Suggestions for upgrade of AI

[Rick L]

Dominions 3 is by far the richest, most complicated game I've ever played, and I love it. My only wish is that the AI was more robust. It doesn't seem capable of summoning the really top level troops, such as trolls. And at the end of the game it just seems to quit. I once had about half the map, and Marverni had the other half. Marverni had 1200 troops in one spot, but they never attacked. Also, the AI tends to mass troops in odd corners, adjacent to sea provinces the nation can't enter.

For those of us who lack the time to do multi[-player games, and who play mostly on airplanes, a stronger AI would be great. I realize this is a lot to ask, and I am grateful for the updates we do get.

[brxbrx]

Make the AI supply conscious!
Also, nation specific strategies would be SWEET.

[Gandalf Parker]

Odd corners could be done if it applies to all games. But buildups next to sea would not be a bad idea if there are water nations in the game.

As for supply conscious, does the AI ignore starving? I thought that when it starved, it moved (as long as it wasnt in a castle)

[brxbrx]

Odd corners could be done if it applies to all games. But buildups next to sea would not be a bad idea if there are water nations in the game.

I see the AI building up before going to war, and that's always pretty cool. Leads to big standoffs.

As for supply conscious, does the AI ignore starving? I thought that when it starved, it moved (as long as it wasnt in a castle)

It moves, sure, but it doesn't make use of cauldrons of broth or bags of wine even when it's a nature nation and insists on large armies even though the armies are crippled by starvation.

[Gandalf Parker]

If it moves to find food then I think that is the best we will get.
The other options sound like "IF"s which are unlikely

[NTJedi]

Dominions 3 is by far the richest, most complicated game I've ever played, and I love it. My only wish is that the AI was more robust. It doesn't seem capable of summoning the really top level troops, such as trolls. And at the end of the game it just seems to quit.
There's lots of problems with the AI players... don't even get me started on the meaningless arena death matches where all the AI players send their prophets and large size gods.
Unfortunately the improving of the AI opponents has not been done since Dominion_3 was first released, well there's been 3 minor improvements. The devs have improved the way battles are done, but that's for humans and AI players. As a result most players who play against AI opponents create or adjust maps to avoid their flaws... which include the following:
A} Bump Map Setting for "Supplies" to 300.
B} DO NOT play any maps with Water Provinces unless your AI opponents are Water Nations or 90% of their recruits can safely enter the water.
C} Provide AI opponents a growth scale within the .map file because otherwise they slowly grow weaker.
D} Pray the game doesn't have an arena death match because the reward has almost zero value and the AI players only become weaker afterwards.

OTHER RECOMMENDED RULES FOR AI GAME BALANCE:
E} Do not use item path boosters because the AI does not use them. Also do not use any of the unique items.
F} Provide the AI some supercombatants within the .map file, because it lacks the knowledge to build them. Give them more for increased game challenge.
G} Provide the AI a library at its capital so it can be competitive with research, which is done in the .map file.
H} Use the map editor to remove small size provinces because small provinces means less supplies which means starving and disease is more likely.


If it moves to find food then I think that is the best we will get.
The other options sound like "IF"s which are unlikely

The problem is the AI will move units from multiple provinces into one single province which then causes starving and disease in the same turn. Too many units arriving into one province will cause units to be diseased the turn they arrive.


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SUMMARY: Since Illwinter doesn't seem interested in improving the AI opponents I hope their future games allow for modding of the AI opponents where the community can improve them. AI opponents should also have multiple personalities so they are less predictable.

[brxbrx]

I like death matches... They add flavor.

[NTJedi]

I like death matches... They add flavor.

The concept of the death match is a great idea, unfortunately it's poorly implemented within Dominions3 since the AI sends their pretenders and the overall "cursed" prize is not worth risking the life of a good unit. If the arena death match was moddable the MP and SP community would quickly fix the problems with how it's currently implemented.


THE RECOMMENDED ILLWINTER FIX
1) The AI should "never" send its pretenders or prophets to the death match because the dominion bonus they provide is too valuable.
2) The Death Match Prize should provide gems and gold based on the current game turn and number of participants. The death match on turn_85 with 8 participants should provide a greater reward than a death match on turn_10 with 4 participants.
3) The commander/mage which is victorious should receive one or more unique abilities such as immortality or immunity to horrormarks or +3 map movement or something major as a personal reward.
4) The commander/mage which is victorious should not be "cursed" by being forced to attend future death matches. Nothing worse then rewarding someone a "curse" for their victory.


Anytime I see a falling star... my one wish is the arena death match gets fixed.

[Deathblob]

Just mod out the arena site if you don't want death matches.

[NTJedi]

Just mod out the arena site if you don't want death matches.

That's been tried and tested yet does not prevent death matches.

