New MA game - Microless finished, congrats GFSnl
 

Crossposting from invision:

Hey. This is for anyone who would like to try a bit of an experiment with micro reduction by removing items from the game. There should be an increased emphasis on magic and national strengths. This has nothing to do with SCs and such being overpowered, it's just a fun little experiment.

Anyway, aside from the removal of items (all items) there will be no other changes. So, here's the proposed game settings:

Game info
Name - Microless
Schedule - 1st turn 48h, then 24h until players prefer 48h. And so on.
Players - 9
Nation Selection - First come first serve, no water nations
Diplomacy - Machiavellian. Trades are binding.
Map - A No Indy map to be determined after signups are finished.

Game Settings
Age - Middle Age
Independent Strength - Standard
Research - Standard
Magic Sites - Default
Money - Default
Resources - Default
Supplies - Default
Random Events- Default
Re-naming - On
Score Graphs - On
Hall Of Fame - 15
Mods: A modified version of CBM 1.92 which I will create.

Players:
1. Kestrel - Ermor
2. jimbojones1971 - Jotunheim
3. Korwin - Bandar Log
4. Ghoul31 - Marignon
5. Valerius - Vanheim
6. Maerlande - Pythium
7. GFSnl - Ogre Kingdoms
8. Snegir6 - Mictlan
9. AreaOfEffect - Machaka
10. Ossa - Shinuyama?

Mod can be found here!
And the map here
And the map image for anyone who needs it: Linky
Renamed copy of ogre kingdoms 1.0 - as well

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Interesting. I'll give this a shot as Jotunheim, but only if I can be "Secret Ninja Player".

When you make your CBM variant, might be worth using the one Calahan made that fixes the Ettin site.

Getting magic diversity with no items, and no indies, will be most amusing. Are mercs allowed?

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

marignon

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Aaargh, without MR boosting gear cannot resist the pull of an experimental game. :) With these settings I'm going to say blood magic ftw. Vanheim, please.

Btw, if a random event gives you a magic item can you use it? This would be a rare enough event that I think it would be cool if you could.

If mercs are allowed it would also be amusing to see the bidding wars that take place for the mages. ;)

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Also, if Wish is staying in the game what is the policy regarding wishing for magic items?

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

This is an interesting exercise. Of course it changes the balance of power between thugs/SCs and troops/mages but you also have to really think about which globals and summons are most important to you since you can't use items to bootstrap your way up.

It had occurred to me to try a game without any path boosters but this goes far beyond that. Should be fun. :)

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Valerius - sure, if you find a magic item go ahead. Same with wishing. If you really want it that badly go ahead. And mercs are indeed allowed.

MA mod nations are also allowed.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Hmm, just how badly do I want the gate stone? Have to think that one over.

Thanks for organizing the game.

Btw, I think jimbojones1971 wanted to play Jotun.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Um. Oops :)

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

I'm not happy with my Van builds, please switch my nation to Pan.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Okay, switched you Valerius.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

I'll bit. Machaka.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Any plans for when this will kick off? Still trying to work out what I should do with my pretender :-)

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Same here; the lack of boosters means you'll need your pretender for a lot of high level magic.

And on that note... Sorry rdonj, but could you please switch me one more time, to Man? This is a habit of mine, that I'll switch nations a couple of times before the game begins. But I'll stick with this one. I think. :p

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Machaka please

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Mmh, I'd forgotten to update the player list here when the last guy joined up on the other forum. Well. I guess we can take you ossa, but you're absolutely the last and you'll need to pick a different nation.

Speaking of maps, I'll take suggestions for maps now. And the game will start when I've finished the mod and decided on a map. I may end up no-indifying a map for the game, which wouldn't take too long. Anyway most likely the game will start in 2-3 days.

And sure valerius, I'll switch you again :P

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Sorry Ossa, called it last night.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Wow, it's been a while since I've been in a game that will need a map this large. Hopefully the no forging aspect is successful in reducing micro. ;)

Maybe elmokki's Plane of Rusty Nails? Slightly higher prov/player average than I go for these days but not too extreme. And it looks like Cal uploaded a version with 10 land/1 water fixed starts to the server so maybe you could use that as a base to make a NI version (and maybe eliminate the water start as well, though I suppose it won't do any harm leaving it in in case someone else wants to use the NI version with a water nation).

While I don't like the Dominions water nation mechanics and am glad there are none of them in the game (which in any case would be a problem with the lack of magic items) the fact that the map does have some water provinces will give amphibious/aquatic units a chance to shine.

Or maybe Shadowshore? A bit lower provs/player average might help make the endgame more tolerable for the final nations.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Hmm... then I'll go with Bakenobo

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Hey. Coming to you from my phone today. Have no internet for my computer, so the game will be delayed. Finished the mod last night but haven't gotten to maps yet. Ideally I'd have released the mod today but that's not going to happen now. Hopefully will have internet access again tomorrow to get this game going.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Hey everyone, I have internet access again now. I'm aiming to have a map chosen/prepared by tomorrow. I'll be starting by looking at plane of rusty nails, as that is the only map vote I received.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

And I'm attaching the mod to the first post now. It's a combination of CBM and item removal, you'll still need nation mods alongside it.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

I started up a quick test game with the mod and noticed the Sceptre of Corruption can still be forged.

