Another Death Match Balancing Idea

[Fate]

All permanent effects gained while in the arena are removed at the end of the competition, and items are never picked up. This includes:

-curses
-horror marks
-wounds
-cursed items
-etc...

I'm not sure how easy this would be to implement, but it would probably address the most basic complaint that has been leveled at the competition.

[Teraswaerto]

I really don't see why this would be necessary. It is a tradition to curse, horror mark and disease the champions of your enemies. No risk, no gain.

[Shovah32]

Yea, theres no gain from cursing, horror marking, diseasing and forcefully equipping your enemies best commander with crappy equipment.

[Teraswaerto]

Really? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

I guess there's also no risk or expence in spending mage-time and gems on making items for the sole purpose of sending them into the arena hoping it will hurt someone else.

Making the reward for winning the DM more widely useful would probably be good though.

[mathusalem]

Teraswaerto said:
[...]
Making the reward for winning the DM more widely useful would probably be good though.




Yes ! Why not different sort of reward ? Let the winner choose what he wants !
An artefact for fighter and another for mage will be great.

[Hullu]

I personally think the reward is crap. The weapon that is. I don't want to send any serious champ up there since he'll be cursed with that crappy trident and can't use any decent items afterwards.

[Agrajag]

Back in dom2, when playing AE/SG Ermor I'd send a Dusk Elder (when I had one to spare = late game), so he can use the trident's quickness to make twice as many skeletons turnly in battle http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif (This is SP of course)
Nowadays quickness no longer effects casting, so that benefit is gone :\

[Hullu]

Hmm, does it give quickness?:/

I thought it only is an average weapon with two attacks a roudn and takes two hands? If it gives quickness it's ok after all... at least for the four handed heroes/pretenders.

[Twan]

Not considering the 100xp when you think about the reward value is a bad idea I think. The trident is just an above average weapon, but coupled with 100 xp (+100 for each new victory) can make a thug really excellent.
After 2 death matchs won my simple bane even with a limp affliction has att 22, def 21 (4 stars (+4) , heroic ability (+3) + quickness (+3)= +10 for attack ; xp (+4) and the trident (+9 !! quickness +3 and weapon +6) def = +13 for defense, and he had to do nothing but death matchs to achieve these stats.
Anyway, I think IW should have kept the original quickness effect for the trident (only), so the item would also interest mages a lot (in this game my bane had only to kill weak commanders and the prophet of an AI nation to win, as nobody see the interest of sending casters now).

[Hullu]

It's pretty scary sending your best of the best champion to the championships really... since one unlucky spell resist and you might be toast..

Also casters are quite brittle. If you send a mage, and your enemy happens to be a melee flier with the first action - you're toast:)

But people USED TO send mages back when quickness gave 2 spells a round, yes?

[PrinzMegaherz]

The winning player should receive increased faith, as his champion being the strongest proves his claim to godhood.

[Wick]

I like the original suggestion, although the current system leaves a certain perverse hope of seeing a match where everyboby sends a spoiler and a scout walks away with a Knife of the Dammed, Slave Collar, a half dozen afflictions, and 100xp. What's the most messed up "winner" you've ever seen?

I'd edit the typo but...

[PvK]

The first time I won the Deathmatch was with a cursed indy priest. My intention was to use someone disposable to perhaps weaken Ashen Ermor a bit, since I was worried about their growth and thought a priest might get lucky and reduce their chances of winning. I also gave him a magic bottle that summoned water elementals, and he won, becoming a hero, so I gave him some items and he became one of my more interesting hero characters.

PvK

[PvK]

I think the main problem with the Deathmatch is that the AI sends his best units there, and then of course all but one of them dies, which is a general strategic mistake, especially when mages are involved. Barring mages from competition might solve that...

[B0rsuk]

The only thing I don't like about Death Match is the way newfound magic items are handled, which is more global mechanic. Forcing someone to use a crappy cursed item is in my opinion design flaw. You could argue that the commander has sticky fingers and a weakness for magical trinkets, but if that were true, why equipped commanders are immune to cursed items (no slots left) ?
Is this just me, or SCs seem overnerfed in Dominions ? Horror Mark, Magic Duel and Curse were probably justified in Dominions2,1, but now with much more gold and resources, and relatively strong bless strategies, do we really need stackable Horror Mark and Magic Duel ? Couldn't early SCs be handled by ordinary troops now ?
I'd happily test this in a game without Magic Duel and Horror Mark, but you need several people to do that...

[Endoperez]

How is Horror Mark bad as it is currently? I thought it only causes Lesser Horror attacks until something like Astral Geyser comes into play, after the patch. Hunter of Heroes doesn't care about Horror Mark in 3.01...

[B0rsuk]

Well, it certainly sounds like an easy way to eventually completely doom any commander/pretender. I think the effect should be somehow related to the way the creature acts.

It may be not so cruel for big giant SCs, but how about smaller pretenders who wish nothing more but peacefully cast fireballs from far end of the battlefield ? Or even cast buff spells. Do they really deserve the same harsh punishment ?
So much for theory.

[Endoperez]

B0rsuk said:
Well, it certainly sounds like an easy way to eventually completely doom any commander/pretender. I think the effect should be somehow related to the way the creature acts.

It may be not so cruel for big giant SCs, but how about smaller pretenders who wish nothing more but peacefully cast fireballs from far end of the battlefield ? Or even cast buff spells. Do they really deserve the same harsh punishment ?
So much for theory.



Even Lesser Horrors are quite rare, and tough bodyguards should take care of those. I haven't tested the combination of Horror Mark, battle-caster and Hunter of Heroes, though. I'll see if I can manage to do that at some point.

[alexti]

B0rsuk said:
but how about smaller pretenders who wish nothing more but peacefully cast fireballs from far end of the battlefield ?


Lol! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Yeah, it's tough for battlemages now, but they have become a "collateral damage" in SC nerf. Ironically, the "nerf" didn't change much for SCs - they're still dying like flies http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif