CarCrash - EA Game - CBM - (Running)

[Calahan]

General Game Information
Name of the Game - CarCrash
Type - llamaserver PBEM (Play By EMail)
Age - Early
Players - 14
Open To - All Players, but some experience advised
Nations - Random ***
Mods - CBM Complete 1.41 (includes Worthy Heroes 1.8) *** http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=42022
Victory Conditions - Hold 50% of capitals for 3 turns (7 out of 14 capitals)

Map - Orania
Independents - 5
Research - Standard
Magic Sites - Default (which is 45 for EA)
Money - Default
Resources - Default
Supplies - Default
Random Events - Default (which is Common)
Re-naming - On
Score Graphs - Off *** (provisional)
Hall Of Fame - 10 ***

Please take note of those settings marked with *** as they are different from the default settings that MP games usually have.

Hosting Schedule, Delays, Stale Turns, AI/Substitutes
A rough schedule will be -
First Turn - 48h.
Turn 2-25 - 30h quickhost.
Turn 26-45 - 54h quickhost.
Turn 45+ - 78h quickhost.

Happy to increase the time between turn hosting at earlier points than indicated if anyone is struggling with the schedule at the time. Having to rush turns, or submit partly completed turns, seriously detracts from a players enjoyment of the game. And a game is always better if everyone is enjoying it.

Ideally, please post in the game thread and PM me if you need a delay, just in case I miss one of them (and so that the other players know what's going on). I'm a friendly admin, so most delays will be granted, but please give as much notice as possible. Since asking for a delay 5 minutes before hosting probably won't do any good. In the early phase any request up to 48 hours should be ok (if you are away over a weekend for example), anything longer may need to be temporarily subbed (or accept a stale). Once the game gets more intense and critical, then longer delays will usually be granted.

Stale turns are always unwelcome, but they are not the end of the world, and I doubt a stale free MP game has ever existed. So can I please ask that players not to drop-out just because of a stale turn or two. If a player stales for 3 consecutive turns then the position will be assessed, and that player will either be turned AI, or a substitute will be sought. In the latter case, the game will be delayed for 48 hours while a search takes place.

If you do have to leave the game for any reason, then please can you let the admin know about it. I understand fully myself that it's not always possible to do this, but it is always highly appreciated if possible :) And if you can find your own substitute for your position, then that would be even better.

Who Can Play In This Game?
Anyone is welcome to play in this game as it will be open to all players, regardless of their experience or skill level. But please note that newbie players wanting to play can not expect any special leniency from the more experienced players in any way. So please be aware before signing up that this is not a 'Newbie' game, and will likely not be the best environment for new players to learn about the game.

How Do You Select Your Nation?
The nations in this game will be randomly selected. If you are interested in playing then please post in this thread, and I will PM you which nation you have been randomly given. I will also update the game page with this information.

Game Settings and Map
Everything is default except for the Hall Of Fame which I have set at 10 so that only those truly worthy get into it :) and the Score Graphs which I have disabled. Although I am aware of the lack of Indy scouts available in the Early Age, so I may well enable the Score Graphs if the lack of scouts is considered a major problem in Early Age games.

With regards to the map, I have no real preference which one is used, and have provisionally selected 'Orania' as it has 279 provinces (259 Land / 20 Water) which seems fine for about 15 players. Although I am happy to listen to suggestions about an alternative / better map if anyone has some ideas. 'Orania' also only caters for one water nation, so if a second water nation is randomly selected, then either a new map (possibly the 'No Sites Alexander' map) is required or the second water nation will have to be changed to a random land nation instead. May also need to consider changing the map if no water nations pop up.

I'm happy to consider creating a new random map with fixed starting zones (not starting provinces) if the majority of players prefer it, or are unhappy with a 360 wraparound map (which 'Orania' is). It all depends on what the players are happiest with :)

Situation Regarding NAP's etc (Non-Aggression Pacts)
No NAP agreements in this game will be considered as inviolable in any way. You are free to sign as many NAP's as you wish, but you do so at your own risk. Also, I personally think that in a game like Dominions 3 there isn't really any such thing as an NAP, since in theory everyone is aiming to win, and there can be only one winner. So all NAP's should instead be considered as Mutual Benefit Agreements, whereby both nations benefit for whatever reason(s) from not engaging in hostilities against the other nation. But the moment one side is no longer benefiting from such an agreement, then that is the moment they are most likely to break them. So if you are ever surprised by a nation breaking an agreement, then maybe you were mistaken with regards to just how important that agreement was to them, or how much they could gain from suddenly attacking you.

Also, if any NAP (or like agreement) is broken in any way, be it intentional, accidental, or whatever, then you have no right what-so-ever to complain about it in the game thread. Please keep this in mind. Any disputes regarding these matters should be dealt with via PM's.

But remember that trade agreements such as a gem/item swap/purchase are a totally different type of agreement to NAP's. You are expected to honour any and all trade agreements that you make.

Banned Spells and Exploits
1.You are not allowed to copy the script orders from Bogus and his friends to others commanders (ie. The 'Fire Commanders' orders).
2.You are not allowed to overload another players lab by sending them lots of items they did not request. Be they worthless or valuable.

I have been out of the Dominions scene for six months, so other things may also get listed here when/if they are brought to my attention.

Final Note To All Players
First I have a request to all players in this game, and that is to read or refamiliarise yourselves with this great set of general tips regarding personal conduct in MP games written by Sheap. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com//showthread.php?t=32050

Also, please can I further emphasise to everyone to firmly keep in mind that Dominions 3 is a computer game. If someone is dishonest and backstabs you in the game, this does not mean that this is how they are in real life. If you honestly believe that people will behave the same in real life as they do in a computer game then I personally think there is something wrong with you, and I would prefer it if you did not sign up for this game.

'Thank You' for your time in reading all this. Good luck and happy gaming to all the players.

Current List of Nations and Players

Calahan - Yomi :dagger::dagger:
Valerius - Vanheim (Incabulos, the original Vanheim player disappeared on turn 22, and Valerius kindly took over on turn 24)
Jazzepi - Sauromatia :dagger::hurt: (Defeated on turn 65. Went AI on turn 58. Kill credited to Yomi, Pangaea and Caelum)
Fantomen - Abysia :hurt: (Defeated on turn 53. Went AI on turn 38. Kill credited to Tir na n'Og. *** Illuminated One took over on turn 33)
Trumanator - C'tis :hurt: (Defeated on turn 30. Went AI on turn 23. Kill credited to Yomi)
Executor - Pangaea :hurt::dagger::dagger::dagger: (Defeated on turn 82. Went AI on turn 65. Original player had to drop due to RL reasons, and no sub could be found)
Phonics - Atlantis (The original player Silence0 went AWOL on turn 74. Phonics kindly took over on turn 78)
Drager - Hinnom :hurt: (Defeated on turn 32. Went AI on turn 25. Kill credited to Pangaea)
Alpine Joe - Fomoria :hurt: (Defeated on turn 20. Went AI on turn 12. Kill credited to Sauromatia for making them turn AI)
Pelthin - Niefelheim (The original player was Bluff, but he had to drop due to RL reasons)
charshep - Mictlan :hurt: (Defeated on turn 67. Went AI on turn 39. Kill credited to Pangaea)
AlgaeNymph - Tir na n'Og :dagger: (The original player was Zapmeister, with AlgaeNymph kindly taking over on turn 68)
tgbob - Caelum :dagger:
PsiSoldier - Agartha

Key-
:hurt: Defeated - This nation no longer has any influence in the land.
:dagger: Kill - This nation is directly responsible for another nations defeat, or in making them turn AI.
:computer: Currently AI - This nation is now controlled by the computer AI.
:evil: Enemy of All - This nation is currently hated by most other nations, probably for putting up a game winning global.
:trophy: Overall Winner - This nations Pretender has become the one true God, and has complete rule of the land.

The above symbol idea was shamelessly stolen by me from a game that 'AreaOfEffect' is admining. Thanks for the idea AoE :)

Edit: I have added the most recent CBM 1.41 mod for anyone having problems with the inconsistant battle replays.

[Calahan]

Oh great, I get Yomi. And there was me hoping my first game back would be a nice powerhouse nation to ease me back into the Dominions world. But instead my brain now gets to hurt right from the off.

No offence intended to the many thousands of Yomi fans out there of course :)

[Incabulos]

I am game :) may as well jump in early when the randomness has a more volatile range :D




edit: ooh Wales... I miss the greenery. Went to Uni in Newport/Caerleon. Already been 12 years... awk!


edit 2: Oh I am assuming graphs off. I prefer avoiding the artificial game device of graphs and prefer people try to figure that kind of info themselves with scouting etc...

[Jazzepi]

Count me in!

Jazzepi

[Fantomen]

I´ll play

Edit: Wouldn´t it be better to reveal the nations when signups are full?

[Silence0]

Hi all..Can i join? Never played pbem only hot-seat with friends.. I´m willing to let my first one be a bloodshed..and random suits me..

[Calahan]

Wouldn´t it be better to reveal the nations when signups are full?

That.......is now a very good point. I did think about this to begin with, but then decided against it because I, as admin, would have an unfair advantage because I'd be the only player who knows which other nations are in the game, so could design my Pretender accordingly. But now I've drawn Yomi, it may not be such an issue (again no offence to Yomi lovers)

What do people think? Should I
1)Wait until the game is full, and Pretenders uploaded before I publish the final nation list.
2)Update the list as new players appear.
3)Makes no real difference either way.

Will delay updating the status page until I get some feedback, and had some sleep :)

[Trumanator]

I'll join.

As far as revealing nations goes, I actually think it could be cool if you published the list after its full, but didn't reveal who's who. Sorta similar to a RAND game.

[Executor]

Count me in, like random nations games. This system works for me.

[Dragar]

i'm in

[Jazzepi]

1)Wait until the game is full, and Pretenders uploaded before I publish the final nation list.

Please don't make this like RAND. I hate having to use in game diplomacy. The message system blows hard.

Jazzepi

[Alpine Joe]

I would like to play in this. Early age is my favorite for random nations, nearly everyone has something interesting about them.

[Bluff]

Attack!

I'd like to play please.

I like the idea of random nations too :D

Cheers,

Bluff

[charshep]

I'd like in if there's room.

[Zapmeister]

Cool - sign me up!

[tgbob]

Can I play? I'd like to play. I'm voting for option #1.

[PsiSoldier]

If there are still slots open I'll give it a go

[Calahan]

Wow, this game filled up overnight! Usually a good sign that the community was in need of a new game.

Will PM all the new players their random nation picks as soon as I get chance.

As far as revealing nations goes, I actually think it could be cool if you published the list after its full, but didn't reveal who's who. Sorta similar to a RAND game.

My understanding was that a full RAND game (random nations + hidden players + no diplomacy) only works if the admin isn't playing in the game, since again, the admin player would have an unfair advantage of knowing who was playing the other nations if he was playing in the game himself.

Although it could be an interesting twist if the admin had the advantage of knowing all the other nations/players, but had the disadvantage in that he had to disclose which nation he was playing. (As would happen in this game if it now got turned RAND). Not actually sure if that's an advantage or disadvantage to the admin player? :confused: Guess it all depends who the admin is :)

I would personally love to play in a full RAND game, but it seems there's only one a year (run by PashaDawg), and that is usually strictly for vets only. I may well setup another game soon that is full RAND, just accept that I can't play in it, and hope it will act as a hint for someone to create another full RAND game that I can play in :) Wink wink, nudge nudge.

