well, I didn't really have anything else to do with my fire gems that would have done me any good, and I had a lot of idling F3 mages around. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Unfortunately I think I'm soon out of tricks. Did you check your email, by the way?

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Yea and I responded... did you not get it?

[Edi]

Yeah, I did. Just hadn't gotten the reply when I posted that.

[Soapyfrog]

This game is crazy... !!!!!

[Soapyfrog]

Well after that last battle (1000 units on each side! Alas I lost it pretty badly...) I am prepared to say that I can no longer even pretend to conduct offensive operations.

From here on our, it will just be desperate resistance and house to house fighting http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Edi]

Excuse me, but what the hell has just been happening? I've been away for about a week or so, and checking the game now, everything seems to have gone crazy! I've got almost all of my units in the middle of Atlantis territory with no idea how they got there, being hammered by Murdering Winter, half my commanders are presumably dead and everything else has gone to hell in a handbasket as well. Not that I had any hope of winning or anything, but this was just a big "WTF?!" experience.

Thufir has been gone for a long time, so I don't know if there is any real sense actually continuing to the bitter finish. I'll be dead of dominion drain in short order anyway.

Edi

[Soapyfrog]

Heheh I think Atlantis is just practciing beating up on us.

I am putting up a token resistance but yes the end is quite inevitable.