Is this possible.

[troopie]

I would like to do a generated campaign, Rhodesia vs Zimbabwe, April 1966 to March 1980, the whole Bush War. I can't pick Zimbabwe before Jan 1980. Using the Mod feature can I, set up a custom orbat with the Zimbos using a slot that is available during those years, select that, and use it for a campaign?

Dankie.

troopie

[Mobhack]

troopie said:
I would like to do a generated campaign, Rhodesia vs Zimbabwe, April 1966 to March 1980, the whole Bush War. I can't pick Zimbabwe before Jan 1980. Using the Mod feature can I, set up a custom orbat with the Zimbos using a slot that is available during those years, select that, and use it for a campaign?

Dankie.

troopie



The availability dates and nation numbers are in the "Historical Design Notes" section of the manual. Zimbabwe replaces Rhodesia (and uses its button position) in 5/80.

So - nope.

Someone has put ZIPRA etc forces in the Zimbabwe OOB, presumably to use date cheats to be able to make scenarios between the 2. But apart from that, there is no way to make generated battles or campaigns between these 2.

You'll therefore need to use a neighbouring country such as Mozambique (possibly with editing) - use the existing formations as a base, and/or analyse the AI pick when you do that, of course.

The country you choose will have a significant outcome on battle locations for map generation, so choose something geographically close.

Or - put the Zimbabwe forces into thr Rhodesian OOB, and formations anywhere free. Then you could play Zimbabwe against the AI with both sides using the same OOB - As a human you can choose at will, and the AI will choose off the normal Rhodesian forces pick.

Cheers
Andy

[troopie]

It can be done, if you pick an orbat with appropriate years. Also, pick something with similar terrain. And they you just restore the default OOBs.

L.W, write down which nation you use, so you don't forget.

troopie

[Artur]

You could pick the Red force as ZIPRA force. It has Soviet hardware.

Artur.

[Mobhack]

Artur said:
You could pick the Red force as ZIPRA force. It has Soviet hardware.

Artur.



That will do the trick, RED generates various battle locations depending on the pairing, such as the balkans etc.

I just tried RHO vs RED and it generated "southern Africa" battle location in a genrated battle in 1970.

You would probably need to play around with the RED OOB to make it a viable ZIPRA/ZANU/TERR OOB.

- Use the Custom OOBS folder to put your modified OOB into iof course! and use the file maid function to load that or the stock RED as required.

As you probably don't want much armour inthe OPFOR:
- edit the armoured formations to be infantry formations of an acceptable type for the year.
- Edit the artillery formations to be more "insurgent" stuff if they do not have access to say field gun batteries.
- The helo and air are a problem. Edit the old air strike and any attack helos and transport helo formations to some sort of insurgent "special" that it would take if the AI were offered air strikes (A mortar unit say).
- AA formations may need rewriting to an AAMG or whatever.

In other words - use formation edits to get what you want.

Copy the existing infantry from the ZIM list (or use them as a base).

NB - you will need to decide if it is a random pick of say ZANU and ZIPRA. (You could just label them all as "Ter Rifle sec" say, and forget about any differences).

If you need a separate pick - make 2 edited red OOBs, one ZANU, one ZIPRA, and put one in a new "Custom OOBS" sub-folder and load the rquired one as necessary with the file maid. OR - since RHO never fought SA - maybe edit the SA OOB as the other terr force and put that in the same custom OOB folder, e.g if you want a campaign against both with differing detail in the OOBS.



Cheers
Andy

[Mobhack]

troopie said:
It can be done, if you pick an orbat with appropriate years. Also, pick something with similar terrain. And they you just restore the default OOBs.

L.W, write down which nation you use, so you don't forget.

troopie



Troopie

I've redone RED as a quick base for an AI insurgent mod for use vs RHO. You should be able to hack that till it is more suitable. You'll find it in the OOBS section.

Cheers
Andy

[cbreedon]

Any chance of getting the work around back? In the Dos version you could pick E Germany, for example, on the battle screen with a date before 1990, then once you have picked them you could change the dates to a date after 1990 and E Germany would stay. You had to go into the OB and change all the dates past 1990, but you could get around the dates issue.

From what I have seen you can't do that anymore. The dates won't go past 1990 for E Germany.

It looks like the win version is the wave of the future and it has better features and will be a much better game, but I would really like to have the "work around" back....

[Mobhack]

cbreedon said:
Any chance of getting the work around back? In the Dos version you could pick E Germany, for example, on the battle screen with a date before 1990, then once you have picked them you could change the dates to a date after 1990 and E Germany would stay. You had to go into the OB and change all the dates past 1990, but you could get around the dates issue.

From what I have seen you can't do that anymore. The dates won't go past 1990 for E Germany.

