OT: Dwarf Fortress

[Endoperez]

Imagine Dungeon Keeper. Now imagine that the imps were dwarves. Finally, imagine that you only had imps, and everything else you met would try to kill your imps.

That's Dwarf Fortress. There are other small differences, like the fact that you can't slap your lazy minions with a virtual hand to make them work faster. You can drown them, though, or lock them in their rooms.

The game is hard, unforgiving and probably unwinnable. Fortunately, losing is fun.

The game is almost revolutionary in the things it has already incorporated. It already generates geographical and political worlds with bit of history and populates them, generates areas based on rainfall, temperature etc, has a bodyparts system which allows for some gory descriptions, has information that's mostly unnecessary (to make steel: mine hematite, smelt it with charcoal made from wood, smelt iron bar with some limestone and charcoal into pig iron, smelt another iron bar with the pig iron and piece of limestone and two pieces of charcoal for a steel bar - or die before you find anything but galena, silver ore), forces you to get food, water and lodging for your dwarves but sends in nobles whose demands make the other dwarves insane (and penniless and starving) just when you started to like them... Insanity includes berserking. Nobles whose demands AREN'T fulfilled go insane and kill the working dwarves (at least those of them who the Sheriff hasn't thrown in jail for ignoring a noble's orders).

It is still in Alpha, and as said, even if you can't win it, you can enjoy it. The game runs on Windows, and can run on Linux under Wine (at least). Unfortunately, Macs aren't supported yet.


The game itself:
http://bay12games.com/dwarves/screens/choosing_building.html


Some screenshots:
Geographical map of the world. WARNING, 700+ kt.
http://bay12games.com/dwarves/screens/world_map1.PNG

Here the seven dwarves are getting ready for their journey.
http://bay12games.com/dwarves/screens/prepare_journey.html


The beginning: a wagon and the dwarves standing in heavily-forested mountainside:
http://bay12games.com/dwarves/screens/start_at_cliff.html

Here the area just outside the cliff is already cleared of trees, the first few building are up and stone stockpile is already filling up. Carpenter is on his way inside, and his trusty but useless-as-of-yet mule following him. Inside, a rudimentary meeting hall has already been constructed and a well has been mined to its center; north of the hall are the first few quarters reserved for the dwarves, while there's a small room fit for industry in the east, as well as some dark stone (jet, onyx or obsidian) to be mined and used for crafts to trade for food before the winter comes.
http://bay12games.com/dwarves/screens/choosing_building.html


Oh, and the game uses extended ASCII graphics. That's a good thing. I wouldn't like to see HOW, exactly, my hunter who ran out of bolts managed to severe that poor fox's left hind paw from its body, or how long the animal suffered when he forgot the animal existed. Or how, exactly, an extremely strong Legendary Engraver unskilled in the art of Wrestling managed to severe the head of a berserking Craftsdwarf. Or what an obsidian crown menacing with spikes of Tin and decorated by pictures of rats in Opal looks like. Not to mention the Flint trumpets!


P.S.
There's a reason for me not posting this before Dom3 had gone gold. This is quite addictive. I'm not sure if this particular addiction one wears down before October, but that's not necessarily a bad things, is it?

[tibbs]

This looks like a nice game to play at work when there is no work to do.

[quantum_mechani]

You know, it's funny, I just happened to stumble upon this exact game yesterday...

It's quite addictive, but people who think the dominions interface is arcane should be forewarned- you haven't seen anything yet. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Endoperez]

quantum_mechani said:
You know, it's funny, I just happened to stumble upon this exact game yesterday...

It's quite addictive, but people who think the dominions interface is arcane should be forewarned- you haven't seen anything yet. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif



Information about it has spread like a wildfire. Few weeks ago, it was unknown. Now it's been mentioned on some big forums, many smaller ones, and few big sites. The creator is in a bit of trouble... He can't read through all the posts in his forum, as an example. I think he now gets more posts in few hours than he used to get in a week.

[Kristoffer O]

JO is currently occupying one of Illwinter's computers hacking away in the deeps of the earth http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Agrajag]

Dungeon Keeper with no evil minions?
Where's the fun in that? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

And while I'm all for old (and old looking) games, when you go all the way to ASCII, you've gone too far for me.

[PhilD]

I guess that's what you get for trying Alpha releases, but the absence of a tutorial or even a manual file that you can read to get you through the first few minutes of the game tends to put me off. Too bad - the game seems to have a lot of stuff included, but that much (apparent?) complexity and no help dealing with it...

[Endoperez]

Kristoffer O said:
JO is currently occupying one of Illwinter's computers hacking away in the deeps of the earth http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



Ha! There, have a taste of your own medicine! The taste of addiction, the heat of a computer that has been on for too long - now you know what you've forced us to endure! (and enjoy, but that's beside the point) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif



Agrajag said:
Dungeon Keeper with no evil minions?
Where's the fun in that? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

And while I'm all for old (and old looking) games, when you go all the way to ASCII, you've gone too far for me.



The dwarves mightn't start as evil, but they sure go nuts fast... At least that's what I get from reading the forums. My first fort is still running for some reason, even with all the really strange decision I made.

ASCII can be hard, and it's especially confusing for this game. It has so much stuff that it'd need a huge tileset - the characters just make the game almost playable. Proper graphics might come in once the alpha has matured into a full-grown game, but that'll take years. At least.


PhilD said:
I guess that's what you get for trying Alpha releases, but the absence of a tutorial or even a manual file that you can read to get you through the first few minutes of the game tends to put me off. Too bad - the game seems to have a lot of stuff included, but that much (apparent?) complexity and no help dealing with it...



It does have a simple manual that gets you started - but for some reason, it starts from * instead of ?. For me, at least. I think it uses the US keyboard layout or something, because < and > work from my ; and : .

[Amos]

Its too bad he canceled "Slaves to Armok: God of Blood". I was following that game from the beginning.

[PhilD]

It does have a simple manual that gets you started - but for some reason, it starts from * instead of ?. For me, at least. I think it uses the US keyboard layout or something, because < and > work from my ; and : .



I'm using a US keyboard myself, so the ? key does work. But the ingame help has several problems for me - first, it's not exactly fun to read it on screen (I tend to print anything that I intend to really read), and second, it's not organized too well.

The Wiki, though, might provide some help. I'll try to see how it goes.

[DominionsFan]

This game looks very interesting. I will give it a try for sure. Thanks for letting us know about it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[tibbs]

Nevermind. I figured it out. Thanks

Ok, im playing the game and trying to figure it out, but I can't get my dwarves to mine anything. I set up two dwarves at the beginning with the mining skill but they don't seem to do anything and I can't figure out how to select the area to mine.

Thanks for any help,
Chris

[Endoperez]

tibbs said:
Nevermind. I figured it out. Thanks

Ok, im playing the game and trying to figure it out, but I can't get my dwarves to mine anything. I set up two dwarves at the beginning with the mining skill but they don't seem to do anything and I can't figure out how to select the area to mine.

Thanks for any help,
Chris



'd'esignate

mine stone or cut wood for raw materials with which to build buildings. Some buildings require processed goods. Stone blocks are made in the mason's workshop, and can be used instead of normal stone almost everywhere, but the difference is minimal. However, stone blocks and wooden buckets (made in the carpener's worshop) are needed for wells, which help quite a bit.

[DominionsFan]

I just generated a new world and started to play. This game is very confusing at first look, I think it will take some time to figure out what to do. This ASCII gfx is also "hardcore" at first.

