Cripple Fight 3- A New Gimp (Send in Pretenders!)

[Frozen Lama]

Burnsaber has asked me to admin the new installment of the cripple fight series.

The Cripple Fight games are a way of people being able to play a nation which is really lame, and not have to worry about a double bless jag army eating them up beacause the nation is lame. Feel free to try crazy strats and unlikely builds because the competition is so bad that it just might work!

This game is comprised of all the nations with zero wins recorded in the HoF, and now with the .5 wins as well. While this is certainly not a scientific way of saying which nations are crippled, its just for fun. if you think a nation is in here that isn't a cripple, sign up for it!

Ok down to business:
Mods: CBM 1.6, Endgame Diversity Mod, Single Age Complete
singleage found here: http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=34265&highlight=SingleAgeComplete - Use the second link on the page!
Map: streamlands by elmokki http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=44093&highlight=streamlands
Diplomacy- I don't really beleive in binding diplo. make NAP's at your own risk. break them at the risk of your trustworthyness towards your other neighbors.
Victory Conditions: Concession of all the other cripples! or 5/8 vp's


Nations:
EA Abysia - Trumanator
EA Atlantis - Maerlande
MA Tien Chi - squirrelloid
MA Agartha - ghoul31
MA Eriu - Valerius
LA Caelum - Kheldron
LA Arcoscephale - AgentSmith
LA Atlantis - Frozen Lama

one more note: elmokki is a great mapmaker, but he is a little sloppy with province connections sometimes, so when you test your builds, please use this map so we have a good chance of finding any bugs still hanging around

[Kheldron]

I wanted to try marverni. If it's not available I'll join as LA Caelum

[Frozen Lama]

LA Caelum it is. the nations listed are the only ones available sorry

[LordFauntleroy]

I'd like to play EA Atlantis.

[Frozen Lama]

Thank you. I was worried that no one would want that nation. You probably know this already, but i should make sure you know to take a very high dom strength on this map because of the way the water geopgraphy is

[Valerius]

Eriu, please.

[Frozen Lama]

We need an experienced tuatha player. Welcome back!

[Valerius]

Thanks! I've been wanting to try the endgame diversity mod so I'm glad you included it. Hopefully I'll make it far enough into the game to get the opportunity to try those summons.

Also, thanks for admining the game.

[Frozen Lama]

game is up!

http://www.llamaserver.net/gameinfo.cgi?game=CrippleFight

[LordFauntleroy]

Just an FYI, make both file names lowercase if you are using a case-sensitive system.

[don_Pablo]

May I join with Bogarus?

[Frozen Lama]

sorry don_pablo this game is full. and like i said, its only for nations with no wins. Micah won artifacts as bogarus

[Kheldron]

I'll need a day or two to test Caelum before start. I never played them in LA afterall and would like to give them their due :)

[Frozen Lama]

no problem. lets shoot for a start by say wednesday

[Kheldron]

btw, what about using the Mark of the Champion mod to make arena worth fighting for?
You don't speak about the settings in the op, hof, renaming etc...?

[Frozen Lama]

well its all standard. rename on, hof 15 (not standerd i guess), sites normal.

i'd rather not add a mod sorry

[Kheldron]

no problem with me.
I ran a few tests with this map and the starting locations were quite different each time, some really lucky others really bad (like I once started on 25 with only 2 provinces around capital among which a swamp!)

[Kheldron]

Hey all,
Is the game still on its way?
Also, Lama, have you had any thought about the map? As I stated it can potentially be really unbalancing and since we already play "crippled" nations...
Anyway, it's your game so it's your call :)

[Frozen Lama]

It is. i will begin harrasing people on irc about pretenders today. Get them in! :)

re: map. i actually like the map. it is the perfect size, and wraps unlike the CF2 one. all the CF games have been random starts so i don't feel any need to make special ones. plus i don't know anything about map modding. if you wanted to go put in 8 spec starts, or just make some provs nostart, go for it, but i have no idea how to do it.