Please don't make this like RAND. I hate having to use in game diplomacy. The message system blows hard.

Jazzepi

I'll probably keep this game to just random nations for now (unless loads think the 'RAND twist' idea is a good one, and prefer that). But if it did go more towards a full RAND game in any way, then diplomacy and communications between nations would likely be disallowed anyway. And don't worry, I would NEVER ask anyone to use in-game messages.
- "What exactly did I just say in that message I sent?" "Oh that's right I forgot, I have absolutely no way of checking it" :doh:

[Dragar]

don't waste time PMing, if it isn't RAND just post the nations..

[Calahan]

Ok, I should have just sent all the new sign-ups a PM, which means everyone who has signed up so far (ie. all those above this post) should have had a PM from me with your chosen nation.

If you haven't received a PM from me telling you your nation, please let me know asap. I was partly relying on the forum PM system to keep track of who I'd sent messages to, but just realised that your sent messages still don't get automatically saved. (Grits teeth and curses :mad:) Thought that would've changed during my hiatus.


don't waste time PMing, if it isn't RAND just post the nations..

I don't mind spending a bit of extra time now, during game creation, PM-ing people if it helps make the game more interesting for everyone :)


Edit: Just realised that we now have 14 players signed up, which is currently giving us an almost exact 20 province per player split, which seems good to me. So I will close this game to new sign-ups as of now.

If any players are looking for new games then I will probably be setting up another game once this one is up and running, so check back soon. Since I highly doubt that one game will be enough to quench my warmongering thurst for power :D

[Calahan]

Right. I have hopefully just setup the game on the llamaserver using the settings indicated on the status page, and the 'Orania' map (which I'm pretty sure is one of the standard maps that comes with Dominions, so no need to download it). So this should mean that it's ok to start uploading your Pretenders.

This is also the first time I have ever used the game creation options on the llamaserver, so apologies in advance if I make any mistakes. It seems pretty idiot proof, but I don't quite class myself as an idiot, so hope it's also proof for someone who falls somewhere between idiot and genius :)

[Calahan]

I have updated the game status page with information regarding the hosting schedule, stales, AI etc. Can I please ask you all to read over it when you get a chance.

I will be out for most of the day, so hope there are no problems with how I've set the game up, and that uploading those Pretenders goes smoothly. Mine is still firmly in the 'how the bloody hell' stage :confused: Although please don't feel pressured into rushing your design to get it uploaded, since I know mine won't be sorted for a good 24 hours, and random nations always leads to a bit of extra time being needed during the design phase.

And a final reminder to everyone to make sure that the 'CBcomplete 1.41' mod is enabled BEFORE you start designing your Pretender. It can be found on the mods forum if you don't already have it, or click the link on the game status page (which is always the first post of the thread)

I should be able to check back on progress in about 12 hours or so.

Enjoy your day everyone :)

[PsiSoldier]

I'll probably keep this game to just random nations for now (unless loads think the 'RAND twist' idea is a good one, and prefer that). But if it did go more towards a full RAND game in any way, then diplomacy and communications between nations would likely be disallowed anyway. And don't worry, I would NEVER ask anyone to use in-game messages.
- "What exactly did I just say in that message I sent?" "Oh that's right I forgot, I have absolutely no way of checking it" :doh:

Hrrrm well If you are going with the idea of no one knowing who's playing what nations I suppose you had better make that decision soon because I like many other people have fairly standard names for my Pretenders and its not all that difficult to look at pretender names and so Oh.. so and so uses that name, I know who's playing that nation.

[Calahan]

This game will be sticking to the original plan of simply having random nations, without any of the extra RAND options of hidden player identities and no diplomacy etc.

I will be publishing the complete nation-player list on the status page on turn 2-3 (ie. once we know that turn 1 went off without a hitch).

But in the meantime, I've just noticed that the llamaserver allows you to see which nations Pretenders have already been uploaded, so I can't see much point in keeping secret the full list of random nations that were selected for this game. Since all that is currently achieving is that the later a player designs their Pretender, the more of an advantage they will have. So I will now be putting the full list of nations on the status page for everyone to see.

Will be looking for this game to start within the next 48hours. Which I think should be enough time for everyone to have managed to get a Pretender designed.

Hope everyone is ok with all of the above :)

[Executor]

[/QUOTE]

Hrrrm well If you are going with the idea of no one knowing who's playing what nations I suppose you had better make that decision soon because I like many other people have fairly standard names for my Pretenders and its not all that difficult to look at pretender names and so Oh.. so and so uses that name, I know who's playing that nation.[/QUOTE]

I promise mt pretenders name does not apply to me! :)

[PsiSoldier]

But in the meantime, I've just noticed that the llamaserver allows you to see which nations Pretenders have already been uploaded, so I can't see much point in keeping secret the full list of random nations that were selected for this game. Since all that is currently achieving is that the later a player designs their Pretender, the more of an advantage they will have.


Hmmmm Me Agartha FEAR ME!!!!! :tough::tough::tough:


Umm.. I don't think anyones fearing me. :(

Yeah.. I kinda doubt anyone would be planning their pretender design around the fact that the great and :rolleyes:powerful:rolleyes: Agartha is in the game..

[Executor]

Black Magic Woman (my pretender) declares war on Agartha!!!!

DIE INFIDEL!!!!

[PsiSoldier]

:party:Yay! He Fears me!!!:party:


On second thought...



Ummmm. :ahh::cry::ahh: Were not Worthy!!! :bow::bow::bow:

[Executor]

Sooo... Starting any time soon???

[Calahan]

Looks like we are only waiting on two Pretenders now for this game to start. Agartha and Vanheim. I will go and PM them now to give them a friendly reminder :)

Hoping that this game will kick off within the next 12 hours.

[PsiSoldier]

Yeah I worked 13 hours today and I am still trying to fine tune my pretender design. I'm pretty tired right now but I'll work on it some more. Agartha's troops suck so bad even a triple bless cant help them but I'm still playing with my options as Ive never played them before. I guarantee I'll have it in by tomorrow night though at the latest.

[Jazzepi]

Yeah I worked 13 hours today and I am still trying to fine tune my pretender design. I'm pretty tired right now but I'll work on it some more. Agartha's troops suck so bad even a triple bless cant help them but I'm still playing with my options as Ive never played them before. I guarantee I'll have it in by tomorrow night though at the latest.

Try out the trogs if you haven't. They're low resource cost and clear our indies great. You'll need to get to a critical mass to avoid losing a couple with each province you take. Once you get to that point, though, they can take just about any indy province and you can expand very quickly.

You also need gold for your good mages.

I would go something like this.

Order 3
Sloth 3
Heat 0
Growth 0 (more if you can, to get extra monies early on for trogs)
Misfortune 2
Magic 1

Feel free to raise the growth to pickup some extra income if you have leftover pretender scales. I would probably take an awake great sage to help your magic diversity, and to do researching to turn on your earth mages. If you pay attention to who your neighbors are, you should be able to counter any rushes with, basically just your earth magic, and troop spam. Also, throw earth and blood on your pretender to eventually diversify into blood magic and blood stones.

Earth Meld is great against high defense troops, Armor of Achielles works well against high protection troops (or troops with small numbers in general like neifel giants), and blade wind is great against spammable sacreds that have low protection values.

Jazzepi

[Trumanator]

Taking a slight heat scale is also helpful, what with the agarthans being coldblooded.

[PsiSoldier]

Yeah I worked 13 hours today and I am still trying to fine tune my pretender design. I'm pretty tired right now but I'll work on it some more. Agartha's troops suck so bad even a triple bless cant help them but I'm still playing with my options as Ive never played them before. I guarantee I'll have it in by tomorrow night though at the latest.

Try out the trogs if you haven't. They're low resource cost and clear our indies great. You'll need to get to a critical mass to avoid losing a couple with each province you take. Once you get to that point, though, they can take just about any indy province and you can expand very quickly.

You also need gold for your good mages.

I would go something like this.

Order 3
Sloth 3
Heat 0
Growth 0 (more if you can, to get extra monies early on for trogs)
Misfortune 2
Magic 1

Feel free to raise the growth to pickup some extra income if you have leftover pretender scales. I would probably take an awake great sage to help your magic diversity, and to do researching to turn on your earth mages. If you pay attention to who your neighbors are, you should be able to counter any rushes with, basically just your earth magic, and troop spam. Also, throw earth and blood on your pretender to eventually diversify into blood magic and blood stones.

Earth Meld is great against high defense troops, Armor of Achielles works well against high protection troops (or troops with small numbers in general like neifel giants), and blade wind is great against spammable sacreds that have low protection values.

Jazzepi

Almost the exact design I have been playing with except I was going growth 3 and trying to decide if I should drop some for more magic on my pretender

[Calahan]

How are those two missing Pretenders looking PsiSoldier, and the still unrevealed Vanheim player?

I'm happy to allow some extra time due to having random nations, and the unfamiliarity that can cause :) But also wary that some players can lose interest in a game if it takes too long getting started.

So please don't make me send my Bakemono chaff hordes round to sort you out :sec:

[Incabulos]

I will get my pretender in today 9within the next 6 hours or so) figured out what I want to do I just haven't had time (since I am at work).

Sorry for the hold up but Vanheim is new to me.

[tgbob]

Heh, beast brother for first turn mercs, who will recruit them? Only time will tell! Be sure to tune in to the next exciting episode of CarCrash!

[Calahan]

Excellent, we're up and running :D

Unfortunately I can't check my start location out until I get home from work :( Can I handle the tension?

Also, a quick note about possible restarts. I'm probably only going to consider restarting if someone gets a game destroying event on turn 1. Like the Ancient Presence or Knight horde for example. Basically, any event that sees you losing control of your capital after the first turn. Huge unrest events are certainly no reason to expect a re-start, and are part of the risks involved in taking misfortune.

I may also consider a restart for Mictlan if they got dom-killed due to a faith reducing event. But Mictlan players should be aware of this danger, and take a non-awake Pretender at their own risk.

And close starting locations are just a regular part of the game. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. Certainly not a reason to re-start. Everyone needs to brandish their pen or sword at some point. A close neighbour just means it happens sooner.

Think that covers most variables.

Good Luck Everyone

[Jazzepi]

Also, a quick note about possible restarts. I'm probably only going to consider restarting if someone gets a game destroying event on turn 1. Like the Ancient Presence or Knight horde for example. Basically, any event that sees you losing control of your capital after the first turn. Huge unrest events are certainly no reason to expect a re-start, and are part of the risks involved in taking misfortune.


FYI, I believe that one of the developers confirmed that certain events, such as those that you mention, can't happen in the first 3-4 turns.

And honestly, none of those sound like reasons to restart. In Lapis, playing the tomb kings, I've gotten hit by 7-8 knight +militia attacks by turn 21 or so. Oh well :O You just deal with it.

Jazzepi

[Executor]

I agree, I like my starting posiotion too much to restart.

[Calahan]

I probably should have been more specific above :)

A restart in my books should only happen on turn 1 or 2. If nobody reports any problems after the first turn, then restarts are strictly not allowed. Since at that point, in theory, you would have had a chance to avoid any game destroying events. ie. Setting your Mictlan priest/prophet to sacrifice on turn 2.

I have noticed that some games in the past have restarted as late as turn 7-8-9. Which to me is just crazy talk!