[Reverend_MrBlack]

I'm really enjoying this game! Something to do until Oct. 2nd, I guess.

Thanks for linking to it.

[PhilD]

OK, what I don't seem to get is this thing about stockpiles. When creating a stockpile, are you just designating a zone (supposedly inside your fortress) where dwarves are supposed to drop stuff? And do you need one square per item?

(I Managed to get a few dwarves to dig in the mountain, but I apparently cannot build a bed to create a bedroom; and I don't see a way to craft stuff)

[quantum_mechani]

PhilD said:
OK, what I don't seem to get is this thing about stockpiles. When creating a stockpile, are you just designating a zone (supposedly inside your fortress) where dwarves are supposed to drop stuff? And do you need one square per item?

(I Managed to get a few dwarves to dig in the mountain, but I apparently cannot build a bed to create a bedroom; and I don't see a way to craft stuff)

I had this exact problem. Found out you have to first build a carpenter's shop (under workshops) then order it to create a bed then when it's done place the bed through the building menu.

Btw, has anyone managed farming or fishing yet? I got so frustrated with them, my last dwarf fort I just spent most my points on bringing food stockpiles so I didn't have to worry about it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Endoperez]

PhilD said:
OK, what I don't seem to get is this thing about stockpiles. When creating a stockpile, are you just designating a zone (supposedly inside your fortress) where dwarves are supposed to drop stuff? And do you need one square per item?

(I Managed to get a few dwarves to dig in the mountain, but I apparently cannot build a bed to create a bedroom; and I don't see a way to craft stuff)



Stockpiles - that's correct. 'p' for those who haven't found the feature yet. You can build bins in the Carpenter's workshop, which store more things in them. Some things, like raw stone and wood, don't go into bins. You can't decide how the dwarves use bins, though, so you can just hope they go where you want them to go. Barrels are bins for food. They also keep food from spoiling.

Stockpiles can also be put outside. Wood stockpile might be easier to have outside. Carpenter's workshop can also be outside. You MUST build refuse stockpile outside. Refuse rots, and becomes - MIASMA! Luckily, it isn't quite as ominous as I first thought. I only makes dwarves unhappy, which is still pretty severe but not instant death sentence.

To "build" furniture you need one piece of furniture made in the Mason's or the Carpenter's workshop. Beds can only be made from wood, so you need a carpenter. Coffins/Caskets, Thrones/Chairs and various other items can be built in both. Buckets, needed for wells and for bringing water for wounded, can be made from wood or metal, but wood is much easier to get.

[Archonsod]

Endoperez said:
Refuse rots, and becomes - MIASMA! Luckily, it isn't quite as ominous as I first thought. I only makes dwarves unhappy, which is still pretty severe but not instant death sentence.



It can cause problems if dwarves stay in it too long.I've seen a dwarf faint due to prolonged miasma, and I suspect it can eventually cause death.

I find the essentials for the starting colony are a carpenter's workshop, a mason's workshop and at least one food workshop, depending on what your using (fish cleaners for fishing, butcher for hunting). A mechanist is also essential to get your farming industry up. Try and build a well as soon as possible to make a meeting hall (just be careful of frogmen spawning from it), a barracks (a room with several beds) and head east till you hit the river.
Remember to designate the area for tree cutting - fairly common newbie mistake.
I also find it a good idea to take along a number of dogs. War dogs are much more powerful than armed dwarves until you can build decent weapons, and a hunting dog tends to die far less than training a dwarf as a hunter (btw if your taking the hunting route, remember to give the dwarf some combat skills).A cat can be useful to keep the number of rats and similar down.

[DominionsFan]

I just dont understand, that why is this execellent game uses ASCII as "gfx". Its very annoying imho. It would take 1-2 days to create basic tiles and add them to the game. Even if those tiles would be ugly, it would be much better then ASCII.
The game is a pearl, I must say. Its really addictive and complex. Also its got a great potential. [Hopefully we will see real gfx in the game sometime soon]

[PhilD]

DominionsFAN: they say it's currently an Alpha release, and everything is likely to change enough that creating graphics for now would be a waste.

No, for me... I can't figure how to build a well. I've made stone blocks, and a bucket, but I can't find the menu to build a well... (same goes for fishery: one of my guys is a fisherdwarf, but I haven't managed to build a fishery, so I guess all that he fishes just rots away...)

Got my first immigrant: a metalsmith. Well, I can build him a nice workshop, but since I haven't found any ore at the moment, I guess he'll be mostly useful for moving stuff around http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Archonsod]

Well & fisheries are on the building lists. Just scroll them down (you have figured out that you can do that, right?)

[Endoperez]

DominionsFAN said:
I just dont understand, that why is this execellent game uses ASCII as "gfx". Its very annoying imho. It would take 1-2 days to create basic tiles and add them to the game. Even if those tiles would be ugly, it would be much better then ASCII.
The game is a pearl, I must say. Its really addictive and complex. Also its got a great potential. [Hopefully we will see real gfx in the game sometime soon]



The problem is that there's lots of stuff in the game that's going to go away. It's easier to add things when Toady One (the creator) doesn't have to worry about tiles. Making GOOD tiles is actually pretty hard. How to make a bed that looks like a bed? You can't go for details, and if it's more abstract, it might still be pretty close to an '8'.

Also...
You might've noticed that this is game number II. This game is built on "Slaves to Armok: God of Blood" (Amos mentioned in it the first page). That game had simple 3d-graphics. It seems graphics weren't the reason he stopped that project, but the fact that Toady One can do something like that gives me much hope for the game once its finished. It'll probably take years to get to that point, though... Have you seen his Req and Bloat lists? Those are things he will and things he would like to introduce into the game. Things like this:

Bloat144, DISEASE AND INFECTION, (Future): Disease and infection. Get some from swamp or blood drinking. Hearty creatures (like dwarves) shouldn't be affected so much. The absence of a spleen can increase the chance of septicemia. Infections of some wounds, especially if you are dirty, leprosy type stuff, plagues. Tumors, especially those caused by magic. The kidneys, spleen, liver, stomach and pancreas should have functions that are reduced by damage.

[Agrajag]

I take it back, this is a fun game, thanks for linking.
I started playing at ~22:00 last night only to realize its suddenly 00:30.
Also, surprisingly enough, after only a little roaming around the website I found the game to be quite easy to understand. Obviously I'm not at the stage of being a master dungeoneer (or even a good one) but I can enjoy the game without constant feelings of confusion http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[PhilD]

Archonsod said:
Well & fisheries are on the building lists. Just scroll them down (you have figured out that you can do that, right?)



Well, no... the interface is somewhat confusing, and I didn't find a way to scroll down these lists! How do you do that?

[quantum_mechani]

PhilD said:

Archonsod said:
Well & fisheries are on the building lists. Just scroll them down (you have figured out that you can do that, right?)



Well, no... the interface is somewhat confusing, and I didn't find a way to scroll down these lists! How do you do that?

Press ecape and look in the key bindings under 'move secondary selector'. That key should let you scroll through lists you couldn't otherwise.

[Endoperez]

PhilD said:Well, no... the interface is somewhat confusing, and I didn't find a way to scroll down these lists! How do you do that?



Well, that does make things quite a bit harder...

-/+ , or up/down arrows. If one doesn't work, try the other. PageUp/PageDown work if arrows work, / and * do the same if + and - work.