[sidhos]

I don't know what happens in anyone else's games, but the AI in my games, starts the game with immediate knowledge of my location and makes a beeline to me. And when I say immediate, I mean immediate. In a straight line, the same number or provinces as turns have passed, which means it didn't scout for me first. It knew.

Secondly, the AI never fights other AI. They all come for me, like it is a team game or something, and almost never fight each other. I can make a 600 province map, only 4 AI opponents and by turn 15, I'll be surrounded by at least three of them.

The odd thing is, they get to my "border" and then hesitate. No killer instinct. Many times, I just scratch my head and wonder why the AI didn't attack as a turn passes.

[brxbrx]

I don't know what happens in anyone else's games, but the AI in my games, starts the game with immediate knowledge of my location and makes a beeline to me. And when I say immediate, I mean immediate. In a straight line, the same number or provinces as turns have passed, which means it didn't scout for me first. It knew.

Secondly, the AI never fights other AI. They all come for me, like it is a team game or something, and almost never fight each other. I can make a 600 province map, only 4 AI opponents and by turn 15, I'll be surrounded by at least three of them.

The odd thing is, they get to my "border" and then hesitate. No killer instinct. Many times, I just scratch my head and wonder why the AI didn't attack as a turn passes.
That has never been the case for me. Are you sure you aren't playing Starcraft, or maybe Civilization V?

[llamabeast]

CBM greatly improves the arena prize. Makes it worth fighting for.

[Gandalf Parker]

Sidhos:

Do you use PD? As little as 11 PD will cause the AI to pause.

Are you playing in open games on Dom3Minions? Some of those purposely ally the AIs against you
http://www.dom3minions.com/HostedGames.htm

Ive rarely had the AI beeline me. In fact it doesnt tend to know where I am. It declares war based on finding you, or your standing on the scoreboard,
Of course some nations are quicker at finding you than others,

[sidhos]

That has never been the case for me. Are you sure you aren't playing Starcraft, or maybe Civilization V?

lol No, never played Starcraft and I loved the Civ series right up to the fifth one. Just can't get into it. Maybe Dominions has spoiled me with such a wide variety of nations and options.
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Gandalf, yes, I use PD. Typically I place 10 in every province I conquer, then start placing 20 when I see the first enemy.

I've tested the beeline thing. It doesn't happen 100 percent, but it happens very often. Sent a scout back along the line that the AI traveled. It never strayed from a straight course to me. Usually I leave the AI "personality" as random. Maybe this is the aggressive behavior?
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Just for the record, I'm not complaining that the AI is too hard, as I have noticed many of the things you guys complain about. My only challenge with the AI is probably my own doing. I like to have very solid armies in EVERY border province, which can get expensive on a large map, so I tend to expand slower than what I read about in the guides.

[Mightypeon]

From what I understand, Ai bases its attack decision on the scoreboard.
If an AI gets a hard one on you, it will attack.
However, AI vs. AI wars happen, however, an AI will be relucant to attack someone if it is already fighting somebody else.
Mercs seem to have a big impact on whom the AI focuses on.

[NTJedi]

Gandalf, yes, I use PD. Typically I place 10 in every province I conquer, then start placing 20 when I see the first enemy.
I recall reading 11 PD is recognized more than 10 PD... and 21 PD more than 20 PD and so on by increments of ten. I think it was research from Gandalf.


I've tested the beeline thing. It doesn't happen 100 percent, but it happens very often. Sent a scout back along the line that the AI traveled. It never strayed from a straight course to me. Usually I leave the AI "personality" as random. Maybe this is the aggressive behavior?
It would be interesting to see how an AI opponent expands and behaves with the different personalities where the scales, pretender, starting location, nation and map were all the same.

[sidhos]

Thanks for that input about the PD. So, if I'm reading you right, I can just spend the money on 11 PD and the AI will view it as 20, as far as being a deterrent? I know I have to spend 20 to get 20, but the AI sees 11 as 20? and 21 as 30? etc.

[Knai]

Thanks for that input about the PD. So, if I'm reading you right, I can just spend the money on 11 PD and the AI will view it as 20, as far as being a deterrent? I know I have to spend 20 to get 20, but the AI sees 11 as 20? and 21 as 30? etc.

That is how it works. That said, the AI is so dumb that PD is actually a worthwhile defensive weapon against it.

[Gandalf Parker]

I think that depends on which AI you get. Defensive, General, or Aggressive.
And it generally doesnt stop at PD. It just decides that Indept provinces would be better. Once the map is fully taken, it will attack. Setting Indept strength lower in a game will cause a more aggressive AI

Of course thats all for vanilla AI.

[Mightypeon]

Actually, some PD (f.e. Sauromatia) can be suprisingly worthwhile against Humans too, especially in the early game periouds.