New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son! - Update v1.1)
 

Presented here is a new Late Ages nation for your game-time enjoyment:

[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Woman2.gif[/img] Sylvania [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon23.gif[/img]

In an ancient mythic time, the elves were the rulers of the world. Their grace, beauty, and strength surpassed that of every other race and they lived out their immortal lives as semi-divine lords enthroned above a simplistic world of mortals. Those times are gone, and the elves have faded almost entirely from the world. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/fear.gif In the lush forests of Sylvania their last city yet stands, a secret enclave hidden from the eyes of mortals by ancient magics. While in the woodlands the sylvankind hunt [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Target.gif[/img] and live peacefully at one with nature [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Panda.gif[/img], their cosmopolitan cousins in the city engage in the millennia-old quest for knowledge, skill, and honor. There the Phoenix King resides, supreme lord of the elves. With the coming of a new god, the elves see a chance, a faint glimmer of hope, to reunite the world under their wise tutelage once more and restore the lost Empire of Dawn. Now, for the last time, the elves march to war.

This nation is an addition to the normal Late Ages nations (nation number 72) and will not replace any of the original nations. This mod was a lot of fun to make and is a much more traditional sort of nation than Sanguinia. I wanted to provide a "purer" version of Pangaea for the Late Ages as well as build a mod based on some of the elven armies from Warhammer Fantasy Battles. This is the result. Load it up, check out the readme file, and give the pointy-ears a try. Please let me know your impressions and concerns so I can make this mod even better! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

v1.0: 59 downloads

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CHANGES FOR v1.1:

-Cited name list usage in readme file
-Sylvan Warrioress and Aspect Archon heroes given Sacred ability
-Eldar Blades and Eldar Knives given an attack and defense rating increase
-Bows for Summer, Autumn, & Winter Aspect Archers given additional damage values
-Damage and precision on the bow for the Spring Aspect Archers reduced for balancing (now 6 and 0); each of them essentially has a superior version of a greater magic item (Vine Bow) and while quite useful I found this was a little too advantageous http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
-Phoenix Guards given a new weapon, Dawn's Edge, based on bardiche stats
-Phoenix Guard gold price increased
-Phoenix Lord gold price increased substantially
-Swordmasters given significant skill increases
-Sea Guards given a slightly higher defense skill
-Loremasters given a 50% chance of having a third level of Astral magic
-Sorceresses' random magic abilities tweaked to give a more truly random feel and variability between individuals -- they can even get death magic -- with a total maximum of 6 possible paths
-Sylvan Priestesses given a 25% chance of having one level of Nature magic

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Very nice mod, as usual.

Troop suggestions:The aspect archers bows (while having nice effects) all have 0 damage which, imo makes them too weak for their cost. I believe both the eldar knives and blades could use an attack (maybe just 1 point) and defence (i would suggest 1 or 2) boost. The elves, imo could also do with +1 or 2 defence and possibly -1 health. I think the phoenix guards could do with +2 damage to their weapons damage and a +9/14 (or else, even with their high resources, their fear could be a bit too powerful). I think the swordmasters could also use a rather large boost (i would have them with a basic attack and defence of 15) with a slightly higher gold cost. I think the seaguard are a bit too expensive (just like in warhammer) and could do with some sort of boost though im not sure what.

Commander Suggestions: The phoenix lord could do with a gold boost up to 150-180 gold (hes very nasty) but fear(as with the guard) would be fitting too imo. The mages could also do with some kind of randoms.

Unit Suggestions:
Assasins would be nice and fairly fitting (+10 or so stealth). You dont need scouts since they have alot of stealthy commanders but assasins would be good imo.

Overall i really like the mod so keep up the good work http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

edit: The world tree pretender seems to have a (not sure if its meant to have it but it dosnt seem like it) problem. Whenver i look at it in the god selection screen (there-fore generating a new unit for it) it gains random afflcitions.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Shovah32, thanks for all the specific suggestions. I got hooked on making a fourth nation (based on Chaos) and have been building greater daemons all day (there will be four new pretenders, one for each of the Ruinous Powers). That being said, I did not play-test Sylvania today as I had planned. I will give it a more thorough testing soon and probably factor a lot of your suggested tweaks into v1.1.

Point-for-point...

The Spring Aspect Archers have damage on their bows since entangle would cause no extra damage when it occurs. As for the others I reduced damage to 0 because the secondary effects were causing as much damage as a normal composite bow (on which the aspect bows were based). I may add a few points, to validate their cost as you say, but probably not much more than 6.