[Agrajag]

Instead, I'd just look at the interface more carefully, IIRC it shows you how to move your selection, written on the bottom of the screen. (Default is +/-)

As for the US/EU keyboard, what is the difference between the two keyboards? Is the layout different or is it something else? (For me '?' works as you'd expect it)

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

DominionsFAN said:
I just dont understand, that why is this execellent game uses ASCII as "gfx". Its very annoying imho. It would take 1-2 days to create basic tiles and add them to the game. Even if those tiles would be ugly, it would be much better then ASCII.
The game is a pearl, I must say. Its really addictive and complex. Also its got a great potential. [Hopefully we will see real gfx in the game sometime soon]



The problem is that there's lots of stuff in the game that's going to go away. It's easier to add things when Toady One (the creator) doesn't have to worry about tiles. Making GOOD tiles is actually pretty hard. How to make a bed that looks like a bed? You can't go for details, and if it's more abstract, it might still be pretty close to an '8'.

Also...
You might've noticed that this is game number II. This game is built on "Slaves to Armok: God of Blood" (Amos mentioned in it the first page). That game had simple 3d-graphics. It seems graphics weren't the reason he stopped that project, but the fact that Toady One can do something like that gives me much hope for the game once its finished. It'll probably take years to get to that point, though... Have you seen his Req and Bloat lists? Those are things he will and things he would like to introduce into the game. Things like this:

Bloat144, DISEASE AND INFECTION, (Future): Disease and infection. Get some from swamp or blood drinking. Hearty creatures (like dwarves) shouldn't be affected so much. The absence of a spleen can increase the chance of septicemia. Infections of some wounds, especially if you are dirty, leprosy type stuff, plagues. Tumors, especially those caused by magic. The kidneys, spleen, liver, stomach and pancreas should have functions that are reduced by damage.



Well the problem is, that the dev[s] dont have an artist who will make the graphic tiles. If they could find someone to do it, it would be easy to add new tiles with all patch.

Anyways, this game is really awesome, its very complex, I cant stop playing. Its extremely addictive. The developer [toady one] must be a master programmer. Hats off. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[PhilD]

Agrajag said:
Instead, I'd just look at the interface more carefully, IIRC it shows you how to move your selection, written on the bottom of the screen. (Default is +/-)




I managed to scroll the list with * and /, I believe. I wouldn't have tried them if I hadn't known it was there to try, though.



As for the US/EU keyboard, what is the difference between the two keyboards? Is the layout different or is it something else? (For me '?' works as you'd expect it)



There is no "EU" layout; it seems that every country in Europe has its own "standard" keyboard layout http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

"UK" keyboards have some differences from the US layout, though I can live with the difference.

French keyboards use a different order for letters (AZERTY... instead of QWERTY...), with more differences for other characters. Because of these differences, I can't use a French keyboard with any kind of speed, and it's even worse when programming - though French keyboards have keys for accented characters, which is helpful.

I don't know what other kinds of keyboards look like, but I know there are lots of them out there - even for Latin alphabets.

[DominionsFan]

Hm, I just managed to do well finally...I had like 12 rooms, and lot of dwarves, and a small but strong army. Then I just got a sheriff, and I couldnt make him happy enough, he demanded some kind of jail or what, but I couldnt make all the required stuff. So he bacame angry and murderized like 20 dwarves, including my uber skilled miner. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif
Finally I managed to kill him, but my losses were still great.
Not so long after this, some monsters appeared and began to run after my weak little worker dwarves, they managed to kill 2, and wounded 3 others badly [1 lost his right arm http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif]. Thankfully I had nice traps, so 2 from the monsters died because they walked into them, and my army took care of the other monsters.
Damn this game is very hard and complex, but its extremely addictive. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
I think that Shrapnel should take a look at this indie game, because in like 1-2 years this game might reach beta, and I must say that its so unique and awesome, that some publishers should contact the developer immediately then.
I bet that this game would sell very good.

[Agrajag]

Without graphics it probably wouldn't sell at all http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif
As for keyboard layouts, check this out (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keyboard_layout).
Obviously mine is the Hebrew layout (though I have a Start/Win between the left Ctrl and Alt, and what they call the Menu key between the right Ctrl and Alt), although atleast here in Israel we have several variations on the layout (bigger Return/Enter button but smaller Backspace and the | and \ button is moved upwards, different buttons between Ctrls and Alts as well as a bigger Left Shift instead of the second | \ button.)

Anyway, my active fortress just reached Automn, and apparently I wasn't doing as well as I thought, I need more dwarves (specifically an architect) and my food supplies are low, I doubt if I'll survive the winter.
I also made mistakes due to my noobness (for example I have a Metalsmith Workshop, but no Smelter, I have a FisherDwarf and for some reason can't build a fishery etc.)
Quite a shame too, because I had an excellent starting position.
Maybe I'll regenerate the world (because that was the only good position http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif)

[RonD]

Agrajag said:
Without graphics it probably wouldn't sell at all http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif





the developers web site says:
Bay 12 Games is dedicated to bringing original computer games to you, free of charge.

[Agrajag]

RonD said:

Agrajag said:
Without graphics it probably wouldn't sell at all http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif





the developers web site says:
Bay 12 Games is dedicated to bringing original computer games to you, free of charge.






DominionsFAN said:
I must say that its so unique and awesome, that some publishers should contact the developer immediately then.
I bet that this game would sell very good.



http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[DominionsFan]

I know Agrajag. However, I was browsing the game forum, and Ive seen posts, where the people were talking about adding real gfx to the game, in fact someone was working on some basic tiles already. I might contact the developer about this, because if Im gonna have more freetime I could make some excellent tile graphics. The problem is, that I dont know how can we gonna use tiles, since all "squares" are 1 character big, because of the ASCII "graphics".

I guess the developer must code a gfx engine to allow to use tiles in 1x2, 2x1, 2x2 etc. sizes.

Seriously Im enjoying this game more, then for example Oblivion. This shows that graphics is nothing, gameplay is what matters.

[Agrajag]

My response was to him responding to me for mentioning money instead of responding to you (now that's a confusing sentence.)
Actually, I don't think the tiles will be that much of a problem, because currently the ASCII characters aren't "true" characters, there's a .bmp file with all of them (two files actually, one for 640*300 and one for 800*600), so making a .bmp file with tiles instead shouldn't be a real problem (coding the graphic engin however, could be a problem, so would coming up with so many tiles and sprites O:)

Anyway, I'm in the middle of a very interesting Fortress building right now, just thought people would like to learn from my huge mistakes which are probably going to cost me that game: (in order of noticing the mistakes)
1) When making a Farm Plot, use the u/h/k/m keys to change the size of the plot, it took me a while to notice which is a major blow to my food income this early. Luckily I fixed it soon enough to at least have hope of surviving winter.
2) You can't trade raw gems. I guess you have to process them somehow (I don't have a jeweler yet)
I was counting on trading away my many (many!) gems for some food from the caravan, and was quite surprised when I couldn't.
3) (O)ffer means give that item as an offering to some king >_< (and not offering something to be traded)
4) Caravans have limited space aboard (measured in weight), so make sure to trade light trade goods (especially since food is light, and you want to buy food)
5) Don't make the same extremely stupid mistake I did and gift the trader with a huge stone door that weighs 250 godamn (weight units) and thus make him unable to trade anything with you due to overweight >_<

Now, since I'm posting anyway I might as well add in a question:
1) How long does winter last? (Real Time and Game Time*)
2) How much food do you need to survive winter?
Winter will be upon me soon and I only have ~70 food units (according to the [z] menu, which doesn't make sense since I have ~20 plants and ~10 meats), am I going to make it?
*-Yes, I know in game time Winter lasts exactly one season. What I wanna know is how many days does it last (considering most Dwarves go to sleep roughly at the same time, which makes me think of that time as night)

[Archonsod]

Agrajag said:
1) When making a Farm Plot, use the u/h/k/m keys to change the size of the plot, it took me a while to notice which is a major blow to my food income this early. Luckily I fixed it soon enough to at least have hope of surviving winter.



