Good bye.

[FrankTrollman]

I can't post here anymore.

So I won't be posting here anymore.

Good bye.

-Frank

[Tyrant]

What a cryptic message.

[Dedas]

Maybe he became banned? But how did he then write the message? Maybe in writing the message, he knew that he would get banned? But how can a message like that get you banned?

Oh well.

Who cares really? For me it can remain a mystery. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[BigDisAwesome]

k?
well i'll miss your informative posts.
hopefully you're still playing MP.

[Mindi]

He left on his own accord because he didn't want to follow the rules.

End of mystery.

[Jazzepi]

Wait. What rules?

Jazzepi

[Shovah32]

The forum rules about flaming ect?

[Gandalf Parker]

The link marked "Board Rules" at the top of this screen. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
I think he was pretty clear that he broke the rules.
He just wanted to debate them.

It was a long and interesting debate. Even long after the judgement was passed. Personally, Ive been on many forums since online forums were invented and I know of very few that would have allowed as much discussion as he got with as many people of authority.

Gandalf Parker

[Sombre]

I don't really understand what rules he could have clashed with. This discussion, is it all deleted now?

[Foodstamp]

He got as much as he gave in the threads I saw. This reminds me of that wagon quote in someone's signature. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[BigDisAwesome]

little known fact, Mindi is the 3rd person i've noticed including myself that lives in Ohio.

[Mindi]

There's a lot of us Ohioans around BigD. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Jazzepi]

Ha!

I live in Ohio as well.

Jazzepi

[Morkilus]

(OT) Sorry Ohio. You lose again. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[llamabeast]

Oh, this is very sad. Not that Frank wasn't a bit confrontational, but he also made a good contribution to the community in other ways.

Do people know if he'll still be playing in MP games? And would it still work to PM him?

[llamabeast]

Whoa, why have all of Frank's posts ever been deleted? Did he do it? That's really not good, he's given a lot of useful information over the last few months (or years, as far as I know).

[Mindi]

As to "deleted" posts in general:

Posts that break the rules are often either 1. altered, 2. moved to the moderator area so they are no longer in public view or 3. deleted. Most are not deleted unless it is hard to extricate them from a thread due to software limitations (and deletions typically only are done by Adminsitrators, not Moderators); however, the public will not see the posts anymore unless the infraction is small enough that we can edit the post, putting an edit tag and a reason, without changing the content of the post. However if the majority of the content of your post is breaking the rules, it will be removed from public view. We are not going to let the embers smolder until it becomes a blaze.

As to "deleted" posts of Frank:

Any posts of Frank that were removed were done so because he broke the rules and refused to comply and only those posts that broke the rules were removed. They were all from recent multiplayer games and concerned user fighting violations as described in the Board Rules (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/faq.php=). Frank wants to argue about those rules and was given several breaks before he was banned for a day earlier in the month. He was told not to keep pushing it when he came back and to follow the rules and he chose to break the same rule again.

He was even given another chance, but was told the next ban would be a week and after that a subsequent ban would be permanent (again as per board rules) and he chose to leave rather than to live by the rules. That's his perogative, and if he felt he could not live by the established rules than it was probably a good decision for him to make.

Look, most of you know that we don't run the forum like little Forum Nazis and we have a pretty relaxed atmosphere around here. Unless you are making an *** of yourself, we leave you alone.

[llamabeast]

Hey, sorry, I wasn't meaning to complain. I just wanted Frank to know I'd be sorry to see him go, as I'm sure many other people are, even if it was completely his own fault and he had been getting ridiculously argumentative.

About his deleted posts though - it's not just a few from recent threads, it's all the posts he's ever done ever, so far as I can tell. I guess he must have done it himself.

[Sombre]

Couldn't the situation have been defused?

I have no idea, but he seemed like a rational guy from what I read. It's hard for me to think of him as going 'off on one' and ending up being run outta town.

[llamabeast]

He did get very angry on some of the MP threads recently.

Not that I'm actually in any of them, but I seem to spend too much time reading these forums.

[Gandalf Parker]

He didnt get banned as far as I know.
PMing him will still send him a notice that he has a PM. He can come get it if he wants.

Not all of his posts were deleted. I still show hundreds of posts. As far as I know, only his long loud rants which he posted after he was told to drop it were removed.

As for diffusing, yes it could have been. Complaints happen on a regular basis here and we rarely take extreme actions. I think its obvious who it is that didnt participate in the effort to diffuse.

[Mindi]

llamabeast said:
Hey, sorry, I wasn't meaning to complain. I just wanted Frank to know I'd be sorry to see him go, as I'm sure many other people are, even if it was completely his own fault and he had been getting ridiculously argumentative.

About his deleted posts though - it's not just a few from recent threads, it's all the posts he's ever done ever, so far as I can tell. I guess he must have done it himself.



No problem, just making sure everyone knows the policy on changing/removing posts and that we did not wipe out all of his posts. Almost all of his posts are still there, you must be inserting a space or something in his username when you search.

[llamabeast]

Um, have you looked at them? They all say "Post deleted by Frank Trollman". Pity. Never mind.

[Teraswaerto]

I'm guessing he went back and deleted them all by hand.

"Deleted.

Edited by FrankTrollman (04/02/07 12:01 PM) "

In all of them.