[Kheldron]

And I don't either. Oh well, why bother?
Let's go and fight! :)

[Frozen Lama]

LordFaultenroy seems to have dissapeared. I emailed him and got no response and since we are waiting on just him, (trumanator is my brother and is just being lazy. it'll be in tonight.)I have asked Maerlande to sub, and he has graciously agreed. hopefully he will have the pretender done by tomorrow, and i will beat trumanator with the nag stick, and we can go. sorry about this.

[Trumanator]

Pretender In!!

[Frozen Lama]

And we are go! many thanks to Maerlande!

[Frozen Lama]

I realized yesterday that there is a problem: Atlantis's flag doesn't change from EA to LA. which could be really funny if we decided to gang up on someone, but isn't really fair. fortunatly there is an easy fix since we had the same problem in CF1.

look here, and do what it says
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showpost.php?p=687279&postcount=59

[Trumanator]

I have ROTC basically all weekend (31-32), so if it would be possible to make sure I don't stale that would be great.

[Squirrelloid]

Given a substantial number of the players, including the *host*, have been banned from Shrapnel, all requests for extensions or other admin actions will need to happen on the new forums. Diplomacy with banned participants will likely need to happen there as well (although IRC is also a possibility). The game has a new thread on the site, located here: http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?showtopic=38

Cheers

[ghoul31]

I think its ridiculous that the whole dominions 3 community is expected to move to a new forum, just to please 4 people who got banned.

[Squirrelloid]

We don't expect you to do anything. However, if you want to communicate with the *administrator of this game* or conduct diplomacy with any of the banned members, then you must use IRC or the other forum, because they cannot be communicated with on this forum. Its really that simple.

If the conditional is false for you, then the predicate is also false and you aren't expected to do anything.

I mean, seriously, do you think you can ask for an extension from the administrator of the game by posting on this forum when he can't even read this forum?

[Valerius]

Squirrell, it would be helpful if Frozen could appoint you co-admin so you could handle any requests from these forums. Not a bad idea having a backup admin anyway.

As far as diplomacy goes, I can live with using in-game messages when needed.

[ghoul31]

He could have just used a new email to get back on this forum. I don't think splitting the community into 2 forums is a good solution.

[Squirrelloid]

Valerius:
I will certainly attempt to pass administrative requests to FL if I see them, but if I should go a day without looking at these forums I don't want to be held accountable for missing a request, especially since that's a relatively common occurrence on Saturdays.

IRC is of course the best diplomacy solution, since you can negotiate in real time. You're of course welcome to try to rely on the in-game messaging system.

He could have just used a new email to get back on this forum. I don't think splitting the community into 2 forums is a good solution.

Blatantly attempting to subvert administrator punishments sounds like a bad idea. And its not like FL could, even if he wanted to, create a new account and then publicly announce 'hi, this is FL' so you'd know to message him for admin requests about this game. That would just get the new account banned.

More pragmatically, whether the forum split is a good idea or not, it happened. For the purposes of this game, since the admin is no longer welcomed on this forum, the home of this game is by necessity the other forum. He is of course also available by IRC. Gnashing teeth isn't going to change those facts.

[Quitti]

So, just happened upon this thread. Some of you guys want your convinience served by the person(s) who has(have) already given you a good alternative, ie. just going to IRC or the new forums? Unfortunately Shrapnel banning certain members of the community does not help the community as a whole, and while they can see it, they won't do anything about it, so it's about the players, that means people like FL and you to accomodate the situation the best way you can, and since Frozenlama (ie. the admin of the game) has moved this game to the other forum, maybe you should follow suit instead of complaining about your inconvinience that just has happened without you doing anything about it.

[ghoul31]

I'm not the one that screwed up. I'm not the one that got banned. So quit making me the villian.

I just don't think that dividing the dominions community into 2 forums, and warring with each other is a good idea.

