Vanilla_Strawberry -> Started

[kasnavada]

Hello !

I played here a few years ago and am returning to play a bit multiplayer. Since I never made it to end game ever and played only a few games, I'm proposing a noob game, looking for players with less than 5-7 games.;)

We'll be using all default options. As far as diplomacy goes, I'd like it to be "set in stone" : word given is to be respected.

Game will go as such : 24h for first 30 turns, 48 for 60, 72 after that. I'll try to do my best for any delay that might arise.

As far as server goes, I'll try to set up everything on llamaserver (thanks to him). We'll be using a random map that will be created when we have players, with a base of 12-15 provinces per player. I'd like at least 6 players, 12 at most, so... we'll see. I plan to start the game this week-end (sunday) depending on the number of players. If there is no room for whatever reason I'll happily set up another game, with the exact same rules, taking Abyssia for myself. Reading the forum a bit, Hinnom seems to be overpowered and will therefore be banned from this game.

As I create the game I'll take the first pick for nations :angel.

Caelum -> Kasnavada.
Thranite -> Vanheim.
Thanatus -> Tir'na nog.
Tratorix -> Arco.
Nightfall -> Tien chi.
Dojango -> Ulm.
Escafoides -> Ermor.
MagicDinausaur765 -> Mictian.
wonderloss -> C'tis

Thanks for reading all that and hopefully see you soon IG.
Kasnavada

Starting the game :here is the map attached.

Send pretenders !

[Thranite]

Hello,

I'm a noob with 2 games in progress, 0 games completed. :)

As long as you are not using a mod, then I am interested in joining. I would like to play one of the viking nations, so in order of preference:

Vanheim
Helheim


Thanks!

[Thanatus del Dragos]

I would like TNN please.

[Korwin]

TNN?

Sadly I dont fall under the definition of noob in this game.
Even if I feel like one :)

If the definition should get changed to somethink like not ever won an game, I would be in. (if you should have problems filling the game).

Have fun.


cu

[rabelais]

24 hours on turn 30 may be tough, unless it is a very small tight game.

[Thanatus del Dragos]

Tir na'Nog I think is how it's spelled? I can never remmeber exactly so I just use the easier TNN. :)

[tratorix]

I'll join as Arco.

[Nightfall]

Only two games before for me, and they were both CBM, so why not try vanilla.

I would like Tien Chi please.

[kasnavada]

@Thranite -> nope, not using a mod.

@Rabelais -> if we find ourselves short on time I'll extend sooner, don't hesitate to tell when you find yourself short on time of course !

@Korwin -> Ok, I put you on "reserve" list and if we're short we'll take you we us.

@all -> Thanks for answering, initial post updated, don't hesitate to correct me if I made any mistakes.

[dojango]

I haven't played any MP yet and would like to get in on the noob MP action. I'll try Ulm.

[kasnavada]

Ok, added !

[escafoides]

Hello!

Can i play?

I will take Ermor.

[kasnavada]

Sure !

I'll be closing the inscriptions around tomorrow night, we are enough to start a game. Note that I'm playing on French time so... to let you guys have a real "sunday night", and will close the inscriptions on monday morning "paris time".

[MagicDinosaur765]

Errr... Hello:

I would want to know if is too late to join the game as Mictlan.

Thanks. :)

[Nightfall]

Wow, this is shaping up as an interesting game, a lot of the more normal 'human' nations in play, unusual for EA, should be fun...

[kasnavada]

It's not too late.

@Korwin -> sorry, it seems we are enough. Next time !

I'm starting the game.

[kasnavada]

Game started on llamaserver. Name is as the thread is named, VanillaStrawberry. We are waiting for pretenders then !

http://www.llamaserver.net/index.cgi

You might find this useful too :

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=35160

(I certainly do).

[wonderloss]

Argh. I am too late.
I registered on Friday to get in on this, but my account was in moderation all weekend.

If you are still interested in setting up a second game, I would like to get in on it.

[kasnavada]

I added a player to the map since you registered on friday, it should let you in. I created a map with 15 provinces per player, with you it's going to be 13 something... good enough I guess, since I wanted 12 to 15.

What nation do you want ? A water nation could be hard since the sea is only a small pond.

[wonderloss]

Thanks.

I will play C'tis.

[Thranite]

Vanheim pretender, checking in.

[kasnavada]

Seems like I'm the last one sending my pretender in (sorry, twas my birthday yesterday... had stuff to do).

The game will start ASAP.

