obat26 Afghanistan

[miq]

Unit 412 (Cavalry Scouts) makes airplane sounds while traveling and should be adjusted from 7 to 17.

[MarkSheppard]

So the ANA/ANP are collapsing in several provinces; with the following equipment lost over the last four days:

1 x Mi-17 (Destroyed)
5 x M1117 ASV (Captured)
4 x D-30 Howitzers (Capt)
51 x M1151 Humvees (10 x Dest, 41 x Captured)
32 x M1152 Humvees (3 x Dest, 29 x Captured)
42 x Ford Ranger (1 x Dest, 41 x Captured)
17 x Navistar Int'l 7000 Series (3 x Dest, 14 x Capt)
15 x ATV (Captured)

[MarkSheppard]

Looks like you'll have to update the 2022 OOB and "flip" Afghanistan back to the Taliban Flag at this rate. :doh:

[scorpio_rocks]

Afghanistan is called "The Graveyard of Empires" for a reason! Genghis Khan, Alexander the Great, Great Britain (3 or 4 times), USSR, USA have all tried and failed to change the place... Constant war seems to be the norm there :(

[DRG]

Looks like you'll have to update the 2022 OOB and "flip" Afghanistan back to the Taliban Flag at this rate. :doh:

:doh: indeed...........

[MarkSheppard]

And it's done. Afghan President has fled the country. :shock:

Taliban are in Kabul now, rumors have skirmishes happening between them and UK Paras who are trying to exfiltrate UK nationals at the airport. :confused:

Hamid Karzai apparently is going to be part of a "transitional council" that will hand over power to the Taliban. :confused:

[DRG]

...and the clock gets turned back 20 years......and so it goes

[MarkSheppard]

Only this time, they have thermal sights at the infantry level (in some cases) :shock:

ATN MARS-HD 384/640 thermal optic

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E82gowPXoAoXL0K?format=jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E82cRL3WQAQ0kid?format=jpg

[DRG]

....and another 20 years of experience not to mention a resilience that is second to none. We may be shortchanging them for base Morale level in the game....

[Mobhack]

That area has been a nasty place for outsiders to try to operate since Alexander the Great's time and likely before.

The morale and rally may need a check for the taliban formations.

The "government" (ANA and etc) is likely set low enough, any "central government" of Afghanistan never seems to be worth much militarily - see how they folded recently after 20 odd years of training and suppply from the Western foeces. The governemnt forces were not much help to the Soviets when they had thier turn in the country, either.

The place is best left to itself and if any organisation causes bother that is based there then a quick in and out to smash the bases in future is all that should be contemplated if something more than cruise missile or B52 strikes is needed.

The Taliban stopped the poppy planting last time they were in control, so hopefully they will do that again, at least.

Afghanistan is the Balkans+++...

[blazejos]

Here is what today happens 16th of August 2021

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vbxxi8UGN6E

Panic at Kabul airport
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzISUAacT8A
https://twitter.com/i/status/1427246557200625665

And this video of American transport plane and desperation of peoples around is a proof that nothing is under control today :( (drastic scenes)
https://twitter.com/i/status/1427236717183045642

Al Jazeera about this subject Airport last stand
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjKmLy7CWWI

Streets of Kabul today
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CswMkfstAZo

British soldiers just arrive to face this last stand on airport
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6T7NPg-Wzo

Street crowd opinion about performance of ANA during this war
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyt7G5ED6a4

Real accounts of internal displaced persons what's happens in countryside looks like on every war since antiqity civilians are killed :down: (read men are shots immediately women raped and probably then killed or not)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pY2jBV8WpHo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RW_7rUPWeQM

And here story of Gul teenage girl who try save her parents
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Smi_rEvVQ0s

A month ago this was said about this subject by today victors about future of women's there. "Taliban wants girls above 15 to be "gifted to fighters as wives"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zju15VoByGI

And here article about women soldiers of ANA They fear most to became POW and may fight to death if this last chance pace talks goes to nothing.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2021/08/16/scared-raped-killed-afghanistans-female-soldiers-fear-lives/ ('I'm scared I'll be raped and killed': Afghanistan's female soldiers fear for their lives) Here their training in 2019 captured by france24 camera
https://www.france24.com/en/20190405-51percent-afghanistan-women-soldiers-taliban-norway-gender-equality-argan-oil-morocco

Story of Women inside Afganistan who are now face uncertain future :(
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h31f-slCNok

And here probably words which summarise all this event's in short form by
Seraj Mahbouba and words to all of us on the west.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUJlQbKHD2o

[SaS TrooP]

And here probably words which summarise all this event's in short form by
Seraj Mahbouba and words to all of us on the west.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUJlQbKHD2o

20 years of actual military supplementation and advanced training.
Nearly the entire Marshall's Plan worth of aid to Afghanistan.
More than 2 trillions of military intervention cost.
Aaaaaand there is Afghan government falling like a cripple from a wheelchair the second the nurse turned the head for a second.

