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-   -   combined MG/Mortar Platoons. (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=29200)

chuckfourth June 13th, 2006 08:14 AM

combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
Hi ALL
I have noticed that several battalion support companies have the 81mm Mortars and MGs in the same platoons. Now Im sure there will be people that disagree but these weapons would normally be employed in rather different positions ie the MG somewhere with a good field of fire and the Mortars in dead ground. Putting them in the same platoons makes this rather difficult to do because of command and control constraints. It probably also hampers the AI when it is building a defensive position. Would there be any chance of putting the Mortars in there own platoons and the MG in their own platoons in the support Coy? An example of this is the German "inf Btl sw Kp". This is one of the changes that happened between DOS v6 and v7 of the game. In v6 the mortars and MGs in the German Batalion support coys have there own platoons.

PatG June 13th, 2006 01:28 PM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
What I do is buy the core, delete the combined platoon then re-purchase the mortar and MG groups separately.

narwan June 13th, 2006 05:28 PM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
Quote:

PatG said:
What I do is buy the core, delete the combined platoon then re-purchase the mortar and MG groups separately.

That's indeed one solution and one which I use myself too. Sometimes however the heavy weapons are part of the HQ platoon of a company, as that was how these weapons were often distributed and commanded in ww2. In that case another solution is to attach the separate units you wish to remove from the platoon to another formation while deploying. You can buy for example a single 81mm mortar unit, then buy 2 infantry companies that have an 81mm mortar unit as part of the HQ platoon and attach these to the single 81mm unit. You now have a separate 3 mortar unit platoon.
Do remember though that the highest 'numbered' unit becomes the HQ unit for that formation so it's best to reattach 'upwards' on the force list (keeping existing HQ units), not downwards. So buy the single mortar first, and then the companies for example.

Then there's the historical solution; often this simply was the way the units were organised and controlled, either in combined heavy weapons platoons or as part of a cie HQ platoon. It might not be the best way for playing the GAME, but that's the way it was, including the C&C problems, and it offers its own challenges for players to overcome.

Narwan

DRG June 13th, 2006 10:13 PM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
Those formations are not used by the AI in generated games. These are assets that would be available to the battalion commander. C&C can be changed by the Human player with the "cross attachment" feature which allows you to assign then to whatever formation you like just as an actual battalion commander would assign them according to need

Don

Mobhack June 13th, 2006 11:23 PM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
the cross attachment screen is for formations, so e.g. you can add a mortar section formation you bought separately to a rifle company's command (instead of leaving under the bn commander which is the default).

The cross atach BUTTON is for individual units that are not the platoon command of a platoon, to allow you to put these under the control of another platoon. E.g, you may put the CHQ MGs under command of one of the rifle platoons and leave the mortars under CHQ command. This button is made available in the deployment screen for generated battles and campaigns (not scenarios, the scenario designer has done that for you http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

Cheers
Andy

chuckfourth June 14th, 2006 06:33 AM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
Quote:

narwan said:
Then there's the historical solution; often this simply was the way the units were organised and controlled, either in combined heavy weapons platoons or as part of a cie HQ platoon. It might not be the best way for playing the GAME, but that's the way it was, including the C&C problems, and it offers its own challenges for players to overcome.
Narwan

Hi Narwan
I find this hard to believe, not only would it not be the best way to play the game it is the worst way to structure the unit in the REAL world also. Perhaps you can site a reference for the German Batalion support coy,s half mortar half MG platoons currently in the game? or maybe they should be changed back to the way they were?
Regards Chuck.

DRG June 14th, 2006 10:21 PM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
Chuck

Consider this.

If you want the mortars and the MG's separate simply buy a MMG Grp ( formation 378 ) and a GrW Grp ( formation 32 ) then you can use them separately and not have the command and control constraints that trouble you. Buying those two formations gives you essentially the same units as buying a Inf Btl sw Zug ( formation 475 ) which is the main component of the three "Inf Btl sw Kp" formations in the game. However, if you or anyone else WANTS to buy them together you can......or not.......the choice is clearly there and that way if you wanted to buy a mortar section for you A0 unit ( for example ) to command and include a couple of MMG's for protection your can........or not, the choice is clearly there as well.



Don

chuckfourth June 15th, 2006 06:00 AM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
OK no worries
Thanks.

PatG June 15th, 2006 07:55 AM

Re: combined MG/Mortar Platoons.
 
Quote:

Mobhack said:
The cross atach BUTTON is for individual units that are not the platoon command of a platoon....<snip>
Andy

Once again I stand in awe of the brilliance of the designers.

Much more logical than my method.


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