Mulligan - RoR'd. Pls Confirm interest...

[chrispedersen]

I expected this thread to die of lack of interest. However, I have received comments off thread, and some interest on thread. So I'd like to see if sufficient interest exists.

Sooo, I don't know about you but I hate being beaten by stales. Or screw ups. And don't you just hate it when you get to a critical point in the game.. and you forget to move your mages?
Or to give those mages those crucial gems?

Tired of getting beaten by real-life instead of your oppononents?

If so.. this games for you.

Number of Players: Flexible
Era: Any (Single Age Mod required)
Map: Mistletoe for 10, Rorshact for 15-18.
Mods: CBM 1.5
Resources 150
Money: 150
HOF: 15
Sites: 60
Map: Depends on player.
Turnaround: 24 hrs for first 20, 48 thereafter. Delays upon request.

Lying, cheating and stealing encouraged.


LA-Mictlan......chris pedersen............1 Mulligan
MA BandarLog..Cthulu......................1 Mulligan
LA-Ermor........Zeldor.........................0 Mulligan
LA-ULM..........Qio............................1 Mulligan
EA-Helheim.....Ossa.........................1 Mulligan
MA-Oceania....PSI-Soldier.................1 Mulligans
EA-Formoria....Bwaha.......................1 Mullligan
EA-Mictlan......Skinu.........................1 Mulligan?
MA-Hinnom......P3D..........................0 Mulligan
EA-Abysia......Hunt11.......................1 Mulligan



Mulligans Rules (Current Version still open to revision)

1. A mulligan must be used within 24 hours of hosting.
2. A mulligan may be used to change starting position. (Once only at start of game).
3. A mulligan may be used to undo a stale. This is not subject to challenge.
4. Mulligan Auction. Mulligans may be expended in order to attempt to reverse a game turn. Once a player indicates that he is going to expend a mulligan in an attempt to reverse a turn, a mulligan auction commences. All players may commit mulligans either For or Against. Mulligan auction will commence for precisely 24 hours after the first person announces a Mulligan Auction. All mulligans announced in the auction will be expended. For the Auction to succeed, More Mulligans must be expended in favor than opposed. (ie, ties result in no turn redo.)
5. Once a turn is mulliganed, for either reason #3, or reason #4, all players will have 48 hours to submit a turn. Failure will result in the same turn being submitted and will not qualify as a stale.
6. All players will start with *one* mulligan, with and additional mulligan earned and available for use on turns 11, 21, 31 etc.
Exception: Newbies will start the game with one additional Mulligan.
Exception: Because of wide concerns on the strength of these nations, EA-Hinnom, MA-Ashdod, EA-Niefle and LA-Ermor will start with one less mulligan.
7. Available Mulligans will be tracked here.

Exploits banned (anyone know a good list?)

[Discussion]: The Pillars of Mulligan. A Holy Magic site(s) that once found confers an addition mulligan per 10 turns. I'm like the idea, but I'm inclined to leave it out, as this is the first time with mulligans.

[cthulhu]

MA Bandar Log for me

[Ironhawk]

While this is an interesting concept, I feel compelled to point out that it is going to basically ruin the game. Any time a player scores a major victory over any other player, the loser will simply use a do-over and move thier forces away and regroup.

And as if that wasnt bad enough, since there is no incentive for one player to use thier mulligan once any other player has used thiers for that turn, you could conceivably have the game stalled for weeks or more on a single turn. I think you should really reconsider your game idea...

[fungalreason]

... seriously?

[Tifone]

Hey, seems interesting chris. I'm at maximum carriage for myself so I can't apply but I hope the idea will work well :)

Double fun if someone could even sell his mulligans to other players!!

[Ironhawk]

So, the insanity of this game has been cooking in the back of my brain. And surprsingly, I thought of an idea which might make it workable: Allow players to use their mulligans to oppose the mulligan of another player. It actually makes for a pretty interesting meta-game instead of just making this thing a morass of everyone constantly using thier do overs.

For example, two players are fighting and one defeats the other badly. So, the loser chooses to use a mulligan to replay. Now the winner is placed in an interesting situation: do they use one of their own mulligans to stop the re-do from happening? Or do they allow it to pass through, and change the orders for thier own men, betting that they can win again later and have just used up one of thier enemies do-overs.

So, any player can use a mulligan for a re-do. And any other player can use a mulligan to resist a re-do. Turns only get regenerated if there are more mulligans played for a re-do than against it.

