Newbie ?? re: Spell Damage

[FarAway Pretender]

I'm wondering if somebody can help me understand (or point me to a reference work that explains) how different types of spell damage get calculated.

Star Fire is listed as doing "5+ armor negating" damage. Am I correct to assume this means actual damage to an opponent would be: (5+2open-ended d6) - (2d6 OE), with no bonus for Armor? I assume this is also the way Lightning Bolt, Orb Lighting, and Thunder Strike work, and haven't been able to find instances where it doesn't happen...

Fire Darts are listed as doing "10 AP" damage. Does this mean damage is:

(10 + 2d6 OE) - ((Protection/2)+ 2d6 OE); or
(10) - ((Protection/2) + 2d6 OE); or just
10 - (Protection/2)


Similarly, Astral Fires is listed as doing "10 AN" damage, if the victim fails an MR. I assume this is:

10 - 2d6 OE (Armor is negated)

After much experimenting, I often only do a couple points damage to targets with this spell, and I've never been able to confirm that I ever do more than 10, even against big targets like Jotun units?

Do I also do more damage with some (all?) spells if I'm higher level in that Magic? Does a Fireball cast by a Lvl 9 Fire spellcaster do any more damage than the same Fireball cast by a Lvl. 2 Fire spellcaster? If there is any bonus, does it apply to all damage-dealing spells, or only some?

Any guidance any body could offer would be much appreciated!

[Graeme Dice]

FarAway Pretender said:
I correct to assume this means actual damage to an opponent would be: (5+2open-ended d6) - (2d6 OE), with no bonus for Armor?



All damage rolls work in this manner, no matter what the source of the damage.


(10 + 2d6 OE) - ((Protection/2)+ 2d6 OE);



This is the correct one.


Do I also do more damage with some (all?) spells if I'm higher level in that Magic?



That depends on whether there is a + after the damage of the spell. Fire darts and falling fires do not do increased damage, fire ball does.

[Zooko]

Does "+" mean "add 2d6-OE and add bonusses for caster's level"? Or does it just mean "add bonusses for caster's level" and all damage even without the "+" gets the 2d6-OE?

[Graeme Dice]

Zooko said:
Does "+" mean "add 2d6-OE and add bonusses for caster's level"? Or does it just mean "add bonusses for caster's level" and all damage even without the "+" gets the 2d6-OE?



Every single damage roll in the game is handled as:
damage + 2d6oe - effective_protection - 2d6oe
There are no execptions to this rule. I have no idea what you are asking otherwise.

[Arralen]

Every spell damage gets +(2D6oe).

DAM 10+ means the spell does the listed damage (10 + 2D6oe) if the caster meets the requirements, and bonus damage for every additional level in the path that is listed first. How much, I'm not shure, though.

[Kristoffer O]

As Arralen says + means higher dmg with higher lvl. THe amount varies from spell to spell, but is about +1 for spells with dmg 1-10, +2 for spells with dmg 10-20. Some spells have higher bonuses, but that is rare (thunder strike IIRC and banefire). In the case of fatigue dmg it might be +5 / lvl (ghost grip).

[Zooko]

Thanks for the explanations!

[Zooko]

So, is it +3 for spells with dmg 20-30?

[FarAway Pretender]

Cool! Thank you so much for the clarification(s)!! Really does help me a lot, and also affects the spells I'll be casting going forward (with some of my spellcasters, at least!). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Zooko]

Yeah, I just decided that my 9-Fire, 9-Astral Flaming Head Baphomet really ought to cast Power of the Spheres, Phoenix Power, Summon Fire Elemental, Luck, Holy Pyre.

Don't tell Argitoth.

[archaeolept]

ooh, also check astral fires...

and living fire, the mass elemental spell, would give you 11 elementals...

[Zooko]

Those are way too advanced for my simple-minded nation of campaigning religious fanatics.

