Swarm 2.5 (Ryleh wins!)

[CUnknown]

Hi all,

I am thinking about starting up another game to replace the one that was stolen along with my last computer. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

So, I think those in the previous game would have priority if they wanted to play in this one. We will keep the same settings as the last game, except let's scratch that 10 turn enforced peace rule, it just caused confusion.

I think I am going to switch races, although I'm not sure which one I am picking this time around. We can do a different era if people prefer. Oh, also, since there are rumors of a new patch, we will probably wait until it comes out to start.


Settings:

Middle Era
Mods: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.2 (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=578909&page=0&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1)
Indies 5
Site Frequency 45
Score Graphs off
Hall of Fame 15
Difficult Research
Map: Lonely Mermaid (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=d3smm&Number=545818&Forum= f195&Words=mermaid&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Main=5138 74&Search=true&where=bodysub&Name=&daterange=1&new erval=5&newertype=y&olderval=&oldertype=&bodyprev= #Post545818)
Victory Condition: 81 of 120 provinces

My ip = 97 dot 81 dot 86 dot 245
Port = 2000

Players confirmed:
CUnknown as Marignon
IndyPendant as Ryleh
Micah as C'tis
DryaUnda as T'ien Ch'i
Xox as Pythium
Jeffr as Pangea
Hetzer as Ulm
Zolharm as Shinuyma

24-hour quickhost for the first 25 turns, after that there will be 48-hour quickhost.

House Rules:
1) The spell "Mists of Deception" can't be combined with any perpetual killing spell such as Wrathful Skies. If the AI casts it for you, that's okay, but please do not ever script these two things together.

2) If you ever happen to charm Bogus's men, please do not ever use the "Attack Commander" option except for the Dark Knight guy himself.

[Meglobob]

Good to see you are good to go again CUnknown!

I won't be able to play however, just in too many games at the moment.

Btw I had the blood site that give you 40% bonus on blood spells in that other game, horde from hell, just 28 blood slaves and 5 gates just 18 blood slaves!

Never have that again...damn thieves... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif

[Micah]

Hmm, sign me up if there's room, I have a spare game slot

[quantum_mechani]

I might join if I can finish CB 1.2 in time and you don't mind using it.

[IndyPendant]

I'm sorry to hear you never recovered your computer, CUnknown. : /

It's a bit of a stretch for me, but I can't resist the idea of trying MA R'lyeh again--and of being able to learn from all my mistakes the first time around. ; )

Count me back in!

[CUnknown]

Wow, nice Meglobob! Makes me think our alliance had a pretty good shot at success.. But we'll never know. Blah.

Sure, Micah, you can take Meglobob's spot. I'm sort of expecting that most of the players have since moved on to other games, but I thought I'd leave open the option for them.

QM - sounds great! I'd love to use CB 1.2. You'd have at least until the next patch comes out to finish up, and we'd probably wait a few days for you after that, even, if you say you're almost done.

[Evilhomer]

If you have room for one more I would not mind entering, will have to decide on nation later on.

[CUnknown]

WraithLord has said he's in too many games, so you can have his spot Evilhomer. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Jurri]

Ugh, I have filled up my quota as well: pity, since Invisible Swarms have been fun and the roster would seem interesting... Still, better stay out, too many is too many.

[AlgaeNymph]

I'm in as T'ien Ch'i if none of the reserve players want it.

[Xox]

Ermor please

[Xox]

May i have a link to the relevant mods? CB in the master sticky mod list is a broken link and not sure if that will get me the scales and balance submod anyways. Is the link to worthy heroes in the sticky master the right version?

[Argitoth]

I choose Machaka!

[CUnknown]

I think I will be Marignon.

As far as the relevent mods, we'll probably be waiting for the new CB mod. I will link to it when it is out.

[Argitoth]

I wouldn't put difficult research... blessed units then have an advantage, takes longer to counter them if they are super storng. (hint hint, machaka spiders... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif )

[fictionfan]

i want to play abysia children of fire

[Xox]

Host chooses settings. Player chooses whether they wish to play in that game.

[CUnknown]

I know what you're saying about the blessed units, but, I just want to give this a try. A brutal early game brawl is what this is supposed to be. Those who survive will crawl out of the muck and start learning spells.

I don't think that blessed units are the only way to go, either. I mean, in that last game Jurri used elephants in the early game mostly. Others used an awake combat pretender. But, yeah, you pretty much have to go one of those three routes.

Will that make the game uninteresting? Hmm.. maybe. If so we'll never play these settings again. They seemed to work okay for last game (that was never finished).

[CUnknown]

Okay, fictionfan, that makes 8 confirmed players. I'd better close the game for now until I hear back from archaeolept, Cicadian, and Jeffr. If they are busy and don't want to play, then there would be another spot open.

Wait -- fictionfan -- isn't "Children of Fire" the EA version of Abysia? Or am I confused? We are playing middle age, just so there is no confusion.

[archaeolept]

heya CU - i'd like to join another game, but I'm enjoying having a bit of slack atm. Probably won't join another for a month or so. thanks for the offer, and good luck to all.

[Argitoth]

Xox said:
Host chooses settings. Player chooses whether they wish to play in that game.



You like to make enemies before the game starts, eh? I was making a suggestion based on the fact that I will be at a huge advantage with hard research and attempting to make the game more fair, funny how you didn't notice that.

[Xox]

Nothing personal Argitoth, I honestly did not even consider whether you were trying to gain advantage.

But...

If that statement made you my enemy in this game, I am happy to face you on the DOM III battlefield. I am very comfortable with that statement.