So basically, if anyone gets a knight horde etc from turn 3 onwards then it's just bad luck, and please don't try asking for a restart.


FYI, I believe that one of the developers confirmed that certain events, such as those that you mention, can't happen in the first 3-4 turns.


Thanks for this info Jazzepi. I remember several threads before that debated the issue, with some saying that these events (a)do happen (b)shouldn't happen (c)couldn't happen. Didn't know the delevopers had confirmed that (c) is actually the truth. It's good to know this.


Glad you like your starting position Executor. Hope I'll be able to say the same :D

[Fantomen]

I´d change the thrad title to "running" to avoid confusion.

[Calahan]

I´d change the thrad title to "running" to avoid confusion.

Thanks for the reminder Fantomen :)

Well my starting place sucks, so hope my neighbours are friendly!

[Calahan]

I've just PM'd the two players who haven't got their first turns in.

PsiSoldier looks to be a forum regular, so pretty confident that Agartha won't stale. The Mictlan player however, charshep, hasn't posted anywhere since signing up for this game, so I'm slightly worried that they might have gone AWOL. And an AI or staling EA/LA Mictlan usually just means a free early dom kill + 2nd capital for it's neighbour, which would lead to a major bit of unbalancing that I'd certainly be looking to avoid in this game.

Also don't see much point in keeping hold of the master player-nation list anymore, so will put it up on the status page.

[Executor]

If Mictlan stales the first turn, I suggest you get a sub.
So, Jazzepir has Sauromatia, nice.

[Calahan]

I'm really hoping I can head-off any first turn stales. Will wait another few hours and if I still haven't heard anything from Mictlan (still confident PsiSoldier will be ok) then I'll try looking for a sub.

Although at this point I'd like to take a quick vote if I can. If Mictlan does need to be subbed, should I do any / all of ........

1) Offer the sub a restart so that they can design their own Mictlan Pretender.
2) Offer the sub a new random non-water nation and of course a restart.
3) Drop Mictlan, and restart with 13 nations.
4) Let the game run and hope a sub can be found for Mictlan who is happy to sub-into the game as is.
5) Turn Mictlan AI.

My own vote would probably be for 3, as that should ensure the quickest restart. Since options 1 or 2 would need extra time due to Pretender designing, and I really don't want to see 4 or 5 happen, And I think that would give someone too much of an unfair advantage early on. As we all know the AI can't handle the EA/LA Mictlan dominion.

Please can everyone let me know their thoughts on this.

[Executor]

Personally I'm for option 4 if it comes to that.
I've seen what restarts and rollback do in the first couple of turns of the game, so it's gonna get ugly.

[Zapmeister]

I'm for 5. The problem with 4 is that the game will never quickhost, ultimately dragging it out more than a restart would.

[Dragar]

I wouldn't AI mictlan, of all nations, due to the dom kill. Pause and look for a sub befor ehe stales, shouldn't be too hard to find a taker for mictlan early game

[tgbob]

I vote for #4.

[charshep]

I've just PM'd the two players who haven't got their first turns in.

PsiSoldier looks to be a forum regular, so pretty confident that Agartha won't stale. The Mictlan player however, charshep, hasn't posted anywhere since signing up for this game, so I'm slightly worried that they might have gone AWOL. And an AI or staling EA/LA Mictlan usually just means a free early dom kill + 2nd capital for it's neighbour, which would lead to a major bit of unbalancing that I'd certainly be looking to avoid in this game.

Also don't see much point in keeping hold of the master player-nation list anymore, so will put it up on the status page.


I'm here I'm here! The thing is I'm new to Mictlan and they seem like a pretty hard nation to manage well so I was running through the beginnings of a test game against the AI before submitting my turn.

Anyways, I didn't notice the start time is 01:20 GMT. Sorry about that I thought I had more time. I should be able to get it in under the wire but if I don't could I get an extension of a few hours?

[Calahan]

I'm going to delay the hosting by 12 hours to give charshep a chance to get his turn in. He probably won't need all that time, but if any problems occur, then 12 hours will mean the game won't be hosting while I'm asleep, hence giving me chance to address anything that crops up.

Hopefully a good early pace will set-in once the game gets going :)

[Calahan]

Excellent, it looks like everyone has checked in and is now on board for this game.

I have changed the hosting interval to 30 hours as indicated on the status page.

Best of luck everyone, and game on!

[Fantomen]

To celebrate the start of this great game Abysia would like to invite all nations to a traditional sauna competition, finland style. Send your champions today!

[PsiSoldier]

PsiSoldier looks to be a forum regular, so pretty confident that Agartha won't stale.



Haha I wish I were as confident that I wont stale as you are..

I'm a bit of a repeat offender when it comes to stales. I think in preponderance I actually have had about 6 stales which at its current turn means I staled for about 10% of the game. Not that it really hurt me as I just went and used the gold to buy forts and playing as Ermor my priests reanimated without my input but...

I dont plan on staling as long as I get my turns. Which for some reason occasionally I do not get the turns and is usually the cause for me staling in the first place or has been in the past. I have developed the habit now of checking the game page to see if I need to request a turn resend though.

[Calahan]

We all have faith in you PsiSoldier :)

I learnt very early on to always have the llamaserver page close to hand, since the info on that regarding the current turn status is always more reliable than anything that arrives by email or written on the forum. The llamaserver is the one true creator after all :D


And can I just take this opportunity to thank everyone for the zero stales so far in this game. It's always good for game balance if nobody stales the early turns, and gives the admin an easy job :) (I accept in advance all the flaming if I have now jinxed the hell out of this game).

[Executor]

Fomoria AI?

[Calahan]

Fomoria AI?

Nice spot Executor. Just PM-ed Alpine Joe to ask for some more info on this. Will keep you all posted.

In the meantime, if I / we don't hear anything, does anyone fancy putting their hands up to claiming first kill bragging rights?

[Alpine Joe]

Fomoria AI?

Nice spot Executor. Just PM-ed Alpine Joe to ask for some more info on this. Will keep you all posted.

In the meantime, if I / we don't hear anything, does anyone fancy putting their hands up to claiming first kill bragging rights?


Sorry for not informing you all sooner, but Fomoria is indeed AI. I made the early mistake of trying to slow down the dreaded sauromatia and ended up with an army of heavy cavalry eating up my provinces. I was down to my capital, loaded with useless fomorian druids sporting......wait for it.... alteration 3 magic. I decided the best choice was to go AI and hope my other neighbor (hinnom...that's fun) decides to grab my capital to balance things out. Anyway, credit for first kill should go to Sauromatia, although really i just blew it with pretender design and research choices.

[Calahan]

Thank you for letting us all know what happened Alpine Joe. Surprised to hear Fomoria got in trouble early, but then I guess the Pretender build is critical to most nations and sometimes it doesn't take much to turn a good design into a bad one.

Hope you enjoyed the game though and learnt something from it, even if it was a brief affair. Look forward to playing in future games with you.

All the Best, and thanks for playing :)

[Jazzepi]

Formia attacked my capital with what looked like his starting forces? It didn't even dent the PD there D: So I attacked back. his provinces are DELICIOUS.

Jazzepi

[Calahan]

Yes there are many tasty delicacies being served up at the moment. Yomi for example is currently eating its way through the Hall of Fame :)

and congrats on being awarded the first kill Jazzepi (see status page).

[Calahan]

I've had to delay the hosting by 4 hours. The llamaserver seems to be in a bit of a mood with me at the moment, since it appears to not want to acknowledge my emails. Have had trouble uploading turns for this game and two others this morning (ComfortZone + CrippleFight). One of those games managed to sort itself out eventually, so hoping this one will do likewise given time.

The current turn is only waiting on me, so the delay will only be for as long as the llamaserver chooses to ignore me :(

[tgbob]

Word of warning to all those who would wise Caleum harm:

Our great and wonderful and happy and winged and buoyant very very aerodynamic sages have discovered the means with which to call down lightning! Yes yes wonderfu--, wait it's not lightning?

Thunderstrike? What the heck is thunderstrike?

[tgbob]

The League of Explorers of Caleum offers their apology to the peoples of Hinnom, the "pirates" that are under our employ were merely attempting to chart the unknown and had zero intentions of taking that not at all defended province.

The military of Caleum on the other hand, would like to know why there are two of armies of Hinnom sitting on our broaders.

[Calahan]

Let it be known that Adil the Prophet of Niefelheim, and Hall of Fame leader, is one tough uber quickened Son of a *****.

[Dragar]

Exactly how do you 'accidentally' attack a province with another nation's (to which you have a NAP) flag on it??

And how do you construe armies directly next to my capital as signs of aggression???


The League of Explorers of Caleum offers their apology to the peoples of Hinnom, the "pirates" that are under our employ were merely attempting to chart the unknown and had zero intentions of taking that not at all defended province.

The military of Caleum on the other hand, would like to know why there are two of armies of Hinnom sitting on our broaders.

[tgbob]

Ah yes, the "we're just chilling next to our capital" excuse. We're watching you! Dun dun dunnnn~~~

P.S. Invitations to dinner are not N.A.P.s, they're more of a friendly gesture of goodwill.

P.P.S. We couldn't see that you owned that island, so take it back if you like.

[charshep]

Sorry guys I *might* need an extension by a few hours. I should be able to get my turn done in time though.

[Calahan]

That's fine charshep. I will be keeping a close eye on the hosting this turn anyway, since Fantomen / Abysia had the first stale of the game last turn, so will be delaying hosting if there's a danger of a repeat.

[tgbob]

Caleum is trading for earth boots. PM me!

[tgbob]

Caluem would like to congratulate Tir na n'Og for their stunning victory against Abysia at the battle of Bhamot. That was some good use of magic there!

Fake Edit: Seriously though, what's with the giant swath of indie lands between Tir na n'Og and Mictlan?

[Executor]

Interesting pretender choice for Fomoria, not sure where he was going with it doe.

[Jazzepi]

Interesting pretender choice for Fomoria, not sure where he was going with it doe.

Lose :O

Jazzepi

[Dragar]

doe?

[Calahan]

My SMS brain tells me that 'doe' is short for 'though'.

[Dragar]

dear god... that's awful

what was the fomorian pretender?

[Executor]

If I recall correctly a crone with F4W2E2A2D4S4N2 or something like that. I really don't see any point in playing Fomoria without a bless.

[Calahan]

That's a really odd Pretender for Fomoria. In fact I can't think of any nation of any age where that Pretender would get a look in.

[Executor]

Well, all in all I think Pangaea is a pathetic little nation and having streams of maenead is not the best way to play them, at least until you get some vital alteration.

A warning to all the nation of the world, do not thrust Mictlan for they are oath breakers and they will stab you in the back when you least suspect it!

[charshep]

Well, all in all I think Pangaea is a pathetic little nation and having streams of maenead is not the best way to play them, at least until you get some vital alteration.

A warning to all the nation of the world, do not thrust Mictlan for they are oath breakers and they will stab you in the back when you least suspect it!

True, I broke an oath. However, it was unintentional. I'm new to MP Dominions and I misunderstood a NAP-3 to be a NAP of 3 turn duration, not a NAP of indeterminate duration with a 3 turn warning before breaking. Sorry I didn't seek to clarify ahead of time. I'll PM you with a proposal to rectify the situation.