Oh, come on woman. If in 20 years Afghans cannot be convinced to broadly understood West, nothing will convince them. Taliban won because they generally do and say what majority of Afghans really believe and want, regardless what bull**** were they previously telling to the ISAF troops shaking their hands.
Afghanistan is for Afghans, if they want it Taliban style, so be it :P
Or they had all the means to fight for it.

[DRG]

It would be interesting to know it was fighters from ISIL/ISIS who made their way to Afganistan to bolster the Taliban that tipped the balance.

[SaS TrooP]

It would be interesting to know it was fighters from ISIL/ISIS who made their way to Afganistan to bolster the Taliban that tipped the balance.

Taliban was ferociously fighting off any ISIS influence, particularly in Herat area, so I would be surprised if they now acted as allies. They have waaaaaay different agenda, both social and religious.

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

To "quantify" the following, 1 is too many, but, war is war. As the release of classified documents released in about the last 15 years or so showed, we were some place else a lot longer then was "advertised" my Dad did an advisor tour while in the USA in either 1957/58 or 1958/59 (1959 is when the war started between North and South Vietnam.)

Both Afghanistan and S. Vietnam with our involvement share similar issues both politically and militarily. Which tried to change their governments but due to incompetency and corruption, they both failed. We spent decades training both so that could fight on their own, the final result? The countries capitals of Kabul fell this past weekend and Saigon fell in 1 day as most historians agree on now-mostly-2 days by some.

Unlike the Ukrainians presently that are fighting to preserve their country (Maybe it's time we bumped up their morale also. At least they're "holding the line".), the other two, besides the above were/are "tribal" in nature regionally in S. Vietnam and more locally in Afghanistan.

The evacuations, no difference. I watched it live on TV then as now and it's the same "F U Soup Sandwich".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LA3uV_YXZAk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36lLBbhnkZU
https://www.forces.net/heritage/history/what-was-fall-saigon
https://thevietnamwar.info/how-long-was-the-vietnam-war/#:~:text=Since%20there%20was%20no%20declaration%20 of%20the%20war%2C,or%2019%20years%2C%20180%20days% 20to%20be%20precise.

To the other...
https://www.forces.net/evergreen/islamic-state-taliban-and-al-qaeda-how-are-they-different

There was guy named George Santayana who said “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”

Sounds about right to me.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

[blazejos]

Arms of Afghanistan army

before soviet invasion until late 70's

small arms rifles/carabines etc
https://wwiiafterwwii.wordpress.com/2015/06/01/wwii-gear-in-afghan-use-part-i-firearms/

vehicles/APC/Tanks
https://wwiiafterwwii.wordpress.com/2015/06/01/wwii-gear-in-afghan-use-part-iii-tanks-and-artillery/

There is an video which was an prediction of this what now happens on Kabul airport

Bagram military base and Jun 5 2021
https://www.scmp.com/video/world/3140043/us-troops-leave-afghanistans-bagram-airbase-without-notifying-new-afghan
June 17 still under control of ANA
https://www.scmp.com/video/asia/3138637/afghans-sift-through-us-military-junkyard-scraps-sell
Now with all this vehicles probably in Taliban hands

And good article about reason why this happens "Why the US-Trained Afghan National Army Have Been Defeated with Ease by the Taliban"
https://www.military.com/daily-news/2021/08/15/why-us-trained-afghan-national-army-have-been-defeated-ease-taliban.html

[Aeraaa]

The article is mostly political, so I'll just leave the link and the warning: politics. However, there are some interesting parts that I'll quote here:

Gen. Petraeus swore he would have the Taliban bleeding from the nose and ready to sign whatever he demanded of them by July 2011. That never happened. McChrystal abandoned COIN after its very first test case in the town of Marjah in the Helmand Province.

By the time Petraeus got there, he’d forgotten all about his own counterinsurgency doctrine and simply escalated special operations night raids and air strikes instead. As the great Gareth Porter proved, they were mostly killing and imprisoning innocent people. The Drone Papers leaked by Daniel Hale further confirmed Porter’s reporting.

The Taliban figured out very quickly that if the U.S. strategy was centered on training up the Afghan National Army, they could thwart that by sending in sleeper agents to commit “insider” or “green on blue” attacks against their American trainers. That was it. The game was over. The distance created between the U.S. soldiers and the local charges by these attacks amounted to the ultimate sabotage of their plans to create an effective force—if that were ever possible.

The ANA was mostly a bunch of “ghost soldiers,” who existed only on paper for the financial gain of the officers in charge. The actual men who showed up were mostly looking for a pair of boots, a rifle and a decent meal. At no time did the largely Tajik and Uzbek army have the Taliban’s sense of morale in fighting for their country. They were fighting at the behest of a foreign power to try to subjugate the population of part of their country, not really in self-defense at all.

https://original.antiwar.com/scott/2021/08/16/blame-bush-and-obama-for-the-afghan-disaster/

[blazejos]

Just d'like to add propostion to Afgan OOB expansion based on data from previous post about equipment of Afgan Army pre 1970.

