View Full Version : Trinity - Newbie game - Finished - Avari/Ulm wins!
Valerius
September 17th, 2010, 05:54 PM
Due to popular demand, I'm starting up a third newbie game! Looking for players with 0-3 games experience for a friendly intro to Dominions MP, using standard mods and settings.
I wrote up an intro to Dominions MP (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=46314) and you may also be interested in some of the conversation from the Boot Camp thread (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=46238).
Settings
Age: MA
Players: 8
Banned nations: water nations and Ashdod
Hosting: llamaserver (http://www.llamaserver.net/) - llamaserver FAQ is here (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=35160)
Hosting interval: 24 hours up to turn 20, 48 hours up to turn 40, 72 hours from then on
Mods: CBM 1.6 (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=43949) and EDM 1.1 (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=45056)
Map: Parganos (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=39857) (dead seas version - this means you can conquer sea provinces but they will not provide gold/gem income)
Hall of Fame: 15
All other settings default
Note: Apparently PM's are turned off by default when you create your forum account. You'll want them on as this is a much quicker way to conduct diplomacy than the in-game message system.
Player Roster
Abysia - puntocom - UTC +1
Bandar Log - Marmaduke - UTC +2
C'tis - Drog the Destroyer - UTC +2
Caelum - iRFNA - UTC -6
Ulm - Avari - UTC +2
Jotunheim - Hylobius - UTC -5
Pangaea - Drog the Destroyer - UTC +2 (previously CarlixTomix)
Shinuyama - Ragnoff - UTC -5
Hylobius
September 17th, 2010, 07:22 PM
I'll take Jotunheim please. Thanks for doing this Valerius.
puntocom
September 17th, 2010, 07:37 PM
Hi!
I'm interested in this game, and i have a friend who is interested too, but he is registering in the forum now.
His name is CarlixTomix and he will with Pangea.
I will play with Abysia.
Bye.
Ragnoff
September 17th, 2010, 10:13 PM
I just got the game this week, I would love to try Fomoria for my First game if I may
iRFNA
September 17th, 2010, 10:15 PM
I just got the game this week, I would love to try Fomoria for my First game if I may
Fomoria is EA :(
This game is set for MA, although I really don't care what age it is. You'll need an EA or all ages game to play fomoria.
Valerius
September 17th, 2010, 10:20 PM
Hylobius, puntocom and CarlixTomix, you are all signed up.
Ragnoff, is there a middle age nation you'd be interested in?
Ragnoff
September 17th, 2010, 10:22 PM
Yes, but I don't know what it is yet!
I will figure something out tonight
Valerius
September 17th, 2010, 10:24 PM
Ok, I'll reserve a spot for you, nation TBD.
Ragnoff
September 17th, 2010, 10:52 PM
I will take Shinuyama please
Marmaduke
September 18th, 2010, 07:22 AM
Hello, I would like to play Bandar Log!
Drog the Destroyer
September 18th, 2010, 08:58 AM
I'd like to join. I'll take C'tis.
Nightfall
September 18th, 2010, 08:58 AM
Hi all,
If you still have a spot open, I'd love to give Pythium a go.
Valerius
September 18th, 2010, 01:51 PM
Marmaduke, Drog the Destroyer you are both signed up. Nightfall, sorry but I'm afraid Drog posted a few seconds before you.
I'll setup the game on the llamaserver soon.
Nightfall
September 18th, 2010, 06:12 PM
:doh:
No problem.
Valerius
September 19th, 2010, 01:03 PM
Ok, the game is setup on the llamaserver and ready for pretenders.
Avari
September 19th, 2010, 01:53 PM
Pretender sent. As you can see from the roster, I'll be the one playing Ulm. Hello & good luck everyone!
Drog the Destroyer
September 19th, 2010, 02:19 PM
Pretender sent, this should be exciting - it's my first MP game.
Good luck everybody and a special thanks to Valerius for taking the time and effort to arrange this.
Ragnoff
September 19th, 2010, 02:27 PM
Pretender sent, Shinu here, may first multiplayer too!
Is there any way to get this map to take a look at (I know we have a non adjusted one, i would like the adjusted one),
The link on lamiaserver goes to a seemingly unrelated post.
iRFNA
September 19th, 2010, 02:43 PM
Alright, I'm in. Ragnoff, try this post (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=39857).
Hylobius
September 19th, 2010, 03:39 PM
Jotunheim pretender sent. It's my first MP as well.
puntocom
September 19th, 2010, 06:08 PM
Hello!
I sent my pretender, and my friend is doing it now!
Bye
Valerius
September 19th, 2010, 07:06 PM
Wow, you guys are quick! Already 7/8 pretenders in.
I turned off the autostart feature to avoid a mishap like we had in First Blood, where a pretender was submitted by someone who didn't sign up for the game. CarlixTomix, let me know when your pretender is in and I'll start the game.
Ragnoff
September 19th, 2010, 08:36 PM
woot, all 8 signed up!
Valerius
September 19th, 2010, 08:52 PM
Ok, the game has begun! Have fun!
Puntocom, I don't see CarlixTomix on the list of forum members. Is he still waiting for his account to be approved? It would make diplomacy easier if everyone had a forum account so I just want to confirm that he will set one up.
And everyone please make sure that PMs are turned on (they are off by default when you create your account).
iRFNA
September 19th, 2010, 08:54 PM
That's a lot of titles you've got on your pretender, c'tis.
You bastard.
Hylobius
September 19th, 2010, 09:28 PM
Caelum worships the pretender Sarah Palin, Lady of Chaos, Patron of Liars, Queen of Insects.
Half a mouthful of beer just came up my nose :D
Ragnoff
September 19th, 2010, 10:17 PM
I had to read that 3 times to be sure of what I was seeing!