[kasnavada]

Game has started this morning, we have a few players turning in their first turn already !

Good luck all, and if you find time to write AAR (after action reports), remember that it should start around now. If you need more time to start don't forget to tell it here, I'll make my best to do what's needed.

Currently and contrary to what the first post tells, we are on 36 hours "auto-submit".

[tratorix]

k, i've got the turn file but when i try to play the turn it says it can't find the map and comes up nagot gick fel. unh, help. :confused:

edit:nvm, i'm just stupid and didn't download the map file.

[kasnavada]

3 turns in and counting !

[Thranite]

An ambassador from Vanheim walks into the mead-halls of each other pretender with the following report:

Vidrir, Guardian of the Bridge, the Persuasive One, Guardian of the Dead, brings you this following message,

Negotiations between the pretender of Tien Chi over our Northern Border have failed, and their armies have descended into lands held by us. We have received a declaration of war from the Tien Chi pretender, and it is in accordance with the laws of war.

Therefore, we announce honorable warfare between our state and theirs, beginning immediately, the cessation of which cannot be accomplished until one of us lies dead at the feet of the other.

We have cast the spear of Vidrir over the battlefield, Valkyries stand by to convey heroes to the great mead-hall, and we have begun loosening the chains of the Fenris-wolf.

[tratorix]

Oooo, entertainment already. :fight:

Fight, fight, fight, fight!!! :D

[kasnavada]

Just a reminder too... don't forget to check the "can receive private message", since usually a lot of the diplomacy goes through this forum by MP. I saw on the forum that it was off by default some time ago, it might still be. Not receiving MP could mean a loss or victory ! And also, remember to check the "copy to sent folder" box if you want to remember what you sent when messaging someone !

On the other side, that does look like fun, it's not anywhere near where I am though, I won't get to see the fights...

[Nightfall]

An elegantly embossed envelope arrives at your respective courts by courier.

It has come to my attention that in the past months you have been contacted by the tyrant Vidrir.

Know that in response to the pleas of his downtrodden people the forces of the celestial empire have, out of compassion, been forced to act.

It is with pride that we can inform you that the tyrant has been banished and his subjects liberated.

All that remains is to enter his temple and destroy the altar that binds his essence to this world. Unfortunately the last remaining temple curator, out of misplaced loyalty, has barricaded all entrances to the temple.

We expect this will only be a temporary inconvenience, and should be able to put this matter to rest soon.

Know that the Celestial Empire has no desire for acrimonious relations with any of it's neighbours now or in the future. However we will not stand by idle when we become aware of the oppression of our fellows.


Alabe Craft,
Head Scribe to Magic8Ball, He who holds the fate of all

[kasnavada]

The chamberlain of Caelum was looking at the horizon. The influence of the winged people now went far and wide ! But new neighbours appeared. He was left with one question : why were the flags of the false gods all clad in green ?

He then spotted another, new flag at the horizon, that was not green, but purple. Gods bless Ermor.

[Thanatus del Dragos]

I will not go down without a fight! Fear the Tuatha!

[kasnavada]

The armies of Caelum arrived at Tir Na'Nog. It was a 2 month long flight from home. The men where expecting a fight, however, for some reason, the Tuatha we met opposed little resistance. Damn elves, they where surely hidden somewhere !

[Thanatus del Dragos]

Ouch, my armies got ***-beat. Oh, woe is me!

[kasnavada]

Yeah... that was a nice fight though. When watching the replay I certainly thought it was starting to smell like defeat when your armies started to reach my archers... and then you rooted, some archers triying to melee your fleeing troops into defeat while the others shot my own troops in the back... I'm also surprised at the resilience of Iron crows, they made your armies stay in one place for 4 or 5 turns and actually most of them fled to other provinces.

And my poor Mammoths were made into "land-based" sushi by your firbolg surprisingly fast. Great "final stand" overall !

Also, it seems that we rushed you 2 vs 1, sorry about that (not much fun I guess).

[Thanatus del Dragos]

Eh, it happens. I didn't try any Diplo, and should have. It was fun while it lasted. Good learning experience. I didn't have a great starting spot, and didn't expand very fast. Good luck!

[tratorix]

Vanheim and Mictlan, you've got like 3 hours before you stale here... might wanna get on that.

[kasnavada]

I was looking at that too. Should I extend ?

I'll be extending for the Easter week-end anyway (I'll be on a trip).