[Zeldor]

If it works out, I can try LA Ermor. But I'd agree with Ironhawk about game settings.

[Gandalf Parker]

Is this going to be direct-connect or play-by-email?
Are you hosting this yourself? Llama's server? My server?

[chrispedersen]

Is this going to be direct-connect or play-by-email?
Are you hosting this yourself? Llama's server? My server?

Oh I'm always a sucker to get someone to do the work gandalf, so if you want to play and host ... More than happy to have you.

If not, I am completely open to whatever the players want to do. Lets get some signups going, Iron, Gandalf = )

[Zeldor]

PBEM is always the best option. Clear game status, archived turns, option to do rollbacks if needed...

[Dectilon]

On what level will these games be played? I'd like to play, but I haven't had a chance to play any mp yet so...

[chrispedersen]

I've no opinionn on this Dectilon - have you played a lot of SP.
Its not at *all* the same - but thats a good start.

I'm inclined to let a few new players in...

[cthulhu]

I suspect that 3 mulligans per player may be a bit excessive, particularly if there's a lot of players... 15 playes at 3 mulligans per player would mean up to 45 turns when everyone would have to replay the turn.

Various ideas:
A. Reduce mulligans per player to 2 or 1.
B. Distribute mulligans gradually over time to surviving nations: say, start everyone with 1 mulligan, then give everyone still alive at turn 30 a 2nd mulligan, and a 3rd at turn 60.
C. Make mulligans fungible, allow trading of them with enforced honesty.

[Dectilon]

I've no opinionn on this Dectilon - have you played a lot of SP.
Its not at *all* the same - but thats a good start.

I'm inclined to let a few new players in...

Yes, I've played a lot of SP. But I hear MP is monumentally different, so I'm not sure how much it's worth.

Which age will this be?

[Ossa]

I'd go with EA Helheim in this one

[Gandalf Parker]

PBEM is always the best option. Clear game status, archived turns, option to do rollbacks if needed...

Those arent actually features of PbEM. They are available on any Dom3 game. Most of the larger runs tend to put it in along with things like notification of turns processing and such.

[Bwaha]

I would like Formoria, thanks. :D

[Zeldor]

Gandalf Parker:

Well, even at your server I don't see an option to:
- check turn status without logging in or using special program [not even sure if it works]
- have all my old turns stored without manually doing so
- checking how many stales other players had

[Gandalf Parker]

Its not there on the little blitz games.
But it has been on the larger games hosted there. Either by me, or by lch, or by DrPraetorious, or others. Its only worth offering the option on larger and longer lasting games.

[lch]

As Gandalf said, there's virtually nothing a PBEM server can do that a network server can't. Personally, I prefer networked for ease of playing turns. I don't like to click and copy and move around stuff every time I download or upload a turn. Others might perceive it differently.

Gandalf Parker:

Well, even at your server I don't see an option to:
- check turn status without logging in or using special program [not even sure if it works]
I created a PHP script (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=33385) for that. Others have come up with similar solutions. Including llama for his PBEM server.
- have all my old turns stored without manually doing so
A reasonable server admin generates backups of all the turns, I do that at least. Rollbacks are always possible then. If you talk about the user side, then yes, you'd need to take care about that yourself. I'm not sure if I'd consider binary attachments in my email inbox a good turn backup solution over backups on my file system.
- checking how many stales other players had
*Points to my PHP script again...* It already does this.

See http://dom3.servegame.com/stats/stats.php?game=Demo for a demonstration.

[chrispedersen]

More on Mulligans: If this is acceptable, I will post it in the game setup.

1. Mulligans can be redeemed (uncontested) to reroll your starting position, or to avoid a stale.
2. Otherwise, muligans can be used to used to redo a turn if the muligans expended in favor exceed those opposed. Mulligan notifications occur in the forum.

(mulligan diplomacy lol)

Presently, I'm inclined to keep the number of mulligans fixed at 2/3.

However, if a majority of players want 1/10 turns I'm ok with it.
I would also be ok with giving newbie players +1 mulligan. Plus it would be useful for them to be able to learn.

Nothing like redoing a turn...

[chrispedersen]

Bump... interest?

[Ruminant]

Sure, I'll give it a whirl.. Total multiplayer nooblet here though.

Stick me down as MA Pangaea.