Ragnoff
September 19th, 2010, 10:36 PM
Are the province names virtually unreadable to anyone else? For me there are the same color as the map. Is it a setting I need to change?
iRFNA
September 19th, 2010, 10:50 PM
I think it's the map file itself that determines that color? You can at least read the names up top if you select them...
And what's with the crowns? I found 5, do we gotta catch em all or something?
Valerius
September 19th, 2010, 11:16 PM
Are the province names virtually unreadable to anyone else? For me there are the same color as the map. Is it a setting I need to change?
I think it's the map file itself that determines that color? You can at least read the names up top if you select them...
You know, that's a good question. I never play with province names on so I hadn't really considered that. I don't think the .map file specifies that (hopefully not since this map file with fixed starts is only on the llamaserver).
And what's with the crowns? I found 5, do we gotta catch em all or something?
Those you can ignore. I think it indicates victory points, even though we're not using them.
puntocom
September 20th, 2010, 06:41 AM
Hello,
sorry for the waiting, my friend has a little problem with the e-mail.
Now i'm going to the university, and after we will send the turns.
Sorry about that.
Bye
Ragnoff
September 20th, 2010, 08:10 AM
So active, so restless, these pretenders without enough faith in their servants that they are stirring already! Only 2 had faith, only 2 allow their servants time to properly prepare for their arrival....
Marmaduke
September 20th, 2010, 08:18 AM
I will be away from my computer from Friday to Sunday evening. I think I will be able to play a turn on Friday before evening (in Europe), and then the next possible time will be late on Sunday.
Is it possible to skip the turn on Saturday? Otherwise I would be looking for a temporary sub (MA Bandar Log). Otherwise I would stale.
Drog the Destroyer
September 20th, 2010, 01:55 PM
Caelum worships the pretender Sarah Palin, Lady of Chaos, Patron of Liars, Queen of Insects.
Half a mouthful of beer just came up my nose :D
Heh, you should see the ingame message I got, i'm sure using satire as a weapon is against some kind of convention ;)
CarlixTomix
September 20th, 2010, 02:05 PM
I had problems with the forum account and it's activaction.
I'm sincerely sorry because of my delay.
Now everything is ok.
I will send the second turn in a few hours.
Thank you very much.
Valerius
September 20th, 2010, 02:28 PM
Welcome, CarlixTomix!
Marmaduke, I think it makes sense to put the game on hold Saturday rather than look for a one turn sub. Please let me know when you are leaving on Friday and I'll postpone the next hosting until Sunday (say, 23:00 GMT?).
Marmaduke
September 20th, 2010, 02:43 PM
Thanks Valerius, I will PM you on Friday then.
Ragnoff
September 20th, 2010, 05:41 PM
I found it quite humorous that at about 530 Eastern on Monday five or six of the eight players were hanging out online in the Shrapnel forums and a bunch of us had just recently submitted our turns. We are sitting about hoping that Ulm happens to login and submit so that we can do another set of turns!
You think most of us are excited about being in a multiplayer game?
iRFNA
September 20th, 2010, 05:59 PM
I desperately want to refudiate any claims of misunderestimating my Shakespearean prose.
Valerius
September 20th, 2010, 07:19 PM
You think most of us are excited about being in a multiplayer game?
That's great to see! Newbie games really are among the most fun.
I've mentioned this a bunch of times recently so I may be repeating myself but just a reminder that if you are the last person to send in your turn (check the llamaserver to determine this), wait a few minutes for the game to host and then immediately complete your next turn (since turns only take a few minutes to complete). This really helps keep the game moving early on (especially when you consider that people are in different time zones) and that gets everyone into the game. :)
Hylobius
September 20th, 2010, 07:51 PM
It is nice to have an enthusiastic bunch and have the game move along quickly. I'm already seeing dark candles on the horizon.
Avari
September 21st, 2010, 10:21 AM
...sitting about hoping that Ulm happens to login and submit...
Uh-oh, looks like I kept you all waiting in vain for a while. It seems that I went to bed only moments before the hosting, and by the time I read the above, I was out for the very long day and all I could do was stare in frustration at the turn file in my inbox. Rest assured that the trip home in rush hour traffic was spent in contemplation of my worthy adversaries waking up and exclaiming in disbelief, "wtf STILL no turn??" ;)
-The Ulm
Ragnoff
September 21st, 2010, 10:30 AM
LOL do realize I was ribbing you! we are scattered all over so no one can reasonably assume anyone else will post at any minute, or even that they are awake!
I am sharing your frustration as it will likely be hours before i can open the turn to see what happened, let alone record my next one....
CarlixTomix
September 21st, 2010, 06:13 PM
Please, help...
I don't know how , but... the menu of the commanders in the current province (in the left side of the screen) isn't there...
I can't give orders to my commanders. T.T
How can I solve this?
Thank you very much, and I'm sorry because of my noob question. ^^U
iRFNA
September 21st, 2010, 06:29 PM
That's weird.. Try saving, closing dom, and restarting?..
Ragnoff
September 21st, 2010, 06:44 PM
the lower case "h" button shows/hides the right side menu
CarlixTomix
September 21st, 2010, 06:44 PM
Well... restarting the game it became normal again.
It was weird. ^^U
iRFNA
September 21st, 2010, 10:40 PM
oh abysia, pulling an ulm on us
Marmaduke
September 22nd, 2010, 03:41 AM
Caelum delivers fine Parganian literature, very fun to read.
Ragnoff
September 22nd, 2010, 09:32 PM
I am wondering what time zone folks are in. I am on the East Cost of the US in eastern standard, based on when some things have happened a think there are a few others who are nearby time-wise, but there is another group that I would assume are not in North America...
It might be interesting to know if someone did not answer a last minute diplo request not because they were preparing to attack you, but just because it is the middle of the night where they are!
