The tank that really never was

[vyrago]

https://wavellroom.com/2023/02/10/armata-the-story-is-over/

Was the T-14 just a dream? Thoughts?

[DRG]

:doh:

WHY does this not surprise me?

I will wait for further confirmation before pulling them from the OOB

Of course, I found some better photos of the Turret a month ago and redid them.......
:banghead:

Thanks for the heads-up

More than a novel tank is lost. In June 2015, The Royal United Services institute (RUSI) hosted an event on Armata, presented by the knowledgeable Ukrainian Igor Sutyagin. The talks highlighted the programme was about a family of ‘Armata’ vehicles (T-15 heavy IFV, T-16 BREM-T ARRV, K-25 Kurganets and others). It is highly unlikely any of these projects will now proceed in the near/mid-term or at all. The future looks much like the out-dated Soviet past. As a final blow T-14 Armata’s improved 2A82-IM 125mm cannon – an undeniable upgrade on comparatively under-gunned Russian tanks – will not serve on T-90M. The breech block doesn’t fit.

I have a couple of months to get further info before the next update but FOR NOW all of these чудо-оружие are pushed to 6/125 start

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

I'm not saying a word here that I haven't said for years now about ARMATA. You can add the BOOMERANG to that list well as it CURRENTLY looks. It's the T-95 all over again.

What I think is we have them in and unless something does actually come along, and you need the slots you can consider putting on the "chopping block" then.

I've also said for years that the 2025/2026 Submission Campaign would act as the way to "clean up" those OOB's that have equipment that never saw the "light of day" that's my plan but some have already identified themselves to me for instance HIMARS to Australia and CHALLENGER 3 for the UK.

All we can is track these things until either the trail goes cold or we're closing in on the quarry.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

[vyrago]

So it seems for now, Russia forges ahead with the T-80/T-72/T-90 as their "future" AFV? Perhaps they'll revisit a less ambition design like the Obj 640 "Black Eagle" or is that basically on par with T-90M?

[DRG]

BOOMERANG now added to the 6/125 vehicle group. I thought I had forgotten one but couldn't think what it was

I MAY leave them in so people can play "what if" if these do indeed get put to the distant back burner or move them to Red as "WHAT IF" vehicles and that frees up some Russian unit and weapons slots an d still allows " what if" play........ we'll see what else we learn in the next couple months

[DRG]

So it seems for now, Russia forges ahead with the T-80/T-72/T-90 as their "future" AFV? Perhaps they'll revisit a less ambition design like the Obj 640 "Black Eagle" or is that basically on par with T-90M?

Well, that's another can - o - worms that will need to be a wait-and-see. According to that article, the steel mill that makes the armour plate is bankrupted

[DRG]

I've also said for years that the 2025/2026 Submission Campaign would act as the way to "clean up" those OOB's that have equipment that never saw the "light of day" that's my plan but some have already identified themselves to me for instance HIMARS to Australia and CHALLENGER 3 for the UK.

HIMARS is not in the Australia OOB. I have been thinking of adding it for Mid 2025 but have not yet

https://www.australiandefence.com.au/defence/joint/australia-purchases-himars#:~:text=%E2%80%9CHIMARS%20enables%20a%20gen erational%20leap,integrate%20into%20a%20coalition% 20effort.%E2%80%9D

suggests "The first deliveries of the HIMARS are expected by 2025, and will be in use by 2026-27"

So right on the edge of maybe/maybe not

Chally 3...... at the rate they are going with the Ajax there is no chance at all for that.

BUT....whatever happens with the ones being set to Ukraine may influence development .....or not

That said, for giggles I have put one in a few weeks ago... start date 12/125 <g>

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

I actually get this about 2 days before it's published in the paper format in this case the 16th. I'm talking about the official ARMY paper published for the MOD.
"The initial delivery is due in 2025, with the final operating capability (FOC-mine.) planned for 2029."

PNG was too big to send here. If you want it, I can forward the email onto you to see if you can access it. Hopefully not "IP" protected.

Concerning the question on the T-95 well my opinion I have felt the "BLACK EAGLE" which was developed just ahead of the T-95 was a slightly better tank. It had the ability to use a 125mm, 135mm (Planned for the production models.), 140mm and finally the 152mm main guns. The highlighted ones were tested from what I could find. ROF 10-12 RDS. Also was to be equipped with an air search radar with a detection range of 16km..

T-95 would've been a safer one for the crew was armed with a 152mm with a 30mm secondary weapon. Also, this tank MUCH DEEPER into the developmental phase. And then it all stopped.