I agree on the blades. I nerfed them after having originally given them two attacks per turn which resulted in some pretty keen slaughtering.

The Phoenix Guard bardiches are stock weapons from Dom 3. I'm thinking about giving them holy damage bardiches (with the same dmg, just holy, and a defense boost) and bringing their cost up a bit.

In the testing I did before release I found the Sea Guard to be rather tough and really didn't feel the pain when buying more because it was taking a lot to kill them. I may increase their defense skill.

Will def. increase the Phoenix Lord's costs.

As for assassins, since I gave this nation a good selection of stealth troops to facilitate players who enjoy stealth strategies I was unsure about also giving assassins. I don't think I'll include one yet unless I hear more requests for such.

The World Tree... yes, I've noticed the same strange bug and cannot explain it. I actually used #copystats from the Treelords to give the pretender it's weakness to fire and it may be carrying over from that. Still, the afflictions seem to vanish once you actually enter the game.

Again, thanks for the detailed critique! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Now, to work on more Chaos...

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Also some of the mages seem oddly priced, is there a specific reason for their pricing?

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Playing with the nation now, and I like it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

The entangling arrows are deadly since they break up the enemy charge. They don't need any buffs IMO. Haven't tried the other aspected archers much yet.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Ive been mostly using archers of the spring myself, i have them set to hold and attack closest, shielded by some phoenix guard with the same command and with flanking glade riders (the bow kind) set to hold and attack rear.

The spring archers arent actually bad in melee, with 2 attacks and the entangling they are fairly effective vrs low prot enemies.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Teraswaerto, glad you're enjoying it! I will be boosting the damage for all Aspect Archers except for the Springs in v1.1.

Shovah32, the pricing is a little odd it's true. I intended the Sorceresses to be used for battlefield magic, summons, and forging, but to be much less useful for research. They're fiery and short-tempered mistresses who channel raw magic rather than lock themselves away in towers to study and experiment. So, they have a research penalty and in v1.1 will be able to get up to six paths of magic with new random tables (level 1 Nature base, 100% chance of a level 2 Elemental, 75% chance of 1 additional Elemental, 25% chance of 1 add. Nature, and 5% chance of level 1 Death). The Loremasters are the opposite. They are obsessed with knowledge, cataloging, and study. Thus, they have a research bonus, but are not very effective as utility mages. In v1.1 they will have a 25% chance of coming out with level 3 (instead of 2) Astral.

Hopefully the v1.1 changes (almost all of them positive) will satisfy! I should be able to release it tomorrow or shortly thereafter.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

If your keeping the loremasters the same cost i would give them a 50% chacne rather than 25. Also with hte added bonus randoms sorceresses should be fine.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

FYI, Sylvania has been updated to v1.1 to address some of the suggestions made here. Enjoy!

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Play-tested Sylvania some today in a game with all LA nations (including the other two I've created) and found that the Loremasters (w/ no Magic scale boost) are capable of pumping out some serious research. I surpassed all other nations and was heading into an increasing lead by the end of the first two years. This agrees with the "fluff" in that the elves have a secret library thousands of years old in which to study, but might end up being the key to a middle or late-game upset since they have decent access (level 3 poss.) to at least six paths of magic.

If anyone else is giving this nation a try, what are your impressions?

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

unless your test game was MP, note that humans will allways come out on top in research. I can take a drain 2, imprissonned pretender and still come out ahead of most computer nations. Other than that, its a cool nation, although the spring archers seem quite a bit better than the others. (which all cost the same)

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Frostmourne27, well, I've been embarassed by AI nations in the research field before... and the difference (exceeding every other LA nation plus two other mod nations) was quite sharp when pumping out Loremasters, esp. with air mages making research boosting items for them. It doesn't seem to unbalance Sylvania, as I know the same could be done with other nations, but research is definitely a strong suit here. Anyway, I too have found no limit to the uses for Spring Aspect Archers. I may end up nerfing their damage to 0 as the ability to entangle en masse is simply brutal against heavy opponents.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Especially when used in combination with blade dancers.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Y do Phoenix Guards have fist as a weapon? :p Kind of makes my bless strat rather pointless

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Possibly a type in the .dm? Or he forgot to make their weapons. It should be very easy to fix.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Well i looked in the file. There weapon is listed and such it appears so i have no idea y it shows up as fist.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Doesn't show up as a fist for me - show's up as dawn's edge or what-have-you.

Incidentally, it's a great mod. I just wish when the AI would build more aspect archers - it does very well with blade dancers and masters, even with glade riders, but very rarely uses the highly effective aspects.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

A cool mod (and i am quite an elf hater http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif ).