[Quitti]

So, no one forces you to move over to the other forums, or force you to come to IRC, but you can't expect people to come or even want to come back here either, especially since they've been banned.

[ghoul31]

Oh look, 3 on one again. i swear evey single person that plays this game is coward.

[Squirrelloid]

Just be lucky Agartha seems to have real PD in MA. Your PD looked pretty weak, so i took a shot, especially as all your armies are far away. Why ascribe to conspiracy what is more easily explained by opportunism.

[Squirrelloid]

Looking to trade for 'small' quantities of d and f gems (~12 each). Have w and s for trade, or can forge items. Contact via PM or IRC.

[Valerius]

Hmm, I didn't expect that Frozen Lama. Actually the first time I've had someone violate a NAP. Please stand by for a response. :D

[Valerius]

Ok, since I can't edit my post above I just want to say Frozen Lama *did not* violate a NAP. Just a misclick situation that has now been cleared up. If an admin sees this please delete my previous post since I'd rather not someone come across it and think FL violated a NAP.

[Squirrelloid]

Game delayed by 48h. I suppose I'm officially taking on co-admin duties at this point, so please feel free to ask me for delays as well. (Sorry for the delay being so last minute - I thought Frozen was going to get it).

[GrudgeBringer]

Squirrel, if it will make it easier FL and I have been co-admins on many games together. If it will help, I will volunteer to help with co-admin duties on this site as I am on here 2 to 3 times a day and I think most of you know me.

It might make it a little easier as I can get a hold of FL immediately and let him know what is going on or change it myself and let him know. if you have it under control then excuse my interruption into your game.:angel

[Valerius]

Squirrelloid, thanks for both the initial delay and the extension to prevent me from staling. Unfortunately, I'm too tired to put together a proper turn right now. Could you please extend hosting by 8 more hours? My apologies to everyone for the delays.

[Squirrelloid]

Done. (Its not like FL's turn is in yet either)

[Squirrelloid]

Extended 24h because only 1 turn is in with ~6h to go.

[Squirrelloid]

My turn is only out so I get the 12h to go warnings and can make sure turns are in. In particular, it would be really bad for Eriu to stale right now. That said, I've extended it three times at 24h each this turn - at some point the game has to continue moving on. Valerius, I really can't extend hosting again unless you specifically request it.

[Valerius]

Sorry about that! I thought you needed the time and so I kept looking over my turn. Thanks for being proactive but there's no longer a need for postponments on my behalf as RL has calmed down (I should have mentioned that). Turn has been submitted.

[Squirrelloid]

Ok, Agent Smith is back... hmm... I only announced his absence on the other forum apparently. Anyway, he is, and he now has the current turn. I've extended hosting 24h to let him have enough time to look at it.

[Valerius]

Please postpone hosting by 3 hours. Thanks.

[PriestyMan]

got it

[Valerius]

Guys, just want to let you know that my turn will be in close to deadline but I'll make it - no need to postpone hosting on my account.

[Valerius]

That was a painful turn. Didn't think you were going to storm that fort yet, Squirrelloid, as illustrated by my poor placement and scripting. Really paid for that mistake. :hurt:

[Squirrelloid]

I'd say the RoS in the other battle was painful, but really, the only painful part was losing the air boosters. Everything else I lost was just eating upkeep at this point. (Although one of these days I'm actually going to get a tartarian cyclops from tart gate so i can cast AoG on turn 1... That's probably my single biggest frustration at the moment - no way to cast defensive spells immediately. Ok, i could have dropped fog warriors turn 1, but i thought i'd also need storm warriors - stupid me, should have reconsidered that looking at the Asynja on my border.)

Should I thank you for building forts for me, btw. =)

[Valerius]

I'd say the RoS in the other battle was painful, but really, the only painful part was losing the air boosters. Everything else I lost was just eating upkeep at this point.