Also, did you change the paths for some of the sprites? The Microless mod was looking for the Skadi sprite in the CBM_Sprites folder but it's actually located in the Worthy_Heroes folder. Easy enough to fix by copying it over but figured I'd mention it in case it was the result of a find/replace.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Valerius - can you please tell me the item ID for Sceptre of Corruption? You can find it by going into the game and using shift+I while looking at the item. I did my own test previously and caught three items that had snuck through, but I didn't see the sceptre. After which I went through and triple checked that all my item IDs were there. It's possible I missed another one due to being excessively tired at the time, I guess. I also didn't have the CBM issue you had, which is weird. I most definitely did not touch anything about file paths and for me it works/worked just fine. I used the ettin fix CBM 1.92, of course.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Sure, the sceptre is item number 113 and became available at Constr. 8.

As far as the sprites folder, you can ignore that. I downloaded CBM again and all the sprites are in the CBM_Sprites folder just as in the Microless mod. I'm really not sure how my version of 1.92 had the Worthy_Heroes folder listed as the location for some sprites. I try to be careful not to change the official CBM mod when working on experimental games but it's certainly possible I accidentally did so. Only, I can't ever recall changing sprite folder locations...

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Uploaded the map and a new version of the mod with the sceptre fixed for download, you can find them on the first page of the thread. I'll get the game up on llamaserver soonish.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Did you use Calahan's fixed start version as a base for the NI version? If so, do you want us to have access to the .map file? Just want to check before I download it.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

I did not use fixed starts, no. That said it would take about 10 seconds to NIify a fixed starts version if people feel strongly about it. I just used elmokki's version 4 and was unaware of calahan's fixed starts version. I actually downloaded it from one of his links :P

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

I'm ok with random starts, though the last two times the game chose random starts it was unkind to me (a peninsula, with two neighboring provinces being an example :p). If you go to the bottom of the llamaserver map list and scroll up one page Cal has his fixed start version. He mentions that he's not posting the .map file in order to not reveal the starts and to contact him if anyone wants the .map file.

Edit: Sorry, that's another of Calahan's fixed start maps. His Plane of Rusty Nails version is the sixth from the bottom of the list.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

I really don't mind either way.

A compromise might be to run the map through the script that let's you specify how many land (for land provinces) and sea (for sea provinces) neighbors a province needs to have to be considered as the location for a starting province. This can lead to some strange clumpings of nations though, if there are regions of the map that have lots / not many neighbors.

Re: New Game - Microless MA
 

Yeah I think I'll not worry about fixed starts. Fixed starts are nice and I'd generally prefer them, but if no one really cares too much, I think random is just as good as a placement algorithm is likely to be.

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

The game is set up and awaiting pretender submissions! Also I've added a renamed version of ogre kingdoms 1.0 to the first post just in case anyone is too lazy to remove the underscores in their copy by hand, as IIRC the llamaserver does not play well with those and I was forced to upload 1.0 for you lot. I did NOT upload the graphics as well so you'll still need to get the sprites yourselves if you haven't done so already (link is here

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

Cool. Will have a play and upload tonight.

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

I'll take my chances with a random start. My luck is bound to change soon. :)

So about my nation... Please switch me back to Van. *ducks* I actually did a lot of testing with Man and may play them in another game but the crones will be too frustrating to deal with here. The old age is annoying, but they have a way to deal with that. The map move 1 is much more irritating and without magic items there's no way to boost it. And without path boosters or communions their minor WE magic isn't of much use.

And after all that testing I actually thought of a pretty good Van build.

On the bright side, soon the game will start and I won't have the option to change my mind anymore. :p

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

I think I'll hold off on changing your nation again until the game starts. You know, just to be on the safe side :P

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

At this point I'd say that's a reasonable precaution. We've gone from a secret player to a secret nation. ;)

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

Would you like to include what other downloads I'm missing. My dominions is crashing at game testing. I have the downloads mentioned in the first post, the sprites for Ogre Kingdoms, and the sprites for CMB 1.92.

Please include everything a fresh copy of Dominions would need.

Edit: Fixed my own issue.

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

Just want to confirm I've sent in my pretender for Van and, since I have no intention of asking you to remove it so I can change nations yet again, that makes my pick definite. Of course I'll probably keep sending in revised pretenders until we start but at least the nation choice is now set in stone. :)

I'm pretty happy with my build - it's not at all optimal but I think it will be fun. It will certainly be interesting playing Van not only without indie archers but without even forged missile weapons. But I've got to say right now I'm *really* glad CBM reduced the cost of the Vanherse from 160 to 120 gold. This in no way makes Van a good research nation but at least I'll still be able to research at a comparable pace to the indie shaman I've typically used when playing them.

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

Okay, since snegir has made an exit (and valerius has managed to stick to vanheim :P) we'll get this thing started soon! I'll make sure Kestrel is in soon, the game WILL be running by tomorrow.