[tratorix]

Well, Vanheim is basically dead anyway, so no harm there, but Mictlan is still in it, so i'd say yeah. Might as well give them a bit more time.

[kasnavada]

It's done. Hosting interval is 3 day now. I'll change it back to 36 hours on monday depending on when hosting happens.

[Nightfall]

By the way, if your literally down to 1 guy in your besieged castle and < 100 gold, nobody has a problem with you going AI if you want to.

It only damages the game if you still have enough resources to actually put up a fight.

[Thanatus del Dragos]

Well, if I'm not destroyed by next turn, I will go AI. I'm totally defeated.

[escafoides]

Hello guys.

I think that Mictlan is not going to send the turn until saturday or monday (I think that he is without internet)

[kasnavada]

Actually I was thinking exactly the same. However the timing is problematic, because I shall not be there from tomorrow morning to sunday night (and probably late and tired). Also because this is Easter and (hoping for a internet problem) usually repairmen don't work. So either I make him stale one turn this week end, or I extend some more hoping for a reply.

Staling on turn 11 something probably is a huge handicap for anyone. Especially for a internet problem or similar "unwilling" reasons.

I'll collect opinions tommorow morning when I wake up (about 10-11 hours after my post), I'm personaly in favor of staling until monday afternoon (leaving the guy time to get to a friend or something). Then, "the show must go on" as they say.

Edit :
If he stales twice and / or we don't hear from him, I wanna propose to Thanatus del Dragos to take over his place since it will make us "restart" the game sooner.

[Thanatus del Dragos]

I can do that, if need be.

[escafoides]

Hello.

He is my friend, but I cant't talk wit him now, and I know that he probably will be without internet until saturday or monday, so it would be ok if you can extend the time. I think that he is in an important situation in the game now, so a stale could be critical.

So we are not going to need a sub.

[kasnavada]

Thanks for the precisions, then... I'll extend until you get more news.

The game will wait until monday 22h40 GMT.

[Thranite]

Sorry for the delay, life got in the way. I've got nothing left however, I'm just sending away my gems to spite Tien chi, so don't worry about my staling. I just like doing petty harm on my way out, or I'd go AI. :P

Oh, and I kicked off a new turn a few minutes ago, so y'all should have something to do now over Easter. :)

[MagicDinosaur765]

Hello, Easter things and family things (and a horrible internet connection) caused I can't send the last turn until the end.
Thanks for the prevision. : D

[kasnavada]

Hehe ! Same here more or less =) !

I postponed the next turn by 12 hours. There was less than 6 hours left and 3 people without their turn in. Which means that tommorow morning I'll be able to postpone some more if needed.

[Thranite]

Vanheim is out!

Thanks for the game, fellas. Somebody go kill T'ien Ch'i for me. :)

[kasnavada]

I'm going to have a problem with the game, I am moving next week and will not have internet for a week (if the local telecom services don't screw up). I'll try to get my turns by using whatever internet I got available, but I can't be sure that I will be able to. I will not be there from 07/05 to 15/05. I *may* be able to get a turn or two in the middle, but nothing sure.

For now I plan to set the timer to 2 weeks or so, if it's too inconvenient for you guys... I could try to find a temporary sub. After that, however, I'm "clear", and got no reason for stalling the game coming in the next few months.

[kasnavada]

I'm back !

[tratorix]

Hey Ermor, take your turn already.

[wonderloss]

What is that in my inbox? Could it be? Why yes, it is a Vanilla_Strawberry turn file! Oh happy day!

[wonderloss]

Will we be going back to a shorter turn time now?

[Nightfall]

Yes, please do...

I don't mind delays due to RL stuff happening, but one of the reasons I joined this game was that it was proposed as a fast paced game.

[MagicDinosaur765]

I'm sorry because the enormous delay to send my turn.

Tests and tests and study and study... It's a bad time for the University students.

[kasnavada]

I'll set a 2 day time when next turn hosts, unless someone has a good reason not to.

[tratorix]

Turn timer goes back to 48 hours next turn, right? We've been waiting on Ermor for like five days now.

[kasnavada]

Yup it is back on 2 days now.

I discovered the "advanced" functions of Llama server actually, when you set up a duration it works for the next turn, not the current one. So for current turn (21) you have 48 hours. Back on schedule !

[kasnavada]

No drama ?

Maybe I'll have some next turn !

[Nightfall]

I think that there is tons of drama going on, people just aren't advertising who is fighting who...