Watch out if your farming the underground river. I got a nice farm all up and running, only to have my farmers killed by a frogman invasion. Probably an idea to manufacture a few weapons first, or at least give novice wrestling skills to your starting group


2) You can't trade raw gems. I guess you have to process them somehow (I don't have a jeweler yet)



You don't need a dwarf skilled in it. Just turn off all of their tasks and switch on jewel carving and they'll go do it (their skill will improve over time)


1) How long does winter last? (Real Time and Game Time*)



It's about the same time as any other season http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif maybe 30 minutes? I think 2 'days' is the norm for a season.
Not sure if this is affected by the location you choose (i.e. shorter in hot climates, longer in cold climates). Winter doesn't necessarily mean no food either - if your in a hot climate and the river doesn't freeze, you can still fish. You can usually still hunt too, regardless of the climate.


2) How much food do you need to survive winter?



Depends on the number of dwarves you have and the type of meals your cooking. Switching your cook to prepare simple meals will save food (it only uses 2 ingredients per meal) and your peasants will probably be just as happy. You can slaughter the horses & mules, since they're completely useless. Another method if you have a large breeding population of dogs & cats is to cull a few of those for food. I made it through winter largely on cat meat, and still had a growing cat population at the end!


Winter will be upon me soon and I only have ~70 food units (according to the [z] menu, which doesn't make sense since I have ~20 plants and ~10 meats), am I going to make it?



I think food units only counts prepared meals, not raw ingredients. Hence you probably have 70 prepared meals stored in barrels somewhere.

[PhilD]

Watch out if your farming the underground river. I got a nice farm all up and running, only to have my farmers killed by a frogman invasion. Probably an idea to manufacture a few weapons first, or at least give novice wrestling skills to your starting group




I've not seem Frogmen, only Lizardmen (who come in rather large groups) and once a Cave Crocodile. Since I haven't tried looking into the combat thing, each attack results in some severe wounding, and worse (my wounded apparently never heal, and I had no burial grounds, so any dwarf corpses were left to rot in the fortress for more bad feelings). I've read that monsters sometimes crawl out of wells, but I have yet to see them (attacks all seem to come from the river).

I tried farming with floodgates and channels, as it should be safer, but I must be doing something wrong, because after the first cycle of flooding and farming, when I flood again I cannot build a new farm plot. And I didn't see this with farming naturally flooded areas - which are probably more prone to river creature invasion.



2) You can't trade raw gems. I guess you have to process them somehow (I don't have a jeweler yet)




Hey, when my first caravan arrived I had no trading post. Completely missed them; but then I survived to see a few more.





1) How long does winter last? (Real Time and Game Time*)



It's about the same time as any other season http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif maybe 30 minutes? I think 2 'days' is the norm for a season.




Is there even a way to see what season it is? Sometimes I miss the messages that tells of the turning of the season, and then I'm lost...



You can slaughter the horses & mules, since they're completely useless. Another method if you have a large breeding population of dogs & cats is to cull a few of those for food. I made it through winter largely on cat meat, and still had a growing cat population at the end!




How do you slaughter animals? I mean, a butcher's shop doesn't seem to do it... I've got mules and horses wandering around in my fortress, because I don't know what to do with them.

Also, is there a way to train cats and dogs for some fighting? I leave them entirely alone, and they all seem to adopt some dwarf or other at some point, but I don't exactly use them too wisely... (I hope they at least help keep some vermin away)

Definitely an addictive game. I woke up last night when I couldn't sleep, looked up someting on the net, and ended up playing for 1-2 more hours... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[DominionsFan]

Argh... My fortress was doing very well, and of course something bad had to happen. Somehow a dragon appeared in my fortress, I have no idea that where its came from, probably it came in via the main entrance??..

Anyways, its killed most of my dwarves, including 11 from my dwarven axeman. I made a huge mistake as well..my patrol armies contained only 2-3 dwarves, I guess a 10 dwarf main patrol should guard the main entrance area.
The other mistake is that I never built gates and levers near the main gate. But hell knew that monsters can walk in like this. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/fear.gif

I guess I will have to restart the game, since my fortress is now full with blood and dead dwarves.

[Agrajag]

Watch out if your farming the underground river. I got a nice farm all up and running, only to have my farmers killed by a frogman invasion. Probably an idea to manufacture a few weapons first, or at least give novice wrestling skills to your starting group



Well, I've got the two initial picks and axes, nothing more.
I've struck some copper though, so I could make some low quality weapons to last until I find something better.


I tried farming with floodgates and channels, as it should be safer


I hope it is, as soon as I found the river I floodgated it, so now the river can't reach me, and hopefuly no creatures will. (They can still climb through the well though)


Hey, when my first caravan arrived I had no trading post. Completely missed them; but then I survived to see a few more.


I missed them as well, the jeweling thing was a mistake after a restart.



It's about the same time as any other season http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif maybe 30 minutes? I think 2 'days' is the norm for a season.



Thanks


Is there even a way to see what season it is? Sometimes I miss the messages that tells of the turning of the season, and then I'm lost...


Try the (a)nnoucements, they keep record of all the messages, including "Autmn has come"



You don't need a dwarf skilled in it. Just turn off all of their tasks and switch on jewel carving and they'll go do it (their skill will improve over time)


But the Workshop isn't built, it says it needs Jewel Making and thus construction is suspended.

[DominionsFan]

Damn lol, now I restarted. I just didnt take care of 1!!! of my axedwarf, he became very unhappy because of many things. He came into the fortress, killed the mule of my best miner. Now the miner refused to work. He is standing in the fortress, doing nothing. In fact my axedwarf caused some medium wounds to the miner, he had a pain in the head, and slight leg injuries...I love this game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[PhilD]

Agrajag said:
Try the (a)nnoucements, they keep record of all the messages, including "Autmn has come"




Actually, it's explicitly written in the top right corner of the status (z) screen. Early/Mid/Late Spring/Summer/Autumn/Winter, presumably corresponding to the "months" whose names are also readable right there. Found that out on the DF forum (which, most likely, is where we should be, instead of here, since there's no Dom3 activity right now)

[Endoperez]

'z' allows you to define what is used for cooking in the kitchen (generally, store seeds you want to farm; wild strawberry seeds etc above-ground plants can be cooked for food ), what animals to butcher (you can't butcher pets - yet), etc. I think it also shows date, month and season in there. Later on, when you get more nobles, you'll see more information. Especially, when the Sheriff comes, check how many metal cages and/or restraints (metal chains or silk/plant fiber ropes) he wants. He can go mad very easily, so be sure to make the cages quickly.

Animals can be trained in the Kennel building. It's on the second page of 'b'uild menu. You can only train dogs, and tame creatures caught in animal traps (small things) or cage traps (inside the mountain).

v-p-l (view a dwarf - preferences - labor) allows you to set a dwarf to do different tasks. Jewel making and gem cutting are probably somewhere there. A jeweler is needed to have the correct building built. You can also order the new jeweler to encrust various items with jewels.