Next I d'like to propose addition of Afgan ANA commandos units which according to wikipedia were tasked with 80% of all fights with Taliban until recently Kabul fall and desintegration of goverment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_National_Army_Commando_Corps
This movie from July is proof that they were no mercy for them even when they surrender
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/07/13/asia/afghanistan-taliban-commandos-killed-intl-hnk/index.html
Not supraised that Commandos were among the first of this who start resistance under Northern aliance banner recently in Panjshir Valley were heading last troops since 17th August
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panjshir_resistance

This propostion is based on Afgan OOB OOB26 where nothing is changed except units after unit662 where this new units are placed

I also add a couple of lbm's which represents
Pm29900.lbm until Pm29915.lbm tanks and equipment from article
Pm29916.lbm until Pm29924.lbm ANA commandos
Pm29925.lbm to Pm299929.lbm former ANA airforce aircrafts look on PM29928.lbm was described as SU-17 recently captured by Taliban

BTW.
Detailed raport of ANA losses

Equipment losses https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Taliban_offensive

According to an open-source investigative report, published at the Oryx blog by Stijn Mitzer and Joost Oliemans,[68] since June, the Taliban captured twelve tanks (seven T-54s and five T-62s), fifty-one armoured fighting vehicles (forty-six M1117 ASVs, two M1117 Command & Controls and three M113 APCs), sixty-one mortars and pieces of artillery (thirty-five 122mm D-30 howitzers, three 76 mm divisional gun M1942 (ZiS-3)s, one 120mm mortar, two 82mm M69 mortars, one 60mm mortar and nineteen mortars of unknown origin), eight anti-aircraft guns (two 14.5mm KPV-1s and six 23mm ZU-23s), sixteen helicopters (nine Mil Mi-17s, one Mil Mi-24V, four UH-60A BlackHawks and two MD 530Fs), six unmanned aerial vehicles (six Boeing Insitu ScanEagles), and 1,973 trucks, vehicles and jeeps from the Afghan armed forces.[66][250] The Taliban also destroyed nine M1117 ASVs, four Mi-17s and three UH-60A BlackHawks, one DJI Mavic and 104 trucks, vehicles and jeeps. Oryx only counts destroyed vehicles and equipment of which photo or videographic evidence is available.[66]

Since 2 July, US forces conducted multiple airstrikes targeting military equipment captured by the insurgents. US airstrikes destroyed multiple D30 artillery pieces, multiple tanks, MRAPs and Humvees that the Taliban had captured from Afghan security forces.

[blazejos]

If you look again on the movie of execution of Commandos from CNN from July further in the middle of the movie there is an evidence from local peoples that Taliban fighters talk in foreign language that may be an answer for question raised earlier that in this last stand of ANA army face also foreign fighters from outside Afghanistan.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/07/13/asia/afghanistan-taliban-commandos-killed-intl-hnk/index.html

And that is something disturbing that during this last month most capable and trustworthy soldiers of Afghan government were lured inside traps and killed without mercy probably thanks to penetration of ANA by traitors. Even Sun-Tzu mentioned that dagger stab in back or poison is more capable in war than open fight. So when Commandos units who fight moust battles in June-July were lost that is not suprise that regular army units and police simple disintegrate. They waren't fighting this war with so high morale either wasn't so well trained they have only equipment which they left and flee.

If you look on this article about Salima Mazari governor of Chahar Kint
https://twitter.com/hashtag/SalimaMazari?src=hashtag_click
https://www.republicworld.com/world-news/rest-of-the-world-news/afghans-woman-governor-salima-mazari-who-took-up-arms-to-fight-taliban-taken-hostage.html
organised a peoples militia to support ANA units and I have feeling that this wasn't an exception but happens in many parts of Afghanistan. So Afghanistan government fall but many peoples fights and now they face consequence of this I have feeling that they don't believe in promises of pace and personal security that is game now between Taliban and west who need airport secured and not attacked by Taliban.

That people resistance against Taliban from side of society is now weak but already started because broken promises of Taliban government about peace, personal security, and issue of girls taken by fighters. That may also explain now bloody riots against Taliban in Jalalabad Khost and Asadaba,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Afghan_protests
Simple Taliban top official government need international recognition and may promise many things even enforce them in Kabul but smaller warlords in provinces don't care they are interested in rape and pillage + killing of their enemies even if that is discouraged by new Taliban government in Kabul.

That is why peoples who are on proscription lists, soldiers from broken units try to starts resistance. They have no other option Taliban want them dead west selfish caring only about safety of their evacuation and airport so probably now they can't even have any help from anywhere.