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

Maerlande is going to be away with intermittent internet access for the week, so hosting has been changed to 48 hours to accommodate him for the time being. The hosting time is intended to revert back to the original 24 after he has returned, so don't get too used to it yet!

Also as a note, Kestrel is presently out of town and any diplomatic requests should go through me as of the moment, as Kestrel also has very intermittent internet access.

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

Vanheim announces exciting new Slay an Ogre Kickstarter project!

By now, nations are becoming increasingly aware of the danger the Ogres pose. Vanheim has experienced their aggression firsthand, falling victim to an unprovoked attack spearheaded by their green dragon pretender.

There is no question things looks dire for the Vanir but there are a couple of bright spots. First, no one has ever questioned the fighting spirit of Vanheim. Second, it turns out D9W4N4E4 Vans are quite good at killing ogres. :)

However, we are experiencing a shortage of funds, hence this Kickstarter project.


Why should you help?

It's not a matter of if, but when, you'll need to face the Ogre menace. Better to face, or at least weaken, them now before they have a strong blood economy to take advantage of those cheap, powerful out-of-the-box, summons, than later.


How can you help?

Donate gold. More Vans means more dead Ogres means a happier world. And of course we exercise the strictest confidentiality and will never reveal our donors. So you can take a stand against the Ogre menace without risking retribution.

Attack the Ogres! If you want to take stronger action against these brutes the Vanir welcome allies. And rest assured that we will never surrender and never make peace with the Ogres so you need not fear being left to fight them alone.


What's in it for you?

In addition to the intrinsic benefit to your nation of reducing the strength of the Ogre Kingdom Vanheim is pleased to announce additional benefits for major donors:

Donors who donate 1,000 or more gold over the life of the project will receive the choice of 1 Dwarf/Vanadrott to charm/enslave/hellbind upon successful completion of the project or one turn's worth of spellcasting from our glorious god (if you choose to summon a unit it will be made available to you just as a Dwarf/Vanadrott would be). Note that you must provide the gems for pretender cast spells.

Donors who donate 730 gold at one time can choose to have their gold spent on an expeditionary force of 7 Vans leds by a Vanjarl. You will receive progress updates on the exploits of your sponsored band of warriors.

Donors who declare war and attack the Ogres will receive the same benefits as those who donate over 1,000 gold. So donating 1,000 gold and attacking the Ogres will yield you two commanders or two pretender-cast spells or one of each!


Time Frame

This is an open-ended project that will be completed with the destruction of either Vanheim or the Ogres.

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

We no evils....

Horsies tasty....

Ogre hungry...

Re: New Game - Microless MA Awaiting Pretenders
 

That was pretty amusing, V :)

Re: New Game - MA Microless
 

Okay Valerius, you'll be happy to know that I've finally updated the OP to show that you're playing Vanheim. Don't even try to switch nations now!

Re: New Game - MA Microless
 

Thanks, I started doing the usual "seek allies" diplo stuff and then decided I'd have some fun with it instead. :) Unfortunately, my Kickstarter project isn't proving popular. You'll all regret not helping Van when the Ogres are stomping you into the ground!


Lol, funny you should mention that since I just noticed it today and was going to ask you to change it so at least my tombstone would be correct.


Btw, you remember how in the YARG3 postgame discussion I mentioned how the only only nation I thought was weak in Tourmaline was the Ogres? Well, when GFSnl chose them I figured I'd better refresh my memory. Taking a closer look I don't think they were as weak as I thought at the time and they had been buffed since then. So, as I mentioned to him in a PM, I was actually quite concerned about running into them early and it was one of the factors in my taking a D9 bless since their average MR is about the only good point of attack against them early on (just as with MA Ulm I'm really not a fan of those level 0 buffs). But given his tough troops I didn't expect him to spring for an awake pretender and have the kind of expansion he did.

Re: New Game - MA Microless
 

Vanheim announces the cancellation of its Slay an Ogre Kickstarter project. Unfortunately, response was not as good as hoped for (actually, no donations were received).

----------

In other news, Vanheim and the Ogre Kingdom coincidentally announced a cessation of hostilities.

Declared spokesogre Gom Gutsplinter at a hastily convened press conference, "We no kill ponymen now. Kill later."

Vanir spokesman Balder reassured a nervous audience that this was almost certainly an error in translation.

Re: New Game - MA Microless
 

Btw, Jotun staled last turn and their current turn is also not in yet.

Re: New Game - MA Microless
 

Sorry for the stale guys. Everything should be back on track now.

Re: New Game - MA Microless
 

Yeah Valerius, the ogres are probably pretty good for this game. They get to keep most of their strengths and don't really lose that much. They weren't that great at forging to begin with, and their blood magic is still very strong. Of course they will still have a huge problem dealing with the age old go-to counter to ogres, so we'll see what happens I guess.

Re: New Game - MA Microless
 

Note to all players - As I previously mentioned, the hosting timer has been set back to 24 hours for turns as maerlande has returned. That will not affect the amount of time that... er.... valerius has to finish his current turn, but subsequent turns now will be on the 24 hour timer.