If it makes me enemies I am proud to be defined as the opponent of those who would attack someone for their statements and particularly that one.

Let loose the Dogs of War!!

as far as how it changes the game, sure all settings change the game, in some way, Some people will like seeing how those changes affect the game and some will not,

But if we are to have games with any variation in settings from standard vanilla..... it is inevitable that some will be liked by some, some will not. Relative merits on what settings are good or not are best discussed in threads other than the hosting thread.

I mean really! You are talking about the research setting right? We are also using the cb mod. Do you know your forum history man! Don't you remember the great CB Flame of "07"!!! Do you know how many forum suspensions, bannings and even just people lost from the game resulted from that flame war over settings of a hosted game? Some people really, really hate or really really love that mod. Like a religion,

Like if terrorists are playing this game for fun, in their off time, they would be saying to each other "why are these guys yelling and screaming at each other so fanatically about that mod, its not like you get 37 virgins if you win the game."

(Which by the way might be a nice promotion you developers should think about by the way. I am sure it would get some press for the game on the major media networks.)

My statement at issue should be a mantra for this and all games that use settings. I will say it again in a new slimmed down format.

"HOST CHOOSES SETTINGS. PLAYER CHOOSES GAME."

If you don't like the settings, you should wait for or host one with settings you prefer.

Cause I really appreciate all you out there who have the resources to host games for the rest of us. Thanks!!

[Micah]

Xox - I agree with your basic premise, but I also think a player has the right to *request* a change in the game, and if there's an overwhelming amount of support for the change then it can be implemented. If there's not a clear preference for the change among the players then the original setting stands, or if the host wishes to veto the change outright that's also his right. At that point the issue is closed and should not be brought up again, but I do not believe asking for a change once, politely, is considered in poor taste. I don't think that Argitoth's comment/query was out of line with that idea, so I don't think shooting him down the way you did was the most polite reaction available. ("I signed up for this game specifically because of the research setting and would not like it changed" should have sufficed to end the debate, and is much less combative)

Edit: And Argitoth, the sarcasm in your reply isn't helping anything either. That being said I'd be happy to team up with whichever one of you has the better bless units to roll over the other one =)

[CUnknown]

Wow, smack talk already, I like it!!!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

Argitoth -- I appreciate that you are trying to sort of self-nerf, afraid of dominating the game in maybe an "unfair" way. But, there is no reason to do that from my perspective. Feel free to go wild with your bless on the spider riders if you think it gives you an advantage. I would not think it was cheesy, or that you didn't deserve the victory, in any way.

Another point that popped up in the last game was double and triple-teaming. No one likes to get ganged-up on. But it happens. I have been known to get angry when that happens to me, other people have also. So, just a warning that this style of game may tend to cause anger and resentment among the players. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

But it's fun! If you get knocked out quick by a double-team or by someone's triple-9 blessed spider riders, try not to take it personally. You can be angry, but don't hold a grudge for next game. And you would get to start another game before anyone else, so it works out. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[CUnknown]

Oh, one more thing --

Does anyone know when the next patch is due to come out? We are waiting for it.

We're also waiting for the new CB mod, so I hope you can all keep the flame of your anger alive until the game starts (when you can pound each other while I research peacefully). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Xox]

ROAR!!!

Yeah, part of testing different settings and mods is to actually try to push them a little to see if they work.

[jeffr]

Just saw your PM and this post.

I'm in as Pan. Looking forward to it, thanks http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Argitoth]

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

Ermor is my natural enemy regardless of who plays him. Killing zombies is my past-time.

[CUnknown]

Cool Jeffr! Maybe we can actually work together this game, rather than last game where we ground each other into the dust for 30 turns. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

I think this game is officially closed to everyone except maybe Cicadian if he wants in.

[Xox]

This is mid age Ermor, Not late age Ermor. We are trying to hold back the death gate. No burden of time or anything like that. We are almost good guys. At least as good as Machaka death mages who turn into Giant spiders when poked.

[CUnknown]

So, it seems the new patch is out. Yay! We should be able to get started here pretty soon... I hope that QM is almost done with the new CB mod. I'd like to use it in the game, and also if we use it, QM will play, so that's good too.

Maybe let's wait a little longer for him..

[CUnknown]

Okay, sweet, the new CB mod is out! We should be able to get started pretty soon!

I am busy right now trying to get Ron Paul elected, lol. Maybe I'll be able to set up the server later today or tomorrow.

Mods to use when creating your god:
Complete Balance mod (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=578909&page=0&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1)


Map we will use:
Lonely Mermaid map (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=d3smm&Number=545818&Forum= f195&Words=Lonely&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Main=51387 4&Search=true&where=sub&Name=&daterange=1&newerval =5&newertype=y&olderval=&oldertype=&bodyprev=#Post 545818)

[jeffr]

Cool. The first post in the CB link says that:

*Worthy Heroes 1.8 merged into CB complete/nations.

Do we have to download the Worthy Heroes 1.8 mod separately or can we just use this CB complete mod?

[CUnknown]

Oh, cool! I guess we don't need heros 1.8 then. Thanks Jeffr.

[Xox]

So it sound like we are using the complete CB module? Not just scales and pretenders? Just want to be clear, because I do not see an option in 1.2 for breaking CB up as in 1.1

Either one ok with me, I just want to be sure I have the mod settings right.

[IndyPendant]

It can be broken up, the piecemeal version is in the second post. And I would prefer just Scales and Pretenders, myself, although I'll play with complete if necessary. ; )

Edit: Oh wait, this is *that* thread.

