The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Are there any Kohan players out there who feel up for a game of MP Dominions? This game is for people coming from the Kohan community- just post in this thread with the nation that you want. This will be an EA game, but the map is undetermined right now. Any thoughts?

Llamabeast, could you please host us, if you have room on your server? I've been quite impressed by its performance in Opossum http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

http://www.timegate.com/forum/showth...ge=2&pp=15


Player - Nation
________________

Potatoman - Tien'Chi
Reverend Zombie - Lanka
Excist - Agartha
Niarg - C'tis
MartialDoctor - Yomi
Slobby - Fomoria

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Would be happy to host, yep. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Oldtime KAGer here. Scrub level, just like my skill in Dominions!

I'd be up for another try as Lanka.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Excist/Juxtapoe here.

I'll be claiming the role of Agartha

Naming my Kohan Ravid.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

KAG rocks! It's the best game ever. Dominions 3 is 2nd on my list. I don't have time to join another game though. Don't tell anyone, though, but the Dominions community is much better than the Kohan community, imo. Kohan players can be sort of elitist jerks sometimes.

We should have Kohan day for Dominions players sometime! I still have it on my HD.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I think Dominions III is better than Arihman's Gift. More variety... and less dancing ;-) Did they ever fix dancing? Or did they keep it as 'most valuable display of skill'?

I played Kohan to death before the sequel came. I was so disappointed with sequel, stopped playing original.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Sadly, KAG performs worse on my laptop than Kohan 2, Kings of War.

Big fan of the lizard campaign. Slss'tok, was it?

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Slaanri! That's what I'm looking for.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Yeah, Slyss'tok. He was quite a powerhouse! Too bad for him that the Slaanri themselves were so bottom-of-the-barrel compared to all of the other independent troops.

I'm not sure when you stopped playing Nikolai, but zone of control dancing (keeping a unit of scouts or shadelings engaged with you to sap your morale and keep you from hitting buildings, but always having them run away from combat) grew to become pretty much THE dominant skill. At some point it became more about dancing than everything else (similar to how last-hitting rules DOTA), and the resulting gameplay became flat and boring (my opinion only http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif).

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Are you guys talking about pressed column dancing? Or simply engage/retreat dancing? Pressed column dancing is basically an exploit, and it is agreed that it shouldn't be used. People don't do that so much from what I remember. You could always ban people who do that.

Engage/retreat dancing is perfectly legit, though. You just have to deal with it.. although calling it the 'dominant skill' is an exaggeration, isn't it? It takes micro-managing to do that, and that means your attention isn't being focused elsewhere, like on building new cities.

Perhaps you ran into some people who were just really good at the game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

The main thing Kohan has going for it over Dominions is the 30 min - 1 hour game length, imo. I love Dominions, but if you could finish a game of it in an hour, I would never ever stop playing, ever!

Kohan is amazing for the amount of strategy that is packed into that 30 min of gaming. Other RTS games can't hold a candle to it. It's really too bad the sequal was as bad as it was.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

In my mind, the problem sprung directly from how people decided exactly what was allowed in online Kohan and what was not. The engine, while great at doing so many other things, had many unintended quirks that people learned to exploit over the years, and they did. Unfortunately, the same engine quirks that are used mostly for innocuous things (engage/retreat dancing summoners to get more than a single golem per fight, for instance) could (and would) also be used for evil. This made any kind of "exploit" label subjective, because for any new trick a precedent for something similar would already exist.

Pressed dancing with a shadeling is illegal (it was outlawed way, way back), for instance, but engage/retreat dancing with the shadeling (a much more recent discovery) is permissible. The actual game effect of these tricks is identical; only the technique and the micro required is different.

Kohan: Ahriman's Gift is still leagues ahead of any other RTS though. I'll always treasure my copy http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

My Kohan alias was Setsuna, by the way.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

ORZ! We played together some. I was UnknownSuX. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I have played with you guys. I still have a recording of an allied win with
UnknownSuX. :-) I kept it because we managed to almost rotate around the
game map... both teams were winning east and losing west.

But I mostly enjoyed 1x1 or 2x2, and most games used to be 3x3 or even 4x4.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Played KoW and loved it. I was never so keen on KAG but if we can leave the whole KAG vs KoW away from these forums then I'm up for a game.

I've only got the demo at the moment but hopefully it shouldn't be too long before my full copy arrives. I'll leave picking a race until I know more abouit all the races.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Yay, Tuidjy! You know, I think I remember the game you're talking about, vaguely.. What was your name in Kohan? I'm getting the feeling you were one of the good people.

I should probably stop posting in this thread since it is completely off topic.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Woot!

My Dom3 just shipped!

Oh, and I second EVERYTHING that Niarg said..only change 'KAG' to 'KAG people'. KAG wasn't that bad of a game especially for the year it came out. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

And I would add the caveat that KOW was broken upon release, but when it truly went gold with 1.2.3 it was a well balanced game with only 2 minor issues which I am tweaking with a community patch.

But, let's leave the details of KAG vs KOW to the thread in the kohan forum labaled KAG and KOW Feud.

http://www.timegate.com/forum/showth...407#post143407

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I have nothing against KoW, I'm sure it's a fun game. It just didn't appeal to me personally.

I'm just saying it's too bad that Kohan I never truely got a sequal. KoW can't be considered a real successor to Kohan due to the huge differences in gameplay and "feel." It may very well be an excellent game in its own right, but it wasn't made in the same spirit as the original.

Kohan I was revolutionary and "avant-garde" if I can use that expression, heh. Kohan II may have been excellently done, but it lacks these qualities. It is more in line with mainstream RTSs like Warcraft.