Here is article about one of this last stand place PANJSHIR VALLEY
in 16 of august they start to collect vehicles and helicopters from broken units and prepare https://nypost.com/2021/08/18/inside-the-afghanistan-province-that-refuses-taliban-control/ they even have their flag which is decadent from Northern alliance from 2001 https://www.republicworld.com/world-news/rest-of-the-world-news/afghan-resistance-against-taliban-led-by-ahmed-masood-and-amrullah-saleh-unveils-its-flag.html
Here is more about rescued vehicles and equipment
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9909029/Armed-guerrilla-resistance-led-deposed-vice-president-forming-Afghanistan-Russia-says.html
https://www.trtworld.com/asia/anti-taliban-forces-coming-together-in-panjshir-valley-says-russia-49308
https://www.the-sun.com/news/3499828/sas-afghan-commandos-resistance-taliban/

And here about arms and gear of ANA commandos in hands of Taliban
https://www.the-sun.com/news/3506397/taliban-mocks-west-propaganda-video-stolen-us-military-gear/

[MarkSheppard]

The morale and rally may need a check for the taliban formations.

The "government" (ANA and etc) is likely set low enough, any "central government" of Afghanistan never seems to be worth much militarily - see how they folded recently after 20 odd years of training and suppply from the Western foeces.

Apparently supply/organization in the ANA and Police forces were nonexistent:

1.) Many ANA people hadn't been paid since...around May of this year. If you're not getting paid for the last 4 months, why stay?

2.) Many people were "ghost" soldiers, existing on paper to supply graft and corruption -- this was also AFAIK an issue with the Soviets in Afghanistan and/or Chechnya, but because Soviet organization was set up around WWII style supply distribution -- if you reported headcount accurately, you got less food/ammo, so there was an incentive to report dead people as alive to get their supplies.

In the Afghan case, it was pure corruption, pocketing the "ghost soldiers'" salaries.

3.) Afghans couldn't even get "into" logistics -- many US units started carrying extra ammo and mags to resupply their assigned police; because the Afghan Police refused to issue out ammo -- you were given 2 magazines for your pistol, and you couldn't get any more until you came back with no ammo.

The Afghans didn't get the concept that waiting until a unit was "black" in regards to supply was really bad.

4.) And this next issue is endemic to tribal culture -- this was also encountered in Mali (Africa) by the French who were attempting to train anti Shahib militas.

Basically, local tribal councils keep the best quality manpower for their local militas and tribal police -- as a consequence, only the total fookin' idiots of that area get given up whenever the central government/police come around asking for manpower.

This has a lot of knock on effects for trying to run a national army in areas of intense tribalism -- you're having to explain to the poorest possible quality of personnel why preventive maintenance is good for firearms and vehicles, and why you shouldn't be smoking hash while on guard duty (!!!)

[MarkSheppard]

From another site:

Whilst it has long being known that ~85 billion dollars of military materials were left behind there has been limited info as to the exact nature. Its should be noted part of that figure is for sustainment of Afghan forces funded through the Afghanistan Security Forces Fund.

This is in part summarized in GAO-17-667R (which has been deleted from the Governments web site); but can be recovered in google cache:

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:ibdZk1clF6QJ:https://www.gao.gov/assets/690/687205.pdf+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

162,643 pieces of communications equipment - inc:
75,256 VHF radios e.g. Datron PRC-1070/1777 and HH7700
66,439 non tactical radios e.g. Motorola GM360, CODAN NGT SRx, AR-8200
13,464 HF radios - e.g. Codan 2110 manpack, Datron RT-7000
5,777 multiband raios - e.g. Harris RF5800M and RF-7850
2,107 ulta and super HF radios e.g. - Harris RF-7800W and Johnson APCO-25

75,898 military vehicles - inc:
42,604 light tactical vehicles -cargo trucks pick ups - Ford Rangers
22,174 Humvees - ambulance, cargo, troop enclosure and gun truck variants
8,998 MTVs - MTV international, 5 ton cargo and general transport trucks
1,005 recovery vehicles - Navistar 7000MV and M1249 wrecker
928 MRAPs - MRAP maxxpro, anbulance and combat variants
189 APCs - M113A2 and M577A2

599,690 Weapons inc:
358,530 rifles - M16, M4, AK47 Dragunov sniper rifle
126,295 pistols - M9 and G19
64,363 machine guns - M249, M240, RPK and NSV(12.7mm)
25,327 grenade launchers - M203 and GP-25/30
12,692 shot guns - M500, M590a1 and M870
9,877 RPG - RPG-7 and SPG-9
2,606 indirect fire weapons - 60mm mortar, 82mm mortar and D-30 122mm howitzers

29,681 EOD
13,265 ECMs - Symphony and Pipper
13,367 mine detectors - VMH3CS and CMD
1,093 combat robots
1,101 EOD suits
496 mine rollers
359x-ray systems - RTR4-L

16,191 pieces of surveillance and reconnaissance equipment
16,035 NODS inc PVS14, PVS7, ANVIS-6 and ANVIS-9
120 radio monitoring systems - wolfhounds
22 ground based towers - Aerostat IDT
8 scan eagles
6 surveillance ballons - Aerostat

208 Aircraft
110 helicopters - inc Mi17, MD-530
60 transport aircraft - C208, C182, C130, T182, G222, AN32
20 Light attack planes - A29
18 intelligence, reconnaissance and surveillance planes - PC12
(with full weapons systems and munitions)

UH60 were part of the forward looking program for ANDSF - the number delivered (if any is unclear)

[blazejos]

Just d'like to add data about afganistan air force from 1946 until now and so called The Taliban Air Force 2021 data which I collected so far.

