Storm Queen with -2 strength?

[johnarryn]

Hey, didn't see this in the bug thread. In a MP game i'm playing my fully-equipped Air Queen (the Storm one) has -2 strength at the moment (out of battle). When I click on her it says "magic bonus +/-18," which is what I presume is what is causing the low strength.

She has a stinger, marble armor, burning pearl, starshing skullcap and a couple other items i can't remember off the top of my head.

Also, I believe she's in heat 3 territory.

Any idea what might be causing this?

[Zeldor]

Prophet on enemy dominion?

[johnarryn]

Good question, but no, not that either.

[Ewierl]

"+-18" does not mean "+/- 18", it means "+ -18". Dominions automatically puts the + in some fields, so when you get a negative modifier, sometimes you see both a + and a -.

Presumably she's suffering some kind of odd effect draining her strength, but I couldn't list many options off the top of my head.

[sum1lost]

Some critters like shades drain strength. Maybe they do so permanantly?

[MaxWilson]

Ardmon's Soul Trap? Drains -2 strength IIRC.

-Max

[Ironhawk]

Total shot in the dark: is she in drain dominion? I dont *think* that drain should have any effect but when I read "magic" listed as a reason the lower strength its the only thing I can think of.

[DonCorazon]

Did she get hit (repeatedly) by an Evening Star, mace that drains strength?

[johnarryn]

Hmmm. That last might be a possibility, DonCorazon, if Abysia forged one. I took over the game from someone else, and they've been fighting against Abysia, so I suppose it could be a possibility. Does the Evening Star cause permanent drop in strength?

[DonCorazon]

I think so. And it ignores shield defense so it can be a bit wicked.

[calmon]

Yep it does, evening star makes permanent weakness and the target gets a "Magic Bonus +-x".

[johnarryn]

Good to know.

[Ironhawk]

Wow, never knew that.

[Endoperez]

Me neither. Permanent? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif

[Aezeal]

nice way to combat SC if you can't kill em right away.. send something with loads of attacks and an evening star http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Tifone]

Mmh, seems to me VERY wicked that it ignores shield defense. ^_^ Does it at least require to hit - taking away at least 1hp - in order to drain strength? If it doesn't (like the poison arrows) it could *maybe* require some kind of fixing. (attention I think poison arrow will get, as KO seemed quite surprised by that fact in Sombre's thread 'bout that topic)

[Kristoffer O]

> Mmh, seems to me VERY wicked that it ignores shield defense

How so? It's not like it kills or anything http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Tifone]

No, no, I was just saying it is a very efficient way to render someone's beloved SC pretender or so pretty useless ^_^ If this is supposed to work this way, it's ok for me at all! Better, I just found something fun to try on that nasty Great Momma http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif (oh damn right, she tramples)

(great work with this game mr Kristoffer, I was just waiting the occasion to see you somewhere http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif )

[MaxWilson]

It doesn't render SCs useless. Many SCs kill mostly with area effects anyway (Shadow Brand/Stone Sword/Sunslayer) which aren't dependent on Strength. The direct damage from hitting somebody with the sword is just a bonus, unless you go up against another SC.

Strength matters more for regular units than SCs.

-Max

[Tifone]

I just said "pretty useless"!!!

Ok, ok, joking ^_^ Yep you're right. Ok. It seems anyway something nice to put on a couple of very niche, specialized thugs... Pity not much use in SP but it's the same. When I'm back home I'll give it a try http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[PvK]

Maybe if a unit would die if it reached Strength 0...

[johnarryn]

Nah. My storm queen as -2 strength, and hasn't died =)

[Herode]

Wearing a Marble Armor with -2 Str, wow. She may find it difficult to sprint. How will she catch her males ? ^^

[Calahan]

How would a unit with -2 Strength fair against a simple tangle vines spell? Would it be unable to ever break free?

[Edi]

Yaii! I don't think the strength drain is supposed to be permanent. That looks like a bug.

[Tifone]

KO didn't seem to think that way, edi. but who knows

[Kristoffer O]

Of course it should be permanent. What's the point if it ended.

No one wants afflictions that can be fixed http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[llamabeast]

Wow, strength drain followed by entanglement sounds pretty effective.

[Tifone]

and nice also. can't wait to try it! damn holidays in one of the most beautiful cities of the world with the girlfriend! XD

[johnarryn]

Yeah. Seems like it might be an interesting niche strategy. As pointed out by others above, most SC's are more about crowd control than straight up bashing, but still, in SC to SC combat it could be a useful strategy.

[Edi]

Okay, so it's supposed to be permanent. Then the display thing is a bug. But Evening Star just became a whole different level of nasty...

[calmon]

Its sometimes usefull and there is a defence: fire protection. 100% means you can't be weakened!

[johnarryn]

Really? I'm not sure... the Storm Queen who has the -2 strength, presumably from an evening start (though i'm not sure) actually has and had 100% fire protection. Not innate, but through items.

[Endoperez]

Bone Glaives of LA Atlantis sacreds have special "Additional Weakness", which is also listed as Strength Drain. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Weapons Leeching Darkness (secondary of Shadow Brand), Steal Strength, Theft of Strength as well and one of the two weapons called "Weakness" also drain strength. The second "Weakness" is part of Evening Star's effect.

Abomination of Desolation, Eater of the Dead and Unfettered, Hamadryad, Shade, Shade Lord, Thing of Many Eyes, Vastness and Wraith Senator and LA Atlantis Arssartut and the Kivigtok hero have some sort of strength-draining weapon.



EDIT:

calmon said:
Its sometimes usefull and there is a defence: fire protection. 100% means you can't be weakened!



Actually, Evening Star has secondary effect Fire and Weakness, which has secondary effect Weakness. The First deals fire damage, the second one drains strength.

And before someone asks, at least Arssartut do drain strength permanently, so I presume all strength drain is permanent. Are there any strength-draining spells?

[johnarryn]

Hm. Well, I took over from another player, but as far as I can tell he only used the Air Queen against Abysia. They have a moloch pretender with a smasher equipped, and lots of ABysian fire mages... I don't believe any of the above are possibilities, but again I wasn't in the game the whole time, who knows what happened.

[calmon]

johnarryn said:
Really? I'm not sure... the Storm Queen who has the -2 strength, presumably from an evening start (though i'm not sure) actually has and had 100% fire protection. Not innate, but through items.



Yes, i did some tests in times i looked for good anti SC killers and fire protection helped against this weapon. It also correlates with Edi's DB. The effect "Fire and Weakness" is marked as an fire effect.

edit: i'm so slow http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[johnarryn]

Interesting. So either she's been weakened through some other effect or didn't have the fire items at the time.

[Endoperez]

Well, Fire and Weakness has a secondary effect of its own, called Weakness. The first secondary deals fire damage, the second deals the strength-drain. I think the latter effect is only called when some of the fire damage is dealt.

[Ironhawk]

Dont dispossessed spirits have strength drain as thier attack? Is it permanent too?

[RamsHead]

I am pretty sure that they have an MR negating paralyze attack.