So where are we all? (if you want to post I will update the list below...)
Abysia - puntocom ?
Bandar Log - Marmaduke ?
C'tis - Drog the Destroyer ?
Caelum - iRFNA ?
Ulm - Avari ?
Jotunheim - Hylobius ?
Pangaea - CarlixTomix ?
Shinuyama - Ragnoff - Eastern Time (US & Canada), UTC - 5:00
iRFNA
September 22nd, 2010, 09:53 PM
Central for me, just like alaska.
Drog the Destroyer
September 23rd, 2010, 12:48 AM
Central european time for me. So UTC+1, until the 31st of october we have DST so its really UTS+2.
(yes I woke early today)
Avari
September 23rd, 2010, 03:29 AM
UTC+2 for me.
Marmaduke
September 23rd, 2010, 05:29 AM
My surrender monkeys of Bandar Log (they managed to win a battle but not conquer an indie province because they all fled back to the capital) are managed at UTC+2 until 31st oct, then UTC+1.
Ragnoff
September 23rd, 2010, 06:53 AM
Apparently we cannot edit a previous post, odd. OK updated so far:
Bandar Log - Marmaduke - UTC +2
C'tis - Drog the Destroyer - UTC +2
Ulm - Avari, UTC +2
Shinuyama - Ragnoff, UTC -5
Caelum - iRFNA, UTC -6
Jotunheim - Hylobius ?
Pangaea - CarlixTomix ?
Abysia - puntocom ?
Hylobius
September 23rd, 2010, 08:46 AM
Eastern time (Canada).
Drog the Destroyer
September 23rd, 2010, 10:44 AM
Apparently we cannot edit a previous post, odd.
You can only edit the first post of a thread on this forum. (unless you are an admin I guess)
Ragnoff
September 23rd, 2010, 10:55 AM
PM for you Drog
Drog the Destroyer
September 23rd, 2010, 12:02 PM
Heh, the first few turns was very entertaining with all the second guessing and such. But now it really starts to get interesting. I'm enjoying this a lot so far.
Drog the Destroyer
September 23rd, 2010, 12:10 PM
Apparently we cannot edit a previous post, odd.
You can only edit the first post of a thread on this forum. (unless you are an admin I guess)
I forgot something, the above is only valid some time after a post has been submitted, ½ an hour I think. Until then you can edit it freely.
Ragnoff
September 24th, 2010, 07:56 AM
updated list of time zones: (note, because they mentioned being friends I assume that CarlixTomix and puntocom are in the same time zone, but we don't yet know which one!)
Bandar Log - Marmaduke - UTC +2
C'tis - Drog the Destroyer - UTC +2
Ulm - Avari, UTC +2
Shinuyama - Ragnoff, UTC -5
Jotunheim - Hylobius, , UTC -5
Caelum - iRFNA, UTC -6
Pangaea - CarlixTomix ?
Abysia - puntocom ?
puntocom
September 24th, 2010, 08:21 AM
Hi,
we are in Spain, with Central European Standard Time , GMT+1.
puntocom
September 24th, 2010, 08:22 AM
error
Ragnoff
September 24th, 2010, 09:26 AM
Bandar Log - Marmaduke - UTC +2
C'tis - Drog the Destroyer - UTC +2
Ulm - Avari, UTC +2
Pangaea - CarlixTomix, UTC +1
Abysia - puntocom, UTC +1
Shinuyama - Ragnoff, UTC -5
Jotunheim - Hylobius, , UTC -5
Caelum - iRFNA, UTC -6
Ok, so the European time zone folks outnumber those of us from across the pond!
Valerius, any chance of adding our UTC numbers to the initial post? makes it a bit quicker then remembering to hunt for page 7 later on.
Valerius
September 25th, 2010, 03:41 AM
Sorry for the delay; time zones have now been added to the player roster.
Also, as per Marmaduke's request I postponed hosting to give him time to complete his turn late Sunday.
Marmaduke
September 26th, 2010, 04:53 PM
Thanks Valerius, I'm back now.
Drog the Destroyer
September 29th, 2010, 10:43 AM
This thread needs a bump, so I guess I'll give away some intelligence for free. So far I have cast 22 site searching spells, net result: My monthly gem income has increased by 1! *Shakes fist in Caelums general direction*
Marmaduke
September 29th, 2010, 12:04 PM
Wow, that is a really bad ratio. Hopefully you will have more luck later on.
iRFNA
September 29th, 2010, 01:20 PM
The key is offshore drilling and stripmining national parks.
Ragnoff
September 29th, 2010, 01:42 PM
Drog, perhaps you should look in a different zone? Once you check that one the first time, that is likely to be all there was....
:D
Drog the Destroyer
September 29th, 2010, 05:36 PM
Drog, perhaps you should look in a different zone? Once you check that one the first time, that is likely to be all there was....
:D
Nahh if I continue searching my capital somethings bound to show up:rolleyes:
Stripmining does seem rather succesful for Caelum, som maybe I should add that to my endeavors
Marmaduke
September 29th, 2010, 07:15 PM
"Keep digging, I tell you there is oil under the castle!"
iRFNA
October 2nd, 2010, 12:08 AM
Hey C'tis, how's the hopey-changey thing workin' out for ya?
Drog the Destroyer
October 2nd, 2010, 04:18 AM
Hey C'tis, how's the hopey-changey thing workin' out for ya?
Obviously it takes a lot of hard work to recover from the mess the previous Pantokrator left - but we can find gems, yes we can!
CarlixTomix
October 6th, 2010, 06:30 PM
"Hosting interval: 24 hours up to turn 20, 48 hours up to turn 40, 72 hours from then on"
What about it?
And... I think the turns should be of 48 hours since 18th turn, or before.
I lost a turn, because at night I had no time to think what to do, and this afternoon I can't: I had university.