It looks like the win version is the wave of the future and it has better features and will be a much better game, but I would really like to have the "work around" back....



It was not a "work around" - it was a bug that let users select nations past thier end dates, so in the campaign it would choose empty forces. Now fixed.

Cheers
Andy

[cbreedon]

it was a nice bug....... I have been building a hypothetical E German OB for past 1990 and played it quite often. Oh well....

[PlasmaKrab]

Mobhack said:
It was not a "work around" - it was a bug that let users select nations past thier end dates, so in the campaign it would choose empty forces. Now fixed.




But how does this fix work? Or the original bug exploit, as well?

Hah, forget it, I guess you aren't allowed to tell how it works! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

All I wanted to know was this:

You must have some reference file telling the game which country starts and ends at which dates.
Would there be any slightest chance that, someday, in some release, this reference could turn into an external, humanly understandable file?
So every weird modder (me for one http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif ) could create their own timeline.
And even link it to the PBEM compatibility check as with the oobs, to prevent cheats http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif.

Alright I know I have been buggering you with unfeasible tweaks for months, but I really had to ask for this one.

Best Regards Andy,

Plasma

[Mobhack]

Nope - it is buried in the code for e.g. pages with lists of buttons. Sub routines to choose flag by date, etc.

Andy

[Jaakko]

Suggestion:
The 'Zimbabwe' OOB availability date should be changed to 1964/5 for simple historical reasons alone ("Bush War"/"Second Chimurenga"). The forces of which it's composed of prior to the establishment of the state of Zimbabwe co-existed with the state of Rhodesia until its dissolution. Therefore the rather technical/jurisprudent historical fact that the state of Zimbabwe didn't exist prior to the dissolution of Rhodesia (via the transitional state of 'Zimbabwe-Rhodesia') is of little significance game-wise, at least in what comes to the availability date of the OOB in question. Compare how the OOBs of 'Viet Cong' and 'ARVN' are treated, with the exception that there's no gameplay-relevant reason to separate the state of Zimbabwe and the insurgents that preceded it into two OOBs (like VC and NVA are). So, why not keep them in one OOB while making it available earlier?

[cbreedon]

troopie said:
It can be done, if you pick an orbat with appropriate years. Also, pick something with similar terrain. And they you just restore the default OOBs.

L.W, write down which nation you use, so you don't forget.

troopie



Troopie

I've redone RED as a quick base for an AI insurgent mod for use vs RHO. You should be able to hack that till it is more suitable. You'll find it in the OOBS section.

Cheers
Andy
Is this file available somewhere? I know it is old but it sounds interesting?

[Mobhack]

troopie said:
It can be done, if you pick an orbat with appropriate years. Also, pick something with similar terrain. And they you just restore the default OOBs.

L.W, write down which nation you use, so you don't forget.

troopie



Troopie

I've redone RED as a quick base for an AI insurgent mod for use vs RHO. You should be able to hack that till it is more suitable. You'll find it in the OOBS section.

Cheers
Andy
Is this file available somewhere? I know it is old but it sounds interesting?

Lets see - you necroed a 2005 thread.

So you could go to the TO&E sub forum, and go back to 2005 and have a look.

Just like I did, it only took about 1 minute of clicking on page links till 2005 appeared. Then I zeroed in on one that lookes like the item in question: http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=24387

NB - be aware that it is a 2005 OOB, and things may have changed. Also - it is a base OOB for the OP to play with, not a finished item.

Andy

[cbreedon]

cheers

I did a couple of different searches but didn't come up with anything...

I do love the sarcasm though :-) but I appreciate your help

Craig

[Jaakko]

Just checked how this is in the latest version of the game. No, Zimbabwe doesn't replace Rhodesia. They're two separate OOBs in the game, as they should be. Now could the availability of the Zimbabwe OOB be extended back to 1965 in the next update, so for a period of time it would co-exist with the Rhodesia OOB?

[DRG]

Given we've been extremely busy with other OOB issues and this has not been even a third level priority and given the patches are going to be released in about a month and we still have a months worth of work to do the short answer is no.

Don

[shahadi]

I would like to do a generated campaign, Rhodesia vs Zimbabwe, April 1966 to March 1980, the whole Bush War. I can't pick Zimbabwe before Jan 1980. Using the Mod feature can I, set up a custom orbat with the Zimbos using a slot that is available during those years, select that, and use it for a campaign?

Dankie.

troopie

Interesting. So many dimensions to the Bush Wars: geopolitical (the whole East/West thing played out in Southern Africa), militarily, and culturally. I played a battle based on the Xangongo, Angola battle featuring the SADF 61 Mech Battle Group vs FAPLA/SWAPO brigades, "Operation Protea" occurred 23 August, 1981. So, what's your primary source of material these battles?