Also, I had crazy luck when I started. My first fortress is still going strong, with 60 dwarves before the last immigration, and some nobles. I think I started in a tundra with no natural hostilities at all - two or three surprise attacks in all these years, and nothing worse than cougars in the wild.

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:
'z' allows you to define what is used for cooking in the kitchen (generally, store seeds you want to farm; wild strawberry seeds etc above-ground plants can be cooked for food ), what animals to butcher (you can't butcher pets - yet), etc. I think it also shows date, month and season in there. Later on, when you get more nobles, you'll see more information. Especially, when the Sheriff comes, check how many metal cages and/or restraints (metal chains or silk/plant fiber ropes) he wants. He can go mad very easily, so be sure to make the cages quickly.

Animals can be trained in the Kennel building. It's on the second page of 'b'uild menu. You can only train dogs, and tame creatures caught in animal traps (small things) or cage traps (inside the mountain).

v-p-l (view a dwarf - preferences - labor) allows you to set a dwarf to do different tasks. Jewel making and gem cutting are probably somewhere there. A jeweler is needed to have the correct building built. You can also order the new jeweler to encrust various items with jewels.

Also, I had crazy luck when I started. My first fortress is still going strong, with 60 dwarves before the last immigration, and some nobles. I think I started in a tundra with no natural hostilities at all - two or three surprise attacks in all these years, and nothing worse than cougars in the wild.



Eh I started in hardcore areas [Haunted for example]...its very hard to start a fortress there. Im a newbie in this game, so I started in a very calm this time. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[DominionsFan]

lol this is unbeliveable. Now a "rhesus macaque" stole the iron pick from my miner, and he cant mine now. I cant believe what bad luck I have...I got no other picks left.

[Archonsod]

How do you slaughter animals?



You need a butcher & butcher's shop. Then assign a "butcher animal" task the same way you assign tasks to any other workshop. The butcher will go off and slaughter one of the animals. You can slaughter any non-pets (that is, any animal which doesn't have a living owner).


Also, is there a way to train cats and dogs for some fighting?



Build a kennel, then have a dwarf on train animal orders (through the assign labour commands).


I've struck some copper though, so I could make some low quality weapons to last until I find something better.



Your craftsdwarf can make obsidian shortswords, which are damn effective.

[Agrajag]

DominionsFAN said:
lol this is unbeliveable. Now a "rhesus macaque" stole the iron pick from my miner, and he cant mine now. I cant believe what bad luck I have...I got no other picks left.


Did you have dogs?
Last time I was attacked by a horde of Rhesus Macaques my dogs (and I think my dwarves as well) made short work of them.

Ooh, and I forgot to tell you something mildly amusing:
On the game forums I've read that Unicorns can be really dangerous, so when I saw them hanging around West of the outsite river I was worried that I'm soon going to lose the game that was going so well.
Time passed, and the unicorns didn't cross the river, autumn came, the caravan came and went, and suddenly I got the message "Unicorn in Enranged!".
I thought that the horde of unicorns will soon be upon me, so I went to where the unicorns were.
And found trails of blood and lots of dead unicorns, and the caravan (and the caravan guards) walking away very quietly... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[DominionsFan]

Nop I didnt had any dogs, yet another newbie mistake. My guards took care of those damned monsters, but my miner was on his way to drink from the river, since I had no well yet, I just restarted the game. While he was on his way to there, 1 monster stole his pick. This game is fantastic, so many things in it already. This is the most complex game what I've ever seen + of course Dominions. I just cant stop playing Dwarf Fortress. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif
The developer's future plans are also awesome. When this game gonna reach beta and hopefully there will be 2d tiles in it by then....I think that it will suck in tons of gamers immediately. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Agrajag]

Woohoo! Got massacred by a horde of ambushing snakemen >_<
They came in through a wall that I was sure was unmined, I must have accidentally queued it for digging while making some space for farms.
Hehe, a few more lessons learned then, and just when I was starting to think I might survive.

Now what do you think I should do, more Dwarf Fortressing or do some studying for my test tomorrow? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
Damned Abstract Algebra getting in the way of Dwarf Fortress http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Cainehill]

PhilD said:
I'm using a US keyboard myself, so the ? key does work. But the ingame help has several problems for me - first, it's not exactly fun to read it on screen (I tend to print anything that I intend to really read), and second, it's not organized too well.

The Wiki, though, might provide some help. I'll try to see how it goes.



Sheesh! I had found the "manual" myself, but the up/down cursors and numeric keypad didn't work. Turns out you have to use +/- to move the cursor, and then it's still a huge PITA to go through it. Why in Dog's name they didn't just put together a text (or PDF) FAQ as a new player's guide...?

[PhilD]

Cainehill said:
Sheesh! I had found the "manual" myself, but the up/down cursors and numeric keypad didn't work. Turns out you have to use +/- to move the cursor, and then it's still a huge PITA to go through it. Why in Dog's name they didn't just put together a text (or PDF) FAQ as a new player's guide...?



The software's still officially early alpha. The whole thing could change a lot in the near future. And the wiki's growing at a fast speed, maybe something much better will be available soon.

[DominionsFan]

Agrajag said:
Woohoo! Got massacred by a horde of ambushing snakemen >_<
They came in through a wall that I was sure was unmined, I must have accidentally queued it for digging while making some space for farms.
Hehe, a few more lessons learned then, and just when I was starting to think I might survive.

Now what do you think I should do, more Dwarf Fortressing or do some studying for my test tomorrow? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
Damned Abstract Algebra getting in the way of Dwarf Fortress http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif




Dwarf Fortress!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Anyways, now I am trying to make flood gates, but somehow I flooded my fortress. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Fate]

I did wonderfully my first year so far, and the winter didn't seem half as hard as the guide said it would be (though I did everything they said to). I have restarted for the 3rd time now, because I wanted the right dwarves and a good starting layout (I have a massive 15x15 entrance with four supports, a fountain/meeting hall, and a dining room, all detailed).

I was doing great, and I had a room for each dwarf until I got easily over 15 migrants (maybe 20?). I locked 7 in a room to die, and the other 10 have messed with my careful track of what all my dwarves are doing (I have no idea. I am going to look into the nickname system...).

Did anyone else have any problems with migrants?

[DominionsFan]

Eh, some weird thing happened. I placed bedrooms for my dwarves, and I placed chests inside. Well not really chests but cabinets so the dwarves will be more happy. [AFAIK dwarves aint putting anything to them, since this part is not in the game yet...I mean that the dwarves aint storing anything in them at the moment, it will be added with a patch.]
Anyways I added doors to the bedrooms of course. 1 dwarf walked into a bedroom what wasnt his bedroom, and he was messing around at the other dwarf's cabinet. Like 3-4 mins later, I was getting announcements about some fighting. The bedroom's owner was chasing the dwarf who was messing around with his cabinet, and he managed to kill him. I had no sheriff yet, so he wasnt arrested. However, some other dwarf seen what happened, and he was already in bad mood. He went berzerk 2 mins later, and attacked many other dwarves in the fortress. The berzerking dwarf damaged like 5 other dwarves [he broke 2 arms], but my carpenter managed to kill him. Now like 10 dwarves are in bad mood.
Seriously the programmer of this game is a genius. I've never seen such a diverse game like this before.

[PvK]

Ok. This is too addictive. And I'm only playing in adventure mode so far. One down and one to go.