[PsiSoldier]

Well that battle at Hinnom this turn was kind of amusing to watch.. Something for that thread on Horrors.. It just doesn't work out well when you earth meld the horrors after you call them so your own troops are spending all of their time fighting the horrors that are now stuck next to your own army..

And they probably could have won that battle had they forgotten about that whole ill planned horror attack.

If I had been having any thoughts on the virtues of using horrors in battle then those thoughts are kind of gone. (Well except for maybe with two or so lone commanders one horror marking the enemy and one calling horrors maybe)

[Dragar]

hehe, ouch.. to be fair though, 2 turns back horrors saved me. Always a gamble

Anyways, hinnom about to go out, I'll play another turn or two probably

[tgbob]

That could've been a disaster for me if the horrors had beelined for my guys instead of.. not doing anything.

That SC you got is nasty business though.

[Dragar]

well, specifically against what you had sent at me yes - partly lucky, hadn't expected mammoths but his size made that sweet

Surprisingly vanheim has stopped attacking me - otherwise preoccupied else I can't imagine why he wouildn't want his share?

[PsiSoldier]

Too bad I didn't see the one a few turns ago.

[Calahan]

I'm going to delay hosting for a few hours at my own request.

Was hoping to get my turn done tonight, but only just got home, and it's just been too long a day (and night) to attempt anything else today other than falling alseep.

So apols to everyone in advance for the slight hold-up.

[Trumanator]

Well C'tis is officially done. I have set myself to AI. Well played by Calahan.

[Calahan]

Good game Trumanator. Making sure my demons avoided your H3 priests certainly kept me busy.

@ Everyone. A busy weekend meant I couldn't monitor happenings in this game, and only just noticed that Vanheim / 'Incabulos' staled their last turn (which explains why they didn't attack you Drager :)) and there looks a danger that another one is due to follow this turn.

Now I personally hate to see staling nations in games, so if it happens or is about to happen (and I catch it) in a game I'm admining, then I always try to do something about it in advance. To that end, I will PM Incabulos to see if everything is ok, and will delay the game if I don't hear back and the Vanheim turn is still missing come the hosting deadline.

I know it's not the usual procedure to delay games (without a request) to avoid players staling, but it's something I choose to actively do as admin in order to keep the game as balanced as possible. Think we've set a good pace so far, so a short delay won't look too bad when viewing the overall picture.

[Zapmeister]

... and will delay the game if I don't hear back and the Vanheim turn is still missing come the hosting deadline.

I feel compelled to make a couple of observations.

1. Incabulos did not ask for an extension for the turn he staled 30 hours ago.

2. He was last online at this forum 12 hours ago. He made no apology nor comment about his stale and did not ask for an extension for the next turn.

3. In another game I've been in (Beyond) he left the game without going AI, leaving his nation to stale until it was eliminated.

4. This game has already been delayed.

In my view, this is the behaviour of someone who has lost interest and is abandoning the game. I would recommend advertising for a sub immediately, letting Vanheim stale again if no-one accepts quickly, and then (if no-one accepts for a further 18 hours) putting Vanheim to AI.

Just my 2c
Zap.

[Calahan]

Thanks for your input Zapmeister.

1. Yes, Incabulos did not ask for a delay, but I try to be an active admin in helping to avoid nations from staling (this is purely my choice). Since I feel staling nations only leads to more unbalanced games overall, and I don't see any reason why I shouldn't help to avoid the latter turn of affairs if at all possible.

2. Last post I can see by Incabulos is 29th April. And the 'last activity' stamp is saying 7th May, so I'm not sure how you know that Incabulos was last on these forums 12 hours ago.

3. Didn't know Incabulos had any history of dropping out of games. But I always give people at least the first benefit of the doubt, so if that gets used up here, then I'll be a bit wiser for the next time.

4. The game only got delayed by 4 hours (which is not exactly a huge delay IMO) to give me chance to get some sleep. I have now delayed the game a further 12 hours to give Incabulos time to re-appear, and / or get back to my PM. I don't intend having huge delays with this game, so my current intentions are that the game will be hosting in about 13 hours regardless of any outstanding turns (unless there is an actual delay request). If Vanheim / Incabulos stales again then I will begin looking for a sub.

[Zapmeister]

Last post I can see by Incabulos is 29th April. And the 'last activity' stamp is saying 7th May, so I'm not sure how you know that Incabulos was last on these forums 12 hours ago.

My mistake - I misread the date in the last activity stamp, so I'm happy with your ruling on this.

[Calahan]

Last post I can see by Incabulos is 29th April. And the 'last activity' stamp is saying 7th May, so I'm not sure how you know that Incabulos was last on these forums 12 hours ago.

My mistake - I misread the date in the last activity stamp, so I'm happy with your ruling on this.

:) Must confess that I made the exact same mistake when I looked at it. I thought "Incabulos was on the forums last night. Why didn't he/she check in on the game then? That's not right is it. No hang on a minute, what bloody date is it again? Ooooh my head hurts".

A rough weekend :sick:

[tgbob]

Hinnom's SC has CRUSHED my will to fight him. His gigantic manhood forces me to gap in awe every single time I watch him fight.

[Dragar]

Looking forward to see the battle when I get home :)

[Calahan]

My damn lack of scout recruiting provinces is making me miss all the good battles :(

Admin wise, Vanheim / Incabulos did stale again last turn, so I am going to try and find an experienced player to check out their position to see what state they are in. Since I don't want to mislead any possible sub into thinking the position is good when it isn't, and don't want to turn a nation AI if it is a major force in the game.

[tgbob]

Looking forward to see the battle when I get home :)

The battle is pretty much what you'd expect from Caluem's laugh out loud province defense.

[Dragar]

ah, was nothing interesting at all :( I'd hoped to have run into a proper army

[Executor]

O come on!
3 against 1 is a bit too much this early on, have you no honor people.
It's not like Pangaea is the ultimate dominions nation, and mictlan/hinnom/sauromatia are pathetic.

Be assured that the peace loving people of Pangaea will fight to the very last man.

Mictlan, back down or this will be the first and last conquest you ever make as you can see from the battle results this turn.

Anyone bordering Sauromatia, keep in mind that most of his lands are undifended since a extremely large Sauro army is in my lands. If you're looking for an opportunity, now is your chance.
Remember, Sauromatia is the leading nation in the HoF and Jazepi is no stranger to it also, and he has already taken out Fomoria.

[Dragar]

?? Hinnom copped a 3:1 a fair few turns earlier, although I am willing to believe it probably waasn't co-irdinated

[tgbob]

It wasn't at all. Maybe it should have! Welp.

[Calahan]

Ok, still no sign of 'Incabulos', so I have begun looking for a sub for Vanheim on either a temporary or permanent basis (depending on whether or not 'Incabulos' returns at some point very soon).

I don't want to delay the game if I don't have to, since Vanheim have only currently suffered one stale, which isn't game breaking. But if no sub appears before I retire for the night (in about 4 hours) then I will delay the game for a few hours just in case a sub volunteer shows up overnight, and I don't get the message until the morning, which will be after the current turn hosts (since it'll be a bit silly to see a nation stale again just because I didn't get the 'Hi I'm happy to sub' message in time to stop it).

[Valerius]

Hi, everyone. I will be at least a temp sub for Vanheim. From reading the thread it seems I'm part of a group attacking Hinnom. I'd appreciate it if anyone with an agreeement with Vanheim would PM me to let me know. Thanks.

[Calahan]

May I say "Welcome to CarCrash Valerius" on behalf of everyone, and a big thank you for taking up the staling Vanheim, be it for however long a duration you are happy with :happy:

@ Everyone - I will be increasing the hosting interval after this turn as stated on the status page. I know that some players would prefer to extend hosting around this stage of a game so as to allow more thinking time, while other players would prefer a faster pace of a shorter hosting. This is always the case in every MP game. But I am planning to stick to the schedule advertised unless any issues with it crop up.

Also, I can only speak for myself time wise, but I know my current turns usually sail past the 1 hour mark without breaking sweat. So I for one would appreciate the extra time to work out how to help me keep my demons alive longer :)

[Bluff]

Hey Calahan,

I don't understand why I lost a battle in province 14 that turn.

According to the replay I won, yet the messages and the game map shows that I lost.

It's not a game turning loss so I'm not too worried about it, but it's still not nice (i like to watch the battle replay before finding out if i win or lose :)

Cheers,

Bluff

[Calahan]

Will take a look when I get home from work Bluff, and let you know what happens in my replay.

[Calahan]

Just noticed that Hinnom has disappeared from the nation list on the llamaserver. Guess they went AI at some point.

Drager, do you fancy awarding the kill to any nation or nations in particular? Or would some nations like to come forward to claim part of the giant scalp?

[Dragar]

Yep was pretty much dead and didn't expect to be able to log on for a few days, so went AI. Hmmm, was attacked by vanhiem, pangaea and caelum. Vanheim is out of the picture, fairly even split Pan and Caelum. If I had to choose I'd give it to Pan as he was the initial major aggressor, caelum came in when i was already committed elsewhere

[tgbob]

Give it to Pan. And I'm sad you went AI, I went to great efforts to kill your SC this turn and you're going to miss my attempt.

[Dragar]

let me know how it goes!

I had an eye op yesterday, didn't expect to be back on the computer so quickly, else I would have stayed until actual death

[Executor]

Feel the wrath of Pangaea Mictlan!
Nobody shall desecrate the sacred grow of Gaia and go unpunished.

Pangaea trading water and fire gems for any other type of gems. Death gems are on the market also. This months special is a robe of invulnerability for only 25 gems! PM me now and you'll get it for 23 gems, and we'll even send you a demon whip!!!
Do not waste time and PM Pangaea now, cause this is the best deal of your lives. Pangaea top shop.

[Fantomen]

I found out I will be going to Kenya the 8th of June to 8th of July. I´ve posted a thread looking for a sub so i hope I get one before then.

[Calahan]

Wow, that's sounds awesome Fantomen. Almost had the chance to go to Kenya for the summer ten years ago as a fresh faced teen, but it fell through at the last minute for various poor reasons. I was gutted :(. Hope you have a blast though :)

Should be able to find a sub within the next two weeks I reckon. If June arrives and still no sub, then I'll start asking around and giving people nudges.

[tgbob]

Just a heads up, I'm going to Hong Kong on Sunday and flying back on Monday. I'll be taking my laptop so there shouldn't be a need for a delay. The flight itself is only 2-3 hours long too.

[Calahan]

@ All

It's a long holiday weekend in a lot of countries, so don't hesitate to shout if you need a delay to go out and party in the sunshine :)

@ Executor

Understand you've just finished your exams etc. for the academic year. Hope they all went well :up: and a delay has already been granted for you if you want to forget Dominions for a few days, and spend all your time celebrating being exam free for a few months!

[Executor]

Thanks, and please stop spying on me. :)
However there's no need to delay the game because of me, The Empire of Pangaea is slowly crumbling so the turns don't take long to do.:)

[Calahan]

I'm going to delay hosting for a few hours so that I can try to find out what is happening with Abysia/Fantomen. She staled the last turn, and is only a few hours away from another one.

If I don't hear back from her overnight (GMT) then I will try and get someone to check the position out to see if it's worth finding a sub or not.

[Zapmeister]

Although the turnaround times were clearly advertised at game-start, I now realize that because of its slowness, this is not the game for me. At 54 hours (plus occasional extensions) I'm already on the verge of forgetting what I was doing by the time the next turn rolls around. If it ever goes to 76 hours, I'll be looking for a sub.

