Penetration question

[Tolkien]

Does penetration work on commanders casting item spells, ex. mind hunt?

[chrispedersen]

Still no.

[Sombre]

Mind hunt is an item spell? Which item?

[Frozen Lama]

cracked (or maybe black) mirror

[Sombre]

Cool, never actually used that.

[Adept]

Hmm, I have a follow-up question.

Do penetration boosters help with things like the mind blast of an illlithid lord or the Enslave Mind ability of an Aboleth?

[Sombre]

Nope.

[Mardagg]

Follow up question no 2:

In the description for the Black Mirror it says that only an Astral Mage can use the item for Mind Hunts,is that right?

it would be pretty powerful if not,since i dont care about normal commanders being feebleminded.

[vfb]

When you Mind Hunt, you are either casting Mind Burn or Soul Slay: whichever one of those spells your mage knows. Your normal commanders do not know either.

[Mardagg]

I believe this item is much too expensive then:
Simple mind hunts are only 2 astral pearls and you cant get the much needed penetration boosters with the item.

[vfb]

It doesn't just do Mind Hunts, you know.

[Psycho]

vfb is wrong, ordinary commanders can cast mind hunt using the black mirror. It's not much useful though, since penetration items have no effect, but at least you don't need to worry about being feebleminded.

You cast mind burn or soul slay, whichever you have researched; it doesn't matter if the caster doesn't have astral paths for the mirror.

[Stavis_L]

Fun trivia fact - a unit can cast mind hunt using the mirror even if they're feebleminded.

[Mardagg]

ah,that makes the item interesting!
thx.

[chrispedersen]

Noone ever builds the black mirror, due to the subject always resisting - earth orbs are safer, better cheaper.

But VFB- do you actually *know* what happens if you build it (and use it)?

[vfb]

Noone ever builds the black mirror, due to the subject always resisting - earth orbs are safer, better cheaper.

I've built the Black Mirror. Probably in one of those horrible games that never ends, and just goes on forever, and there are no good artifacts left. By "earth orb" do you mean "stone sphere"?

But VFB- do you actually *know* what happens if you build it (and use it)?

Well, I was wrong about the caster needing S! :) I just assumed that.

All the other effects are in the manual, anyone can look it up an see what it does. I never had an opportunity to try out the "dispel illusion", since there's not a whole lot of units with the Illusion tag. You'd need to fight someone with Fata Morgana up, or who like casting MoD, to get any any benefit in battle, probably.

[Mardagg]

great!
Giving advise when you dont know it yourself is just excellent personality,congrats.

I was also assuming that it needs a S mage to use it,you know.
The description of Mind Hunt is not a tough read.
I still asked here because i wanted to make sure.
And the side effect is so minor,that it wasnt worth mentioning...obviously you couldnt resist...again.
Because of your false advise i didnt built it in one of my games that turn.Not sure if i am building it anyways,but still:mad:

[Frozen Lama]

Way to be a deuschebag. he was trying to help. when it was brought up on IRC 90% of the people thought what vfb thought. no need to get pissy about it

[Mardagg]

haha,common.
I got history with him in the Nations under CBM thread.
He has been unfriendly to me right from the start.
I actually dont believe therefore he was just trying to be helpful,especially with his 2nd statement here.

Call me what you want frozen,but this guy is either racist vs Germans or i have history with him from Dom2/other games i am not aware of yet.
Its probably the best in the future for him to just ignore me/questions from me like i will do,thats sure.

[Frozen Lama]

haha,common.

I actually dont believe therefore he was just trying to be helpful,especially with his 2nd statement here.


Umm what? his second statement of "it doesn't jsut do mind hunts you know" ?

umm well yeah, it doesn't just do mind hunts. don't see any nasty comments in that.

and i will assume you were joking about the racist thing and the whole conspiracy theory from dom2.

[Mardagg]

his ending comment is directly corelating to the other thread,you know.You lack all the insight info.

[Sombre]

Ooh, burn from the crazy foreign dude.

[vfb]

Damn! My evil plot to trick you into not building Teh Black Mirror in your games that I am not in has failed. Curses, foiled again!

On a more serious note, I had a look at the item description in-game. "But the real power of the mirror can only be unlocked by an Astral mage: the ability to destroy other people's minds from any place in the world." So, that's probably why I thought it only works if an S mage wields it.

[Mardagg]

On a more serious note, I had a look at the item description in-game. "But the real power of the mirror can only be unlocked by an Astral mage: the ability to destroy other people's minds from any place in the world." So, that's probably why I thought it only works if an S mage wields it.

Lol,sure,i mean because thats what i did before asking that question.
most items can be used by commanders without spell path+the description states different=confusion.
I obviously wanted someone to give me accurate advise that did really test it and not someone just guessing,like i can do myself.

[MaxWilson]

Fortunately for those suffering personal attacks in this thread, sense of humor stacks, even if you're Quickened, unless you are also Lifeless.

-Max

[lch]

his ending comment is directly corelating to the other thread,you know.You lack all the insight info.

Ooh, burn from the crazy foreign dude.

There's another one now? Great, you really don't need me anymore. Don't ever get me started on penetration items!

[Squirrelloid]

Don't ever get me started on penetration items!

Not a proper use of a bottle of living water!

(... so that's what you use a runebreaker for...)

[Ishamoridin]

Epic thread.