First character: Human "start now!" character, who seemed to have no real skills or equipment. As I try to learn the movement system, I encounter a couple of lions, who eat me up, and I get to watch the gory bits fly around the screen before I die.

Second character: Dwarf axe warrior who accidentally gets classed as a wrestler because he has equal wrestling skills to weapon skills, so they decide he doesn't need any weapons... hopefully he got some compensating advantage. Starts by a nice dwarf fortress with lots of dwarves wandering around, a couple of which are bored enough to join me. It's hard to tell at first but later they turn out to be girl dwarves... maybe that's why they were the only ones willing to join my male dwarf wrestler. Well, he can dream. There's another town to the north, so finding not much else to do in the dwarf town, we head out for there and have to do battle with a small pack of wolves. We win, but I notice that one of my friends has a crossbow, and doesn't seem to know how to retrieve her shot bolts. And I don't see a way to give them back to her. Or any way to tell them to do or not do anything.

We wander to the human town, where they have some things for sale, but now I need to learn how currency works here... apparently they have a concept of value, ownership, and debt, but no coins, and I have no coins and nothing they want to trade for. Except the mayor, who wants someone named Skullcollector killed in the nearby ruins. I interest a human pikeman (who laters turns out to be a female pikeman... unless the game just has a bug in the combat narrator calling all friends female), and the four of us set off to the ruins.

Zombies and skeletons live there, the place is littered with junk jewelry, and there are two extremely tall towers. We climb both of them cleaning them out but never find Skullcollector, though we found a couple of well-armed and named other undead warriors and killed them. And lots of jewelry. I got a morningstar and shield off of one of the named/armed skeletons, so I'm not just trying to judo my way through everything. My dwarf seems to be left-handed though. The crossbow dwarf woman eventually ran out of bolts and started beating things up as a brawler, and did ok but was suddenly killed by a lucky skeleton. Then hunting around for Skullcollector, the human pike(wo)man fell behind and got ambushed and beat up, but I got back just in time to splatter the zombie. That was the cue to leave with as much loot as _I_ could carry (is there a way to get others to carry loot for you? Or to retrieve ammo or equipment?), and pike(wo)man healed up on the way back to town (only two map squares).

Back in town, I try to trade my backpack stuffed with loot for improved equipment... and am almost entirely daunted by the trading interface, which is weird. Apparently 50 value shown on the table is equivalent so maybe 700* in debt units, or something. Was very tough to figure out, but I managed to give him a bunch of used equipment for 650* in debt, then he wouldn't sell me a 50? new shield until I offered a few pieces of jewelry as well.

My main mystery now though is how do I get more food and drink? Is there a way to fill a waterskin at a river? Or to buy food and drink?

Anyway, too dang addictive! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

PvK

[DominionsFan]

Dwarf Fortress is much better then adventure mode imho. Adventure mode is fun too, but Dwarf Fortress is simply brilliant. This alpha version game just hit alpha a few weeks ago, but there are lot of topics on various message boards with 200+ posts about the game already, and everyone is amazed, that how complex and deep gameplay it has already. Have you guys seen the future development plans? If those will be added...frankly I dont think that I will stop playing this in the next years. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif
I think the only weak part of the game is the ASCII style, many people won't try it, because they don't like ASCII. I've played with many roguelike games, so I have no problems with it, but a graphical expansion would be nice for the game. When the major elements and features will be added to the game in the future, Toady might add a tile based engine, at least I've seen this on IRC like 2 days ago, they were talking about that. However that won't happen just in like 1.5-2 years. Tons of work to do still [check the dev list], and only 2 people are coding the game.

[fahdiz]

Just wanted to pop in here to express my newfound love for Dwarf Fortress. I found out about it last week and have been playing the crap out of it whenever possible. I enjoy both Dwarf Fortress mode and Adventure mode. It's giving me something to do until Dom 3 comes out, so that's icing on the cake. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[DominionsFan]

I know people who basically stopped to play WoW because they are addicted to Dwarf Fortress. Gameplay > Graphics...
I am a big DF addict now as well. Even though lot of things aint added yet, also there isnt a real goal in the game yet, but somehow this game is extremely addictive already. [Future dev plans are icredible, there will be dimplomacy with other civilizations, magic, you can raise real armies and attack other civilizations and cities etc, and tons of other things, just check out the development section for more details:]