Later, at 8:34, the 20th turn ignored me (20th turn should be of 48 hours, how it's said in the first post).
Well, I supose I will continue playing, in spite of that horrible 20th turn.
Valerius
October 6th, 2010, 07:07 PM
#$%*! Sorry, changing the hosting interval now. I remember last time I checked it was turn 18 but I forgot to change it two turns later.
I had it at 24 hour hosting until turn 20 because that's probably the most common setting. Obviously extra time can be useful if you get involved in a war but otherwise turns don't take much time early on.
But I should also mention that regardless of the current hosting interval sometimes real life interferes and you need extra time. If that happens we can postpone hosting.
Again, sorry for not changing hosting on time and thanks for continuing to play.
Marmaduke
October 14th, 2010, 12:22 PM
To all lesser beings of Parganos,
Let it be known that Marmaduke, He Who Eats Bananas In The Dark Of Night, Bird God of Bandar Log, Friend of All, has ascended to another state of consciousness. Freed from the cycle of reincarnation, Marmaduke has found a way to escape the burdensome duties of kingship.
Until the end of time*, Bandar Log's elite government will reign over the holiest of seas, dispensing enlightenment and military advice to wisdom-seekers.
Embrace the Truth.
Gladd Yogg, Emperor of Andoria, Progenitor or the future sea chimp civilization, Official Spokesichtyid For All Things Monkey, Secretary of State of Bandar Log
* Statement not contractual.
Hylobius
October 14th, 2010, 10:15 PM
Thanks for playing Marmaduke, see you in another game.
Valerius
October 15th, 2010, 01:52 AM
Marmaduke, hope you enjoyed the game and nice job playing to the end!
Marmaduke
October 15th, 2010, 03:27 AM
I'm not sure what you're talking about. Marmaduke might have ascended to another plane of existence, but Gladd Yogg and the sea kingdom of Andoria remain a force to be reckoned with!
Payback time has never been so close, Ulm! (*)
(*) Again, not contractual.
Avari
October 15th, 2010, 07:03 AM
I'm sure Gladd Yogg and The Sea Monkeys will remain a thorn on the side of Ulm for all eternity. Children of Ulmish fishermen will be taught the abyssal horrors of Gladd Yogg for generations to come.
Should Gladd Yogg for some reason not succeed in the complete annihilation of Ulm though, I would like to thank you for the spirited fight. It's too bad our diplomats could not agree on the whole ancestral lands issue.
Hylobius
October 16th, 2010, 09:16 AM
Pan just attacked me without breaking our NAP-3. I have few defences in that end of my empire as I had NAPs with all of my neighbors. You might want to consider temporarily postponing other hostilities before Pan over runs the north-east corner.
CarlixTomix
October 17th, 2010, 06:56 PM
I'm not very well informed of the diplomacy, and how do the NAP work, but on September 28th I received a PM that talked about a NAP-3.
I accepted the NAP.
In the turn 26, a lot of turns later, I attacked him. This attack's cause was that I needed to have my fortress secure, and to have two nations so close of my fortress was very dangerous.
Was this attack a bad attack? Was it non legal?
Please, inform me.
Valerius
October 17th, 2010, 07:04 PM
Uh, a NAP 3 means that you are at peace until you end the NAP and at that point there are three turns to prepare. So, yes, that was a NAP violation. See the link in the first post for some info on NAPs that I wrote up.
CarlixTomix
October 17th, 2010, 07:19 PM
Oh my...
I was wrong. I believed that "NAP-3" means "Non agression pact for 3 turns".
It means "Non agression pact forever or until some of the two nations broke it, then the nations may wait 3 turns to attack". Am I wrong again?
Sorry, what can I do to be forgiven?
Thanks.
Valerius
October 17th, 2010, 08:17 PM
If it was a misunderstanding that makes things tough. It looks like you did want to attack him but didn't want to break an agreement in the process. Since the war is already started I'm not sure if there's much to be done about it. Maybe PM Hylobius and you two can see where things stand? Let me know if you want me to delay hosting.
PS - Just to be clear a NAP 3 means the two nations are at peace until one of them ends the NAP. At that point they both have three turns to prepare (unless they both decide they'd like to start fighting sooner).
Hylobius
October 18th, 2010, 12:38 AM
I am glad to hear that it was a misunderstanding. Strictly speaking you did not break the rules as diplomacy is not binding in this game. It is more like a broken promise. I'm not sure what to suggest. By taking those three provinces, one of which had a fort one turn from completion, you have penetrated to within two of my largely undefended capital.
CarlixTomix
October 18th, 2010, 04:46 AM
I won't put defenses in that provinces, and don't worry I will say to my army to move back. I'm not sure if I can't do anything more to excuse me.
puntocom
October 22nd, 2010, 06:34 AM
Hello,
Valerius, could you put me in AI?
Thanks.
Valerius
October 23rd, 2010, 06:19 AM
Hello,
Valerius, could you put me in AI?
Thanks.
I can do that if you'd like. You can also give the order yourself (in the game go to Options --> Become computer controlled).
Before we do that, can you make a last stand or is there so little left that it doesn't matter going AI?
puntocom
October 23rd, 2010, 03:34 PM
Hello,
i'm going to the AI this turn, i haven't got posibilities.
Thanks for the game.
Drog the Destroyer
October 23rd, 2010, 04:56 PM
Thanks for playing Puntocom
Hylobius
October 23rd, 2010, 05:45 PM
Thanks Puntocom.
Marmaduke
October 23rd, 2010, 07:57 PM
Hiya, I had a lot of fun with the game diplomacy. I have put some of the messages I was able to save in a blog post here (http://www.alphaeridani.com/2010/10/trinity-rise-and-fall-of-monkey-phoenix.html).
If anybody minds me publishing these game-related PMs, please tell me.