It's hard to tell from just the score graphs and a few scouts but there seems to be a lot of action in the middle of the map, with, I'm guessing, about 5 different nations involved.

[kasnavada]

Probably...

I never should have taken misfortune 3. That's now 6 provinces that rebelled / got barbarian attacks in less than 24 turns. Plus, my main battle plan failed, I'm in a rather bad situation now.

[Nightfall]

Ouch, Misfortune 3 is pretty brave... but I guess you had to get the points for all that income bonus from somewhere. ;)

Can't say that I'd go that way with Caelum, you really need a nation with better PD than them to play high Misfortune.

[kasnavada]

At least I'll know for next time it's a bad idea... I don't really know of a PD that can take 90+ barbarian unscathed though.

Also, I prepared a turn per turn AAR, which I won't release until I'm dead or the game is.

[wonderloss]

Mictlan and myself (C'Tis) are going back and forth.

I do not think I would go with misfortune higher than 2, if I did, it would be with order 3. I tried M3 before in SP, and had the same problem with losing provinces to crappy events.

[kasnavada]

The worst thing is that I do have order 3 !

[kasnavada]

Extended time by 16 hours since 3 have not send their turns yet.

[kasnavada]

I've added some time to let llamabeast repair whatever was wrong (thanks to him) with the server, and it seems to be done (thanks again).

Next turn is due on the 24th but timer is still 48 hours.

[kasnavada]

Tries to wake MagicDinausaur765 up =)

[kasnavada]

Still on 48 hours schedule, be wary !

[tratorix]

I'll be setting myself AI this turn, as Tien Chi basically has me beat. Seems I really underestimated warriors of the five elements. It's been fun. :)

[Nightfall]

Hey Tratorix,

You fought well and hard.

I would recommend that you send in at least 2-3 more turns before going AI. It probably will not make any difference to me, but at the moment there is a chance that the AI will attack Caelum before I can finish it off.

[tratorix]

Hey Tratorix,

You fought well and hard.

I would recommend that you send in at least 2-3 more turns before going AI. It probably will not make any difference to me, but at the moment there is a chance that the AI will attack Caelum before I can finish it off.

It's nice of you to say that, but from where I was sitting it seems like you kicked my *** all over the place. ;)

Also, since I have no money and the only troops I have left aren't really near him, I don't think the AI will pick a fight with caelum.

[kasnavada]

Ok... Ermor staled twice.

If I have no answer tomorrow, I'll postpone look for a sub / set him AI (depending on you guys).

[Nightfall]

Ok... Ermor staled twice.

If I have no answer tomorrow, I'll postpone look for a sub / set him AI (depending on you guys).

He needs to be subbed, in my opinion way to big to AI... although if C'tis is almost out of it (I'm not sure of the situation there), perhaps wonderloss would be willing to take over?

[wonderloss]

Mictlan and I have been playing tennis, and going back and forth, without either of us getting a decisive victory. I think I am about to push back. I am in a crappy position, but my defeat is not imminent.

I am also involved in another game right now, and that takes up enough of my time that I am not sure I could do justice to a position as large as Ermor's.

I am willing to do it, but I think a sub from outside of the game would be a better choice, and I think we could find a sub.

[MagicDinosaur765]

I really enjoyed this turn.
And I think Ulm enjoyed it too. : )

C'tis and Ulm are attacking me since at least 10 turns ago.
I attacked C'tis and I conquered a lot of provinces.
But Ulm is destroying my whole empire...
This turn Ulm stormed one of my castles, and my mages called a lot of imps to bite and devour his troops.

:)

[kasnavada]

A sub it is.

I have a family reunion this week end and will not be able to play due to no internet available (friday evening to monday morning).

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?p=779589#post779589

Also, I postpone once again to wait for the sub.

[kasnavada]

I really enjoyed this turn.
And I think Ulm enjoyed it too. : )

C'tis and Ulm are attacking me since at least 10 turns ago.
I attacked C'tis and I conquered a lot of provinces.
But Ulm is destroying my whole empire...
This turn Ulm stormed one of my castles, and my mages called a lot of imps to bite and devour his troops.

:)

That sounds fun !

We are going back and forth with Ermor too but... barbarians attack again and again. 2 turns ago I move to some indie province I hadn't conquered yet, and the very next turn the AI strikes back : it got barbarian attacked (that's 7 or 8 now...).

Thankfully I didn't get the vampire attacks or some bogus.

[Bullock]

Hello Guys !

At last i can post !