My sources
https://military.wikia.org/wiki/List_of_Afghan_Air_Force_aircraft
http://www.easternorbat.com/html/afganairforce_in_1979_eng.html
https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2021/08/the-taliban-air-force-inventory.html

There is OOb96 which contains airforce aircrafts and lbm's

[whdonnelly]

Would like to add that a majority of the larger equipment left with the ANA was beat up and nearing the end of useful service. A possible exception were the A-29s but even they won't last without maintenance.
The same is true for most of the contractor equipment, a lot of it was hand-me-downs. The Embassy had the least worn kit but not much of it.

[MarkSheppard]

Would like to add that a majority of the larger equipment left with the ANA was beat up and nearing the end of useful service. A possible exception were the A-29s but even they won't last without maintenance.

Planes are most certainly deadlined soon; but a lot of the smaller stuff (and ground stuff) can be redneck engineered; and this version of the taliban has set up their own Special Forces units:

A.) Badr 313 --- named after the battle of Badr, where Mohammed had 313 men.

B.) Red Unit (Sara Kheta) -- per Wiki:

The Red Unit, which numbered approximately 300 by 2016, reportedly employs commando tactics and is equipped with "advanced weaponry", including night vision equipment, heavy machine guns and M4 carbines.[10][11] Members have been seen during photo ops to be carrying Icom IC-V8 VHF radios.[12] They are known to be especially proficient in night combat, and considered to be better trained and equipped than most Afghan National Army soldiers.[7]

Though generally called the Taliban's special forces[1] or commandos,[3] analysts have argued that the Red Unit was probably not performing traditional special operations missions, but were, instead, being used as shock troops or a rapid deployment force.[2][8][13] Moving on motorcycles, the unit often raids isolated outposts, destroying the local defences, and then retreating before other forces can respond.[7] The Red Unit often spearheads Taliban offensives,[14] as it has proven to be very effective in combat. Nevertheless, its equipment and training are inferior to those of Western special forces

So expect those:

162,000~ pieces of communications equipment
16,000~ pieces of Night Vision Equipment

to be used in expanding Badr 313/Red Unit to larger formation sizes in the short term; and in the long term, being cannibalized for spares -- and they have enough to keep it going for a while.

[Karagin]

Having worked with the Afghani Army I doubt very much if they will still have much of anything left up and running in a month to six months. They could not or would not understand that engines need maintenance.

All the small arms are going to do is allow them to arm more men, but the ammo is not compatible with the majority of what they have. Going to be interesting to see what they cobble together in their village forges to keep the M16s etc...supplied with ammo.

[DRG]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-43500299
Russia 'arming the Afghan Taliban', says US ( 2018 )
..... and the convoluted Irony of that is staggering

" the enemy of my enemy is my friend ( even if they used to be my enemy..)

5.56 ammo will not be hard to acquire methinks. It's used worldwide. Keeping the engines maintained is another issue

[blazejos]

Some proof about weapons "export":confused: from afganistan after Taliban tekover
https://twitter.com/i/status/1432049552018731010

Source Northern Aliance
https://twitter.com/NorthernAliance

[blazejos]

Update on situation inside Afganistan

Taliban claim final conquer of Panshir Valley. And that is probably true they enter inside valley and fights if still are ongoing probably are on final bastions of resistance in mountains.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m9X1vsWKso

Resistance is still fighting but now lost last province
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o21nUTm6ZiA

But what is interesting Taliban to have this swift victory use external resources available.
According to this video from Pakistan


their Cobra Attack helicopters
Their aircraft JF-17 Thunder
And Pakistani Commandos forces which were inserted by helicopters inside valley


Resistance show one photo of shot down Pakistani fighter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcBkA68s2YM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcBkA68s2YM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPGYJ6jwvfg

So such relay on external power openly without hiding it made outrage inside country and internal protest with simple phrase "Pakistani go home" so looks that was a danger move from Taliban side probably they don't care and thinking that such open show who is their ally doesn't meter now when war is nearly over.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1i69iD9ZQs
looks that ordinary peoples does care and probably negotiation was better option because the may have now many ordinary people against their new government. For me looks like military victory for price of internal political disaster. If that will go this way no more "inclusive" government because people saw that they are only emanation of next external invader.