The intentions of the original hoster of the game were in no way harmed or circumvented in the creation of this post. IndyPendant (heretofor "the poster") absolves himself of any intentions to argue the original hoster's intentions, and the poster absolves himself of any intentions of changing said intentions, for the duration of the Invisible Swarm game (heretofor "the game"). The poster fully and publicly recognizes the right of the hoster to set the terms of the game. The poster is only stating a preference, should the hoster decide to seek preferences of the players of the game.

That is all.

[Xox]

I can very much go with either myself, I just need to know which we are doing, both for pretender creation and also I may change my nation selection if we are doing cb complete

[Micah]

Think I'll give Ctis a go if that's cool.

[jeffr]

I downloaded the Worthy Heroes 1.8 and it seems to be slightly different from the CB heroes 1.8, so I used the Worthy Heroes 1.8. I also downloaded the CB complete mod, not the components. This made it a bit easier.

[CUnknown]

We are doing CB complete, to test it out. That's what QM asked for, and I have no problem doing that. So, the only mod we are using is CB complete, which includes worthy heros.

Server to go up on Wednesday. Game to start wednesday night or thursday, depending on when people get their pretenders loaded.

[Xox]

Ok, CB complete, but this game first started out just CB scales and pretenders.

Ermor is drastically nerfed in CB complete. I will change my choice from Ermor to Pythium

[IndyPendant]

And I will need to know Evilhomer's nation before I upload my pretender...; )

[CUnknown]

Sorry Xox, I originally wanted only to use the scales and pretenders like you mentioned, but I didn't realize that QM was making a new version of the mod that fixed the problems I had with the other parts of it. He asked for us to use the whole thing, and I agreed.

Sorry if that was not clear.

[Xox]

no problem at all, I just needed to change nations.

[CUnknown]

Server up!

My ip = 97 dot 81 dot 77 dot 39

Port = 2000

Let's do this!

Edit: Hey Evilhomer, what faction are you choosing?

[Argitoth]

do we have to download the mod?

[Evilhomer]

Due to changed in my job situation, I will not start any new games I have decided. But good luck to all who plays.

[IndyPendant]

You will need to download the mod and have it turned on before creating your pretenders. Remember to password your pretender when creating it!

[Argitoth]

where can I download the mod?

[Xox]

You can find mods in the mod category here in the forums,

I think the appropriate thread for cb 1.2 is here:

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=578909&page=0&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

and a link to the attachment is in the header of the first post.
You really should experiment a bit with CB, it does change things.

Worthy heroes is here:

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=560854&page=2&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

and the map, I forget how i found that, cant find it now. The host should perhaps put the links in the first post. I hope i have the right links.

[CUnknown]

Added links to the first post for map and mod.

[jeffr]

Pan uploaded.

[Micah]

I'm in

[CUnknown]

We are waiting on Abysia and QM, if he still wants to play.

[CUnknown]

QM is bailing on us! Nooo..

Also, he says that there are apparently some bugs in CB mod 1.2.. he says that version 1.21 will be out soon ... ... ...

I am asking him if 1.2 is playable. If it is, we will just accept the bugs, I think.

[AlgaeNymph]

How will we get turn updates?

[CUnknown]

This is a server game.

My ip = 97 dot 81 dot 77 dot 39

Port = 2000

The server will upload the turn to you.

[AlgaeNymph]

I meant how will we be notified when the timer has run out and a new turn begins?

[IndyPendant]

Essentially? We're not.

There is a timer displayed when you connect to check your turn though.

[archaeolept]

you can use wraithlord's little app "py_eye_gui" to check out the status of any of your games. the user interface isn't the most polished, but it works nicely http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[CUnknown]

Oh! Sorry, DryaUnda, I was confused about what you meant. I think, if someone is the last oen to take a turn, they should post here and let people know.

I pm'ed fictionfan. He needs to upload his god before we can start. Although perhaps we should find someone else if he's staling already. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[CUnknown]

If fictionfan doesn't show up soon, we will just start guys, sorry for the delays. Defintely by sunday afternoon, we will be starting. QM says we can update the CB mod on the fly, so that is not an issue.

[CUnknown]

Okay, started!

I wanted to wait for another person to join, but I guess that's not happening. We have only 7 players for 120 provinces -- a little less jam-packed and brutal than I originally wanted it. But, it will give us some elbow-room and make difficult research maybe not so bad after all.

And besides, there are other games open right now, and I don't know how long we'd have to wait for the game to start.

Have fun guys!

The timer won't be turned on until everyone has taken their 1st turn. After that it will be 24-h quickhost.

[Argitoth]

Hey, please restart the game. I am dropping because I originally joined this game to play with a friend, but we are going to just start our own server. Sorry.

[IndyPendant]

Eep. Okay, I think we need more players now.

Unfortunately. : /

[CUnknown]

I agree. Eep.

Um.. who was your friend? Who is still playing?

[Argitoth]

My friend never joined the game.

[CUnknown]

I count 3 games open in addition to this one right now.

Makes me wonder if we're going to get any more players anytime soon. I suppose we could leave this game open and wait, we could switch to a smaller map and just start with the players we have, or we could scrap this game and all join the other games opening up.

I'm up for whatever, even if you guys want to scrap this one. I just want to play, basically. I can try hosting again at a later date when not so many games are open. But, maybe we'll get more players. We'd just have to wait for a game to finish up.

[Xox]

I am open to all those options CU.