BURROWS, TRANSPORTION AND AUTOMATION ARC: Make dwarves live and restrict their movements to sections ("burrows") of the cave to reduce the amount of hauling. This includes many of the haul/pile reqs. Other workshops could be automated, while the work order system could be made more robust to decrease the amount of interface fiddling required to produce glass and soap, for example. Related to Core36, Req1, Req18, Req22, Req24, Req28, Req47, Req67, Req128, Req129, Req146, Req162, Req273, Bloat32.
FIRE AND LIGHTING ARC: The lighting in caves is artificial right now. It should be pitch black. This is also true of moonless cloudy nights. Once that's in, your adventurer will want fire. Fire can also come up in dwarf mode in various ways. Related to Core14, Req96.
ADVANCED HELP ARC: Yeah, dwarves has a steep learning curve. Tutorials and advisors could help this. Related to Core19, Core22.
CARAVAN ARC: As a prelude to armies, we'll have caravans actually move around the world map rather than just appear at your outpost. They'll move between each city on the map, though we'll try to stay away from supporting a real economy for the time being. You should be able to find items you traded in your fortress in adventure mode, and a caravan could come to your fortress with an adventure mode item. Related to Core3, Req204.
COUNTY ARC: When you get a baron, you'll be able to send out patrols. Once you get a count, you'll get a village outside your fortress and be able to organize armies. This arc would have to be developed along with the army arc. Related to Core27, Core28, Core29.
ARMY ARC: You should be able to control patrols and then armies in dwarf mode. The adventurer should be able to both go with and command armies. In dwarf mode, you should have the option to control your individual patrol members as you would in adventure mode. This comes back to adventure mode in terms of being able to control each member in a party of adventurers you make yourself. You could lead one and the others follow (as it is currently) or control them all, particularly during tense situations where you don't want to count on the AI. Entities should war with each other from bandit and monster raids to full fledged wars. Upset enties could patrol near their sites, leading to new wilderness encounters etc. Related to Core24, Core25, Core26, Core30, Core33, Core35, Req221.
NEMESIS ARC: The civilization leaders should be fleshed out in many ways. Related to Core11, Core40, Bloat68.
HOUSEHOLD ARC: You should be able to take a spouse, make a household, and create playable heirs as an adventurer. The dwarven relationships and personalities can also be expanded upon. Houses should have tables, cabinets, boxes, beds w/ enough random crafts to steal, there could be workshops in stores, etc.
DIPLOMACY ARC: There should be a lot more diplomacy between your outpost and the outside world, especially as you get more nobles. Right now there's hardly anything.
GHOSTS ARC: When you take an adventurer back to a fortress, it could afford to be a lot more interesting. Since it keeps track of all the dwarves that ever lived or died in each outpost, it might as well utilize them. When the civs fight in world gen, it could also create ruins from earlier times, and you could go to these places (old castles, temples, etc.).
AFFILIATION ARC: You should be able to rise to the top of an entity (civilization, town, etc.) in adventure mode. While the full set of responsibilities that would entail will have to wait, it should at least be possible to attain this status for the first version. You should be able to do things for individuals. This could earn you favors from sleeping in their home and food gifts all the way to a marriage offer. There can be smaller entities like bandits and cults which could offer more unsavory tasks for similar privileges (steal, kill, kidnap, etc.). Can earn right to sleep in the large hall in town if you've become affiliated with them, but vagrancy needs to be punished and the camping must be harsher before this is meaningful.
COMBAT ARC: Many more combat skills and more attributes, etc. Related to Req92, Req171, Req183, Req188, Req200, Req206, Req224, Req233, Req234, Req315, Req330, Req331, Bloat15, Bloat55, Bloat76, Bloat102, Bloat135, Bloat136, Bloat137, Bloat138, Bloat139, Bloat141, Bloat142.
SCENARIOS ARC: Character generation is due for a major change. The current plan is to have an interactive history generator that takes your character from birth to a playable age, incorporating them into the fabric of the world. Pressing "Play Now!" would answer the questions automatically, perhaps with a strong tendency to place you in dire/interesting situations.
LIFE CYCLE ARC: Right now, there are no births and no aging in the towns and other populations. From the founding of a town, it should instead simulating and track these things during world creation. This makes the world much more interesting and also more resilient to changes inflicted by the player. At the same time, it creates instability unrelated to the actions of the player, so it has to be done carefully.
ARTIFACT ARC: Special items made by the dwarves aren't very interesting right now, and there's not much for an adventurer to do with them. These objects should have magical powers and they should have a huge influence on the actions of entities that come into contact with them. Even if your adventurer can't make use of a particular artifact, you could arrange for buyers in the nobility, and use those opportunitites to get a home or good entity standing, for instance.
CRIME AND PUNISHMENT ARC: There should be mild punishments for mild crimes, for instance. This could include making the drunks in the town more interesting and adding bar fights, as well as proper thievery.
ADVENTURER SKILLS ARC: It's nice to have all those jobs and professions sitting around in the dwarf mode. The adventurer should be able to do these things, especially those skills related to survival in the wilderness.
HIGH LEVEL PLOTS AND DIPLOMACY: Various intrigue and interesting not-necessarily-violent conflict between entities and individuals. Once you place the actors in place, they should act according to their wants and the wants of their associated entities based on the strength of those ties. Both adventurers and dwarf fortresses can become immersed in the push and pull which arises from the AI. This is already true to some extent (the current quests are all created from the surroundings and entity ties), but these effects can be made pervasive. Since armies and invasions will be done before we get here, there will already be some of this AI in place to work with.
LATE GAME: As you kill the large creatures, the world becomes more... boring. The game can be prepared for this kind of change and move over into a sort of fairy-tale/Beowulf/Robert E Howard type of hybrid with human civs and occasional monsters so that things continue to be interesting. This already happens naturally in a way, but the dialogue and reactions of people to these changes should be there to fully adjust to the new setting. Related to Bloat149.
EARLY GAME: The Age of Myth in world generation should be playable. Related to Bloat148.
HUMAN TOWN: You should be able to control a human town, as you control a dwarf fortress, but with changes appropriate to the new setting. Related to Bloat146.
BANDITS/MOUNTAIN MEN: There might already be bandits and cults and all that by the time we get here, but what we mean here is being able to start a group of bandits and make a camp or construct a cabin out in the woods and have your own site. If you have enough people, it could switch over to a kind of human town mode where you control the bandits more strategically.
GOBLIN/KOBOLD/CAVER: Controlling the bad guys is an obvious extension, and you've got the whole friendly happy world waiting for your raiding parties.
ELF FOREST RETREAT: Yes, elves for the elf people -- but thinking more general, as we list all these racial civilizations, we should think in broad terms and use the civilization definitions to allow any type of civilization to be played. Elves will provide some necessary extra elements for this process. Mixing the cliff dwelling, wilderness dwelling, town building, good vs. evil tendencies into a robust interface for civilization building is a long-term goal.
MONSTER: Playing the dragons and other large beasts seems like another good (and fairly easy) extension. You'd have to be careful, since there aren't very many large beasts in the world and you don't want to just possess them and have them all burn out in a blaze of glory. Or maybe you do... or it could just give you new ones. You could also just occasionally have fun going out on an excursion and retiring, then play an adventurer and take a quest from a town to go and dispatch your old self.
MERCHANT: With the Caravan Arc, we have traders moving around the world, but I said over there that I didn't want to mess around too much with having a real economy, or it would surely fall apart and all the towns would starve. Once I get up the nerve to tackle these problems, it would be a lot of fun to play a merchant or guild yourself. You could even retire and be visited by yourself in a subsequent dwarf game.
MAGIC: This would allow for the flashier stuff, but it wouldn't have to be in every region. Related to Core15.
CONTROL A WIZARD ENTITY: Not just one of those guys that backs up the team and shoots fireballs, but run something more like a dwarven outpost and construct your own multilevel tower or other such dwelling. This could include adventure style elements where your wizard is engaged in various activities, as well as larger scale army battles and so on. Randomized creatures could also be introduced as you create your minions, and they should be able to breed and expand outward, perhaps becoming a playable race in either adventure or civilization modes. Related to Bloat147.
DEITY: Have religions in the game correspond to forces or deities and let you play one and do whatever you like, possibly restricted by your defining characteristics and geography.
WORLD GENERATION PARAMETERS: While not yet getting to the level of some of the things below, you should be able to set parameters for world generation. Order up a world-wide swamp punctuated by glowing towers and some randomized creatures, and so on.
TERRAIN/WEATHER/SWIMMING/FLYING/BOATS: Boats of some kind might go in early to make different regions more accessible, but you won't be able to be a pirate or an undersea civ for quite a while. Rivers freeze with daily temperatures instead of seasonal temperatures. Realize river and ocean squares when you visit them (forcing town layouts to adapt). Realize interesting canyons and so on in such areas. Track hurricanes and other major storm/disasters, in-game and during world gen. Thunderstorms with lightning strikes (with corresponding lighting effects) and hail. Levels of rainfall. Eating snow, making snowballs and picking up hail during and after hail storms. Tornados with wind flows that push items, projectiles and creatures. Proper eclipse modeling. Tides, deep oceans and pearl-diving, etc. More intricate interplay between cliff faces, inner rivers and outer rivers, using Z coord and waterfalls.
PLANES: Once it's all established, you can make regions arbitrarily strange, and you make a lot of them. The real chore here is allowing multiple world maps to be active in one way or another and to allow game elements to move between them. It would be a headache to program, but it would add a lot to the game.
EDITORS: Those things that made programming the first Armok so annoying! As the format of game elements become more stable, we can allow you to change them. Draw your own region maps, create your own towns, creatures, items, start situations, etc.
AND MORE, AND WORSE: I'm still too embarrassed to share every idea we had...


This is the game of the year for me, and Doms 3. of course.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

PS. Big thanks to Endoperez once again, because it was him, who introduced this game to us.
I've just made a search on google for dwarf fortress, and it seems that the game has began to conquer the gaming communities, Ive found threads on various forums with 400+ posts already about the game, and it was just released. Incredible.

[DominionsFan]

Dwarf Fortress gets some publicity.
It has been mentioned on the Eurogamer website even.
Incredible, considering that this is an ASCII game.

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=67553

[Nerfix]

Haha, one of the local game mags (the most credible and professional one if you ask me) previewed ADOM and Nethack once. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Haha, one of the local game mags (the most credible and professional one if you ask me) previewed ADOM and Nethack once. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



Reviewed. Previews happen before the game is published, and in Nethack's case... Well, I doubt there were computers capable of running it in Finland when it was first created, or even when it started to spread. But yes, there've been some games in the magazines one wouldn't expect.