Brave women's made protest even earlier in 4th of September
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4NrNn8Zk8c

And now they join together with angry men because Pakistani involvement
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghVXodtnYTo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FYAxA0ekFw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEgAKb3YnCA
Here from London and then from Herat people shout "Death to Pakistan"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiYaQGofyPs

And here most disturbing video women's held on underground parking (Makeshift prison) by Taliban arrested during protests
https://twitter.com/MuslimShirzad/status/1435161667466403842

[blazejos]

Final version of additions to Afganistan OOB :smirk:
That is all what I collected about afgan army

New vehicles and units are after unit 662 with their lbm's representing vehicles in Afgan service

Pictures represents:
Pm29900.lbm to 29915.lbm Afgan armoured vehicles and guns
Pm29916.lbm to 29924.lbm ANA special forces Commandos
Pm29925l.bm to 29969.lbm Airforce
29970 to 29982 various variants of Ford Ranger
29983 to 30001 various variants of HMMWV
30004&30002 BMP-1 afgan service
29800 ANA ford ranger with HMG
29801 Taliban ford ranger with ZSU-23
29802 to 29806 ANA soliders with various guns
29807 to 29824 Taliban fighters with various weapons usually AK with RPG-7
29826 to 29831 Afgan army truck and amphibs

So what we have here armoured vehicles:
-Disston 6t
-Renault M17 FT
-SU-76M
-CV-35
-Universal carier
-IP Carrier
-BMP-(Gun) (with zis-3)
-BMP-(ZU) (with ZSU-23)
-Citroen-Kegresse M23
-Lancia 1ZM
-T-34/85 (also covering their use during soviet intervention)

Soviet trucks:
-ZiS 6x6
-GAZ-66
-ZiL 6x6 (ZU-23)
-ZiL 6x6
-Kraz-214

American trucks:
-FMTV Truck
-2&1/2 Ton Truck


Amphib vehicles:
-GAZ-46
-BAV-485 6x6
-K-61

Utility vehicles:
-UAZ Jeep
-Dodge WC51

- 107mm Type 63 from Chine early 70's

Various armed versions of:
-Ford Ranger
-HMMWV

ANA infantery units with varius weapons gear which were sold to Afganistan last 20 years
-Polish wz.96 Beryl
-Canadian C7A1
-USA M16A2
-Russian AK47 & AK74

- 155mm M114 guns
- BTR-80 sold to pro soviet goverment in 1989 and stil in inventory of ANA and american M113A2

[WilliamB]

The October issue of AirForces magazine has an article on the Afghan Air Force just before and during the collapse. I don't know how useful this information will be but I thought I would post it.

Quoting from a June 30th report by the Special Inspector General for Afghanistan Reconstruction the operational strength of the Afghan A.F., excluding aircraft not in country was:

23 A-29B Super Tucano
10 AC-208B Eliminators
23 Cessna 208B Grand Caravans
3 C-130H Hercules
33 Mi-8/17 Hips
43 MD530F Cayuse Warriors
33 UH-60A+ Black Hawks

22 fixed wing aircraft and 24 helicopters, types not specified, were reportedly flown to Uzbekistan. 1 UH-60A+ is reported to have crashed in Uzbekistan when it ran out of fuel and 1 A-29B was destroyed when it collided with an Uzbek A.F. Mig-29.
About 40 operational fixed wing and helicopters are believed to have been captured by the Taliban, including 2 Mi-8/17s, 5 to 7 MD530Fs, at least 1 A-29B and an unknown number of AC-208Bs.

[blazejos]

When comes to my mind Technical vehicles usually that was a Toyota pickup like this but now In Afganistan Ford is a chariot of war.

Famous "The evolution of revolution"
https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/aB28yrQ_700b.jpg

But toyota is also in usage even if smaller number
Here Taliban Special Forces in Kabul 1 September 2021
https://images.newindianexpress.com/uploads/user/imagelibrary/2021/9/1/w900X450/Taliban_kabul_AP.jpg?w=900&dpr=1.0

Here is article which explain Taliban victory from Technical usage perspective: https://olhardigital.com.br/en/2021/08/16/carros-e-tecnologia/tecnico-caminhonete-taliba/

Here photo from times of Afgan war in 1980 and as technicals were use GAZ-69 and GAZ-66
https://topwar.ru/uploads/posts/2014-04/1398455656_0_b534a_e0b70732_xl.jpg

Toyota's may come near end of this war late 1980's here some photos https://houseofqueeg.wordpress.com/2014/09/11/technicals-spotlight-no1/ even Specnaz used vehicles captured from Partisans delivered by West https://t.me/anna_news/8903 https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1318993324376805376 look's that they were so happy from this captured vehicles that they use even now modern equivalent of Toyota hilux in their special forces here article https://defence-blog.com/russian-special-forces-receives-toyota-hilux-pickups/https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EMrKSUjXkAEIARj?format=jpg&name=medium

[DRG]

Final version of additions to Afghanistan OOB :smirk:


Błażej

While I acknowledge the time and effort you put in---- this OOB is not quite useless but it certainly is close

You added units but you did not create formations for them.