Also Astral Fires doesn't have "+" damage, and magic resistance negates. Bleah. Oooh, but I see that the area of effect has a "+" on it. Cool. If my mages ever get tired of throwing themselves into battle and decided to do some research, we'll look into that.

[Kristoffer O]

Fire Darts is very fun at the early stages if your pretender has 8-10 in fire. Dmg is only 10, but 10-12 darts is still very useful unless the opponents have heavy armors. Besides the dmg is armor piercing.

[deccan]

Zooko said:
Yeah, I just decided that my 9-Fire, 9-Astral Flaming Head Baphomet really ought to cast Power of the Spheres, Phoenix Power, Summon Fire Elemental, Luck, Holy Pyre.




Oooh! So that's what you have. Lucky I didn't start next to you. You must have really kick *** flagellents!

[Peter Ebbesen]

While we are at it, FarAway Pretender, spells with + to area of effect are often worth much more than they immediately would appear when cast by a high-level pretender, and potentially more dangerous than those with + to number of targets. Standard examples include Shadow BLast and Falling Frost, both of which are extremely vicious at high levels.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Zooko said:
Also Astral Fires doesn't have "+" damage, and magic resistance negates.



True, but higher skill helps you bypass the target's MR more easily (+1 bonus for each 2 levels above the spell requirements - ie, +3 with your Baphomet).

[Zooko]

Oh, yeah, I love my double-bless flagellants! They get two attacks (with flails), each one getting +4 to attack, and the 8 extra a.p. damage. Also, their attacks are considered magic so they ignore etherealness. And my Pretender's Astral-9 gives flagellants Twist Fate so that it is hard to kill them before they get off their attacks. :-)

Unfortunately, having taken drain-3 dominion in order to pay for this, I find myself governing a nation of ignoramouses, whose greatest achievement in the magic arts is Conjuration level 5.

[Zooko]

Astral Fires has area of effect 4+. It requires Fire-3 and Astral-1. Now suppose I cast it with a Pretender who has Fire-9 and Astral-9. Would it effect 18 squares??

If my Pretender first casts Power of the Spheres and Phoenix Power and then casts Astral Fires, would it effect 20 squares?

[Arralen]

It's only the first of the listed paths that counts. So you're casting at +6 only

[Endoperez]

Peter Ebbesen said:
While we are at it, FarAway Pretender, spells with + to area of effect are often worth much more than they immediately would appear when cast by a high-level pretender, and potentially more dangerous than those with + to number of targets. Standard examples include Shadow BLast and Falling Frost, both of which are extremely vicious at high levels.



Breath of Winter also seems to cover LOTS of ground when cast by Water 9 pretender... I discovered this when I was trying to get pretender/nation combo which had Golem Cult and W9E9. The idea was to research Enchantment to Claymen and after that to Enliven statues... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif I wasn't able to pull it off, however. I had to leave one of the magics at 4 or 6, IIRC. It could still be pretty nice with C'tis who can use Enchantment pretty well and has sacred, communiable Shamans to benefit from the reincigoration of the Earth blessing. Maybe I will mod something to be able to try E9 (or 8) Shamans with W9 Serpent Dancers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Cainehill]

Zooko said:
Also Astral Fires doesn't have "+" damage, and magic resistance negates. Bleah. Oooh, but I see that the area of effect has a "+" on it. Cool. If my mages ever get tired of throwing themselves into battle and decided to do some research, we'll look into that.



And a high magic pretender (or empowered + item boosted mage) not only gets a larger area of effect, but it becomes harder and harder to resist the magic. Then you add on an item or two that helps with spell penetration, and rings of sorcery and wizardry raise magic skill level _and_ penetration. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Kristoffer O]

Yep, AoE attacks hit everything in the area. Multiple target spells (blade wind) must still hit each individual target. Shields are useful against blade wind, but not against fire cloud.

Edit: hmm, there was a whole new page of Posts.

[FarAway Pretender]

Guys, you've peeled back a whole new layer of complexity and schemery to me, many thanks!!

If I ever get laid off, I just might take up this MP thing with a passion.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif