Forge Of the Ancients

[GrudgeBringer]

I personally have never used the Forge of the Ancients and a couple of of us where having a discussion on its use.

We discovered that out of the 3 of us...NONE of us actually had a clue on its use, exactly what it does (the description can be interpreted a number of ways)and if you outgrow its use or would it be worth a wish.

Could someone that uses this mysterious object please enlighten us....

[thejeff]

It's not an object, it's a global, so you can't wish for it. You have to cast it.

It gives you a 50% discount on all forging and all paths your mages have by one for forging.

So, yes it's worth it. In fact, the biggest problem with it is, as with some of the other endgame globals, everyone is going to try to kill you or Dispel it.

[GameExtremist]

Step 1. Have good gem supply
Step 2. Have some Thug templates.
Step 3. Cast Forge of the Ancients.
Step 4. Make Dwarven Hammers (Forge Bonus which stacks with your bonus from FotA) for your designated item forgers.
Step 5. Enjoy making magic items for a fraction of the cost.

[Lingchih]

Step 1. Have good gem supply
Step 2. Have some Thug templates.
Step 3. Cast Forge of the Ancients.
Step 4. Make Dwarven Hammers (Forge Bonus which stacks with your bonus from FotA) for your designated item forgers.
Step 5. Enjoy making magic items for a fraction of the cost.

Step 6. Die a quick and painful death as everyone else in the game immediately attacks you.

[Frozen Lama]

not always :)

[thejeff]

Actually, I'd say:
Step 3: Make dwarven Hammers
Step 4: Cast Forge

You want to make as much as you can in the first couple turns, both to prepare for the onslaught or in case it gets dispelled.
It costs 80 with no extra gems. You'll need to save more than that before it's Dispelled for it to be worth it.

[Redeyes]

The forge works great when someone else has stuff like Burden of Time, Utterdark or Astral Nexus up - people don't quite know who to gang up on first :p

Also: it stacks with Constructions bonus sites... Right?

[Lingchih]

not always :)

Sure, If you have an ally, or allies, that are benefitting from the Forge (ie: you are making items cheaply for them), then it becomes viable. Casting it solo is kind of useless.

[Redeyes]

not always :)

Sure, If you have an ally, or allies, that are benefitting from the Forge (ie: you are making items cheaply for them), then it becomes viable. Casting it solo is kind of useless.

And then there's always the 999 gem casts, though then it only pays for itself in those tremendously large and long games...

[don_Pablo]

It's one of the best global if yours and one of the worst if not.
The 50% discount is cumulative with Dvarwen hammers giving 75%total.
5gem cost->1 gem
40gem cost->10 gem

[Fantomen]

not always :)

Sure, If you have an ally, or allies, that are benefitting from the Forge (ie: you are making items cheaply for them), then it becomes viable. Casting it solo is kind of useless.

I've found some kinds of situations where it was very viable solo.

If it makes you powerful enough to kill everyone else quickly.

When there is someone else with a massive lead and you are part of the ganging.

As MA atlantis(or some other water nation) when no one is quite ready to go underwater.

Etc... I'm sure there are countless examples of times when it is the right spell to cast.

[Baalz]

Its actually not hard at all to have it pay for itself the very first turn its up - particularly if it lets you forge some nice stuff you couldn't easily before. Set yourself up to forge 50 items the turn it goes up then it can make a lot of sense to cast solo if theres a good chance of somebody dispelling it rather than rallying everybody to attack you. You can always dispel it yourself or suicide the caster if that makes a difference. If you're crapping out phoenix rods, standards of the damned, as well as a couple rings of sorcery/wizardry and maybe an expensive artifact or two its not too hard to save a few hundred gems in one turn which can make it worthwhile to do a bit of contortion.

[RadioGibbon]

So can you stack all the way to 100% gem reduction if you have a unit that already has a 25% forge bonus?

[Redeyes]

So can you stack all the way to 100% gem reduction if you have a unit that already has a 25% forge bonus?

Yes, but the reduction caps out at 1 gem per level required to make the item (that's at most 90% required to bring a 6 path item down to 65 from 6).

Anyway, I wrote that up thread, and a cheap experiment shows that it's still true.

[chrispedersen]

I know for a fact that I have made 5 gem items for free. I haven't checked in a couple of patches, but I would be surprised if it wasn't still true.

Forge Lord, + hammer of the forge lord, + forge of the ancients + construction site should equal FREE.

[RadioGibbon]

Where those 5 gem items trinkets? They have a level of 0 required to build so if you could get a 100% forge bonus you could build them for free and still be paying the level required to make the item in gems.

[Ironhawk]

Etc... I'm sure there are countless examples of times when it is the right spell to cast.

Yeah. I would add another semi-common situation is when you are a minor nation during a war b/w major nations. They basically won't care what you do so long as you dont try and interfere.

[Maerlande]

So that would be your normal situation Ironhawk?

[militarist]

Pebble skin suit, Ruby eye.. placed each of them on my Baal's and both lost forge bonus. Not funny, getting to account that they non-removable.

[vfb]

You placed them where?

[militarist]

Sorry, my mistake. I started to create a message, but then deleted, so ignore it. I don't know how I managed to post it.

[Lingchih]

Pebble skin suit, Ruby eye.. placed each of them on my Baal's and both lost forge bonus. Not funny, getting to account that they non-removable.

Umm, that's not where you are supposed to put them.

[militarist]

Lingchih ,why? Or it's a kind of "Sophomoric humor"?

[vfb]

No. It's just that you've got to be really careful about the items you are putting on your Baals. They are quite valuable units, you know.

For example, I never place an Enormous Cauldron of Broth on my Baals.

[militarist]

Yes. This is true. I just had 2 fire baals, one of them with F3, another is F4. the F4 one is too valuabe, but for F3 I though Ruby Eye will not be a broblem. As for Pebble skin - it was a mistake. I't first time I prosuced it, so just didn't know it's unremovable.

[vfb]

I've never had that much fire on my Baals. But in any case, I prefer to have earth on my Baals (for the reinvigoration).

And you're right, once you get pebble skin on your Baals, there's no cure. It's unremovable and you're stuck with it forever. Even worse, with pebble skin, your Baals eventually transform, and afterwords you're left with a much smaller unit.

[TwoBits]

Now you're just being cruel! :p

[vfb]

Now you're just being cruel! :p

Sometimes you've just gotta grab ahold of the low-hanging fruit.

[militarist]

It seems I need an urgent anti-magic amulet for this guy!

[Lingchih]

I think (hope), you get the joke by now, militarist.

That said, if you have already equipped those items, then too late.