How is it you missed that important detail ??? You could not have tested anything you did in the game

An orphaned units check should look like this......

246 - Assault Boat (042 - Assault Boat) - ORPHANED -
249 - Crew (054 - Crew) - ORPHANED -

====================
Searching for units which do not have a container formation at a particular date
====================

246 - Assault Boat (042 - Assault Boat) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/46
249 - Crew (054 - Crew) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/46

====================
**** Run Complete ****


This is what your Afghan OOB looks like when the same check is ran

246 - Assault Boat (042 - Assault Boat) - ORPHANED -this is normal
249 - Crew (054 - Crew) - ORPHANED -this is normal
THESE ARE NOT
672 - Disston 6t (102 - Reserve Tank) - ORPHANED -
673 - Renault M17 FT (102 - Reserve Tank) - ORPHANED -
675 - CV-35 (102 - Reserve Tank) - ORPHANED -
687 - ANA Commando (083 - Commandos) - ORPHANED -
688 - ANA Commando (083 - Commandos) - ORPHANED -
689 - ANA Com Scout (088 - Commando Scouts) - ORPHANED -
690 - ANA Com Sniper (147 - Commando Sniper) - ORPHANED -
692 - MaxxPro 4x4 (219 - Light MRV APC) - ORPHANED -
693 - Cougar HEV 4x4 (219 - Light MRV APC) - ORPHANED -
694 - Cougar HEV 4x4 (219 - Light MRV APC) - ORPHANED -
698 - Ford Ranger APC (136 - Improvised APC) - ORPHANED -
699 - Ford Police APC (136 - Improvised APC) - ORPHANED -
700 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
701 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
702 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
703 - Ford Ranger AT (129 - Light SP ATGM) - ORPHANED -
704 - Toyota AAR (128 - Light SPAA Vehicle) - ORPHANED -
705 - Toyota AAG (128 - Light SPAA Vehicle) - ORPHANED -
706 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
709 - HMMWV-MMG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
710 - HMMWV-AAG (128 - Light SPAA Vehicle) - ORPHANED -
711 - HMMWV-SPG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
712 - HMMWV-MMG-SPG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
713 - HMMWV-MMG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - ORPHANED -
716 - HMMWV-Box-APC (136 - Improvised APC) - ORPHANED -
756 - T-34/85 (102 - Reserve Tank) - ORPHANED -
759 - T-34/85 (102 - Reserve Tank) - ORPHANED -
761 - T-34/85 (102 - Reserve Tank) - ORPHANED -
765 - ZiL 6x6 (ZU-23) (181 - AA Truck) - ORPHANED -
773 - BAV-485 6x6 (033 - Light Amphibian) - ORPHANED -
774 - K-61 (033 - Light Amphibian) - ORPHANED -

====================
Searching for units which do not have a container formation at a particular date
====================

246 - Assault Boat (042 - Assault Boat) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/46.... this is normal
249 - Crew (054 - Crew) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/46.... this is normal
THESE ARE NOT
665 - SU-76M (021 - SP Artillery) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/52
668 - Universal (025 - APC (Track)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/47
672 - Disston 6t (102 - Reserve Tank) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/56
673 - Renault M17 FT (102 - Reserve Tank) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/60
674 - SU-76M (021 - SP Artillery) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/76
675 - CV-35 (102 - Reserve Tank) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/51
687 - ANA Commando (083 - Commandos) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/108
688 - ANA Commando (083 - Commandos) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/108
689 - ANA Com Scout (088 - Commando Scouts) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/108
690 - ANA Com Sniper (147 - Commando Sniper) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/108
692 - MaxxPro 4x4 (219 - Light MRV APC) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/115
693 - Cougar HEV 4x4 (219 - Light MRV APC) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/112
694 - Cougar HEV 4x4 (219 - Light MRV APC) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/112
698 - Ford Ranger APC (136 - Improvised APC) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/110
699 - Ford Police APC (136 - Improvised APC) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/110
700 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/110
701 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/110
702 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/110
703 - Ford Ranger AT (129 - Light SP ATGM) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/110
704 - Toyota AAR (128 - Light SPAA Vehicle) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/92
705 - Toyota AAG (128 - Light SPAA Vehicle) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/92
706 - Ford Ranger MG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/110
709 - HMMWV-MMG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/112
710 - HMMWV-AAG (128 - Light SPAA Vehicle) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/115
711 - HMMWV-SPG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/115
712 - HMMWV-MMG-SPG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/117
713 - HMMWV-MMG (126 - Gun APC (Wheeled)) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/115
716 - HMMWV-Box-APC (136 - Improvised APC) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/112
756 - T-34/85 (102 - Reserve Tank) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/74
759 - T-34/85 (102 - Reserve Tank) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/78
761 - T-34/85 (102 - Reserve Tank) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/88
765 - ZiL 6x6 (ZU-23) (181 - AA Truck) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/80
773 - BAV-485 6x6 (033 - Light Amphibian) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/55
774 - K-61 (033 - Light Amphibian) - has no corresponding formation at - 1/55

====================
**** Run Complete ****

If you want what you have done considered further for the next update then you need to give those Orphaned units a home in properly named formations that do not have gaps that will pass all the MOBHack database checks and when it does I will take another look at it.