So i'm a newcomer, i practiced quite a lot solo game but that was years ago and now i want to experience multi :)

i dunno well ermor EA but i m sure i ll have fun joining the game, especially being directly in the action as it seems to be.

See you soon in game

[dojango]

I really enjoyed this turn.
And I think Ulm enjoyed it too. : )

C'tis and Ulm are attacking me since at least 10 turns ago.
I attacked C'tis and I conquered a lot of provinces.
But Ulm is destroying my whole empire...
This turn Ulm stormed one of my castles, and my mages called a lot of imps to bite and devour his troops.

:)

This is my first multi-player game, and I must say that players certainly script differently than the AI does! Still, we shall see what sort of counter-strategy might work.

[kasnavada]

@Bullock :

I'll send you the information you need ASAP. Have you check the "can receive MP" button in the options ? I need your email adress.

[Bullock]

Everything seems to be working fine on my side !

Time for some diplo and my turn 28 should be done by the 5th.

[kasnavada]

Aeliane looked at her windows. The shadows of the master of the 5 elements were all over the place, and currently were the largest empire around. That was definitely not good.

That left her with only one choice. Messengers were sent to all known rivals. For all of them, the message was that Caelum would start attacking Tien'Chi in 2 month's time. For all but Tien'Chi, rivals were asked to join the crusade.


/RP : respecting current agreements, first blood will be authorised at turn 34.

[Nightfall]

Yazi, prophet to Magic8Ball, surveys the fortress as the sun is rising, turning to his aide.

"This is the last of them."

Yes sir, it has been confirmed, the foul being Jack Skellington has fallen, his head was recovered and is on it's way north to take it's place alongside Vidrir's.

He sighs, "Just as I finish one war, another is to start."

It appears that way sir, the people of the sky have revoked our pact.

"I wonder who tricked them into doing that, not wise of them at all. And the timing could not be worse for them, had they waited a few more months half of our forces would have been reassigned. What does that indicate to you?"

A lack of good intelligence and scouting sir.

"Just so, see to it that the men are reformed as soon as this fight is done with, they should be told of this development as soon as is practical."

Of course sir, there is also word from the mages, the capital has approved the magical support you requested.

"And the new recruitment centre."

Fully operational sir.

"Excellent... I feel him you know, now that he is here with us, his power resonates within me even at this great distance."

My life for He Who Holds the Fate of All.

"Magic8Ball does not require your life Sethan, just your worship and service."

[Bullock]

From his peaceful corner of the world the ermor nation remain carefree. Especially since the discovering of nature magic path who made beautiful butterflies appearing everywhere in our provinces.

But black smokes are rising in far away lands and spies are bringing bad news of a fast spreading dominion overwhelming all others. Messengers of many nations came to our gate with the purpose of finding allies or asking Ermor to stay peacefully in their corner.

Therefore some decisions have to be made and obviously a war is coming. Troops are starting to gather and the drums of war announce the beginning of a new conflict.

Ermor's plan will be exposed to everybody soon and will start early in the Year 4.

[Bullock]

So we are going to expend our territory trough c'tis. Then we will have more connection to others nations which will allow us to interact more with the rest of the world.

So C'tis prepare for war !

[wonderloss]

Crap. I took my turn last night, but I forgot to submit it. Llamaserver is down, though. If you get this in time, kasnavada, could you postpone the turn 12 hours? If not, my fault, no big deal.

[Bullock]

well the server are up but didn t compute next turn.
I think the host need to force hosting which give u some extra time.
Didn t you send ur turn while server was down ?

[wonderloss]

I have not sent my turn. I will not have access to my home PC for ~8 hours.

[kasnavada]

Errr sorry. Didn't see the message.

[wonderloss]

It's okay. Due to llamaserver's weirdness, it did not host until my turn got in.
Not that it helped me much.

[kasnavada]

Poor Berevezan! He could not get to the first place of the Hall of Fame because he was slain by the treacherous magics of Tien'Chi !

Berevezan, you will be remembered forever in our nation for all the good you did to us !

Glory to the Winged People !

[wonderloss]

Thrashing around in what is likely their death throes, the lizards of C'Tis will inflict as much damage as we can to Ermor's legions before we go.

"Do not go gentle into that good night." - D'lenn T'masssssss.

[Nightfall]

Poor Berevezan! He could not get to the first place of the Hall of Fame because he was slain by the treacherous magics of Tien'Chi !


