Optimal Equipment for Water Queens

[deccan]

So, like, I generally know how to equip things like air queens, ice devils, bane lords etc., but I'm wondering what the experts here would consider optimal equipment for water queens for underwater combat? Non-artefacts only please and the intention is to take underwater indies solo or in Groups of two, and perhaps defend against water incursions by land nations.

[Zen]

Customary equipment for my Water Queens:

Blood Thorn (Hellsword)
Lucky Coin (None)
Marble Armor
Starshine Skullcap (Fire Helmet)
Ring of Tamed Lighning
Amulet of Antimagic (Ring of Fire/Lucky Amulet)

Usually if they are underwater only you don't worry about fire resistance or Amulets of the Fish. If not underwater you will have to drop one thing (usually MR) to drive up onto land.

[deccan]

Ah yes, the key here is what to put in the armor slot. Marble Armor provides good protection without sacrificing defense. I should have thought of that.

And oh, does Storm work underwater?

[Tuna]

and dont forget friendly currents/water ward/water shield

[Zen]

No, storm doesn't work underwater AFAIK. Though in recent light, perhaps there should be a "Tsunami" spell.

[Phoenix-D]

Zen said:
No, storm doesn't work underwater AFAIK. Though in recent light, perhaps there should be a "Tsunami" spell.



Which wouldn't work in water either. Tsuanmis are harmless once you get just a little ways off shore..

[Turin]

I put robes of invulnerability on my waterqueens. You should have some massive forgeboni though http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif .

[Boron]

deccan said:
Ah yes, the key here is what to put in the armor slot. Marble Armor provides good protection without sacrificing defense. I should have thought of that.




Zen's suggestion is very good .

Other nice armors for WQs imo are :
-Armor of Souls , gives +5 Mr
-Robe of invulnerability
Copper plate can be worth being considered too because it gives you 100% SR so frees up 1 misc slot .
This misc slot can be nicely used by either burning pearl or ring of warrior or luck amulet or lycantrop amulet .

[Taqwus]

Lycantropos? Doesn't that force instant Berserk, which prevents the casting of Quickness? Added to that, there's the drawback of eventually turning into a skinshifter.

Armor of Souls is lovely, 'though, if you have the blood mages and blood slaves lying around, and the RoInv is decent -- although as it has no additional properties such as resistances, life-draining aura, speed, or whatever else, and Water Queens have 0 enc anyway, it might be reasonable to go with either the cheaper Marble Breastplate, or a more special armor.

Against indy tritons and thinking cheaper, I wonder how well a Shield of Gleaming Gold, a Snake Bladder Stick, a fear helmet, a rime hauberk, a dancing trident, and a luck pendant, would do. The underwater indy's aren't likely to Soul Slay or Enslave you *shrug*.

[Yossar]

Zen said:Usually if they are underwater only you don't worry about fire resistance or Amulets of the Fish. If not underwater you will have to drop one thing (usually MR) to drive up onto land.



Why shock resistance but not fire? Seems like rods of the phoenix would be a pretty decent way to take a water queen out.

[Boron]

Taqwus said:
Lycantropos? Doesn't that force instant Berserk, which prevents the casting of Quickness? Added to that, there's the drawback of eventually turning into a skinshifter.

Against indy tritons and thinking cheaper, I wonder how well a Shield of Gleaming Gold, a Snake Bladder Stick, a fear helmet, a rime hauberk, a dancing trident, and a luck pendant, would do. The underwater indy's aren't likely to Soul Slay or Enslave you *shrug*.


Oh yeah the Lycantropos Amulet is rather a bad choice for a WQ . Mea Culpa http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .
For Banelords and the like it is imo very nice though .

When would a waterqueen fight against underwater indies ?
By the time you reach conjuration 7 and construction 6 most or all underwater indies should be long gone http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Chazar]

Boron said:
When would a waterqueen fight against underwater indies ?


Maybe in games without water nations? In my view, the independents of water provinces vary quite a bit in strength, so one might grab one water province with quite some effort, and then proceed...

[Zooko]

That's what's happened in the MP game that I'm playing against Deccan. The independent underwater provinces are contested by the heat-loving human preachers of Marignon (that's me) and some shambling rotting things (that's Deccan).

[Zen]

Because most units who have Fire magic don't have water magic that enables them to go underwater. Rod's of the Phoenix are always a threat, but since you are underwater you have to drag a fairly meaty army or protection force with them if you don't want your Commanders swarmed by tritons.

Whereas Shock Resistance is always good and the majority of air spells work underwater. Also certain shock spells cause fatigue damage which is a big no-no for Sc's. It's purely a preference thing, thats why you probably want a Hellsword/Fire Helmet combo if you can get it to cover all your resistances.

If you happen to be contesting Abysia/Marignon/Machaka underwater you might want to look to fire resistance a little more.

[deccan]

Zooko said:
That's what's happened in the MP game that I'm playing against Deccan. The independent underwater provinces are contested by the heat-loving human preachers of Marignon (that's me) and some shambling rotting things (that's Deccan).



Curses! Why are you reading this thread? Go away. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Now I am sure to see Phoenix Rods against my water queens. But I have all three of them! Muahahaha!

[Zooko]

Phoenix Rods? What are those?

<with hands held behind his back>

Bphlah the Great and Firey

[Endoperez]

Rods of Phoenix. Constr. 6 item, Fire 3 (=20 gems) needed, lets wielder cast Incinerate (100 prec, range 25 spell giving 18+ an damage to one person) for 5 + base fatique.