I discovered one potential minor bug though:
The lance glade rider has as weapons a light lance and the eldar blade. He has no ambidextrousity though, so his 2 weapons have only 4 and 6 attack !
And i also have a hard time to imagine how you can fight with a lance and a sword.
Furthermore he has even a shield.

Another little bug in the nametypes:
#addname "Anardil of Sylvnaia"

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

I think Zepath may have left the forums, but I'll certainly fix those issues when I make the CBM version of Sylvania.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Oh - the priestess' description says they are "able to heal the afflictions of mortals", but they don't seem to have a healing ability. Is the description meant to be fluff, or is it an oversight?

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

They have nature magic, don't they? So they get some healing spells. All the elves have rejuv anyway, so not like you really need healers.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Yes, but the description makes them sound like they can heal wounds, rather like Arco's priestesses. Very handy for non-elf troops, and most of all, the pretender. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: New Nation: Sylvania- bugs
 

As posted in the modded nations game thread - Sylvania's Phoenix Guard still has a Fist for a weapon, instead of the golden bardiche they're supposed to have. Likewise, the Enchantress, Loremaster, and Priestess only have fists for weapons, which might be by design, but seems unlikely (as they probably should at least have a knife, eldar dagger, something).

In addition, the lance Glade Rider doesn't have a sword like it should, only Light Lance and Hoof - should presumably have an Eldar Blade as well.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania- bugs
 

Bug isn't in Sylvania, it's in the combination nations mod.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania- bugs
 

Then maybe it comes from the CB 1.1 mod? Or from the CBM version of Sylvania? Because all I did was copy and paste all of the mods together, and when I created the preliminary version I checked for overlapping ID numbers and there were none.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania- bugs
 

Apparently there was a conflict between a weapon in CBM Kharamdzu and a weapon in CBM Sylvania.

I posted about how to fix it in the CBM nations thread.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Zepath, this mod is beautifull, but I find it a bit overpowered. They got powerfull mages,an almost perfect army, sailing... I think the four variety of aspect archers is too much, one would have been enougth. As it is now, you've got no way to escape their firepower !

It is however a great mod, even if you shouldn't have mixed high elves and sylvan elves, 'cause it gives them too much strategic flexibility.Can someone tell me what is their flaw ?

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Humakt, if you think that this nation is "overpowered" then maybe you could try out Sombre's CBM version. We are currently having a game with 7 CBM variants from mod nations to see how they compare against each other. One position would be open to a replacement player (Zepath's Kharam Dzu mod) - would you like to take over those, maybe?

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

What's CBM ?
I am a bit young as a player to compete with the oldest players ( in term of experience).I like Kharam Dzu, and tested it, and it seemed to me they have more weakness than Sylvania, they are slow,mostly unarmored, and get trampled by packs 'cause they are small.
But maybe it is my Ork blood that makes me criticize...

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Conceptual Balance is an extensive mod that has managed to achieve better balance, but which changes the game in many ways. I haven't bothered getting used to it myself, because I don't play much MP.

CBM version or CBM variants are mods balanced to work with Conceptual Balance, instead of the vanilla game.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Just fired up this mod for the first time and I am rediculously impressed. I normally just go for small nation edit mods (Ulm updates, etc) because I tend to find user created extreme mods to be silly and unthematic, but this mod fits in PERFECTLY with the regular dom world and the sprites blend wonderfully.

In case you aren't seeing it, I love this mod. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Only suggestion is that Sorc's are the absolute best unit and they can be built anywhere while Loremasters and Enchantresses are nowhere near as good and are capitol only. I don't even see a use for enchantresses because Sorc's can easily get 2N and as for 2H, well, this doesn't really seem like a bless nation, though the Phoenix Guard looks pretty uber. An idea might be to boost Enchantresses, (give them a random or two) and weaken Sorc's (take away a random).

My typical army is aspect archers firing behind a screen of seaguard with shields. I love the idea of the two sworded guys and the greatsword guys, but since they don't have shields and this is an archer-heavy nation, I don't see a way to incorporate them in my strategy.

Overall A++. If you've been thinking about getting this mod, get it.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son!)
 

Stryke11 - you should definitely try some of Sombre's mods - they are all very carefully balanced and non-silly too.

I agree this is cool. I'm not completely convinced by the balance, but the theme is very nice.

Re: New Nation: Sylvania (Elves, son! - Update v1.1)
 

Where is the CBM version of this?