I really only see one other game open and maybe not anymore. Also, you are hosting a network tcp game, which is much more convenient than pbem. So I think if we make it obvious it's open for new players, more will come. I am just saddened all the pregame posturing was wasted as Argitoth is no longer playing.

Did I come across to scary? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[CUnknown]

Haha, yeah I think you scared him away. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif

[CUnknown]

Bump!

We are still open for new players! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Hetzer]

Okay im playing in two games atm i can handle a third... but just give me a few hours (until tomorrow midday european standard time) to choose a nation and pretender... i have played a few games mp over at quartertothree....

[archaeolept]

Okay im playing in two games atm i can handle a third.

famous last words... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

just remember to get crushed in at least one of them and you'll be fine...

[Hetzer]

archaeolept said:


Okay im playing in two games atm i can handle a third.

famous last words... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

just remember to get crushed in at least one of them and you'll be fine...



nah i have played in 3 games at the same time in the past... its ok....

[Hetzer]

Okay i´ll make it easy for me and take ulm...

[CUnknown]

Cool!

Okay, I am going to set up the server now, IP info is in the first post.

We will still accept new players (at least 1 more) if any want to join before we start.

[Zolharm]

Can I join? I want play Shinuyma. Shall we use CB 1.21?

[CUnknown]

Yes, the new CB is what we should use.

Sure, you're in Zolharm!

[CUnknown]

Someone hit start. You have to wait until everyone loads up, and then the host hits start. I will set up the server again.

[jeffr]

Pan uploaded.

[CUnknown]

Waiting on DryaUnda (T'ien Ch'i) before we can start.

[AlgaeNymph]

CUnknown said:
Waiting on DryaUnda (T'ien Ch'i) before we can start.

Thought I was already uploaded, sorry about that.

*later*

Uh oh, I think I need to re-upload my god; my pretender activated the cheat alert and was reduced to an arch mage with no paths.

If that means you have to restart the server again, I'll PM everyone to expedite the re-uploading.

[CUnknown]

It seems like everything went smoothly DryaUnda. Is there a problem on your end? I don't see any cheat message.

[Hetzer]

Server down? i cant connect....

[CUnknown]

I was having internet problems before I left the house. Probably the problems are continuing. It will likely be spotty all of today. Maybe check back in 30 min or so. Sorry about that.

[AlgaeNymph]

I tested the pretender in single player, the cheat message showed up there.

[CUnknown]

Let me know if anyone still has trouble connecting. My internet looks to be pretty stable at the moment.

[IndyPendant]

I can't connect at all, still.

And in all honesty, I am not sure I even want to play in this MP game any more. : ( The recent scale-loss bug/or/feature will completely *HOSE* me on this map, playing R'lyeh with most water provinces surrounded by land. R'lyeh really needs Order-3, and I don't want to play it without Growth-3. I'll get neither, which will royally screw my strategy, and my fun.

And the only other MA nation I'm currently interested in playing--Ermor--gets hosed by the CB mod...

[AlgaeNymph]

IndyPendant said:
Ermor--gets hosed by the CB mod...

Oh! Thanks for reminding me about the mod! No need for me to re-upload my pretender, CUnknown, everything's fine when playing a game with the mod. (I forgot we were using a mod, it's been so long...)

[quantum_mechani]

IndyPendant said:

And the only other MA nation I'm currently interested in playing--Ermor--gets hosed by the CB mod...

Changes to reanimation were I believe removed in 1.21.

[Hetzer]

Sorry but im still not able to connect

[jeffr]

I also can't connect.

[CUnknown]

It looks like my IP address is different now for some reason, that was the problem.

My ip: 97 dot 81 dot 86 dot 245
Port: 2000

Try that, it should work.

"The recent scale-loss bug" That doesn't affect every game, does it? I thought it was an intermittent problem. If you took order-3, you should have it, right?

[IndyPendant]

No. The old scale-loss bug was intermittent. The recent patch fixed it--and introduced a new one: now, a province's scales change depending on its neighbours' scales, regardless of dominion. So if you have Order-3 and Growth-3, but your opponent has Turmoil-3 and Death-1 for example, and he owns some of your province's neighbours, you can kiss your good scales goodbye.

Still, I...think...KO has recently indicated that this is indeed a bug, although he's being annoyingly murky about it, possibly due to ESL. If it is a bug that is going to be fixed soon, then my initial start will be rather severely weakened by a loss of roughly 25% of my wealth--but then a start could be hampered by poor positioning too, for example. If I get my scales back in another patch soon, I'll keep playing. ; )

--Oh, and changing the IP fixed things for me.

[AlgaeNymph]

Turn #1 has ticked.

[Hetzer]

Next turn...

[CUnknown]

Turn deadline extended. I don't like to see people stale so early.

[AlgaeNymph]

Did the last one playing the previous turn forget to post, because I got a stale.

Is there any way to get e-mail notices for turns?

[CUnknown]

Sure, I would do that.. how do we set up e-mail notices? Does anyone know?

[IndyPendant]

I would talk to Velusion. He seems to be the master of the hosted games. (llamabeast being the master of emailed games. ; )

[Micah]

turn's up

[CUnknown]

Turn.

[AlgaeNymph]

New turn now.

If you're the last person to take a turn, please post here.

[CUnknown]

Turn 10 is up!

[AlgaeNymph]

It's now turn 11.

Please remember to post if you're the last to play a turn.