Good luck to the survivors... Who is winning at the moment?
Valerius
October 23rd, 2010, 08:47 PM
Thanks for playing, puntocom. Marmaduke & correspondents, that was a funny AAR! :)
Hylobius
October 23rd, 2010, 09:31 PM
Thanks for documenting the history of Bandar Log.
I had a scout in one of the provinces just south of the Ulm capital when the two of you fought what seemed to be the pivitol battle. It was epic, I had to watch it several times.
Wars are raging in Trinity and it is still much too early to know who will be the victor.
Avari
October 24th, 2010, 03:15 AM
Thanks for putting those up Marmaduke, I also had a lot of fun with the messages :D
The battle you saw, Hylobius, was indeed quite pivotal. Perhaps most importantly it restored my confidence after Marmaduke had conquered most of my provinces. I have to say that being rushed by an elephant nation was my worst fear and having it realized was not very inspiring. However I also have to say that I had been preparing for just that eventuality from turn 1 :) Because of that I had Blade Wind very early in the war. As implied in the blog post, that proved to be my salvation in the big battle and much help throughout the war.
CarlixTomix
October 24th, 2010, 05:09 AM
Hi.
This night I have sleeped in one of my friends' house.
I'm not able to send my turn with my computer. If your could postpone the turn one day more... it would be fantastic.But there is no time... I'm going to try something stupid to send me turn.
Valerius
October 24th, 2010, 05:15 AM
No, you're ok. I'll postpone hosting right now.
Edit: Hosting postponed until 10:10 GMT Monday.
Drog the Destroyer
October 30th, 2010, 03:57 AM
Alas, the war against Shinuyama is going a teensy bit different than planned....
At least I can still aim for a glorious death!
iRFNA
November 1st, 2010, 09:11 PM
You're going to have to work for your meal, pangaea!
Valerius
November 1st, 2010, 11:08 PM
I just checked the server and Pangaea isn't listed as one of the nations. Could one of you please confirm that Pan has been set AI (Statistics --> Pretenders of the world)? If so, that was very inconsiderate of CarlixTomix.
Having one of the main nations in the game go AI is very unbalancing. If we keep playing with Pan under computer control it basically provides easy provinces for any neighboring nations. OTOH, in order to reverse the AI command we'd have to roll back two turns, which also has obvious drawbacks.
iRFNA
November 2nd, 2010, 01:43 AM
Ya, it says AI ingame. Not sure why he went AI, as he's in the lead in multiple categories and has been slowly but surely tearing me to pieces...
Avari
November 2nd, 2010, 05:04 AM
Now this is.. extremely disappointing, to say the least. I'm sure he had a good reason to stop playing, but he should definitely have said something before simply going AI! Having Pan as AI would indeed be extremely unbalancing at this time.
I'm one of Pan's neighbours so I would in theory be set to gain much. However I feel very strongly that we should roll back as much as needed and then find a sub for Pangaea. As long as there is no threat to game stability (?) I think that would be best. Even if it would be a major inconvenience and change some events.
What does everyone else think? I propose that we postpone hosting if necessary until this has been resolved.
Ragnoff
November 2nd, 2010, 10:20 AM
I think a sub needs to be found. I am not certain about a roll back, the last several turns have been significant in the Shinuyama-C'Tis war. I supposed if C'tis is willing to replay it I am but I know he surprised me and anded me some setbacks I may be able to avoid if they are redone (of course he has also learned and could hand me worse ones too).
Ragnoff
Hylobius
November 2nd, 2010, 11:10 AM
Wow, how very rude!
We certainly need a sub. I don't understand the mechanics of a roll-back so I don't have a comment on that.
Avari
November 2nd, 2010, 11:34 AM
As far as I understand, the command to go AI cannot be reversed. Thus it would be necessary to rollback to a previous turn, where the nation in question is still under human control. However I'm not sure why a two-turn rollback would be needed, as I think Pan went AI this last turn. In any case getting a sub to play Pan would only be possible via a rollback. I think there might also be additional problems if Pan had set a password, I don't know if it's possible to check that before deciding. (I may be wrong on all this but this is my understanding)
I'm also not entirely sure of the details of a rollback, but I'm sure Valerius can enlighten us, if it is decided that a rollback is preferable to having an AI Pan. A rollback would entail very little in-game hassle to me, as I'm not currently engaged in any real conflict. The situation is of course different for those who are in a decisive war action (Shinuyama and C'tis at least). My preference for a rollback stems mainly from the fact that I would possibly be getting a big advantage which I feel is unfair. (Of course it's also possible that AI Pan would kick my behind :P )
Drog the Destroyer
November 2nd, 2010, 11:59 AM
Well the situation for C'tis is pretty straightforward, I may have bloodied Shinuyama quite heavily the last few turns - but it has cost me almost all the troops I have left. The war was decided early when Shinuyama won a couple of major victories. All that is left is sticking it out and being as big a pain in the b*** as possible.
This also opens up an option - C'tis wont last long. And I've really enjoyed playing with all the people that are left in the game. So instead of joining a new game, perhaps I could take over Pangea? Even if it's Manead micromanagement hell, I would really hate to see this game go haywire.
Valerius
November 2nd, 2010, 12:39 PM
Now this is.. extremely disappointing, to say the least. I'm sure he had a good reason to stop playing, but he should definitely have said something before simply going AI!
Yes, exactly. I'm not one to give someone a hard time if real life circumstances change and they don't have time for the game or even just lose interest - but if you are a major power at least show the other players some consideration and let them know they need to find a sub.
Anyway, it looks like everyone supports finding a sub for Pan so I am going to roll back one turn (Avari is correct that the command cannot be reversed). BTW, I was mistaken about needing to roll back two turns - I was thinking in terms of a player being eliminated, not one going AI. We may well only have to roll back one turn. And if that's the case then we can re-host using the same turns everyone already submitted last turn - the only change would be sending Pan's turn without AI orders.