[Micah]

I'm not playing in this thing, but I'd vote for gradual distribution of mulligans, since otherwise there's gonna be an early-game morass as overmatched opponents blow their mulligans just because they have a lot of them, even if their situation is pretty much doomed. Anyone that gets killed by a lopsided rush shouldn't be able to hold up the hosting 3 times. (And the more imbalanced the situation the less incentive there is to counter it, ensuring that the host will indeed be delayed.)

You also should put in a deadline or otherwise clarify the process for mulligan voting so there's no last-minute antics.

Good luck, you'll need it =)

[Executor]

Interesting concept,
Maybe you can add mulligans by kills also if you're going for gradual distribution. Every capital taken + 1 mulligan.

[hunt11]

This game sounds way to much fun not to join, EA Abysia for me

[Bwaha]

Due to unforseen circumstances I withdraw my position. Sorry, game on. :D

[qio]

Can give it a try I guess.

LA - Ulm.

[chrispedersen]

Well, we've only 6 players. Perhaps thats enough just to test the concept.

Any comments on maps, whether to proceed etc?

[qio]

The name. It's with a "Q" not "G". Not that it matters.

Just throwing out a suggestion. Mistletoe. But any map with 10+ provinces per player is fine with me.
6 is always enough. I vote for "press play".

[chrispedersen]

barring further discussion I'll look at mistletoe and try to start the game this weekend.

[Ruminant]

I am incredibly sorry for this, but I foolishly entered this game thinking I would have enough time but between my new job, the coming uni term and the other games I'm entered in I seriously doubt I'll have enough time. Really, really sorry for dropping out :/ Especially this close to you starting the game. God speed in finding a replacement :(

[PsiSoldier]

Hrrrm Looks like you had someone drop out. assuming that your game hasnt started yet, and it doesnt look like it has as I dont see it on Llamaserver I'll join with MA Oceana if you have room for a water nation.

[chrispedersen]

Sure thanks for joining Psi!

[PsiSoldier]

How many more people are we looking to get for this game?

Oh btw. I saw you were thinking about Zeldors map for preponderance and it is fine and all but with me being a water nation its not really good for me I'm afraid.

[chrispedersen]

How many more people are we looking to get for this game?

Oh btw. I saw you were thinking about Zeldors map for preponderance and it is fine and all but with me being a water nation its not really good for me I'm afraid.

Yeah.. 6 people is way to few for preponderance.
How about albathia. 69 provinces, 13 water... Which puts us all about equal although a little tight?

[Zeldor]

Huh, that thread is for serious? I'm not in it :) 6 players, water nation and multi-age? That doesn't make really sense. Let's just admit it won't work and everyone looks for another game. I think we need some normal games now, not strange ones, which cannot get enough players.

[chrispedersen]

Awww Zel - now you have us disappointed....

[Zeldor]

Someone had to tell the truth. There are many cool games around that have really nice themes, but the unfortunate thing is that so many people decided to make different theme games at the same time, so there are not enough players to fill them.

[Gandalf Parker]

Everyone who wants to thank Zeldor for telling us the truth keep in mind that there is a Thanks button on his post. Or you can click on the scales at the top of his post to raise/lower it.

[chrispedersen]

Someone had to tell the truth. There are many cool games around that have really nice themes, but the unfortunate thing is that so many people decided to make different theme games at the same time, so there are not enough players to fill them.

Um I'm not disappointed in what you said, Zel - ONly in your comment that youweren't in the game - I mean you did say earlier you'd bite = )

[Zeldor]

Oh, I was. I was just saying that with what we got left it there is no reason to start the game and if you want to start it, I will step out. Maybe not best words used :)

[Skinu]

Well if you DO decide to go ahead with the game, and your still signing up, ill join as EA mictlin

[P3D]

If Betelgeuse is concluded by game start, I'd like to join as Hinnom, if not, Ashdod.

[Bwaha]

I confirm that I wish to play as stated.

I had to come out of retirement, so my time is limited.

What type of schedule are we talking about?

Sorry not to have communicated much lately, but as I said I've been rather busy lately.

:D

[chrispedersen]

Hey Bwaha & Skinu: glad to hear from you.

This thread is closed - only 5 people indicated a desire to play. I had sent an email out to everyone.
But I would like to bring you into NOx. We need 1-2 more players and there are a lot of good nations.

Would be nice to see you in a game again Bwaha!


Best wishes...

Chris

[Bwaha]

Thanks Chris. I'll look into it. :D

[Belac]

If people are still interested in this, I am.

Let me know if it's still active and I will rustle up a nation.