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-   -   Weapon Discrepancies in the OOBs (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=29220)

MarkSheppard June 14th, 2006 04:50 PM

Weapon Discrepancies in the OOBs
If you find something that you think is wrong in the OOBs regarding weapons, can you please post it here, to keep the forum organized and neat? Thanks in advance.

Secondly, this is NOT the place to argue over the HEK values for semi auto rifles, or whether machine guns should have an AP value; we've had enough of that, thankyouverymuch.

I've noticed that in the German OOB:

20mm Flak 38 has a HEK of 12, with a rate of fire of 0.89 kg /sec (119 gram shell at 450 RPM)

20mm MG-151/20 has a HEK of 10, with a weight of fire of 1.07 kg/sec (92 gram shell at 700 RPM)

Shouldn't the MG-151/20 have a 12 HEK due to it's higher weight of fire from a 1 second burst?

Apologies if this has been beat into the ground.

Gud June 14th, 2006 06:34 PM

Re: Weapon Discrepancies in the OOBs
ummm...maybe something to do with amount of explosive in a round ? A 75mm HE from one gun isn't same as 75mm HE from another gun....

MarkSheppard June 14th, 2006 07:14 PM

Re: Weapon Discrepancies in the OOBs
ummm...maybe something to do with amount of explosive in a round ?

I've got the stats for the M-Goss shells used for those guns as well; a MG-151/20s M-Goss Thin-walled HE shell is 115 grams, compared to 92 grams for the normal round; that gives the MG-151/20 with M-Goss a 1.34 kg/sec burst.

Sorry if I'm being pedantic here.

Marek_Tucan June 15th, 2006 01:26 AM

Re: Weapon Discrepancies in the OOBs
Maybe the Mg151/20 is considered to have some AP shells in the ammo mix? Weren't API/T about 1/4 - 1/5 of the ammo load?

narwan June 15th, 2006 12:11 PM

Re: Weapon Discrepancies in the OOBs
Hi MarkSheppard,

it's not an invalid question, don't worry about that. But it does look you may have had two units mixed up. The 20mm Flak 38 (weapon 147 in Mobhack) has a HEK of 11, not 12. Perhaps you are looking at the 20mm Kwk38 (weapon 008)?
When comparing stats of weapons it is useful to check Mobhack for weapon types; the Flak38 is class 4 (Flak) while the MG-151 is class 11 (aircraft weapon). Often certain discrepancies between stats can be attributed to how the game treats different classes. Aircraft weapons for example can only have HE ammunition (goes back to the original code afaik) so AP capability gets translated into it. That means certain aircraft guns will be assumed to be firing a mix of shell types, in other words they'll be firing less HE shells than their max ROF fire would allow for so they'll get a lower HEK then you might expect.

Having said that, I'm no expert on the weapons in question so I don't know if the MG-151 fired AP rounds but the gun does get a HE penetration of 2 where 1 is standard for HE rounds for this calibre (see flak 38 and Kwk38 for example) so it does look like it is assumed to be firing some AP rounds.


PS when posting questions about certain weapons in the game it makes things easier to check if you refer to its Mobhack number.

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