Just to be clear: when I roll back you will be sent a turn file from the llamaserver - please ignore it. There won't be any need to complete your turn again.
Also, how about Drog taking over Pan's position and we set C'tis AI? This seems like a good solution.
Hylobius
November 2nd, 2010, 01:06 PM
Drog is to be commended for his willingness to fight to the last man, err.. lizard, instead of dropping when he lost a big battle. I'd be happy to see him pick up Pan.
iRFNA
November 2nd, 2010, 01:36 PM
Yes, drog is the lord of last stands in cbm_retold.
Ragnoff
November 2nd, 2010, 01:50 PM
Honestly I think an AI pan would give you such an advantage as ULM that we either group to oppose you or concede. Mostly I say this because C'Tis and bander before him have played VERY well, taught me a lot by the ideas and rearguard actions they fought (and I paid for those lessons in troops, mages and position) that I will be a number of turns getting reorganized if/when I defeat C;tis, which as well as he has played could still be a while.
The fact that all three opponents who are defeated or close to it fought till the end until there was nothing left to fight with was great! And the level of sportsmanship is well above what I have read happen in some other games, truly a great first MP game so far.
Now as a newbie game I want to state this has been a great experience whatever happens next. If a rollback is needed to continue I am fine with that.
Ragnoff
November 2nd, 2010, 01:53 PM
If Drog wants to that would be great, he has been one of the reasons this was a great learning game for me and a very honorable opponent.
Avari
November 2nd, 2010, 02:11 PM
I have no objection whatsoever to Drog switching to Pangaea. I think it is an excellent idea.
Valerius
November 2nd, 2010, 02:16 PM
The fact that all three opponents who are defeated or close to it fought till the end until there was nothing left to fight with was great! And the level of sportsmanship is well above what I have read happen in some other games, truly a great first MP game so far.
I'm very glad to hear that! :)
It looks like we'll be able to fix this problem with minimal disruption. I rolled back the game and quickly completed a turn for Pan and then rehosted. You should all receive a new turn 36 shortly.
I think the safest thing to do is delete your .2h and .trn files from your Trinity folder and save the new .trn into that folder and then play that turn as normal. This way we avoid any issues with the old .2h file mistakenly being sent in, which can definitely cause problems.
Then, if there are no objections to Drog taking over Pan I'll switch it to his e-mail address and then send in the AI orders for C'tis myself.
Drog the Destroyer
November 2nd, 2010, 06:44 PM
Just to be certain, the turn 36 file I received for C'tis, should I play it and submit? Or just wait for the coming Pangaea turn?
I might also need a slight extension to get a grip on my position as Pangaea.
Valerius
November 3rd, 2010, 01:58 AM
Just to be certain, the turn 36 file I received for C'tis, should I play it and submit? Or just wait for the coming Pangaea turn?
No, please ignore the C'tis turn. I will submit that turn with orders to go AI.
But please send me your e-mail address so I can make the change on the llamaserver.
I might also need a slight extension to get a grip on my position as Pangaea.
Of course; just let me know how much time you'd like. Thanks for taking over the position!
Valerius
November 3rd, 2010, 11:13 AM
Ok, I changed the Pan/C'tis e-mail addresses and resent the turns. Once the C'tis turn arrives I will set them AI.
Drog the Destroyer
November 3rd, 2010, 02:37 PM
Worthy opponents, Pangaea is under new management. Now I can guess that i'm war with the winged ones, but frankly the notes of the previous administration is somewhat lacking. Please PM me any deals that you have with Pangaea and I shall honor them.
Sincerly Drog
Valerius
November 9th, 2010, 04:25 PM
We've reached turn 40, so as per the game description I've changed the hosting interval to 72 hours.
Valerius
November 18th, 2010, 06:00 PM
Drog needs a bit more time for this turn so I've postponed hosting 24 hours.
Ragnoff
December 3rd, 2010, 09:21 AM
Sorry for the stale turn 47, we had company and that caused the problem. I am back and running again.
iRFNA
December 12th, 2010, 10:10 PM
Drog, you need to submit this last turn even if you got murdered by that monster, ulm. Or else it's gonna wait another day and a half for you. :(
Valerius
December 13th, 2010, 02:12 AM
Just saw this. I'll send in Pan's last turn myself in case Drog doesn't check the forums before the next scheduled hosting. Drog, thanks again for subbing.
Valerius
December 23rd, 2010, 03:42 PM
I see your next hosting is scheduled for the 25th. If anyone needs extra time over the holiday weekend let me know and I'll postpone hosting.
Valerius
December 24th, 2010, 04:51 PM
As a precaution I've postponed hosting 48 hours. If you end up not needing the time, no harm done.
Ragnoff
December 25th, 2010, 09:36 AM
Sorry for the delay folks, I had done most of the turn and then must not have saved it!
Anyway turn submitted, and Merry Christmas..
Ragnoff
December 31st, 2010, 12:51 PM
Hylobius, are you still playing? I saw that you have staled the last two turns...
Valerius
December 31st, 2010, 04:17 PM
Hylobius last logged in just a few hours ago so I sent him a PM asking about the game.
Hylobius
December 31st, 2010, 04:18 PM
I'm back. I was on a little island in the Caribbean over Christmas and I knew that I would not have frequent access to internet, but I was not expecting power outages as well :doh:
Ragnoff
January 14th, 2011, 01:38 PM
We seem to have a problem, we are PAST the deadline, I do not have my turn in, the turn is not processing!
I am finishing my turn, because no warning messages have been sent I thought I still had time (been very sick the last 2 days).
I will get my turn done, working on it now, but this is a CRITICAL turn. I hope it is accepted! I hope it does not process while I am finishing it....