Does anyone else have this problem? If so, any chance of taking a vote for a less ponderous schedule?

[Jazzepi]

Although the turnaround times were clearly advertised at game-start, I now realize that because of its slowness, this is not the game for me. At 54 hours (plus occasional extensions) I'm already on the verge of forgetting what I was doing by the time the next turn rolls around. If it ever goes to 76 hours, I'll be looking for a sub.

Does anyone else have this problem? If so, any chance of taking a vote for a less ponderous schedule?

I would really like a reduction, honestly.

I've never understood the "at x turn, we switch" policy. Whenever I admin a game, we switch when people ask for it.

Jazzepi

[tgbob]

I like faster turns too, but only if folks aren't inconvenienced by it.

[Calahan]

Ok, we have three votes for quickening up the game hosting. I personally prefer a slightly slower hosting because my job sometimes has a habit of making me work late into the small hours, and then a daily schedule forces me to stale or submit token turns now and again, especially once the game gets past the early stages. Or just ask for delays all the time, which I don't really like doing.

But I certainly don't want to lose any players because of the current hosting schedule, and would also hate to think players are having less fun because of it. So with the vote currently at 3-0, I'm happy to cut the hosting back to 30 hours, but I'll wait a few hours to give the other players a chance to respond with their views. So please shout out now if you are against changing the hosting back to 30 hours.

I also need to sort out Abysia/Fantomen, since I didn't get a reply overnight to my PM.

@ Jazzepi - The idea of changing the hosting at specified turn numbers was so that people had some indication (well in advance) of what the schedule for the game was going to be.

Noticed one game recently where someone started up a game advertised at 15hour quickhost, but then refused to increase the hosting time when the game was on turn 40+, and simply stated "It said 15 hour hosting, you shouldn't have signed up if you couldn't keep up with it" as a defence, despite all the requests being received to increase it and the problems it was causing. So I wanted it to be clear at the outset that the hosting would increase as the game progressed, and at (to me) logical intervals.

Although next time I will certainly ask for a show of hands in advance of increasing the timer.

[Zapmeister]

So with the vote currently at 3-0, I'm happy to cut the hosting back to 30 hours, but I'll wait a few hours to give the other players a chance to respond with their views. So please shout out now if you are against changing the hosting back to 30 hours.

Actually, I think the vote stands at 3-1. You get a vote, Calahan ;)

[Calahan]

Actually, I think the vote stands at 3-1. You get a vote, Calahan ;)

My many years of real life history in chairing various committees and meetings tells me that it's usually best for the chairman (or admin in this case) to have only a casting vote :)

Since a time always comes when someone needs to stick their neck out and make a firm decision (and accept the consequences) when everyone else is just giving the usual "I don't mind either way" responce :D

[PsiSoldier]

I'm for speeding things up as well..

[Silence0]

I´m also for faster turns..

[Calahan]

Ok, the hosting referendum is looking pretty unanimous so far at 5-0 :)

I have decreased the hosting timer back to a 30 hour turn schedule, although this will not take effect until the next turn. If all the turns for the current one get sent in, with Abysia's turn once again being the only outstanding one, then I will probably find someone to turn them AI. Although I will wait at least another 12 hours before doing this to see if 'Fantomen' or a sub appears first.

'Thank You' to all those who have given their time to post their views on the hosting schedule. Much appreciated.

[Illuminated One]

Hi, I'm the new Abysia if anyone has any treaties with me please send a PM.

[Illuminated One]

I'm sorry for the delay but I will need some time to asses the position and think up a way to fight Agartha and Niefel, can only do this tomorrow.

[Calahan]

No problem Illuminated One. We all owe your a thanks for taking over a staling nation anyway, so don't worry about needing the extra time to get the Abysian affairs in order :)

Also, may I officially welcome you to the 'CarCrash' game, and offer the thanks of all the players for saving Abysia from the AI.

[PsiSoldier]

Damn. Poor Abysia is at war with Me, Neifle And Tir Na Nog? Geez

Wasnt a good time to take over a sub position I guess.

[Executor]

Damn. Poor Abysia is at war with Me, Neifle And Tir Na Nog? Geez



In that case, Abysia is a good friend of Pangaea, for we share a similar fate my friend...:p

[Executor]

Why is the self-seeking Empire of Sauromatia protecting Mictlan and trying to block our path?
Pangaea shall have it's revenge!!!

[Illuminated One]

Damn the battle result bug!
Kind of anoying when you get it at a fortress.

[Executor]

HAHA!!! Never thought it be so interesting playing with tons of maeneads,
Mictlan, are you ready to rrrrrrrrrumble!!!!!!!
Here comes the second wave, Sauromatia, please stand in queue, you're acting very impolite, Mictlan claims first invasion rights, all in due time.

[Calahan]

Yeah Maenads are great once you can get enough Pans to produce 200-300 a turn. And only mugs use gate cleavers or high strength units for sieges. Just bring 5000 Maenads along and the defences will be down before you can say 'Open sesame' :)

[Executor]

Well a stroke of luck on Mictlans part this turn, I forgot something.

Now where was I? Oh yes, fortify your capital and pray for a miracle. Also a word of friendly advice, don't use blood rain, it has no effect on berserk maeneads.

I'm curious to see how Sauromatia plans to take down my forts? Surly he has some elaborate scheme planned?

EDIT: Hmm, it seems TNN has joined the war against me, you greedy bastards!

[Jazzepi]

:O

Is anyone selling gate cleavers?

Also, we'd like to buy a moonvine bracelet. Can forge or pay games of most any type.

Jazzepi

[charshep]

Well a stroke of luck on Mictlans part this turn, I forgot something.

Now where was I? Oh yes, fortify your capital and pray for a miracle. Also a word of friendly advice, don't use blood rain, it has no effect on berserk maeneads.

I'm curious to see how Sauromatia plans to take down my forts? Surly he has some elaborate scheme planned?

EDIT: Hmm, it seems TNN has joined the war against me, you greedy bastards!

Thanks for the tip.

BTW, do you know what happened with the scouts? I thought my capital troops were set to attack but they got stuck digging up hidden scouts instead. I thought troops had to be set to Patrol to hunt for scouts.

[Executor]

[/QUOTE]

BTW, do you know what happened with the scouts? I thought my capital troops were set to attack but they got stuck digging up hidden scouts instead. I thought troops had to be set to Patrol to hunt for scouts.[/QUOTE]

Hmm hallucinations, not a good sign.
You can have delusions and be right nevertheless, but that won't make those delusions go away. So Charshep, let's have a talk... When was the last time you saw a pink Natajara flying in your courtyard?

[tgbob]

My scouts!:cry:

Now I won't be able to watch the battles there.

[charshep]

Hmm hallucinations, not a good sign.
You can have delusions and be right nevertheless, but that won't make those delusions go away. So Charshep, let's have a talk... When was the last time you saw a pink Natajara flying in your courtyard?

Uh, this is only my second game. What the hell is a Natajara?

[Zapmeister]

Uh, this is only my second game. What the hell is a Natajara?

He probably means Nataraja. Its a pretender type modelled on the multi-armed Hindu gods.

[Illuminated One]

Ha, eat blindness you 150 hp Jarl!

[tgbob]

It's alright, he can probably still trample!

[Illuminated One]

I'm setting Abysia to AI now.

[charshep]

Good fight Pangea. Going AI, please credit Pangea with the kill.

Thanks everyone, I enjoyed it while it lasted!

[Calahan]

Wow a quick double knockout!

@ Illuminated One - Many thanks for taking on the Abysia position and giving it some extra final legs. Tough to impossible ask to fend off three well placed foes, but there's at least one blind 150HP meat shield stumbling around thanks to your efforts :) So 'Thank You' for sparing your time to save Abysia from the AI when you did.

@ charshep - Good game and well played. 'Executor' has been around a fair while so no shame coming unstuck against him, and you put up a good fight for a new player. Hope you enjoyed the game though and that you learnt a few tricks for your next one :) I will award the kill for Mictlan to Pangaea as stated.

@ Zapmeister - My understanding is that you were the first one to attack Abysia, so I'm going to tentatively assume you were the one chiefly responsible for killing them off. But 'PsiSoldier' and 'Bluff', please shout out if you had a lot bigger hand in the killing than I know about, as I will award a joint kill then.

[Executor]

Good fight Charshep.
Now I just have to figure out how to kill Sauromatia.

To all the nation left, well excpet TNN, not very nice of you to kick a man down, DO NOT SUPPLY SAURO WITH GATE CLEAVERS!

[Illuminated One]

Well, to be fair Zapmeister has made peace with me some turns ago.
But it looks like Abysia's military forces were crushed by and large before I took the position and TNN was next to their cap already while the others were gobbling more remote territories, so I think the kill should go to him.

P.S.: That specific Jarl is dead. No good idea to lead the charge while blind and feebleminded. :)

[Zapmeister]

To all the nation left, well excpet TNN, not very nice of you to kick a man down, DO NOT SUPPLY SAURO WITH GATE CLEAVERS!

Actually, I agree. I was just tidying up my border and, in the process, kicking a man while he was down. Mind you, everyone seems to do that in this game ...

Still, I regret it. Take it back if you want (I think there's 11 PD in there).

[Jazzepi]

Oh, I'm so glad Helmut's Sappers showed up right in time! Such good guys, them.

Pangea, your walls are rumbling as we speak.

Jazzepi

[Executor]

Attention! It seems a delivery of 35 death gems has been misplaced, can Pangaea count on the honor of whoever received those gems to send them back?

Jazzepi, feel free to storm any time, but be careful of what awaits you behind the walls.

[Calahan]

Sorry to hear about your sending accident Executor.

As admin can I please remind everyone that despite Dominions itself being a truly fabulous game, some parts of it are not so great, one of them being the messaging and item/gem sending interface. Those who have played the game long enough have all made the same accidental mistake Executor recently made, as it's very easy to do, and you have no way of checking who you have sent things to once it's been done.

So I would kindly ask whoever received their free gifts to do the right thing and return them to their sender. It would be a very poor show to profit from such things, and I would take it as a personal insult if anyone playing in one of my games decided that they should profit from others genuine mistakes.

It's been a good, hard fought game so far IMO, so please let's keep that up and not sour it in any way by going against the nature of fair play.

[Jazzepi]

Attention! It seems a delivery of 35 death gems has been misplaced, can Pangaea count on the honor of whoever received those gems to send them back?

Jazzepi, feel free to storm any time, but be careful of what awaits you behind the walls.

Delicious cake? :V

Jazzepi

[Executor]

Something very very strange happened to me this turn, am I the only one?
Oh, ****, wrong thread!

[PsiSoldier]

WTB Crown of Overmight. I know it was forged this turn so I figure I'll ask if whoever forged it is willing to sell.

Just name your price and PM me.. I think that ones cursed so I'm hoping I catch you before its equipped. Preferably trading in Gems or gold, but I have a few artifacts for trade too, I'm guessing whoever forged it is the one that has almost all the artifacts so you may be able to figure out which ones I have.

[tgbob]

I'll sell it for mega $$$.

[tgbob]

Oh right. I was kidding about that artifact by the way. Crown of Overmight is F5E3, and I can only think of two nations in this game with the paths that can forge it. Guess who one of them is!

Other than rainbow pretenders that is, and who takes F5 on a rainbow anyways?

Or maybe a fire bless...