[deccan]

Endoperez said:
Rods of Phoenix. Constr. 6 item, Fire 3 (=20 gems) needed, lets wielder cast Incinerate (100 prec, range 25 spell giving 18+ an damage to one person) for 5 + base fatique.



Um, he was joking. He most certainly knows what they are! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Endoperez]

Oh, of course. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif Hands behind the back... with fingers crossed.

[tinkthank]

Interesting that no one has mentioned the Wave Breaker as a decent weapon if you decide to go 2h. I much prefer it to a Wraith sword or other life-drainer, since the WQ regenerates completely anyhow. (Also, I dont use Marble Armor, which I otherwise love, on fighters because of the Fatigue; I prefer a Robe of Shadows. Sometimes some reinvig gear is nice too.)
The WB is not only a really decent weapon (insanely fast too), but it also gives you a free Friendly Currents. Dunno, I like it.

[Boron]

tinkthank said:
Interesting that no one has mentioned the Wave Breaker as a decent weapon if you decide to go 2h. I much prefer it to a Wraith sword or other life-drainer, since the WQ regenerates completely anyhow. (Also, I dont use Marble Armor, which I otherwise love, on fighters because of the Fatigue; I prefer a Robe of Shadows. Sometimes some reinvig gear is nice too.)
The WB is not only a really decent weapon (insanely fast too), but it also gives you a free Friendly Currents. Dunno, I like it.


I never used that weapon http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif . It looks interesting though .
3W to forge is though 20 aka 15 watergems so -2 clams http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif.

I am always very reluctant to use any spells or forge any items that need water before turn 100 because that just decreases my potential income quite a lot by neglecting me more clams http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[tinkthank]

Boron said:

tinkthank said:
Interesting that no one has mentioned the Wave Breaker as a decent weapon if you decide to go 2h. I much prefer it to a Wraith sword or other life-drainer, since the WQ regenerates completely anyhow. (Also, I dont use Marble Armor, which I otherwise love, on fighters because of the Fatigue; I prefer a Robe of Shadows. Sometimes some reinvig gear is nice too.)
The WB is not only a really decent weapon (insanely fast too), but it also gives you a free Friendly Currents. Dunno, I like it.


I never used that weapon http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif . It looks interesting though .
3W to forge is though 20 aka 15 watergems so -2 clams http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif.

I am always very reluctant to use any spells or forge any items that need water before turn 100 because that just decreases my potential income quite a lot by neglecting me more clams http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



I challenge you to post 10 Posts in a row in which you do not mention clams or hoarding!

[Boron]

tinkthank said:
I challenge you to post 10 Posts in a row in which you do not mention clams or hoarding!


Ok i will post 10 empty Posts http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif .

Seriously though I really hope that hoarding possibilities are still available or even increased in dom 3 because they make dominions special http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .

I sometimes use the sword of swiftness on my SCs as well . Good defense , 1 handed and 2 attacks . Optimal for 0 encumberance + regeneration creatures like the WQ:) . 2 hand neglects me lucky coin or other good shields so i rarely take a 2hand weapon .

[Jurri]

Boron said:
Seriously though I really hope that hoarding possibilities are still available or even increased in dom 3 because they make dominions special http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif


Whoa, dude, you're really the proverbial German with your love of micromanagement!

[Boron]

Jurri said:

Boron said:
Seriously though I really hope that hoarding possibilities are still available or even increased in dom 3 because they make dominions special http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif


Whoa, dude, you're really the proverbial German with your love of micromanagement!


If it were just true http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .
I am very often too lazy to script my mages well . If i play a nation like Arco with many randoms i don't use my Mystics to full potential for sure http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .

Imo clamhoarding is the least microintensive thing in dominions .
Detailed battle scripting or detailed equipping of many SCs is imo much more microintensive and i am often very lazy there http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif .

I have a good candidate though for the proverbial German with immense Micromanagement http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif .

Voila , the first place goes to Nebukadnezar .
If you know the game Victoria ( you can do there at least 10times more Micromanagement then in Dom 2 ) then read the following AARs from Nebukadnezar (you have to understand german at least a bit):
- http://www.si-games.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5147
- http://www.si-games.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4667
- http://www.si-games.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6498

Really highly recommended and entertaining lecture if you are a victoria fan http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

P.S. : don't read if you are new to victoria , only read if you know the game quite well . Otherwise you may be demotivated after reading the AARs http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Huzurdaddi]

Seriously though I really hope that hoarding possibilities are still available or even increased in dom 3 because they make dominions special




The ROI on the investment vehicles in Dom2 are far too high on large maps, a little too high on maps like Aran, and just about right on the 3 player maps.

[Boron]

Huzurdaddi said:


Seriously though I really hope that hoarding possibilities are still available or even increased in dom 3 because they make dominions special




The ROI on the investment vehicles in Dom2 are far too high on large maps, a little too high on maps like Aran, and just about right on the 3 player maps.



Depends strongly if you play an underwater nation or not though .
With underwater nations i agree with your statement .

With land nations though if you hoard too much you lose really a lot potentially by flames from the sky then because they kill hidden scouts also .

[Zooko]

Does Purgatory kill hidden undead scouts?
Deccan: stop reading this thread!

[deccan]

Hahaha, too late! So that's what you're planning...

Remember though that Purgatory only works in your dominion and so far as I know I have no troops anywhere near your dominion.