[Micah]

12 up

[Xox]

turn up

[Micah]

turn

[Micah]

turn up

[CUnknown]

We are getting some good early wars in!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/Injured.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/Injured.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rant.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[Micah]

Well, I don't know about "wars" but you seem to be doing quite well on the "opportunistic land-grab" front yourself... And I certainly wouldn't describe Shinuyama's attack on me as a "good" war since I'm pretty certain that all he's managed to do is kill us both, even if he's outlives me by a bit.

[CUnknown]

Hehe, I was mostly talking about Pangea. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

I wasn't bragging about myself, it's been mostly opportunistic land grab as you say.

But to me, good = lots of death. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[jeffr]

turn up

[CUnknown]

Two things -

I wish I took Ulm for this game!! We will be patching next turn, if that is okay with everyone.

Also, I will be away from town sunday through wednesday. Since I am the host, I think the game will be paused for those days. I'll take my turn before I leave, and leave the server up so people can take one more turn without me. Sorry for the delay.

[CUnknown]

Turn 19 up.

Please upgrade to the new patch now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I am leaving town today, so I have taken off the timer. But, I'll take one more turn, so you guys can get in two more.

[Micah]

turn

[IndyPendant]

Uh oh. I can't access the server. And CUnknown is away. I sure hope there's a mundane reason for this, and not a repeat of what happened last time...

[AlgaeNymph]

IndyPendant said:
Uh oh. I can't access the server.

Same here.

[CUnknown]

Yep, no repeat of what happened last time, thank god. My computer just froze. Server back up, sorry for the delay!

[CUnknown]

Turn 21 is up, I re-set the timer to 24 hour quickhost. If anyone would like a 48-h timer, just let me know.

[CUnknown]

Turn 23 up.

[Zolharm]

new turn

[CUnknown]

Turn 26 is up.

I switched the hosting schedule to 48-h. Of course we can still take turns quickly if we want (quickhost is still on). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Micah]

Stupid helmet bug...

[CUnknown]

Turn 31 is up already, wow. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Micah]

Someone come kill Shin for me so I can fulfill my goal of outlasting them...they've got 2 capitals at the moment, and a pretty beat up national army. Free Caps, come and get em!

[CUnknown]

Haha.. Micah... lol... it's funny 'cause its true. There are basically 2 free capitals there.

I loved your prince of darkness: Seige one capital. Wait until 1-strat move enemy army plods its way near. Fly to other capital. Continue seige until enemy army plods its way back. Repeat.

Remind me never to attack you, you don't give up man! Props on not going AI. Give 'em hell.

[Micah]

Yeah, my Pretender finally died at least partly due to the helmet bug (he lost an arm and it caused his helmet to pop off). I knew it was a risk to attack into the army at Shin's cap, but I figured he'd retreat at worst, especially after being buffed from my old cap-dominion...not so when he's taking 32 point hits in his unarmored head =(

And the amount of trouble I make for someone when I go down is pretty proportional to how annoyed with them I am...in this case Shin refused any efforts at diplomacy even when it was clear that we were in a situation of mutually-assured destruction if we kept attacking each other, so I made sure to uphold my end of the destruction agreement. I've still got 100-odd gems that I can send off to someone I like though, slated for release upon the demise of Shinuyama. Just mentioning it for anyone that might be looking for a bounty.

I actually gave all my gems to Calmon in one game when he killed me, because I was the one that started the war, so I didn't have much of a problem with him crushing me, and I figured the rest of the world deserved him as an overlord after they failed to help me out (He was clearly very much dominating the game at that point). They got mad at me for that stunt, but I quite enjoyed it.

That being said, you're all free to not attack me as much as you'd like in the future. (And note the gem givaway was due to a war I started, so just bide your time and wait for me to attack you...) ;-)

[Micah]

64 more Shinuyaman units have been fed to my surviving slave lizards this month, all of them Dai and O-Bakemono...Truly Shinuyama's capitals are a prize easily worth the trouble of taking.

Our last province shall not fall easily, as most of the population of our capital has volunteered to serve in the local militia, as Shinuyama has found, much to their detriment.

[lch]

Micah said:
I actually gave all my gems to Calmon in one game when he killed me, because I was the one that started the war, so I didn't have much of a problem with him crushing me, and I figured the rest of the world deserved him as an overlord after they failed to help me out (He was clearly very much dominating the game at that point). They got mad at me for that stunt, but I quite enjoyed it.


That again. Nobody managed to help you because you were on an island, killed off all the other inhabitants before calmon got there, and his Marignon was the only one being able to sail across the waters, as you might recall. Plus, the other nations were getting their asses handed to them by LA Ermor all the while. calmon might have won eventually because he had a very good start and seized that island, but for all the others, having invested weeks and months into a game and then experiencing that the game ends prematurely because somebody is acting out of spite wasn't fun at all. I think that big gem movements like those should be forbidden, even if it's among friends. They're very unbalancing and just hurt the game. Some negligible faction that didn't expand past turn 12 gets finished off a couple dozen turns later, and suddenly there are hundreds of gems going around.

[lch]

double post

[CUnknown]

I see what you are saying, lch. I'm not sure how I feel about this, though. Anyway, I think it would have to be declared beforehand as a house rule if we wanted to prevent it.

[CUnknown]

Turn 34 is up.

[IndyPendant]

Dammit! I thought I still had some time! Now I've staled out. : /

Bah. Very bah.

[CUnknown]

Turn 35 up.

[CUnknown]

Turn 36 up.

[IndyPendant]

May I suggest an addition to the victory conditions?

"At least 81 out of 120 provinces held for three consecutive turns."