I certainly agree with that; it hurt a *lot* more to lose 300 gems worth of summons and gear. And though it's a small loss in comparison, I'm still irritated that I forgot to script returning the previous turn on the mage I teleported in to protect against mind hunts and lost two S boosters. I can pretty much be counted on to do that once per game. :mad:

(Although one of these days I'm actually going to get a tartarian cyclops from tart gate so i can cast AoG on turn 1... That's probably my single biggest frustration at the moment - no way to cast defensive spells immediately.

I've noticed that. You didn't want to try summoning a cyclops? I don't find them very appealing SCs but they're good E spellcasters.

Should I thank you for building forts for me, btw. =)

You most certainly should! It's not every opponent that would demonstrate such courtesy and sense of fair play.

[Squirrelloid]

Do you know how hard it is for me to cast an E6 spell? (Ugg)

[Squirrelloid]

Delayed yet more. Sorry, this is the complicated game I'm in that I have admin control over, so its the one that gets delayed when i don't have time to do them all.

[Agent Smith]

You're also one of the most viable nations left in the game, so if your turn doesn't get in, it kind of kills the game anyway.

[Squirrelloid]

Helped some friends move this weekend, and have had very little brain, so sorry for delaying again.

[Squirrelloid]

Ugg, I meant to get to it tonight. Tomorrow, I swear. This week has been simply impossible to spend that much time on one turn.

[ghoul31]

Valerius hasn't sent in his turn either. Is he still playing?

[Squirrelloid]

Valerius hasn't sent in his turn either. Is he still playing?

Valerius always waits until the last minute!

Ok, really hoping to finish this tonight, but i have to unexpectedly dedicate my internet and time to something for work for an indeterminate period of time, so my plans may get squashed if there are any problems with that which need troubleshooting. I'll post if its getting extended again.

On the bright side, after tomorrow my schedule is a lot more flexible, and thus there shouldn't be any more substantial hold ups.

[Squirrelloid]

I officially suck, and this'll have to happen tomorrow.

[Valerius]

Valerius always waits until the last minute!

Only in late game situations when the micro overcomes the fun of playing! But the way things are shaping up I think you'll be able to help me considerably reduce the number of units I've got to manage - which should speed up my turns nicely. ;)

[Agent Smith]

Ok, I am leaving for the Navy in 20 days, how am I supposed to win this game within that time if I don't get a turn soon :)
But in all seriousness, I can't continue 20 days from now.

[Valerius]

Ah, excellent. The old "forge more items than you have lab spots for" move - another one I can be counted on to do once per game.

Ok, I am leaving for the Navy in 20 days, how am I supposed to win this game within that time if I don't get a turn soon :)
But in all seriousness, I can't continue 20 days from now.

I'll get my turns in quicker and with Squirrelloid's schedule getting easier at the end of the week we can try to get back on a 48 hour schedule. I think this game is moving towards its conclusion anyway so maybe it will be over by the time you have to leave.

[Squirrelloid]

We're losing you to the navy, Agent? =(

Fortunately, your position shouldn't be too hard to sub into if it comes to that, so we should be able to find one.

I'll try not to delay the game too much in the next 20 days.

[ghoul31]

Ok, this game is over. Atlantis and arco refused to help me me fight Tien chi. I guess they wanted him to win for some reason. So now he has won.

Congratulations to squirrelloid

[PriestyMan]

Bahaha! you took all my provs but 2 and then expect me to *help* you? for the last 20 turns my only intention has been to make sure you lose. the same goes for my friend arco. you'd have been better off trying to kill us quicker.

and your ruining all my fun by giving up. i was all set to declare TC the winner and then listen to you moan about how you never got to fight him and it wasn't over etc etc...

oh well. :(

good job squirrell. i'll post more tonight

[Squirrelloid]

well, you know, having your economy totally collapse can lead to surrender =).

tbh, Eriu should have attacked Agartha while i spent forever finishing Abysia. Valerius, you can't take crap scales like that, overtax and patrol like mad, and then turtle! (Although i confess, the totally castled territory is with only 2 borders to me is somewhat daunting. But I can has plan! On the other hand, i was not feeling much pressure to be quick about it since your economy was killing you all on its own.)