[Executor]

And there go the invading forces of Sauromatia...

[Jazzepi]

And there go the invading forces of Sauromatia...

Don't worry. Replacements are already en route.

Jazzepi

[Executor]

And there go the invading forces of Sauromatia...

Don't worry. Replacements are already en route.

Jazzepi

I'm not worried, furthermore Pangaea welcomes any replacements that are due to arrive.

[Jazzepi]

And there go the invading forces of Sauromatia...

Don't worry. Replacements are already en route.

Jazzepi

I'm not worried, furthermore Pangaea welcomes any replacements that are due to arrive.

OH YOU SHOULD BE >:|

Jazzepi

[Calahan]

Just had a delay game request from Executor due to a malfunctioning keyboard. The message was a bit unclear because of this problem, but I will delay the game 8 hours just in case. I chose 8 hours because that allows me to check again in the morning (GMT) to see if Executor's problem has sorted itself out or not.

[Calahan]

I have PM-ed Executor to see what the status is regarding his computer problems, as I have not yet heard back from him since he sent me his original delay request.

So this is just a heads up to everyone that I will be delaying the game again if necessary to accomodate Executor's problem. He didn't mention any specific period of time in connection with his request (typing with a broken keyboard naturally presents problems) and have so far only delayed the game by 8 hours. The current turn is only waiting for Executor's .2h file, so at this stage I am intending to keep a close eye on the hosting, and delay hosting as required until Executor sorts his problems out.

So apologies to everyone for the current delay and hold-up. But I doubt if any of us has ever not had any computer problems at some point in time, so hope it's easy for everyone to understand the problems this sort of thing can cause. Executor has been one of the forums most active players over the past year, so I am certain he will get back to us asap.

Sorry again, and will keep you all updated as best I can.

[Calahan]

@ All - Executor has sorted his keyboard out, so he shouldn't have any more problems there at least.

There is currently one hour left before hosting, and Jazzepi's turn has not yet been submitted. I have posted before about how I prefer being a pro-active admin with regards avoiding possible stales if I spot them in time, so I will be extending the hosting time by a few hours if it appears Jazzepi is likely to stale.

Edit: Hosting delayed by 6 hours to help prevent Jazzepi from staling.

[Jazzepi]

My mistake. After reviewing my PMs, Yomi and Sauro don't have any standing NAPs.

Jazzepi

[Calahan]

I have just delayed the game by a few hours as it looked likely a double round of stales was going to happen. (Sauro and Atlantis)

At this stage of the game (turn 47), can I please ask all the players how thay are managing with the current 30 hour hosting schedule? I know there are a lot of wars going on at the moment, and I have had to delay the last two turns in order to avoid stale turns occuring (which is a decision I alone made as admin).

My current thought is to increase the hosting schedule slightly, perhaps to 36 or 48 hours. Please let me know your thoughts on this, as I'd like to try and find some sort of balance if possible between keeping a good pace going, and avoiding players staling or rushing their turns.

[Calahan]

To the rest of you, a warning :

Calahan is a liar and a thief. He's broken his NAP with us by moving 3+ stealth armies through our provinces to purposefully activate our PD. While at first I thought it was just a fluke, he still has armies nested in our territories. I would not be surprised if he is in cahoots with Caelum.

Jazzepi

Excuse me Jazzepi, but what NAP are you talking about? I have only signed one NAP in the whole game, and it was not with your nation of Sauromatia.

I know we are currently having a difference of opinion on another thread, on a completely seperate issue, so I would kindly ask that any personal feelings you have towards me do not spill over onto this thread as a result.

Edit: May I also remind everyone of the rules regarding NAP's for this game as written on the game status page.

Situation Regarding NAP's etc (Non-Aggression Pacts)
No NAP agreements in this game will be considered as inviolable in any way. You are free to sign as many NAP's as you wish, but you do so at your own risk. Also, I personally think that in a game like Dominions 3 there isn't really any such thing as an NAP, since in theory everyone is aiming to win, and there can be only one winner. So all NAP's should instead be considered as Mutual Benefit Agreements, whereby both nations benefit for whatever reason(s) from not engaging in hostilities against the other nation. But the moment one side is no longer benefiting from such an agreement, then that is the moment they are most likely to break them. So if you are ever surprised by a nation breaking an agreement, then maybe you were mistaken with regards to just how important that agreement was to them, or how much they could gain from suddenly attacking you.

Also, if any NAP (or like agreement) is broken in any way, be it intentional, accidental, or whatever, then you have no right what-so-ever to complain about it in the game thread. Please keep this in mind. Any disputes regarding these matters should be dealt with via PM's.
It clears says here that if any NAP's are broken, you have "no right what-so-ever" to complain about it in the game thread. Please can I ask everyone to bare this in mind for the rest of the game.

[Zapmeister]

My current thought is to increase to hosting schedule slightly, perhaps to 36 or 48 hours. Please let me know your thoughts on this, as I'd like to try and find some sort of balance if possible between keeping a good pace going, and avoiding players staling or rushing their turns.

While I don't need any increase in "thinking time" I do appreciate the need for diplomacy time when players live on opposite sides of the planet. 48 hours would be tolerable, BUT I gotta say that I strongly disagree with the policy of postponing the turn whenever it looks like someone's going to stale. If you're going to do that, you may as well remove the time limit altogether.

If someone is going to miss the deadline, all they have to do is ask for an extension, which takes 2 seconds assuming they have connectivity. If they can't be bothered doing that, then a stale is appropriate, IMHO.

[Calahan]

While I don't need any increase in "thinking time" I do appreciate the need for diplomacy time when players live on opposite sides of the planet. 48 hours would be tolerable, BUT I gotta say that I strongly disagree with the policy of postponing the turn whenever it looks like someone's going to stale. If you're going to do that, you may as well remove the time limit altogether.

If someone is going to miss the deadline, all they have to do is ask for an extension, which takes 2 seconds assuming they have connectivity. If they can't be bothered doing that, then a stale is appropriate, IMHO.
Thank you for your feedback Zapmeister. I know my policy of extending the hosting to avoid stales is definitely not the norm for games, and may certainly not be to everyone's liking. But I personally have a serious issue with games becoming unbalanced because of stales / AI-turning etc. so I do try to avoid these things happening if I can.

But I do take your viewpoint that there is very little point having a 'deadline' if I am just going to extend it whenever anyone looks in danger of missing it (although I am not always around). I thought there was going to be two nations staling this turn, but the Sauromatia turn appeared very shortly after I extended the hosting (I extended it 10-15 minutes before the deadline).

My apologies to everyone if my decision to do this is affecting the flow of the game, and I will not take this 'pro-active' stale prevention action again unless someone (other than me) thinks it is a good idea.

[Silence0]

Sorry for the incovenience..I´ve had to travel without warning and couldn´t make it in time..Many thanks calahan for the delay..and for doing it for sake of a fun and balanced game:).. but even though i was the offender i sort of agree with zapmeister..most of the time it's possible and better to ask for a delay..and i deserved it:doh:

[PsiSoldier]

Oh No.. My Troggies killed da poor widdle king of da mountains.. I keep telling dem dont pway wit udder peeoples toys cause you keep bweaking dem. But dey just dont wisten.

[Calahan]

Sorry for the incovenience..I´ve had to travel without warning and couldn´t make it in time..Many thanks calahan for the delay..and for doing it for sake of a fun and balanced game:)..
Glad that at least someone benefited from my pro-active actions :)

....but even though i was the offender i sort of agree with zapmeister..most of the time it's possible and better to ask for a delay..and i deserved it:doh:

If someone is going to miss the deadline, all they have to do is ask for an extension, which takes 2 seconds assuming they have connectivity. If they can't be bothered doing that, then a stale is appropriate, IMHO.
Must admit I never really thought of viewing a stale as a 'punishment' for not asking for a delay. Interest concept though :) Although there is always the question mark over whether a player didn't ask for a delay because they couldn't (no net connection, unexpected travel, many other obvious things). But like I said, I won't take any pro-active stale actions again unless others think it is a good idea. (currently see 2-0 against)

From an in-game perspective, I tend to view stales as just an extremely bad random event. "Your entire nation is on strike for the month" :) Could be worse I guess.

My mistake. After reviewing my PMs, Yomi and Sauro don't have any standing NAPs.

Jazzepi
No worries :)

[tgbob]

Poor earth king! Swarmed by stupid troglodytes.

[Calahan]

It's now me who needs a delay this turn. I have added 4 hours so I can do my turn tomorrow morning rather than trying to do it tonight and vainly attempt to fight off the sandman at the same time.

Starting next turn I will be extending the hosting to 36 hours. This is not a big increase on the current 30 hour schedule, but an extra 6 hours would have been enough for the three recent delays (although only this current one was actually requested) to not have been required. Also very few games have such a quick schedule this close to turn 50, so I think we have had a pretty quick game so far. And I ask again to please post if you feel strongly that the hosting should remain at 30 hours (or if you think it should be increased to more than 36 hours)

Sorry again about the slight delay.

[Calahan]

I need an extra few hours for my current turn. Sorry all, sleep has beaten me tonight.

[Executor]

I need an extra few hours for my current turn. Sorry all, sleep has beaten me tonight.

I'm sure the admin won't mind delaying the game a bit.

[Calahan]

I'm sure the admin won't mind delaying the game a bit.
Well I hope he doesn't get too angry, since I am sadly going to need another delay this turn :( And a proper 24 hour one this time at that.

So sorry everyone, but I have very little time tonight to do my turn, and tomorrow I am out for the entire day watching a sporting event (which wasn't confirmed 100% until today). So won't get chance now to get the turn sorted until Sunday afternoon/evening (llamaserver time)

[Executor]

Well lucky you.
I'm jealous, my *** is practicaly glued to my chair.:(

Be sure to PM the admin before you go.

[Executor]

Quick delay? Sauro about to stale.

[Executor]

Pangaea issues a proclamation,
We will declare war on any nation that tries to take provinces 104 and 99 for we consider them most vital to our cause.
The wrath of nature will have no mercy on those who ignore our warning.

Now, where was I,
Jazzepi? Still with us here?
If he stales again I suggest we at least find someone to turn Sauro to AI.
There's no pleasure in attacking a staleing nation.

[Calahan]

If it looks like Sauro are going to stale again, I will delay the game for 12 hours to see if Jazzepi returns. He is also close to staling in Legends of Faerun, so it is not just this game he is missing in.

@ Executor - Can I ask when you are likely to need your few days delay for? Since if it is very soon (as in tomorrow or day after) then we can use that time to work out what to do with Sauro, and to see if Jazzepi re-appears or not.

[Executor]

I can make one more turn tomorow, but I'll need 2-3 after that.
I'll let you know when to delay the game for my sake.

[Calahan]

That's cool Executor. But I really don't want to see Sauro stale again, so it may well turn out that the delay needed to decide what to do with Sauro will tag onto the front of your delay, and will end up being a 3-4 day delay overall. Which is not great, but better than the unfair situation now where several nations are attacking a staling nation.

Edit: I have just delayed the game two hours to give me a safety net so that I don't miss the hosting deadline due to sleep and getting into work tomorrow.

[Calahan]

Ok, it looks like Sauro's turn has come in overnight, so it's game on again :)

@ All - Executor will be needing a few days delay soon due to things in Real Life, so the game will be getting put on hold during this period. The delay shouldn't be for longer than 2-3 days, and will possibly seem like less depending on when the hosting deadlines fall.