[Dedas]

I think you did a good job Mindi, although an unpleasant one.

[Meglobob]

Sombre said:
Couldn't the situation have been defused?



Both Gandalf and Mindi tried very, very hard to defuse Franks anger and explain the forums rules. Sadly Frank for a very, very intelligent guy just seemed unable to accept or live by those rules.

[Foodstamp]

We know drama
http://i.tnt.tv/v5cache/TNT/Images/hdr_tntlogo.gif

[Mindi]

Teraswaerto said:
I'm guessing he went back and deleted them all by hand.

"Deleted.

Edited by FrankTrollman (04/02/07 12:01 PM) "

In all of them.



Sorry, no I didn't know he did that. Guess we will have to reinstate the editing window in the future. Obviously he was trying to get attention. And yes, Gandalf, Annette and myself all tried to get him to understand that whether or not he agrees with a rule, doesn't mean he doesn't have to follow it. He didn't want to budge and felt he was justified in leveling personal attacks based on things that had happened inside of MP games. Frankly I couldn't care less what happens in people's personal games, just don't bring the drama on here. With all the available ways to snipe at each other if you really want to get into a fight (ICQ, IM, Email), you don't need to bring it here.

[Gandalf Parker]

llamabeast said:
Um, have you looked at them? They all say "Post deleted by Frank Trollman". Pity. Never mind.


Wow. After arguing so long about the worthiness of his points, he deletes them? And I made such a strong case with him that his initial comments were allowed and remained. Then he goes and deletes them making me... grrrrr....
*sigh* If he wishes to erase his worthy contributions then I guess thats the way he wants it.

[B0rsuk]

Gandalf Parker said:
Wow. After arguing so long about the worthiness of his points, he deletes them? And I made such a strong case with him that his initial comments were allowed and remained. Then he goes and deletes them making me... grrrrr....
*sigh* If he wishes to erase his worthy contributions then I guess thats the way he wants it.



That's what I did when I was banned from another forum.

[llamabeast]

B0rsuk said:
That's what I did when I was banned from another forum.



If you don't mind me asking, why?

[B0rsuk]

llamabeast said:

B0rsuk said:
That's what I did when I was banned from another forum.



If you don't mind me asking, why?



In my case - because(not despite the fact) I spent a lot of time finding the right words, argumentation, logic etc to back up my points. Hard to say, really. I remember a red cloud obscuring my vision and a sense of injustice.

[FAJ]

What rule didn't he want to comply with?

[Teraswaerto]

It's too bad that he deleted them all... He had said relevant and insightful things in lots of threads that had nothing to with the recent arguments.

[Meglobob]

Teraswaerto said:
It's too bad that he deleted them all... He had said relevant and insightful things in lots of threads that had nothing to with the recent arguments.



Yep. This was the good side of Frank. His guide to T'ien Ch'i was excellent. Shame he had a dark side as well and his final act of deleting all his posts shows that dark side very clearly.

[Dedas]

I imagine we all have that side somewhere, hopefully under control. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Jazzepi]

Meglobob said:

Teraswaerto said:
It's too bad that he deleted them all... He had said relevant and insightful things in lots of threads that had nothing to with the recent arguments.



Yep. This was the good side of Frank. His guide to T'ien Ch'i was excellent. Shame he had a dark side as well and his final act of deleting all his posts shows that dark side very clearly.



He was obviously upset. I don't think deleting all those posts shows a mysterious evil, unchecked "dark side", I do think it shows that he's a bit spiteful over what happened. Heck, I might be too if I were in his shoes.

Jazzepi

[Ballbarian]

Upset or not, it is just plain childish and severely immature. Don't upset me or I will take all of my toys and go home...

Ugh. I was not going to comment on this topic. That is what I get for lurking so much. If the post sounds hostile, please forgive me. I have the flu and the antibiotics are giving me a serious stomach ache.

[Gandalf Parker]

I dont see too many others here ending up in his shoes. It was an awfully piddly little thing to take to such extremes

[Dedas]

Maybe this thread should be closed. I feel it is very easy to judge someone who cannot defend himself. This includes me, so sorry Frank.

[Mindi]

I'm locking this down. This doesn't need to be rehashed to death and unless you know all of the things that went on behind the scenes, you are just speculating. It's very simple, if you don't want to follow the rules, then don't post here. We're very laid back and believe in giving people second chances (and did so with Frank, I know other forums' administrators in my position would have permanently booted him the moment he started arguing with me); however, if you are going to keep doing the same thing you've been told not to do over and over and over causing multiple people to complain about your behavior, then you are just asking for trouble.

With that said though, we didn't kick him off and we didn't delete his posts. He did that himself and honestly that's a little childish on his part and seems like a last ditch effort to get attention. He's mad because he didn't get his way and thinks he should be allowed to harrass other users on the board if he feels it's justified. If this was his forum, that would be his right to do so and he could deal with the consequences (including legal ones if anyone decided to sue for harrassment), but this is Shrapnel's forum and we have to be responsible to the community as a whole and that's why there are rules.

If anyone has any other questions, you can PM me.

[Mindi]

For those of you who are upset that he deleted things that were helpful to you, we have a back-up of our board that we do testing on and I am going to try to restore as many of the posts as possible. Please PM me if there is something specific that you are wanting restored.