If you get a chance please delay the hosting, even though it has past...
(Confused)
Ragnoff
Ragnoff
January 14th, 2011, 03:47 PM
Ok, My turn is done and the system says it is accepted!
If JotunHeim can get his turn in we can see if the game will host...
Valerius
January 14th, 2011, 04:19 PM
It looks like we got lucky. When the llamaserver has problems (like not sending out reminders) it postpones hosting as a precaution. I think that's what happened here (which is why the hosting is now set for Sunday though I didn't delay it), which helped us avoid a very bad stale.
But this brings up the question of hosting interval. This game is kind of unusual in that once Jotun is eliminated there will only be two players left (usually there are still other nations around when games end, though they may not be in contention for the win). Do you and Avari want to continue with 72 hour hosting or increase the interval?
Valerius
January 14th, 2011, 04:32 PM
I just sent Hylobius a PM since without reminders being sent out he's probably not aware the turn is due.
Avari
January 14th, 2011, 07:00 PM
Hehe today was indeed quite confusing, with the turn timer overrunning and all. I don't know whether that was working as intended or not, but most importantly it appears that everything is fine now. This is indeed arguably one of the most critical turns in the game for Ulm and Shinuyama, as our game-long NAP is ending and the long-anticipated final war is about to begin :D
About the hosting interval, I had also thought about whether to increase it. Of course it depends also on how Ragnoff feels about it. For me the current 3 days is usually enough, but occasionally I feel rushed and I fear it may get worse as our two superpowers start clashing.
I would thus be in favor of increasing the interval if Jotunheim is eliminated, perhaps by a day or two (or even more?). This would be of much help with cases of major real-life stuff intervening etc. With quick hosting on, most turns would probably not take longer than thus far, as I'm sure both of us will be eager to see the game moving forward.
Ragnoff
January 15th, 2011, 10:21 AM
I can agree with this, I too think most turns will be 2-3 days, but just in case we can lengthen once Jotem is gone.
Hylobius
January 15th, 2011, 11:17 AM
I'm not dead yet :D
Turn is in sorry about the delay. There was a message on the server a couple of days ago about a delay until a patch was installed and that we would need to patch our games, so I was on hold until we heard more.
Jotun
Hylobius
January 15th, 2011, 11:37 AM
A new turn has arrived so the server seems happy again.
Valerius
January 15th, 2011, 11:25 PM
Ok, so after Hylobius has made Jotun's last stand I'll increase the hosting interval by two days. As mentioned, you won't usually need this time but it will help avoid stales, which would be very costly at this point. And with you both motivated to bring things to a conclusion we won't run into the usual problem of extending hosting intervals (where people wait until close to the deadline, meaning the extended precautionary hosting time becomes the effective hosting interval).
Valerius
January 17th, 2011, 07:57 PM
I see the game hosted and Jotun has been eliminated so I've changed to a 120 hour hosting interval.
Hylobius, please send in your last, blank, turn as the server will expect it sent in (after the next turn hosts Jotun will no longer appear on the list of nations). Thanks for playing and for fighting it out to the end!
Hylobius
January 17th, 2011, 08:00 PM
Thanks for the game guys and thanks to Valerius for hosting.
Hylobius
January 22nd, 2011, 09:12 PM
So, how is the grand final battle progressing?
Ragnoff
January 22nd, 2011, 10:16 PM
Several elemental royalty, a few tartarians, a few other lesser SCs and a bunch or troops have died. So far with the exceptions of a few quickly reclaimed remote attacks the war has been exclusively on Shinu soil. Ulm has also knocked down a few of my Globals and has about a 75 gem/turn lead as well as over 1K lead in gold. I do not think the issue is in doubt, I believe I will lose.
However in the 2 biggest battles we have had I have killed a great many troops and this last time 35 mages with few losses, so a few more battles like that and things could change..
However, I believe the gem lead is insurmountable, especially as the only time I had gem parity was when I had all 5 globals.
Avari
January 24th, 2011, 12:09 PM
Yeah, I've learned a lot from the last few turns, for example that normal troops in general, and Ulm's heavy infantry in particular, are indeed quite worthless at this stage of the game :D Apparently when faced with a few dozen water elementals (thanks Caelum ;) ) and Grip of Winter for good measure, the only thing they can do is keel over and die. Losing that number of mages would make me very queasy if not for the fact that Ulm's basic smiths are not only cheap and numberless but also not very effective. Of course it could also very well be that I just have no idea how to use them effectively.
I have also learned that sometimes the random number generator is your friend after all, with my sideshow of a few Mind Hunts sniping two Water Queens (if I'm not mistaken) on the first turn of the war :) Naturally all subsequent Mind Hunts have been completely useless.
My gem lead is substantial and I have a few tricks up my sleeve, but so far I've been pretty much stumbling ahead so we shall see. In any case I hope this will be an excellent learning experience and as fun as possible for both of us :)
iRFNA
January 24th, 2011, 10:19 PM
I figured I should leave some sort of legacy, and vengeance by proxy seemed appropriate.
Ragnoff
February 5th, 2011, 11:19 AM
Congrats to Avari!
This turn he killed over half of my Sc, including my god, none of whom are now replaceable. With a better than 2 to 1 gem lead, huge gold lead, 3 or 4 to one SC lead and the only one of us now able to summon and equip SC's, and 4 or 5 to one active forts he has achieved a solid victory.
I was just never able to come back from Jotunheims attack, and could not convince Jotunheim that Ulm was the bigger threat! Although I eventually defeated Jotunheim, he crippled my development in the midgame
I had a great time a learned a good deal. I do hope that there is some answer to Tarts I will learn, it seems that once Ulm had the Chalice and GoH in addition to the gem/province lead there was nothing I could do, it was just a matter of time. Avari did a great job with the initial attacks, and despite several early victories on defense, Avari pressed me in enough different places that those victories could not be exploited and became meaningless.