Heck, it's possible--if highly unlikely--that I could win the game next turn under the current conditions! *Teleports mind-blasting illithid to every single PD-only province on the map...* ; )

[CUnknown]

Heh, fine, sounds like a good call.

Edit: wait... no, we can't actually do that. The game will end once someone reaches the province limit.

(goes to invest in PD)

I probably should have make it 90 or so provinces to win. IndyPendant - I didn't realize how many provinces you had until I just counted them up! You've got 40+ provinces. Nice.

[CUnknown]

I have to leave today, I'm going out of town. I'll be back on tuesday night. I hope to be able to take my turn before I leave (the game hasn't hosted yet). If not, I will have to raise the hosting time a bit. Sorry if this delays the game..

[AlgaeNymph]

Turn 38 up.

[Micah]

C'tis is in the market for some items, please contact us if you're willing to do a bit of forging. Thanks

[Xox]

cant connect

[CUnknown]

I'm back!

There must have been a power surge or something. The server was down.

It's back up now.

[CUnknown]

I turned off the timer for now. (quickhost is still on)

I don't want to let you stale again, IndyPendant, esp. since you said you were busy with work. But, if it will take longer than a day, perhaps you could get a sub? Anyway, work is more important than this game, so don't worry about this game if you have actual real-life stuff to do. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[jeffr]

I'm (Pan) going out of town for 10 days on Wed morning. I'll play my turns until then.

I'm just hanging around (only have 2 provinces), having some fun, but I'll go AI if you guys don't want to wait 10 days. I don't mind.

So, just let me know http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[IndyPendant]

Hmm, did I forget to ask for an extension in this thread? Looks like I did, sorry guys. Thanks CUnknown for helping me out. I will probably need a 72-hour schedule for the next two turns, and then things will settle down for me again when I return home.

[CUnknown]

72-h schedule is fine with me, for the next two turns.

Jeffr, if we switch to 72-h hosting time, it won't be too many turns in 10 days, but still, I don't think I'd like to pause for 10 days. I mean.. I suppose we could.. IndyPendant needs some time as well. But 10 days seems like a lot.

Could you find a sub? Is that just silly? But, at the same time, it wouldn't take much time to sub for.

[IndyPendant]

R'lyeh would like to publicly apologize to Pythium for that fool of a Barbarian Chief who decided he would single-handedly conquer one of Pythium's territories. We do regret that he was killed in the resulting battle however; the ritual execution for his stupidity--a punishment consisting of slowly devouring his brains bit by bit while he is paralyzed and aware--would have been a far, far worse death. You may desecrate his corpse as you see fit.

(The wierd thing is I am certain I have accounted for all the barbarians I had in that area--there weren't many--and that guy wasn't one of them. Odd. --I have downloaded and reviewed the turn, but I won't have it done for at least two days, maybe the full three, sorry. After this current turn though I will be back from my trip, and we can go back to a 48-hour schedule. Don't know what to do about thejeff...)

[jeffr]

No point in the sub. I'll just go AI. Good game, guys http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[jeffr]

jeffr said:
No point in the sub. I'll just go AI. Good game, guys http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



Except I can't connect now! Can you set me to AI? If I can't connect tonight, I won't be able to set it myself.

[CUnknown]

Ack! The server is back up now. It went down when I wasn't looking.

Sure, I can set you AI, no problem.

Good game, man!

[IndyPendant]

After this turn, I will be able to go back down to 48-hour turns btw. I should have this turn done in 24-30 hours.

Thanks for your patience, all. Damned company, actually scheduling *work* for the majority of my business trip...; )

[CUnknown]

Turn 44 up.

[CUnknown]

Turn 46 up.

[Micah]

Damn, think that was my first-ever MP stale. Not that I could have done anything.

[CUnknown]

Turn 48 up.

[IndyPendant]

Marignon's voracious appetite is insatiable. We had hoped that T'ien Ch'i's vast army would give them pause, but Marignon has rolled right over them like a juggernaut. Soon, T'ien Ch'i will be destroyed by those foolish, misguided fanatics.

This cannot be permitted.

We are an honourable people, and we will abide by the terms of our NAP with Marignon, though it may mean T'ien Ch'i's downfall. Hold if you can, valiant warriors! While we do not even have the NAP with T'ien Ch'i that we share with Pythium and Marignon, we cannot sit idly by and watch T'ien Ch'i fall. Soon your foe shall face another enemy.

Marignon must be stopped.

It is now Turn 58. On Turn 60, we will give the orders to our armies, and they will invade on Turn 61!

[CUnknown]

The High Inquisitor of Marignon will watch with glee as your pathetic 'god' is tortured until he recants his claim to the Divine Throne. We appreciate your honorable gesture, but breaking our NAP only hastens your downfall.

[CUnknown]

Foul magicks are in the air. The wisest old Inquisitors (the ones who are still alive, anyway) say that the vile alien presence under the sea is to blame. The Great Paladin of Marignon finds it odd that the aliens would hesitate to attack with force, out of 'honor', when they don't hesitate to corrupt time itself and thereby cause hardship and death among our peoples. He recommends immediate, unrelenting attack, despite the Pact of non-aggression.

Yet, other voices, most notably the most powerful Grand Master himself, urges caution, not wishing to overextend Marignon's armies.

As a compromise, the following message is delivered to the aliens: "The Empire of Marignon considers your unholy magics to be an act of war. Yet, Marignon is a most honorable nation and will abide by the Pact we have made. We wish to inform you that it is unnecessary to abide by the letter of the Pact, if you refuse to abide by the spirit. Let us keep the orders we have issued to our forces for this month, but next month, if you wish, we can both consider the Pact to be dissolved. Don't keep to the three-month rule for our benefit, for we wish to push your unholy race back into the sea as soon as possible.