[Nerfix]

Doi, my bad. I typoed.

[PvK]

Well, considering ADOM, Nethack, and Dwarf Fortress ALPHA are <font color="red">ALL BETTER GAMES THAN MANY CORPORATE GAMES</font> in many ways, it just shows an unusual level of good taste and intelligence to review them.

[DominionsFan]

PvK said:
Well, considering ADOM, Nethack, and Dwarf Fortress ALPHA are <font color="red">ALL BETTER GAMES THAN MANY CORPORATE GAMES</font> in many ways, it just shows an unusual level of good taste and intelligence to review them.



I agree, DF's gameplay is deep and complex. Its one of the best what I've ever seen. Hopefully 1 day the game will have some graphics. Gameplay is much more important, however the ASCII graphics is not perfect for a strategy game. It is ok for a roguelike.

[Morkilus]

I don't know if anyone reads Bill Harris' blog (http://dubiousquality.blogspot.com/2006/09/end-of-disenfranchisement-through.html) , but he's ready to call this the Game of the Year. Well, maybe until October 2. Seriously, though, I haven't been this addicted to a game since I discovered Dominions 2.

I still haven't gotten very far, since I restarted several times after a couple disasters and discovering I made some very bad planning mistakes. I can't wait 'til my first invasion, and I can only wonder what goodies will be added once the game actually is considered "beta". Looks like the devs are mainly working on the Adventure mode, which admittedly, I haven't spent much time with.

[Kristoffer O]

I've spent free time the last week on DF. Splendid game. Tried a couple of times. Now I have a nice city going, but the little buggars are about to die this winter I think. The last human caravan didn't bring much food and my farmers have acted stupid (or rather, I didn't fertilize my farm plots efficiently). I'm getting over-stoned and over-nobled. Annoying chaps. Make this and make that!

I absolutely love the freakish moods and insane craftsmen.

I still havn't figured out how to milk cows. Might be that all my cows are male http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

[Agrajag]

Oh no, we got KO addicted.
Don't expect any patches for Dom3.

[Nerfix]

Or the demo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Kristoffer O]

&gt; Oh no, we got KO addicted.
&gt; Don't expect any patches for Dom3.

Don't worry. I was addicted to some pre-release patch making the other week. Expect at least one new nation in the first patch, and it wont be dwarves http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

But, I must confess to having played DF for at least 30 hours this weekend (I had the friday off) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

[Nerfix]

What nation is it? Early Machaka, or perhaps Late Pythium?

[JaydedOne]

Either way, the mere fact of its existence pre-release smacks of awesome. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Kristoffer O]

&gt; What nation is it? Early Machaka, or perhaps Late Pythium?

Entirely new one.

[Nerfix]

Kristoffer O said:
&gt; What nation is it? Early Machaka, or perhaps Late Pythium?

Entirely new one.

Oooh, is it perhaps Kalevala themed one, or maybe one based on biblical Israel? I've heard hints that you guys have had plans for both, and that you yourself wished to see a Kalevala nation....

...but ah, I wait with excitement. In under a month I'll be 18 and I'll have much easier time to arrange transactions. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif The demo will propably, depending if there are likeable nations there, keep me entertained untill that.

[DominionsFan]

Kristoffer O said:
I've spent free time the last week on DF. Splendid game. Tried a couple of times. Now I have a nice city going, but the little buggars are about to die this winter I think. The last human caravan didn't bring much food and my farmers have acted stupid (or rather, I didn't fertilize my farm plots efficiently). I'm getting over-stoned and over-nobled. Annoying chaps. Make this and make that!

I absolutely love the freakish moods and insane craftsmen.

I still havn't figured out how to milk cows. Might be that all my cows are male http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.



I think that we cannot milk cows yet, it is not implented at the moment. I think that the game will hit v1.0 in like 3 years minimum, because the developer's list is just HUGE.

[DominionsFan]

Kristoffer O said:
&gt; Oh no, we got KO addicted.
&gt; Don't expect any patches for Dom3.

Don't worry. I was addicted to some pre-release patch making the other week. Expect at least one new nation in the first patch, and it wont be dwarves http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

But, I must confess to having played DF for at least 30 hours this weekend (I had the friday off) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.



Yeah, the game is decent, and keep in mind that its a very early beta. Like I said many times, this is definitely the game of the year for me because of the deep gameplay...and of course Dominions 3. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
PS.
The adventure mode is also exciting. I just recently lost my uber sword [and I died like 10 seconds after it], because it was stucked in a monster's head. I tried to pull it off, but a kobold archer popped up in the corridor, and I guess his name was Robin Hood probably, because he killed me with a single shot. The arrow just removed the brain of my char. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Morkilus]

This is the most violent ASCII game I've played since the debut of my Fantasy Pit Champion game back in high school. Ah, memories...

Don't let Jack Thompson know about this one.

[PrinzMegaherz]

has anyone here created a working farm?

I've got a floodgate system to flood a 5x5 room, I build a farm plot and order some plants to be grown (sweet something). However, I haven't seen something growing there yet, and now it's winter and the ground is dry again, so I have to reflood it... any idea on what i could be doing wrong here?

Thanks!

[thejeff]

You may have just started too late.

I got my farm set up and started planting in autumn my first year in one game. Winter came and the fields dried up before any crops grew.

If so, just flood it early in spring and plant again.
Make sure some dwarves actually carry out the planting orders, too.

If not, I don't know what to say.

[DominionsFan]

PrinzMegaherz said:
has anyone here created a working farm?

I've got a floodgate system to flood a 5x5 room, I build a farm plot and order some plants to be grown (sweet something). However, I haven't seen something growing there yet, and now it's winter and the ground is dry again, so I have to reflood it... any idea on what i could be doing wrong here?

Thanks!



You must irrigate the farmlands from the outer or inner river.

[Morkilus]

He couldn't have built the plot without first flooding; I seriously doubt that's the problem. I'm guessing he started to plant too late, or did't have any of the right seeds. It can take a while to grow stuff, but never more than a season.

[DominionsFan]

Morkilus said:
He couldn't have built the plot without first flooding; I seriously doubt that's the problem. I'm guessing he started to plant too late, or did't have any of the right seeds. It can take a while to grow stuff, but never more than a season.




Ah! I haven't read his whole text. Yes, that must be it. He cannot plant on winter.

[Agrajag]

My guess: You don't have the correct seeds.

[PrinzMegaherz]

Hm, not having the right seeds might be the reason.
So, how do I get seeds if I haven't bought them at the start of the game?

[DominionsFan]

PrinzMegaherz said:
Hm, not having the right seeds might be the reason.
So, how do I get seeds if I haven't bought them at the start of the game?



Well you better start a new game, because your dwarves will die if you don't have seeds or plants. Next time make a farm in time and later on you can trade foods with the merchants as well.

[Morkilus]

I didn't start with Cave Wheat or Sweet Pods, and there seems to be no way to get it (with this version) from the caravans. It's listed in Things to Do for the dev for the dwarven traders to carry more than Pigtail Cloth and useless stuff like that. You should be able to get Plump Helmets from them, which are pretty much all you need for food and liquor purposes. If you have enough horses you can live off their meat; just be sure leave some males and females to keep production up. As for hunting... it takes a bit of micromanagement at the moment. You might have to turn on "collect outside refuse" option for the dwarves to pick up downed foxes and deer.

Always keep in mind that there's a new version pretty much every week!