The sad part is that wasn't even the one with +8 penetration... that one you lucked a save against...
;)

[Bullock]

Thrashing around in what is likely their death throes, the lizards of C'Tis will inflict as much damage as we can to Ermor's legions before we go.

"Do not go gentle into that good night." - D'lenn T'masssssss.

We were not expecting less ! Rendez vous at your capital ;)

Cheers

[kasnavada]

Poor Berevezan! He could not get to the first place of the Hall of Fame because he was slain by the treacherous magics of Tien'Chi !


The sad part is that wasn't even the one with +8 penetration... that one you lucked a save against...
;)

My Kings got 17 base MR, with +8 penetration you've barely got a bit more than half chance of getting a kill, assuming I don't have a scout in the province, which reduces your chances by half ! ;) I should have put up some antimagic amulet, which would have reduces your chances to 1/3 or so (and then, only for the guy with +8 penetration).

Still worth it, especially since you've got loads of gems to spare. But I'll counter it, like you countered my seeking arrows !

[Nightfall]

Still worth it, especially since you've got loads of gems to spare. But I'll counter it, like you countered my seeking arrows !

Yeah you can mitigate it somewhat, but much harder to completely counter, and, more importantly, much more expensive to counter.

By the way as far as scouts go, from my own experiences with being on the receiving end, I think size may be a factor, keep on eye on it and let me know what you think.

And your math is wrong, 2 errors as per the rulebook, and, I've been told, one where the rulebook is in error. Probably should have let you keep believing that... but this game is for learning after all.

[kasnavada]

About my maths, I did not do any, it was an estimation. Since you asked, I checked, and found this :
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=17160

Which, coupled with the formula in the manual, tells me that with 17 MR and +8 penetration (and base 10), so you've got +1, so 62% chance. That's more than half.
With 21 MR and +8 penetration (and base 10), you've got -3 so 30% chance. Around 1/3. I ignore the elements you have not given me though, like skill in astral. Since I do not know about them.

The estimations I had were correct assuming the formula also is. That's where I'd be interested in the "real" formula for MR though, if the one of the manual is wrong - I can't find any reference to it on the forum. I must have missed it.


About counters... well. You will see. It's going to be WAAAAY cheaper than the one you found for the seeking arrows.

[Nightfall]

Aha, finally found it for you... knew I'd seen it somewhere but couldn't remember where.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=46973&highlight=magic+resistance

And there is still one modifier that you are both aware of and forgetting about.

Incidently, was very impressed with the way you opened the war, I was expecting a slightly different bag of tricks from you.

It's a bummer that llamaserver stuffed the turn where I lost 80 W5E's, I did send an arrow fend mage to that battle in my updated turn file, but it wasn't processed after the server became unstuck.

[kasnavada]

Nice catch !
Great to be shown once again that not only the manual is not up to date and incomplete, it also can be plain wrong. That's one of the thing I don't like about this game.

The last modifier, AFAIK, is astral path, which, I don't have any information about. Therefore ignoring it :D. Even if it's not, obviously, in my favor at all.

About the war, I wasn't expecting at all what you've thrown at me either. I happened to counter it, which was more luck than anything. I do have to change tactics now. Thanks for Arco's forts though ! Early war with Ermor deprived me of the ressources to build them myself.

[Nightfall]

The last modifier, AFAIK, is astral path, which, I don't have any information about. Therefore ignoring it :D. Even if it's not, obviously, in my favor at all.


Not what I'm talking about, there is another fundamental thing that modifies unit MR; you'll kick yourself when you realise what I'm talking about.

As for the losses so far, yeah, I'm really disappointed with the pegasus riders performance, I expected much better effectiveness from them, they just don't seem to run into mid game well at all.

[kasnavada]

The only things I see are blessing and scales. Blessing does not work outside of combat except for prophets, robe of the shroud and a few other cases. Scales, well, do not matter since in provinces I was in, have 1 magic, which has no effect on MR.

[Nightfall]

Pretty sure that -.5 rounded down is -1.

Zero would be rounding up. And I just did some testing and it is rounding up...

Damn manual...

[kasnavada]

Start a game with magic 2. You'll see the penalty is written on all units : -1 MR, due to scales. Not that anyone ever takes magic 2 in a game. With magic one, there is nothing written, so, no penalty. It's called rounding up, not down, I agree with that.

[kasnavada]

The last modifier, AFAIK, is astral path, which, I don't have any information about. Therefore ignoring it :D. Even if it's not, obviously, in my favor at all.