Let us know your decision.

-Marignon"

[IndyPendant]

"Foul magicks" indeed. Leave it to unreasoning fanatics of a false religion to spout such obvious hypocrisy. Be careful Marignon, lest you condemn yourselves with your own words.

Or have you forgotten your own Great Hunt?

That spell has cost me two hard-won empowered bloodhunters, and forced me to abandon a forest laboratory. We can only imagine the harm it has done the other nations, with more forest provinces than R'lyeh has. We had simply assumed you did not consider it a hostile spell against R'lyeh--or at least, that you would publicly take that obviously self-serving position. There was just enough merit to it that we did not seek to pursue the matter with you.

However, if the Great Hunt is not to be considered "foul magicks", then neither can the Burden of Time. --Or is it only that the one was cast for you, and the other against you? Can even Marignon be that blatant in its hypocrisy? It is your nation that has not abided by the spirit of our pact; we have simply made use of the opening you provided for us.

We are also confused. It is currently Turn 59, and our orders have been given to our minions. We will be unable to change them before Turn 60 arrives--and that is the turn that our NAP ends and we can give the orders for our armies to attack, as I have stated clearly in my declaration of war above. Yet you seem to be 'offering a compromise' of ordering the attacks next turn. (Or does Marignon intend to attack us this turn? We would be extremely irate at such dishonourable tactics, and at the least if you tried that we would expect you to extend the current turn, and turn off quick-host, so that we could change our already-submitted orders.)

I suspect there is a misunderstanding here however; you do not strike me as the sort to resort to such tactics. ; ) If you are asking to *delay* our war so that orders to attack cannot be given until Turn 61...let us know. I cannot agree now, without checking the game again, but we would certainly consider it.

[CUnknown]

There must be a turn waiting for me at home.. if you've already taken it, then nevermind, let's just wait until the NAP expires normally. I must be a little confused as to the timing of the NAP -- I want it to end as soon as possible. I was giving you the option to end it early, or so I thought. We've been taking turns pretty quickly! Maybe I'm having trouble keeping track.

** Only the unrighteous need fear the Great Hunt! I'm sure your filthy blood hunters were targeted precisely for that reason. You should thank us for destroying them and bringing you closer to righteousness, if such a thing were possible with one of your kind. Your corruption of time with the foul magic of death is clearly a violation of our treaty, since it affects the righteous as well as the unrighteous! The Paladins and Inquisitors of Marignon are righteous by definition, of course. **

Maybe I forgot about the Great Hunt, hmm. But you have to admit Burden of Time is a little different! That's a much worse spell.. I may have killed a couple of yours, but all of mine are going to die. Ack. I was having old age issues as is..

[IndyPendant]

I'm afraid I cannot sympathize very much with that position. That's like complaining "You punched me back much harder than I punched you!" ; )

My sympathy lies with poor Pythium and T'ien Ch'i. They're the smaller players in this game (although T'ien Ch'i is almost gone) and they have to suffer the penalties of our globals as well.

Let us see what happens now, when our forces collide.

[CUnknown]

IndyPendant - dude, you're psychotic.

Xox - okay, first, you're attacking the wrong person, second, we had a non-aggression pact! Please turn around and attack the nearest Ryleh province to prevent him from winning.

[IndyPendant]

Heh. Thanks, CUnknown...I think... ; )

However, all my alpha-strike has done is even the playing field a little. I've already lost a number of thugs, your armies are much bigger than mine, and you have had the use of those provinces for far longer than I have. It remains to be seen whether I can keep what I have taken from you. I am far from winning the game, and it's in Xox's best interest for him to let us wear each other down for a bit anyway. Frankly, I'm surprised he attacked you at all, particularly if you share a NAP. I suspect he thought you would steamroll right over me, as you have all your other opponents--and he may yet be right! And finally, unlike T'ien Ch'i, Xox and I share a NAP as well, and as a quick search of my posts would show...

...I take a very, very dim view of violating NAPs.

That having been said, I would understand if Xox wants to end our NAP, and give his three-turns' warning now.

[CUnknown]

Yeah, it was meant as a compliment. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif I've just never seen that sort of thing before.. it was pretty impressive.

I agree that you are not going to win the game in the next few turns.. or, at least I hope that you don't have -more- where that last turn came from. If you put up another turn like that next time, that would be it.

Yes, my armies are stronger than yours (although you have more darkvision guys than I do, so that does even the field a lot).

But -- you've got artifacts and tartarians. You've got 3 globals to my none. You have way more gem income than I do, I believe... at least, it seems that way from the last turn. Definitely you do now, seeing as you took like half my provinces.

It's sort of a global skirmish right now.. we'd both just be trying to take as many of each other's provinces each turn as we can. I think you're right, that this could go on for quite some time.

Pythium can definitely attack me if he wants... I dunno what the best move for him at this point is. My initial reaction to seeing that turn was that you were winning in a landslide, but maybe it is not as bad as that. If I can start taking back the provinces and killing some of those starspawn, maybe you wouldn't have the resources to repeat that kind of thing. We will see.

[CUnknown]

Wow, I'm impressed that you still had money for PD after Utterdark.. you must have been saving up cash for this purpose.

Seeing as you have 5 globals active, and you're only a few provinces away from hitting the victory limit, I think it's pretty safe to call it here unless Pythium has a secret plan in the works..