Will keep you all updated as to when the delay will start.

[Calahan]

@ All

I have had a request to permanently extend the hosting schedule for this game, which I too would also welcome at this stage. Everyone seems to be in at least one war right now, many are in several, so I'm guessing there are other players who would also appreciate the extra 12 hours.

Plus I know I also personally find it slightly annoying the way that with a 36 hour schedule, the deadline falls on a completely different time of day every other turn. Which if you only have the evenings free to do your turns, means that 36 hours isn't really that different to a 24 hour schedule.

So my intentions are to increase the hosting schedule to 48 hours, which is what a lot of other games would be on by this stage of the game. Please can you all let me know your thoughts on this.

[Zapmeister]

So my intentions are to increase the hosting schedule to 48 hours, which is what a lot of other games would be on by this stage of the game. Please can you all let me know your thoughts on this.

I prefer 36 hours, but 48 would be OK.

[Calahan]

@ All - I have increased the hosting schedule from 36 to 48 hours as per a player request, as there were no objections to it. I have heard from Executor Re: the delay he needs, and he said he should only need one day. So I have added this length of time onto the current turn deadline as well to accommodate Executor's needs.

[Zapmeister]

@ All - I have increased the hosting schedule from 36 to 48 hours as per a player request, as there were no objections to it. I have heard from Executor Re: the delay he needs, and he said he should only need one day. So I have added this length of time onto the current turn deadline as well to accommodate Executor's needs.

Actually, Executor has his orders in already, so we probably don't need the extra extension in the current turn (although we may do for the next turn).

[PsiSoldier]

Alright Neifle. Hit the road Jack and dont ya come back no more no more no more no more, hit the road jack and dont ya come back no more.

I'd retreat what you have left before you loose it. Give me a chance to show Caleum what fun he's missing out on.

[tgbob]

I don't want to. I'd much rather sit peaceful like in my corner reading up on avine mitigatory habits.

[PsiSoldier]

I was talking to Neifle actually. You and TNN have to wait your turns I can only be in so many places at once. I'll kick you back out of my lands soon enough.

[Zapmeister]

Sauro has gone AI.

[Calahan]

Many thanks for the heads-up Zap.

[PsiSoldier]

Ok, this makes no sense. I slaughtered nearly all of Neifle's forces in a certain battle and routed the rest of them and watching the battle I clearly won but yet it says that I lost and looking at the map my guy retreated to another province.

Doesnt matter too much because Niefle is about to loose 90 vampires that retreated into my dominion so he's going to pay dearly anyways.

I also killed nearly all of Neifle's commanders, but yet it says I killed 0 of 12... Something ****ed up.

[Calahan]

Ok, this makes no sense. I slaughtered nearly all of Neifle's forces in a certain battle and routed the rest of them and watching the battle I clearly won but yet it says that I lost and looking at the map my guy retreated to another province.

Doesnt matter too much because Niefle is about to loose 90 vampires that retreated into my dominion so he's going to pay dearly anyways.

I also killed nearly all of Neifle's commanders, but yet it says I killed 0 of 12... Something ****ed up.
That sounds like the replay bug to me. One solution I've heard is to re-download the CBM 1.41 mod, as llamabeast made a slight alteration to the original CBM 1.41 (and uploaded it to the CBM 1.41 mod page), and this is the version that is on the llamaserver (and which this game is using). And it is this slight difference in CBM 1.41 versions that is thought to be causing some of the replay discrepancies.

[PsiSoldier]

Hrrrmm where can I find 1.41 now... Its up to 1.5 on the forum page.. I'll keep looking to see if I can find a link to the older one.. Or has Lammaserver updated us to 1.5 on there now so 1.5 is what we should have???

[PsiSoldier]

Heya.. Updating my cbm did it.. It was just a 50 turn autoroute

[Calahan]

Good to hear you sorted the replay bug out PsiSoldier :)

Edit: Have attached the latest CBM 1.41 mod for anyone else having problems with battles replays. Although this doesn't guarantee to solve any and all replay problems though.

[PsiSoldier]

Still actually not 100% sure it sorted the problem out because the province report on my map still doesnt match what I saw after the battle, but its definitely a lot closer to what I saw then before.

Of course you cant really go by what a province report says anyways but I'd still think it should say something different.

Its weird how changing the cbm mod can make that huge of a difference in the battle that you see play out.

[Calahan]

Sorry all, I'm going to need a delay here. Still in work, so have no chance of getting home and completing my turn before the imminent hosting.

I've tagged on 24 hours since I'm not even sure when I'll get home from work right now, and the worst case is I might not get a spare moment until tomorrow evening. But it's only my turn outstanding, so will try and get it done first chance I get.

Apologies for the hold-up.

[Executor]

Pangaea buying death gems, we offer ANY other kind in return.

[PsiSoldier]

Anyone know if Shatter works on Earth Kings? Appearantly TNN got smart at the last second and pulled back his golems otherwise they'd have been dead meat, and I went to all the trouble to setup a nice welcoming committee for them where I thought they'd be going... Not too smart to attack an earth magic nation with things like that, but I guess you figured that out...

Anyways Shatter is supposed to destroy stone and seeing as how Earth kings are made of stone It seems it should work but I dont know it does have that thing in there about lifeless beings.

Eh well, Bring that Earth King on down again Caleum and we'll find out if it works. Assuming I dont just kill it with something else.

You may as well send down your horde of Gargoyls in 162 too, I'm pretty certain they wont last against shatter.

[tgbob]

Gargoyles with an E!

[tgbob]

I am on 80% cruise control in regards to this game, would anyone hate me if I looked for a permanent substitute?

[Zapmeister]

I am on 80% cruise control in regards to this game, would anyone hate me if I looked for a permanent substitute?

No-one could blame you for that. On the contrary, finding a sub is the best thing you can do when you're not having fun any more.

[tgbob]

It's not not having fun, it's the lack of time with my stupid dumb classes taking up all of my time.

[Calahan]

Would hate to see you have to drop out of the game after all the time and effort you've put into it tgbob. Would a longer hosting interval help you at all? The game is past turn 60 now, so switching to 60 or 72 hours wouldn't be unheard of for this stage of the game.

It might not have to be permanent either, (since I know there are fans of quick schedules here) as we can always switch back to a quicker interval when/if tgbob gets some more free time. But I would really like to find a way to help tgbob out if it means keeping him in the game, rather than him having to sub out due to a RL time crunch.

[PsiSoldier]

Caleum is doomed anyways, I'd hate to have to kill some poor guy that comes in to sub for Caleum but Ive earned a victory here against Caleum so whoever takes over is still going to die.

They may still get a few good turns in though since most of my best forces are geared to be used defensively but that doesnt matter too much.

[Calahan]

That's some good confidence on display there PsiSoldier :)

[Zapmeister]

Now Executor is looking for a sub as well.
The game is collapsing :(

[Calahan]

Losing one player, potentially two, is not good that's for sure. Don't think I'd say it's collapsing yet, but certainly some deterioration going on.

I've PM-ed tgbob to see if a longer hosting schedule would help keep him around. And I'll see what I can do about helping in the search for a Pangaea sub. It would be very sad for a nation that has endured as much a Pangaea has, and survived, to have it's ultimate fate sealed by the AI :(

Thr current turn may be getting delayed if it helps in keeping both Caelum and Pangaea under human control.

Keep you all (or whoever's left) posted.

[Calahan]

I have now heard back from tgbob, and he says that extending the hosting to 72 hours would be a big help to him, and allow him to continue playing in this game.

So rather than risk having two major nations turning AI, I will be extending the hosting schedule to 72 hours as of now so that we can keep tgbob in charge of Caelum, and then only have the problem of potentially losing Pangaea to the AI (although haven't given up on finding a sub yet).

[PsiSoldier]

That's some good confidence on display there PsiSoldier :)

Confidence is never been something I have lacked, even when there has been no good reason for it. :D:D

[Calahan]

Pangaea were about to stale, which would have been a bit pointless IMO. So I have extended the hosting to prevent this. I will find out off Executor if he's had any luck finding a sub, or if not, ask him (or someone else) to turn Pangaea AI asap.

[Zapmeister]

Pangaea were about to stale, which would have been a bit pointless IMO. So I have extended the hosting to prevent this. I will find out off Executor if he's had any luck finding a sub, or if not, ask him (or someone else) to turn Pangaea AI asap.

Cal, I think you've forgotten that Pan is in the grace period of the NAPs he recently cancelled, and the AI would almost certainly violate that grace period.

I've played my turn (and don't particularly want to replay it) based on the confident knowledge that Executor would either play his turn honouring the NAP, or stale.

I think the turn should be force hosted immediately. If Pan goes AI in the following turn, the grace period would still be violated, but at least I could play my turn with that knowledge.

[Calahan]

Pangaea sent their "All NAP's void" notice on turn 62 (in-game message). By my reckoning (although this is just my view of an NAP timetable) if the NAP's were 3-turn NAP's, any attacks that were ordered this turn would be valid.

Turn 62 - Turn 1 of notice
Turn 63 - Turn 2 of notice
Turn 64 - Turn 3 of notice, hostile orders may be issued if so wished.
Turn 65 - All 3-turn NAP's are officially over, and any attacks that occur were valid with regards cancelling the NAP.

Also, the game status page states that no NAP's in this game are inviolable, so any player in the game could choose to violate any NAP at any time if they wished. So if Pan are turned AI, and the AI decided to attack, then the AI would simply be choosing to violate the NAP's (if the NAP's were longer than 3 turns), which is fine IMO, and one of the features of this particular game, as was stated before sign-ups.

I have PM'ed Executor to see what the situation is regarding a sub, but my intentions are to find someone to turn Pan AI this turn (and within the hour) if no sub if found. I don't see how letting them stale again is correct though.

For the record I have done my turn on the assumption that Pan are still human controlled, as I don't believe in issuing orders just to take advantage of AI-turning nations.

[PsiSoldier]

Hrrrrm so the question is... Do I Let Pangaea's massive army take one of my provinces so they are in friendly dominion so that I can Master Enslave them all with no risk of losing my pretender or do I kill 95% of them before they have a chance to attack one of my provinces... Tough choice..

[Executor]

I don't think you can master enslave them, carrion at least, that's why you have arcain domination. You can quite easily screw yourself by casting the wrong spell.
Master enslave for regular units,
Undead mastery for undead,
Arcain domination for magic,

And since carrions are both magic and undead I have no idea if both work or one of them and which one.

[PsiSoldier]

I think Master Enslave actually does all types and its the only one that does regular.. I could be mistaken though. I believe Ive tested that numerous times in Single Player.. I cant recall it ever not working.

But it would be cheaper to cast Master enslave once for the Maenads and then Arcain Domination for the Carrion.. I would think Undead Mastery should work on the Carrion summons as well seeing as how they are both Undead and Magic and which I am also able to cast.

If Master Enslave doesnt enslave Carrions then I'll just have the Carrion summons fighting the Maenads for a turn or so before I cast Arcane domination.

But I may just pop in with another commander and kill them all with some battlefield wide spells beforehand seeing as how they have no armor or very little in the case of the carrions.. Havent really decided.

[Executor]

I could be wrong. I know master enslave didn't work on undead chariots for me, however chariots were mindless come to thing of it. Than again most undead also are.