Also, my advice to you in regards to PIC / LBM's is the same as my suggestion to Michal.... IN THE FUTURE either spend some extra time to do them better or just supply the original photos or a list of links to them. ( and we do not need "unique" Afgan unit photos unless it is troops )

[blazejos]

Hello
great that you check this to be honest I never considered adding formations to this units list which I done for Afgan OOB :(

But If you are really interested that should be no problem for me to made this as a proposition of changes in actually Afgan OOB just give me a few days and I will upload this units together with proposed new formations for them If that will made this propositions usefully?

[DRG]

I don't want to have to guess what the formations should be. I have already added a few units for early into the OOB but that is as far as I am going to go for now

[blazejos]

Afgan OOB already improved now units are with formations and all palletes inside pictures checked.

[DRG]

You didn't run a final check and there were units with start dates that did not match the only formation they were used which in that case would not have shown as problem in the game but it points out you didn't do the checks and there were doubles for the T34/85 that should not have been left in but I have sorted that and a few other little issues all out..... finally

[blazejos]

Photo of Lancia 1ZM and Citroen-Kegresse M23 in Afganistan in recent years during American presence here

http://i88.servimg.com/u/f88/13/68/96/25/camp_w10.jpg


And here original Photo of C-K M23 from French army during WW2 in Syria can be used to replace "polish wz.28" in afghani OOB even if they are quite similar :)

https://zbiam.pl/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/03-744x574.jpg

https://www.chars-francais.net/2015/index.php/6-archives/des-origines-1930/1489-1923-citroen-m23

will be nice to have C-K M23 also in French WW2 then Vichy OOB because they were used by French army in Syria defence against allies in 1941

here schematics
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Citro%C3%ABn_K%C3%A9gresse_M_1923,_Automitrai lleuse_de_Cavalerie_(cropped).png

icons are already done and inside both games SPWW2 & SPMBT

[DRG]

will be nice to have C-K M23 also in French WW2 then Vichy OOB because they were used by French army in Syria defence against allies in 1941

here schematics
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Citro%C3%ABn_K%C3%A9gresse_M_1923,_Automitrai lleuse_de_Cavalerie_(cropped).png

icons are already done and inside both games SPWW2 & SPMBT

Vichy unit 396 - AMC P16 Mle 29 is more than "good enough" for something that insignificant to 99.99% of players

[blazejos]

I know that eyes of all peoples there on forum are now on Ukraine not Afganistan but here I d'like to propose modified Afgan OOB together with additional Lbm's and txt files for Islamic Emirate of Afganistan.

So this OOB has now included New army created with weapons and equipment of former ANA army + Armed opostion forces NRF which still fights against emirate forces even after fall of Panshir Valley.

Here description of New Lbm's
Pm29844.lbm to Pm29846.lbm GAZ/UAZ Technicals
Pm29847.lbm to Pm29865.lbm New Emirate Army
Pm29866.lbm to Pm29868.lbm Mujahedinen from 80's
Pm29869.lbm Emirate Mi-8
Pm29870.lbm Self defense unit from 2021
Pm29871.lbm to Pm29878.lbm Mujahedinen from 80's
Pm29879.lbm to Pm29884.lbm Emirate armoured units and soliders
Pm29885.lbm to Pm29886.lbm Mujahedinen from 80's
Pm29887.lbm Afgan Army from 1950's
Pm29888.lbm to Pm29899.lbm Mujahedinen from 80's/ 90's

Also Gaz69 & UAZ469 pictures not limited only to Afganistan but very usefully there for technicals but also for others Eastern Europens states

Pm30007.lbm to Pm30022.lbm Gaz69
Pm30023.lbm to Pm30038.lbm Uaz469

[blazejos]

Here quite intresting info Afghanistan Begins Restoring M114 Howitzers source
https://mil.in.ua/en/news/afghanistan-begins-restoring-m114-howitzers/ so units 743&744 from Obat26 Afganistan are back in buisness. Also unint 37 122mm M38 FG is back in usage. Futher in that article I found that they also have BM-27 Uragan 220mm rocket systems which is not in oob at all propably from times of soviet regime. Here is all what Afganistan show on military parade https://mil.in.ua/en/news/elbrus-and-luna-m-tbms-shown-off-at-afghanistan-parade/

[DRG]

Unit 412 (Cavalry Scouts) makes airplane sounds while traveling and should be adjusted from 7 to 17.

My copy of the OOB already uses sound 17 for unit 412 I have NO IDEA when I changed it but it was already changed

[Mobhack]

As does mine