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-   -   Manchukuo aircraft (v.2017) (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=51696)

Pibwl September 4th, 2017 01:32 PM

Manchukuo aircraft (v.2017)
 
1 Attachment(s)
Just a few notes on aircraft, according to "A History of Chinese Aviation - Encyclopedia of Aircraft and Aviation in China until 1949"

117, 140 Aichi D1A - weren't used.

In fact, the air force was created only in 1937, and first combat aircraft were Kawasaki Type 88 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawasa...sance_Aircraft and Nakajima Type 91 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakaji...ype_91_Fighter

The icon could do well for Type 88: https://www.aviationsmilitaires.net/...saki_88_3v.jpg

118 Nakajima Ki-27 - introduced after 1940 (now 1/35, when it haven't even flew) (photo attached, or other copy: http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g6...9.jpg~original)

119, 136 Kawasaki Ki-32 - introduced after 1940 (now 1/38)

It might look like this: https://i.pinimg.com/736x/94/4b/bb/9...98585d3681.jpg or http://www.avionslegendaires.net/wp-...re/Gki32-3.jpg or http://aviadejavu.ru/Images6/MM/MM-165/1017-08-2-3.jpg - photos of Manchukuo aircraft are very rare, but color drawings show they were light grey

133 Ju-86 - there were transport Ju 86Z-2 only (photo attached). Only in mid-39 "it was at some stage planned to convert six Ju 86s into bombers, but this was not carried out, although one was tested with armament fitted".
(BTW - now the picture is Swedish)

134 Heinkel 111 - there's no mention about He 111 in Manchukuo service in the book

135 Ki 21 - the book says, that they were used only as transports by Manchu Air Transport Company.

Michal

DRG September 4th, 2017 02:21 PM

Re: Manchukuo aircraft (v.2017)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pibwl (Post 839509)
135 Ki 21 - the book says, that they were used only as transports by Manchu Air Transport Company.

Michal

"the book" may be wrong or incomplete but you frequently pick one source and make that the Bible to dispute what we have in our OOB


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchu...rial_Air_Force

Mitsubishi Ki-21 Japan bomber number in sevice 6

References
Jowett, Philipp (2005). Rays of the Rising Sun, Volume 1: Japan's Asian Allies 1931–45, China and Manchukuo. Helion and Company Ltd. ISBN 1-874622-21-3.

In reference to your last post on Nat China.......


Quote:


.....That's all from my side.

I have learned that is NEVER the case no matter how much I wish it were true

Don

Pibwl September 4th, 2017 05:54 PM

Re: Manchukuo aircraft (v.2017)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 839510)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pibwl (Post 839509)
135 Ki 21 - the book says, that they were used only as transports by Manchu Air Transport Company.

"the book" may be wrong or incomplete but you frequently pick one source and make that the Bible to dispute what we have in our OOB

Maybe, but I'm trying to find most reliable references - and this one really looks well-researched ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 839510)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchu...rial_Air_Force

Mitsubishi Ki-21 Japan bomber number in sevice 6

References
Jowett, Philipp (2005). Rays of the Rising Sun, Volume 1: Japan's Asian Allies 1931–45, China and Manchukuo. Helion and Company Ltd. ISBN 1-874622-21-3.

Yes, but these six were used by MKKK (Manchu Air Transport Company), a semi-military airline, not by the Air Force (scan of page 171, that I've sent). I don't insist on deleting anyway, just to put it under a consideration.

Quote:

Quote:


.....That's all from my side.

I have learned that is NEVER the case no matter how much I wish it were true

Well, in case of Manchukuo it is true :)
I've never thought to deal with Manchukuo, and just came across a nice source on aircraft.

Michal

PS. the quoted Wikipedia page says also "The only bomber craft it had were provided by Kawasaki Ki-32 light bombers." ;)

Pibwl September 6th, 2017 06:46 PM

Re: Manchukuo aircraft (v.2017)
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pibwl (Post 839523)
Quote:

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 839510)

I have learned that is NEVER the case no matter how much I wish it were true

Well, in case of Manchukuo it is true :)

You've provoked me ;)

I had no intention to deal with Manchukuo, but I just started to wonder, what could I possibly find about it. And voila - an article in a French magazine. I don't know French, but maybe somebody does.

Tanks are pretty correct, but just a few things:

08,09,10 Renault Type 79, 89, 87 - should be unified with Japanese OOB 200-201 (Ko-gata, Otsu-gata) - 09 should receive longer 37 mm gun and a photo 9132, and 10 - photo 9131. Maybe better names will be Renault FT and Renault NC, since Taki claims that "the Manchukuo Army never used Japanese calender designation." (http://www.network54.com/Forum/33033...23/View+thread)

There is some mention about Type 95 Ha-Go - but used for training?

22 Type 92 SNLF - Japanese 147 Wolseley A/C and 299 Crossley M25 armoured cars should be rather used instead. Also Japanese 23 Chiyoda A/C seems more probable, while browsing Internet forums (considering its production size in comparison to a handful of SNLF car).

BTW: according to
http://www3.plala.or.jp/takihome/93car.htm and https://ikazuchisen.wordpress.com/im...-use-in-media/ the right designation of "Type 92 SNLF" is Type 93.

This model manufacturer: https://hlj.com/product/FIRM055 claims, that twin-turret Austins were used (651 from Polish oob, with changed guns)

There could be also added improvised armoured cars, like Chinese 266, 272. Some photo is at the bottom: http://www.network54.com/Forum/33033...23/View+thread

That's all I could find ;)

Pibwl September 8th, 2017 12:14 PM

Re: Manchukuo aircraft (v.2017)
 
Through the last quoted forum web page, I've found an interesting page with a couple of Manchukuo army photos (sniper, 81m mortar, unidentified infantry gun, cavalry): http://www.horae.dti.ne.jp/~fuwe1a/newpage417.html

There were also river gunboats with 120mm guns
http://www.navypedia.org/ships/manch...of_sui_kai.htm
http://www.navypedia.org/ships/manch...f_chin_jen.htm


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