[PsiSoldier]

Honestly the best memory I have of using Master Enslave was teleporting my pretender on top of an army of about 1000 Formorian Giants and Enslaving them all I'm pretty sure they had some other magic beings in that army but I cant recall for sure. Not that they would have lived long once I enslaved all the giants if the enslave hadnt work on them.

[Zapmeister]

Pangaea sent their "All NAP's void" notice on turn 62 (in-game message). By my reckoning (although this is just my view of an NAP timetable) if the NAP's were 3-turn NAP's, any attacks that were ordered this turn would be valid.

Turn 62 - Turn 1 of notice
Turn 63 - Turn 2 of notice
Turn 64 - Turn 3 of notice, hostile orders may be issued if so wished.
Turn 65 - All 3-turn NAP's are officially over, and any attacks that occur were valid with regards cancelling the NAP.

Really? I could have sworn we were in the second turn of the grace period. Still, I defer to your non-Alzheimer's-afflicted memory.

Also, the game status page states that no NAP's in this game are inviolable, so any player in the game could choose to violate any NAP at any time if they wished.

Yeah, I'm not saying that people shouldn't break NAPs. What I'm saying is that the human player of Pan convinced me that he wouldn't break his NAP and I played on that basis. My issue is, if Pan had gone AI and the turn hosted without my knowledge, I would have been at a significant disadvantage.

EDIT: Ah - I see that this is exactly what occurred and yes, Pan attacked. :(

This is not about taking advantage of nations going AI, its about knowing the state of the game at the time you play your turn.

Also, in terms of game balance, I disagree that the difference between one turn of stale and one turn of AI control is significant.

Just my 2c

[Zapmeister]

Henceforth, Tir na n'Og shall be played by DryaUnda.
I have forwarded his email to the administrator.

[Calahan]

Sorry to see you go Zap :( You've certainly been a tough competitor here all the way through, and a fine asset to the game as a whole. Many thanks for playing and providing everyone with good competition. And as admin a definite extra thanks for lining up your own sub before bowing out, and staying until one was found. Many games would be a lot different if everyone took the time and courtesy to do that.

Hope this (and Red Ruby) wasn't your Swan Song for Dominions in general though, since I believe you are one of the few that have been around since Dominions PPP, so be even sadder to see a PPP vet disappear.

The email for DryaUnda has now been changed, so....

@ DryaUnda - On behalf of everyone, 'Welcome to CarCrash' :)

[Calahan]

Game delayed 12 hours by request of a player.

[Silence0]

Hi all... I´m very sorry for my lack of communication but i had lots of work and no access to the forums.. it´s been a fun game but without human interaction it´s not really the same.. that said i hope i can be a regular again and plot world domination with you all..

[AlgaeNymph]

Henceforth, Tir na n'Og shall be played by DryaUnda.Henceforth, Tir na n'Og's player will be known as AlgaeNymph. This will only affect forum correspondence.

[Calahan]

@ All

The game may be getting delayed 24 hours to address the Niefelheim stales. They've staled two out of the last three turns, and I really don't want to see that become three out of last four if it can be helped (the current Niefelheim turn is still outstanding).

I PM-ed 'Bluff' two days ago to ask for a status report regarding the stales, but I have not received a reply yet. But Bluff's last forum activity was apparently over a week ago (according to his profile page), so there's a good chance he hasn't seen my PM yet.

I don't think it's right to look for a sub at the moment for Niefelheim, as the stale situation isn't that bad yet, as there hasn't been two stales in a row, and Bluff may well be intending to submit a .2h file for the current turn. So he is likely to, and rightly to, be a bit annoyed if his nation was to be usurped from under him by looking for a sub. The problem is I just don't know due to the lack of contact.

I will try using the llamaserver to contact Bluff in the hopes of getting hold of him that way. Other than that my only other thought is to let the game host and send Niefelheim an in-game message.

So this is just a heads-up to you all about the Niefelheim position. Any delay for Niefelheim is not definite yet, so please still aim to get your turns in by the current deadline. But I will post again later to say whether ot not a delay is happening.

[Calahan]

Still no word from 'Bluff'. I have PM-ed him twice and sent him a message using the llamaserver, but neither has worked so far in getting a responce from him. I have now also sent him an in-game message asking him to contact me to let me know what's happening.

I am going to delay the game 8 hours so that I can check again in the morning for any emails or PM's. If I still have not received anything, then I will let the game host and hope the in-game message gets to him.

If there is still no sign of him 24 hours into the next turn, then I guess I will have to start looking for a sub, since I have run out of ideas for contacting him, so I'll have to assume he's gone AWOL.

[PsiSoldier]

I hate to say it, but considering he didnt ask for an extension of the turn there is really no reason to expect an 8 hour delay to make any difference. Obviously it could pottentially make a difference but if he has neglected submitting his turn up to this point I just dont see that 8 hours will mean much in the end when it wasnt requested.

It may be a good idea to go ahead and look for a sub, then if Bluff doesnt come back or acknowladges in the thread that he is having Real life problems and needs one then we are a step ahead of the game. And on the otherhand if you find a sub and he does come back and get his turns in on time then you can kindly thank the sub and let him know you will keep him in mind in the future if we need him.

I'm guessing with the current stale situation though that we are more inclined to need the sub than not to need one though.

It's a shame though I was hoping to see the turn before I went to bed :(

[PsiSoldier]

What's with the message from Host about Yomi having an unexplainable increase in wealth that can be caused by cheating?

I think Ive seen message's like that in nearly every game Ive every played and if memory serve's I think it's even said that about me once or twice. Anyone know what causes that? I seriously doubt everyone's cheating in all these games and I'd be surprised if any of the message's Ive seen have actually been caused by cheating so there has to be another reason.

[Calahan]

@ PsiSoldier - Yeah, I've had that message in a lot of my games. No idea what causes it. This is the second time that it's happened to one of my nations, and on neither occasion did I ever see anything appear gold/gem wise that wasn't expected.

I had a theory that it was linked to the mercs somehow, since the first game it happened to me in I was bidding on mercs at the time, but lost the province I was buying them for. Hence losing the mercs, and getting the gold-refund, which I thought was the 'unexpected increase in wealth' being reported. But when I tried reproducing that in test games I didn't get the message. So I went back to being puzzled by it :)


@ All - Niefelheim

Ok, I heard back from Bluff overnight, and it sounds like he's having a few RL problems. He didn't actually say that he wouldn't/couldn't continue with the game, but to be on the safe side I'm going to look for a sub (first chance I get).


@ All - Re: 8 hour un-requested delay last turn

I delayed the game 8 hours on the previous turn mainly because that pushed the hosting back to 11am llamaserver time, which should have equated to the late evening in Australia (where I'm pretty certain Bluff is from). So my theory was that if Bluff was away over the weekend, and than into work on the Monday, Monday evening might have been the first chance he got to check his emails etc. I bit of guesswork on my part, but thought it was worth the 8 hours to see if it panned out.

Also, when I was arranging a cease-fire with Niefelheim about 40 turns ago, the majority of the many PM's I exchanged with Bluff were during the 7am-10am llamaserver time window. So again I hoped that a 11am llamaserver time hosting would have caught Bluff in his 'Dominions time' window, hence again my decision to tag-on the 8 hour delay in the hope of getting some sort of responce from Bluff before the double stale.


Anyway, enough chat :) Need to get some RL work done so that I can find time to throw-up a sub post this afternoon.

[Calahan]

@ All

I have managed to find a sub for Niefelheim. The future of the frost giants in now in the capable hands of 'Pelthin'. So please direct all future Niefelheim correspondece that way from here on.

[Pelthin]

Hello All.

I am the new management for the frost giants, so let me know if we had any NAP's, ect.. No response and I will assume you are fair game, ect.. :)

If you hate me, I will accept neing attacked as the defacto message coming my way.

Thanks for allowing me to join!

[tgbob]

Requesting a 5 hour delay. Oh I hope Calahan sees this.

[Calahan]

Requesting a 5 hour delay. Oh I hope Calahan sees this.
Time added as requested tgbob :)


@ All - For future reference.

If the turn is set to host anytime after 11am llamaserver time, then there's usually a good 95% chance I'll see any last minute delay requests. Only time I might miss one is if the turn is hosting 1am-11am llamaserver time, as those are the hours I'm usually sleeping and getting ready for work.

Since there's only a few of us left now, I might make sure the hosting time always happens at pm llamaserver time. As that way there's far less chance of me missing last minute delay requests due to being asleep.

[tgbob]

Forewarning, I was planning to move sometime this weekend but Typhoon Morakot decided to pay Taiwan a visit. My internet is going to be pretty flaky again.

[Calahan]

@ tgbob - Thanks for the heads up on the Typhoon and dodgy internet warnings. I'll keep an eye on your turn and the deadline, and do what's needed to make sure Mother Nature doesn't cause you to stale.

[Calahan]

A few hours to go before hosting, and still no tgbob/Caelum turn. The news is still reporting that Typhoon Morakot is doing it's thing in tgbob's part of the world, so there's a fair chance his internet could be out at the moment. As he has already warned that dodgy internet is a very likely result of said Typhoon activity, so he has indirectly asked for a delay because of it.

So I'm going to add on a few hours for tgbob to help him avoid a stale. He has a good record of submitting turns on time, so pretty sure he won't keep us waiting. I would normally wait until nearer the deadline to add on the delay, but will probably be out of the office for the rest of the day, so won't have chance to keep a closer eye on things.

[tgbob]

Thanks for the additional time, but I'm doing my turn right now. Freaking class taking up all of my spare time.

[Calahan]

@ All - Game delayed 24 hours by my own request. A small family problem has just occured, which means I won't be at home again until tomorrow afternoon, so no chance of sending my turn in before the current deadline hits.

Apologies for the hold-up.

[Calahan]

@ All - Apologies again, but I'm going to have to kindly ask for another 8 hours for my turn :( Only just got home, and it's unlikely that I'll have enough time tonight to get my turn done. But should have the time tomorrow to get my turn sorted.

Very sorry for the two delays I've had to request. Some RL problems have limited my Dominions time over the past few days, but hope things are back on track now :)

[PsiSoldier]

Anyone who wants to see neifle's Arcane corruption dispelled send me Pearls and I'll take care of it. I'll need a few turns to save up though.

[PsiSoldier]

Thanks to Neifle's Arcane Corruption Caleum and I have declared a truce to our war.

Neifle has one turn to let me know how many slaves were put into the AC before I annihilate him.

[tgbob]

Preemptive couple of hours delay just in case request.

[Calahan]

No problem tgbob. I'll add 6 hours for now. Let me know if you need any more or not.

[Calahan]

@ All

Many apologies everyone, but I'll need a 4 hour delay for this one. Had to rush getting ready for work this morning due to a failed alarm clock, and as such I forgot to send my turn in as I intended. And some after work plans mean I won't be getting home until a lot later than usual.

I've also used the llamaserver to send a message to Atlantis, since they have staled the last 2 turns. 'Silence0' is not a regular on these forums, so have no idea if these stales were just accidental, or something that will need me to break out my sub-hunting rod.

[Pelthin]

Can I get a delay for the next turn? I had to request a resend, as it didn't email me. Just got it, and I need to get to bed and work.

Could I have 12 hours? Please?

Thanks.

[Calahan]

No problem Pelthin. I've added 18 hours as I might be struggling as well to get the turn done in time, and 18 hours will allow me to do my turn during a work-free Saturday morning :)