As for the losses so far, yeah, I'm really disappointed with the pegasus riders performance, I expected much better effectiveness from them, they just don't seem to run into mid game well at all.

Then again, they were always met with overwhelming forces on my side, 25 of them against at 3 to 5 times as much caelian archers and 6 to a dozen mages scripted to take units out of the way. Caelian troops are so weak that a basic raiding party has to number in hundreds... which of course 25 units can't compare to. Well, some units may, but not pegasus riders.

About the strategies I used to start the war, I badly lacked number. With better preparations, accurate research priorities and such, and less dumb scales, I would have had more than twice as much of the Kings, secure protection against you would have been coming fast, and so on. This is mid-game already, what I have is barely a token force produced by 15 provinces... imagine the forces I would have with the gem access you've got :angel ?

I got lucky I surprised you until now, but I'm going to run out of resources. Let's hope that the surprises I'm preparing don't run out until I get enough resources to compete with yours. Otherwise I'm screwed.

I wasted some kings and associated items during assaults against Ermor which did not show the kinds of results I got when I assaulted your lands, as I this is the first MP game in which try thugs. I'm doing much better on that regard in the other game I'm in thanks to the experience here though. Also, thanks to you I will have to add a complete chapter for astral protection ;).

Magic struggle against Tien'Chi also is not really my best match, air and astral magic being the kind of magics that hurt Caelum the most.

Finally, I relied on archery too much, Caelum is a archer-strong nation that has mages which thrives when archery does not work. I should have made that change turns ago.

I'm writing a complete turn by turn AAR since the game started anyway, then a guide when that game is finished or I die.

[Nightfall]

This is mid-game already, what I have is barely a token force produced by 15 provinces... imagine the forces I would have with the gem access you've got :angel ?


Keep in mind that I've been at war the entire game with 3 seperate nations now, as well as some skirmishing with Ulm, and they have all cost me, I don't think my resource lead is as big as you think.

But it has been fun... :D

I'm also just starting to get my mid game on line, so it should get very interesting.

[kasnavada]

So... how's your pretender ?

[wonderloss]

I was gone this weekend, and forgot all about getting a turn in. Don't worry about me staling. It really will not make a difference.

[kasnavada]

For some reason the timer was extended on all games and set to 18:25 GMT. Which means, you've not stalled yet.

[wonderloss]

I went AI. I am out of commanders. It has been fun.

[Bullock]

Yes a nice fight til the very end which cost me a lot of troops (almost all in fact ;) ). well played

[kasnavada]

Kinda scary.

I'm sieged everywhere, and I'm still first in army size. Looks like all of you went for elite troops or something...

[Nightfall]

Kinda scary.

I'm sieged everywhere, and I'm still first in army size. Looks like all of you went for elite troops or something...

Not really, keep in mind that graph is literally army _size_, so your position on it has always been inflated because Caelum basic infantry are size 3.

[wonderloss]

Yes a nice fight til the very end which cost me a lot of troops (almost all in fact ;) ). well played

I thought that might be the case, and even considered trying to retake some territory with my pretender and my bane lord, but I just did not have it in me to postpone my defeat any longer. I have two other games where I have much better positions, so I was not as motivated to keep up this one anymore.

Enjoy my capital. The dead toads that cover everything in sight are a gift from Mictlan.

I really had no idea what I was doing when I started this game. By the time I really started to figure things out, I was already too far behind to ever catch up.

[kasnavada]

Kinda scary.

I'm sieged everywhere, and I'm still first in army size. Looks like all of you went for elite troops or something...

Not really, keep in mind that graph is literally army _size_, so your position on it has always been inflated because Caelum basic infantry are size 3.

I know that. Still, I was at 900+ last turn and most of you guys barely around 500 - 600... Still are actually.

[Nightfall]

I know that. Still, I was at 900+ last turn and most of you guys barely around 500 - 600... Still are actually.

Umm, from what I've seen.

Ulm was using lots of warrior maidens ealier, but he slowed down after gift of health went up, presumably to spam more researchers.

Ermor has been building, using and losing principes pretty regularly. Probably at a lower build rate than you, but I'd say that's mostly because of the higher cost.

Mictlan and myself have mostly been using sacreds... not sure what C'tis was using.

[kasnavada]

Hum well. I'm nearly done with this game and was thinking about publishing the Caelum AAR from turn 1 to 45-something. I does contain some information like capitals position close to mine, and some of Tien'Chi tactics, but what beat me up should already be mostly known to the remaining powers with decent scouting, and significant research should have been done since that. Also, you do not have to go and read it ! Especially since I lost :angel.