Anyway, if anyone wants to keep playing (hey Valerius, sound off!) I'm happy to keep going.

[Valerius]

Yes, please end it! What a disaster. :hurt: First off, I want to say I think everyone did a good job fighting it out until the end. Credit goes to Maerlande for being a good sport about me poaching his provinces when he was already on the ropes. Unfortunately, that was about the only effective thing I did all game.

Squirrelloid is of course right that there was no sense to my turtling. My not taking a side in the Agartha vs. the world fight meant that when I finally woke up and realized, "hey, TC's about to win" there was nobody around to ally with against him. The only defense I can make is that sometimes when I see a well fought match I hesitate to dogpile one side or the other. Not always, obviously, since I did so against LA Atlantis in CF 2 (and it paid off nicely). But I did here. Really, I kind of feel I should apologize for the game I played here.

Squirrelloid, I don't know if I mentioned it earlier but I was very impressed with the strategic game you played in CF 2. The only mistake I thought you made was declaring war on me before finishing off Aby and fortifying his territories. You made no mistakes this game and congratulations on a well-earned victory!

Random thoughts: I thought the grendelkin in this version of the EDM were borderline OP and of course planned to summon many of them. Early on I found an Ench. 30 site and thought I was in good shape. Unfortunately, my core territories had a water income of 3 so that plan went out the window. My D income in those territories was 2 so I wasn't going to be mass-producing tarts, either. S income was 6 - not horrible but not great either. Of course an obvious solution to this would have been to, you know, conquer someone. :rolleyes:

BTW Squirrelloid, did you have a Conj. bonus site in 77?

[Squirrelloid]

No bonus sites for me. 77 was just a convenient territory to not have a temple (so those rampaging tarts couldn't destroy one), since i didn't plan to ever build a fort there because my capital wanted the resources.

I'm not convinced the grendelkin is OP. Without magic it simply has too many vulnerabilities to cover with gear to really be OP. Sure, it'll mess up another SC or a thug pretty badly, but an army or even a small hit squad targetting its weakness(es) should just destroy it. But its stats have to be kind of over-the-top to make up for its lack of magic. So its basically an anti-SC SC. I for one had 5 or 6 of them and was unwilling to use them on their own in most capacities.

I like the versions of many of the EDM summons we're using better than the current EDM versions. The cyclopes are vastly more useful in this incarnation, as are the kraken.

I don't know who has nature gems free for the nature ones ever though, so never got around to summoning those.

And yes Agartha, those were my tidal waves and plagues you were getting bombarded by. It was no longer worth trying to kill off Eriu's people, and i figured i'd have to destroy you eventually. Since it looked like I was playing a long economy game, i decided to make my economic advantage more decisive.

[Agent Smith]

Even though was pretty well dead through most of this game, I have to say it was a really fun one.
Congratulations to Squirrelloid :)
In regards to Agartha, Ghoul31, it is not the case that I specifically wanted to make this game hell for you, but the simple matter of fact that we had been at war for a good 30-40 turns. Would you expect me to suddenly trust the very nation who had me pretty well locked up into 4 provinces? I have been betrayed in this game before, so it wouldn't be that far of a stretch for you to wait untill I wasted my forces on Tien chi and then swoop in for my few provinces.
I am a little dissapointed in the lack of uber killing on the part of Eriu, but what can I do?
Thank you all, I hope I see you all in a game sometime in the future if I can get the chance :)

[Squirrelloid]

Ok, i'm going to end the game. Thanks everyone for playing, it was fun.

I know, there was no real climactic battle for me. But it was entertaining watching all the shadow-thrusts and maneuvering. A good general knows when to refuse battle, so dancing armies with Valerius was at least as much fun as actually getting to fight the battle.