Great Campaign Avari! Very well executed, and a well deserved victory!
Avari
February 5th, 2011, 12:45 PM
Thank you very much for your praise :) Although I'm not sure that I would credit my campaign strategy as much as my admittedly huge lead in resources. I do agree that after the events of the last couple of turns, the outcome seems pretty clear.
As we have agreed here and in private correspondence that the game is over, I suppose Valerius can end the game on the server unless Ragnoff has second thoughts in the near future. Thank you very much to everyone for playing and to Valerius for hosting. This was an excellent intro for Dominions MP, and of course the outcome is a huge positive surprise for me :)
I think I'll write a bit about my game in case someone is interested. I struggled with my start, with poor neighbouring provinces and one of them held by independents that I couldn't figure out how to beat at that stage (blood vine druids). When Bandar Log rushed me early on, I was almost sure that I would be the first to fall. Indeed his elephants advanced all the way to my capital before I managed to research Blade Wind and destroy his army. He also killed the blood druids for me, which was nice of him.
At that time I also entered into the Ulm-Shinuyama alliance that was to last for almost the entire game. With Shinu assistance I conquered the Bandar lands relatively easily. After that it was smooth sailing for me. When C'tis attacked Shinuyama, I harassed C'tis for a bit but otherwise I had a long stretch of peace in which to build up.
I had decided to attack Pangaea, as he was big but seemed to rely on maenad hordes which I anticipated would be a soft target. Just as I was about to attack, Pangaea switched hands in the infamous AI-going scandal. I delayed my attack a bit but went ahead with it anyway. To my surprise Pangaea could not put up any resistance at all and I conquered all of the Pan lands in a very short time. Only in the very end did the new Pangaea ruler inflict a serious loss on me. His last marauding stealthy army of Pans managed to paralyze and soul slay my Earth King with Ember, Barrier and other assorted expensive gear.
After that Caelum attacked me, no doubt realizing that I would attack him anyway. His icy mountain lands fell quite rapidly as well, as he had been fighting Pan for the whole game as far as I can tell, and I was much stronger.
By this time I knew that the game would end up with me and Shinuyama duking it out, just as we had planned in the beginning ;) The only other nation left was Jotunheim, who to my relief decided to attack Shinuyama instead of me. I agree with Ragnoff that Jotun's choice quite possibly decided the game, giving me time to build up while causing great attrition to Shinuyama.
When I finally decided to break the NAP with Shinu and attack, I had a considerable lead in gem income and was summoning and equipping tartarians consistently. I had much difficulty at first with my conventional armies, but then I realized that SCs are the definite way to go. As the game now stands - and as it will end, it seems - I have snatched Gift of Health with a huge number of gems, killed the Shinuyama god and have 10+ tartarians who are making their way into Shinu territory when they are not freaking out in various ways.
In summary, I would guess that I managed to come out top in this game because of diplomacy first and a good pretender second. I had read many people say that MA Ulm has to take an awake SC pretender to survive early rushes. Despite that I chose a rainbow pretender with moderately high astral. My rainbow pretender helped in early research, and later on it made possible for me via boosters to forge and cast almost anything in the game. I reached Const8 first and got all the good artifacts. In the midgame I also conquered a site from Pan that allowed me to recruit A2S2?1 mages, which was a godsend as I was most lacking in just those paths. In the end they weren't game-changing but did help against Shinuyama with mind hunts, arrow fend and assorted other A/S goodness.
I also think I made relatively good use of Ulm's only real strength (forging). In the end I had about 15 hammers and the Hammer of the Forge Lord in constant use, although it didn't seem to me to be nearly enough at times. I also had two pairs of Rings of Wizardry and Sorcery, the +3D artifact sceptre, the Chalice, Magebane and Aegis (which were never used), a ton of assorted boosters; and of course a crapton of Lightless Lanterns, which coupled with dozens and dozens of smiths gave me a big research lead in the crucial midgame. I didn't get to cast Forge of the Ancients at any time though, as I always had more pressing needs for earth gems. I suppose putting that up would have been much more cost-effective, but such is the way of the newbie.
Well that's my perspective of this great game. It was really fun and I didn't get too worn out at any point, but I never thought it would take this long for me, and I am happy that it is over. Thanks to everyone again for a great intro into Dominions MP!
Hylobius
February 5th, 2011, 01:31 PM
Congratulations to Avari on the win. I think Avari is correct that it was diplomacy that won the game for him. When C'tis was defeated I had to decide whether I should attack Shinu or Ulm. I knew that I had no chance to win the game, and that whoever I attacked then the other would probably win the game. I had a NAP with Ulm and Ulm had been in constant communication with me, particularly when Pan had attacked me with a NAP in place. Shinu I had little contact with, no NAP, and when I contacted him after Pan jumped me through the NAP I received no response. Also Ulm's forging was keeping my Skratti thugs geared and it did not seem right to turn on him with weapons that he had produced for me.
Thanks to Valerius for hosting, I learned a lot in this game.
Valerius
February 6th, 2011, 05:42 PM
Thanks everyone for playing (and for the AARs - interesting to find out how things played out) and congratulations to Avari on the win! Based on your comments it looks like this game illustrated just how important diplomacy is in the game - probably even more important for a weaker nation like Ulm.
Also, just as with the recently concluded FirstBlood, I have to say you're a good group. Actually, I feel I've been very lucky with the quality of the players that participated in my trio of newbie games. :)
I'm glad it was a fun intro to Dominions MP and a good learning experience and I look forward to seeing you all in future games.
Marmaduke
February 6th, 2011, 07:42 PM
Congratulations Avari, it was fun playing Bandar Log against you even if you got the upper hand!
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