However, I can delay if you guys wish it.
:angel

Glory to the winged people and Berezavant !

[Bullock]

Would be happy to read it :)
I guess only TC can be against this publishing so lets wait to hear from him.

[dojango]

I too would be interested in reading it, but I can wait until after Tien Chi conquers the world and expunges it of all memory of those who opposed him.

[Nightfall]

Um, only two things I can think of that might cause an issue.

I still don't know exactly where Ermor's cap is, due to some good patrolling.

I'd prefer you didn't reveal what is currently seiging the old Tir capital, as Ulm may not be aware of it.

Other than that though, I don't have a problem with you posting all your AAR.

[kasnavada]

Ok, then I'll wait.

[MagicDinosaur765]

I'm really sorry, but I can't send my turns because of a travel for 1 week.
If you can wait, it will be great, but if you can't, it's okey to search a substitute.

[kasnavada]

I'd vote for 1 week delay.

[Bullock]

let s wait

[Nightfall]

Happy to wait

[kasnavada]

Arg... I thought it would be ok to wait until this morning so I could get answers, and nope... Sorry !

Next hosting postponed by 144 hours anyway.

[Nightfall]

Ok, then I'll wait.

You should be okay to post the AAR now both my concerns are no longer an issue.

[kasnavada]

Great ! I'll post them on monday though, I got lots of things to do tomorrow and this week end.

[Bullock]

I m seriously losing interest in this game.

In part because i m a sub of ermor and the previous guy wasn t playing at all as i do.

But mainly because this game is way too slow. Mictlan can you keep us posted ?

Btw if Ulm is fine to proclame Nightfall winner of this game im fine with that.

How do you feel about that game ?

[Nightfall]

Btw if Ulm is fine to proclame Nightfall winner of this game im fine with that.


I'm okay with whatever you guys want to do, since I have a pearl income of ~60 a turn and am due to finish researching Alteration 9 next turn, it's totally reasonable for you guys to concede if you prefer.

On top of the gem income you can see, I'm also pulling about ~80 blood slaves a turn.

Mictlan has already swore fealty to Magic8Ball about ~20 turns ago, when I saved him from Ulm.

Want to give kudos again to Kasnavada as well, his thugs absolutely smashed me at the start of our war, unfortunately for him I had already started researching thug counters before he broke our NAP. And _damn_ that was a lot of magic on your pretender.

[kasnavada]

Want to give kudos again to Kasnavada as well, his thugs absolutely smashed me at the start of our war, unfortunately for him I had already started researching thug counters before he broke our NAP. And _damn_ that was a lot of magic on your pretender.


It actually was the first time I successfully fielded thugs in a MP game. I was going for a rainbow pretender for magic diversity and items, but ultimately it somewhat slowed me down. Next time I'll go with something like a E9N4A4 pretender... which enables the kings be as effective as the kings you've seen with half the items. The "national" anti magic unit spells is also really annoying. Finally, the indy troops you found... those are just amazing.

I need to find out how to kill golems too, I had problem with those in earlier games and still have... well.

Whatever, you deserved to win that war :angel:

[Nightfall]

Finally, the indy troops you found... those are just amazing.

Yeah they worked beautifully, only downside to them is the cost, as they cost 125g each, but they are offensive powerhouses with a decent bless.

If you can get a pair of eagle kings to E3 they should be able to nail golems with shatter provided you manage to engage them.

[kasnavada]

Good idea, shatter is in their range with boots of earth (whose massed use is needed anyway for Caelum) and summon earth power. Both are useful for a King anyway (invulnerability > iron skin).

[dojango]

I'd be willing to concede to Tien Chi as well. I never really recovered from the Mictlanese war, and I just don't seem to have any thugs or SCs within reach. Going to have to rethink my pretender design in the future. Wish I could have observed Tien Chi's crushing of his neighbors, it would have been... instructive... to be sure.

[kasnavada]

Actually you will somewhat see him beat me...

[Nightfall]

For those that may be interested, my pretender build was:

Magic8Ball
Imprisoned Dom 10 Oracle
W9/S9
Order 3
Sloth 3
Heat 3
Misfortune 1
Magic 1

I have all my turns archived and saved, although it's split between my desktop and laptop, if anyone wants to take a look at them I'd be happy to zip them up and email them to you.