This tank I feel would've been more competitive against Western tanks.

Both were looking at unmanned turrets new armor, APS etc. I think the "BLACK EAGLE" has a more efficient hull design overall and was considered the lowest profile tank in the world at the time.

T-95 was the precursor to ARMATA and as you'll see they share a very close commonality to each other. overall.

BLACK EAGLE was my first tank posted in this Thread because I was impressed by its potential as I was with the T-95 however, I can't say I was as impressed in the same way with the ARMATA.

There were some good posts on the first two tanks above in the beginning of the Thread you might find interesting.

If you were to ask me what tanks motivated me the most to do what I do here it would be the BLACK EAGLE and the ironically now, Ukrainian YATAGAN because they both took something "old" and "thought outside of the box" and made it not only better but competitive as well.
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t12_black_eagle.htm
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t95.htm
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t84_yatagan.htm
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/armata.htm

Forgot to answer the main question, I feel the BLACK EAGLE is better than the T-90M in many ways, especially if updated to today's standard than it'd be no contest.

I gotta hit the rack.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

Well, it seems that talk of Russia putting into combat their T-14 (And having that number of them.) is continuing to come out of Russia from various sources. They want to fight specifically the LEOPARD 2A6 tanks that the Ukraine will receive making it a 1:1 ratio in tanks on tanks.

Who will win?

With German crews I'd say the LEOPARD 2A6.

Considering the T-14 will be manned by the crews that have been operating them for about ~2yrs. now during its extended "OPEVAL" against "fast tracked" Ukrainian crews (Who are probably combat crews of this war.) and it being the LEOPARD 2A6
(I recommended one in a post.) (Latest current versions in operation are being converted to the 2A7.), I would have to give a slight edge to the Ukrainian crews.

This is based further upon an article I posted in here within the last 10 days or so where the Russian crews were having issues with the T-14 and basically provided feedback and I'll be nice and just say the tank wasn't ready for combat.

OF COURSE THIS IS ALL JUST A MATTER OF SUPPOSITION AND SPECULATION, how's that for CYA!?! :D
https://www.armyrecognition.com/ukraine_-_russia_conflict_war_2022/russia_to_deploy_in_ukraine_their_t-14_armata_tanks_to_counter_leopard_2a6_and_m1a2_ab rams_mbts.html
(NOTE: The LEOPARD 2A6 has NEVER been used in combat either.)

What is of much more interest to me is the following.
Off the top of my head, it looks like, and I can't remember the name of the tank now, that it's built upon the same T-72 extended chassis as the other was we discussed with Marcello a few years back.

However, I end both with this quote from the next ref.
"As for the Russian T-14 Armata MBT, the new North Korean seems like a very modern and technologically advanced combat vehicle but there is no evidence that the tank is fully functional and ready for deployment in combat. " That goes for BOTH tanks.
https://www.armyrecognition.com/weapons_defence_industry_military_technology_uk/analysis_new_north_korea_mbt_main_battle_tank_appe ars_at_february_2023_military_parade.html

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

[DRG]

"Wait and see" is our motto. Sometimes we guess right.... sometimes not so much......so......."Wait and see" I will not make the T-14 "active" until one shows up in Ukraine

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

Well :doh: put Post 600 in this, the wrong Thread. I hope the other is in the right Thread!?! :shock:

Regards
Pat
:capt:

[DRG]

Well :doh: put Post 600 in this, the wrong Thread. I hope the other is in the right Thread!?! :shock:

Regards
Pat


:capt:

All fixed now

[DRG]

You can add the BOOMERANG to that list well as it CURRENTLY looks. It's the T-95 all over again.



MAYBE NOT PAT.................

https://www.armyrecognition.com/images/stories/conflict/russia_invasion_ukraine/Russia_sends_to_Ukraine_its_new_local-made_Bumerang_8x8_armored_vehicles_925_001.jpg

https://www.armyrecognition.com/ukraine_-_russia_conflict_war_2022/russia_sends_to_ukraine_its_new_local-made_bumerang_8x8_armored_vehicles.html


According to information published on the Russian Social Network "VK" on February 28, 2023, Russia send its latest generation of local-made 8x8 wheeled armored vehicles Bumerang to the NVO (Novorossiya or New Russia) zone, also referred to as the Union of People's Republics, the confederation the self-proclaimed Donetsk People's Republic (DPR) and the Luhansk People's Republic (LPR) in Eastern Ukraine.