Good game, IndyPendant. I thought I had this one won, but there is nothing I could really do to counter your teleporting tactics. I think, if we do this map again, it would be best to make water races illegal. Or cut down the number of water provinces. Not that you didn't do a great job. Congrats.

[AlgaeNymph]

I'm ready to call this game, too. I knew I should have started an alliance against R'lyeh... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/skull.gif

[IndyPendant]

Thanks CUnknown. Yes, I had been planning (read: worrying about ; ) this blitzkrieg for weeks, including saving up for PD. With 5 globals up and so many provinces, I think I can achieve the win now as well. We'll see how Xox feels first however.

And funny you should mention about the Lonely Mermaid map having too many sea provinces (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=604054)... ; )

[IndyPendant]

Well, I PM'd Xox, and he has responded acknowledging my win. The game is officially over, and I can finally say good game all! ; )

I received, created, and exploited a number of lucky breaks this game. The first, ironically, was Ulm attacking me very early in the game. If he hadn't, I probably wouldn't have attacked him, but early game he was just about the best possible foe I could have. Low-MR, high-resource troops and limited battle magic, and a capital on the shoreline. Yum!

Second lucky break was discovering a Citadel of the Lore Masters site early on, which jumpstarted my magical diversity and bloodhunting something fierce.

Third lucky break that I leveraged to the maximum was sort of Marignon. (No offense, CUnknown! ; ) He offered to help me mop up Ulm's remaining forces, and I let him take a bunch of provinces primarily to avoid looking like a big, tasty target to everyone else. I was comfortable with what I had won. This developed into a respectfully wary, friendly relationship between our two nations. And then he promptly went on an aggressive conquering spree--which allowed me to turtle up, research and site search like mad, and point frantically at him while whistling innocently...; )

I also found it strange that I got *all* the artifacts. Every. Single. One of them. (That I could build, anyways.) Was anyone else even close to getting them? I went Conj-5 for sitesearching, then Const-8, then Conj-8, with only a few stopovers for a couple of levels in other schools. And except for Wild Hunt, no one else bothered with globals. At all! That surprised me too...

Next lucky break was Marignon's Wild Hunt, because it allowed me the excuse I needed to launch some offensive globals early, exploiting the loophole CUnknown left me. ; )

Last major lucky break was when I realized how I could win. It felt kind of cheap, so I suggested changing the winning conditions so that the provinces would have to be held for 3 turns--and was flat-out refused. So I blinked, thought "okay then" and turtled up even more fiercely. By the time Marignon attacked T'ien Ch'i, I was fully outfitting about 2.5 Starspawn thugs a turn.

I was actually really nervous about that. At first I was concerned someone would try to take my land provinces away from me--forcing me to divert research and equipment resources to fighting a war. Then I was concerned Marignon would conquer too quickly for me to build up a sufficient number of thugs--or that he would do something similar to what I was quietly planning, and blitzkrieg the last ten to twenty provinces he needed for the win before I could react. I was also concentrating almost all of my efforts into one single tactic, and if I lost too many battles when the time finally came, or if I underestimated Marignon's defensive strength even with Utterdark up, I really had nothing left except Globals. You have no idea how much time and thought I put into agonizing over every little detail, or how many hours I spent on those last two turns....

I had a ton of fun with this game!

[CUnknown]

I'm glad you had fun! I did, as well.

I didn't realize what a threat you were, I mean I knew you were powerful, but the extent of your power I really had no idea. I probably should have attacked you straight away after we finished Ulm. It's just, I couldn't have defeated you completely (I had no underwater capability), so I decided to save you for last.

I never got the research for artifacts.. I had other research priorities.

About the victory conditions -- I didn't refuse to change them. I thought it was a good idea, actually. It's just it was impossible to change at that point. As soon as someone conquered the necessary # of provinces, the game would have ended. And, it really wouldn't have made a difference anyway.

I thought that I could win quickly by just conquering the world and never even going into the sea. There were 120 provinces, 20 sea provinces, and only 80 were needed for the win. My plan was to force you to react to me being about to win, let you take the first strike, see what you had going on, then push you back into the sea with overwhelming force.

That plan didn't go so well, obviously. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

I thought I was far in the lead in this game, I just greatly underestimated your strength.

I knew you were building tartarians, but I could have handled those. I didn't anticipate you hoarding death gems for all those globals.. Utterdark really screwed me. And I didn't anticipate the teleporting starspawn -- well, I mean I know you mentioned that you were going to do that. But I thought the 15 PD or so that I had would handle them. I didn't anticipate all that equipment you forged for them!

That's what really blew my mind.. everyone one of those guys was equipped out to the teeth. Your conservative playstyle led me to believe that you were weaker than you actually were. If I had all the gems that you apparently did, I would have... you know... done what I did in this game. Expand and destroy as much as possible!! Bwhahaha!!!

But definitely in no-graph games, I can see the reasoning behind holding yourself back. Certainly worked out well here. I think if we had graphs on, this game would have been very different. Who knows what would have happened..

[Xox]

Sorry Marignon, I did not realize we had a nap, I searched my emails before i attacked and did not see it. Yeah i hate those globals and wanted to attack ryleh, but you were rolling over tien chi and I owed them big time for helping me defeat Pangea who was the one who had attacked me very early on.

My personal victory conditions of defeating Pangea satisfied and no longer having the ability to be a big player i was just trying to support tien chi. In my opinion You should have attacked ryleh instead of tien chi and tried to enlist us smaller empires in your cause.

xox of pythia

[Micah]

Ha, good work Indy, hope my contribution to the war effort helped out. =)