Jomonese Blood-Magi???

[Ed Kolis]

Hmm, I wonder... Does R'lyeh have a monopoly on "freakish tentacley things", or does late-era Jomon have a few of their own? I imagine they'd be quite good blood-magi, but be unable to actually hunt for blood-slaves, due to their, umm, "appetite" getting in the way once they found some http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[quantum_mechani]

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/3712/shadowlz5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[JaydedOne]

Sexy.

[Arralen]

Actually, Kurofumi is a leftover from the days of the Early Age, when demons (Oni) roamed the land. Late age Jomon is a nation of samurai and elemental mages and does not have 'regular' blood mages.

The tentacle-sex thingy came up a bit after the days of the samurai http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Jurri]

Arralen said:
The tentacle-sex thingy came up a bit after the days of the samurai http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Not quite! Hokusai (http://www.jahsonic.com/Hokusai.html) already used the motif, and he died well before the Meiji Restoration. (Definitely not safe for work, that link!)

[Arralen]

I am shocked !!

However, the pics subtitle is "Dream of the Fisherman's Wife c. 1820 - Hokusai" ... and 1820 isn't what I consider the age depicted in LA Jomon http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Nerfix]

Well, since we can mix Atlantians with Inuits and Mictlan, why not an Illithid theme for Jomon...

[Arralen]

Hentai mod ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Nerfix]

Arralen said:
Hentai mod ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

I doubt that hentai done with 64x64 and 128x128 sprites would be exciting at all.

Besides, I will leave such to people with more eldtritch...interests.

[Nerfix]

Right.

So...

Umm...

The Oni Kings have blood mages? Are they strong or are they all around 1 Blood like Kurofumi?

[Arralen]

Just checked: No blood mages, not even among the national summons.

But they have nice capital-only commanders (note: he does not wear a helmet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif )

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/444783-DaiOni.png

[Nerfix]

Arralen said:
Just checked: No blood mages, not even among the national summons.

Some demons they are...so Kurofumi is a special case.

[Nerfix]

That Dai Oni looks superb.

[Ed Kolis]

Oh well, just thought I'd ask... yeah, maybe in a mod someone will borrow some R'lyeh sprites and use them for Jomon http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Nerfix]

I notice that that the Oni are poor leaders. How amusing. Demon kings who are poor leaders. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Boron]

Nerfix said:
I notice that that the Oni are poor leaders. How amusing. Demon kings who are poor leaders. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif


They are good leaders for demons and undeads though.

20 leadership
210 undead leadership
20 magic beeing leadership

50% of the early era japan national recruitable troops are demons http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

For leading their normal troops the use the demon general, he has 120 leadership.

[Nerfix]

Oooh, I see, I see. I just thought that it was very fitting that they are poor leaders for humans, since their description hints at that.

[thejeff]

So demonic and undead leadership is still the same thing?

Do blood mages still get less of it than death mages?

Are there any new cheap demonic leaders?
It's always annoyed me to have to summon skeleton kings and the like to ferry demons around.

[Boron]

thejeff said:
So demonic and undead leadership is still the same thing?

Do blood mages still get less of it than death mages?

Are there any new cheap demonic leaders?
It's always annoyed me to have to summon skeleton kings and the like to ferry demons around.


Hm then you will be slightly annoyed maybe http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif.

It is still like in Dom2. Imho there was no need to change it though. If you look at it from another way you might like it maybe:

Imho this adds complexity and makes some nations more fun to play. Mictlan for example has now nationspecific uber blood summons. BUT blood leadership is slightly problematic for them. They have some new blood leader summons, but those are either expensive or have other minor weaknesses.
So this way the mictlan player has to be creative http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

Also keep in mind the new random system. Now unlike in Dom2 a nation who does not get blood randoms has a very very tough time to try to get blood too. So imho it is fine as it is and if blood and undead leadership would be seperated it would make the game less interesting imho because some nice leadership problems for blood nations where the players have to be creative do not exist anymore.

[thejeff]

It's not so much that it's more complex or interesting. I've never had great problems getting leaders for demons.

It just seems unthematic for the simplest solution to be summon up some cheap undead leaders. Now if that becomes really hard in Dom3, it may add some interest. But since you only need 1D and a couple of gems, it seems likely that indy mages will supply that even with the new randoms.

Of course, it also pushes towards the uber blood summons instead of armies of lesser demons.

[Boron]

thejeff said:
It's not so much that it's more complex or interesting. I've never had great problems getting leaders for demons.

It just seems unthematic for the simplest solution to be summon up some cheap undead leaders. Now if that becomes really hard in Dom3, it may add some interest. But since you only need 1D and a couple of gems, it seems likely that indy mages will supply that even with the new randoms.

Of course, it also pushes towards the uber blood summons instead of armies of lesser demons.


All the indy mages got redone too. Getting a death indy mage is not so easy, you need to be very lucky for that. Iirc the only poptype death mage that you can find is the death amazon tribe and from magic sites there are not that many neither i think. Maybe 2-3 rare ones.
So if you have no death getting access to death magic is not so easy anymore.

And those cheap death summons are imho suboptimal to lead devil armies etc. since they are a liability then and can easily die in a battle.
Also to use them effectively you need e.g. air boots.

Most Dom3 blood nations do not easily get air or death, so it might be quite interesting in Dom3.

For Dom2 with the Dom2 random system you are correct though there you just got any path eventually with the randoms http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

[Caduceus]

He can be banished by priests, a fact he is unaware of.



Amusing.

"I am the greatest.." *Poof!*

[PDF]

Well, maybe the "undead-demon" confusion in leadership is not a big problem, but I don't agree with trying to justify it through fudges such as "well so you need to be creative"...

To me it's just a not very important but still not logical game simplification.

[Nerfix]

PDF said:
Well, maybe the "undead-demon" confusion in leadership is not a big problem, but I don't agree with trying to justify it through fudges such as "well so you need to be creative"...

To me it's just a not very important but still not logical game simplification.

Agreed.

[Fate]

I love the Dai Oni. So, do they actually turn into ghosts & recuperate when killed? That is cool. I am totally playing Jomon first. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Also, will they eat food?

[Ighalli]

I believe they'll reduce the supplies in the province they're in, but not technically eat, since they have the need not eat icon.

[Cainehill]

Caduceus said:

He can be banished by priests, a fact he is unaware of.



Amusing.

"I am the greatest.." *Poof!*



Of course, with a base MR of 18, he's unlikely to be terribly dismayed by priests using banishment spells, unless Banish Demon has been changed to have increased chances of MR penetration.

[Daynarr]

Fate said:
I love the Dai Oni. So, do they actually turn into ghosts & recuperate when killed? That is cool. I am totally playing Jomon first. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Also, will they eat food?



They are Yomi, not Jomon. Jomon are late era and represent faudal Japan with samurai's. Yomi are early era nation. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif
Also, Yomi have a heap of other demons they can recruit and that turn into ghosts if killed (ghost form is ethereal of course).
Middle era (Shinuyama) and late era (Jomon) have national spells that allow them to summon some of those demons but it will be hard to pull it off with national mages (wrong magic paths).

They consume food in province (use supplies there) but they don't really need to eat so they never starve.

[Morkilus]

I guess that's why Japanese demons are always pictured fat.