Excist, by "KAG people" if you mean the KAG community as a whole, I agree with you. I always found it to be poisonous, even hostile, at times. Especially with regards to newbies (they were pretty much shunned) and people who didn't do things the way everyone else did them (like me). For such a revolutionary game, the people who played it were incredibly dogmatic and unaccepting of new things/ideas/people.

They pretty much didn't accept you unless you were a "vet".. I was never really accepted as a "vet" even though I started in the early KIS days and played on and off until after KoW came out (sometimes mostly off, I admit). At my best I thought I was pretty decent, although at my worst I'm sure I was horrible. Anyway.

Sorry to hijack this thread! (waits to be told not to post anymore) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

CUnknown,

I know what you are saying about the KAG community. I played the original KIS and played a bit of KAG as well. I just got turned off by the whole - "I know how to play this game and you do not" even though I had proven myself to some of the other vet players (I went by the name Hombre - you all probably didn't see me much, if at all). It's too bad because, when I think about it, KAG really is an amazing game.

I was more of a KoW player myself (went by A****aka-san). I started playing that game about the same time many of you KAGers stopped (when the patch came out). It did have a different feel to it but was still a good, tactical game.

Anyways, I would really enjoy joining you all in this little game. I'll choose Yoni as they are the ones I feel most familiar with, at this time. Plus, there is something quite fun about playing as Japanese demons. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

My first choice was Kailasa, then I thought, maybe Agartha... Seeing Jux claimed them I then thought, maybe I'll try Yoni... ><

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Sign me up for Kailasa. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Guess you're just meant to be the Apes, Slobby http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I'm sorry Excist but I think I'll have to choose Agartha as well, I've been playing the demo for a bit and I've started to get a bit of a feel for them.

Don't worry though, I think that I'll be destroyed long before I ever see you in game.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Two people can't play the same race, Niarg.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Hmm, annoying.
Well my copy has shipped so I'll decide which race once I've got the full version. In the meantime feel free to give advice on a good race to start with.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

It's been too long since I've been part of the Kohan community, unfortunately. I almost beg in just for the chance to play Fomoria for the first time... I'm so very tempted.

But for the moment, I'll try to help Niarg.

What's your playstyle like, Niarg?

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Woot Kohan was an amazing rts for it's time! i still remember the incredible fun i had with it like mmm 7 years ago ?

It definetly was a masterpiece a shame modern rts don't have the 'squad' idea kohan introduced http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Do we have any more joining us? If not, may I suggest Aran for the map?

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

If you want me or need another player, I'll join. I can certainly manage another game. And I'll enjoy it. If not, I'll survive. I'm organizing another game anyways...

I was never part of the multiplayer community- Dom3 is the first game I went online with. But I did hang around the forums a little bit, and geek out enough to time how fast morale, attack ratings, tand thatclimbed.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

We're just waiting for people to get their copies of Dominions 3 in the mail now, I think. If you're still waiting for your copy, post in this thread. Otherwise, I'll assume that you're ready to go!

Aran should be fine.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I'm still waiting sadly. Surprisingly it's quicker to get something shipped from France to Canada then the States to Canada.

How are we gonna set the game up? 24hour turns?

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I just received mine yesterday (actually arrived on Saturday....just not to me http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)

Niarg, I was not expecting Agartha to be so hotly contested. I have had some fun playing around with some of the other nations yesterday, and so would not mind picking a different race.

I'll just have to do a little research tonight about which nation would fit best with a Ravid kinda guy http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Ravid should have a magic background of Stone or water/air (whichever does the +dev) for the defensive bless and be able to cast high level air spells.

And I think he will like a nation of civilized, efficient peoples skilled in commerce and growth.
The more I think about it the less likely it is that Ravid would fine himself hanging with the Agarthans http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Consider the Agarthan spot open, and please reserve the 'sidhe' race for me until I have a chance to check which nation that is, what they're like and officiate it, or another one http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

The 'sidhe' race is Tir na n'Og.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

My copy hasn't arrived yet, hopefully it should arrive soon...

Excist, the only reason I chose Agartha is because I randomly got them a couple of times in the demo. I might choose them but it's more likely I'll settle on a new race.

Lazy_Perfectionist, I haven't really got a playstyle yet, I was just looking for targets that I should try to aim for in the early game (get how many per year, research what?). When my copy of the game arrives I'll have a read through the manual and try to work things out.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I'm still a noob so take this how you would like http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif


However, one of the things that has me in love with this game already is that there are SO many different ways to slice the cheese http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

I am sure some methods are better then others, and a lot of that depends on how you have your dominion and pretender set up. But, the game is suitibly complex enough that it is impossible to come up with the 'ideal' strategy. So if you plan well and react intelligently you can have viable builds around massing enourmous troops, expanding dominion and territory early with a fairly strong awake pretender vs having a strong dominion scales and expand slower, but by the time your pretender is awake you are in a good position to suddenly own the map.

I have not seen this, but according to the game manual you can even play this as an rpg with a few heroes fully equiped wading through millions of foes, and that too can be a viable strategy with good choices of magic items.

My impression is focusing on research, focusing on gem production and summons, focusing on gold income and national troops and focusing on creating powerhouse heroes - you can set your priorities there anyway you want as long as your dominion is growing since that is the point and name of the game.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Is anybody planning on doing the dorky thing of naming their god after a kohan?

If nobody is then I'll stick with Agartha and take along one of my (now) many Agartha gods into this epic game.

If so, then I'll switch to either the Sidhe race or the Eaglelord race.

I haven't played either of them yet, but they probably would be most in line with Ravid and his Council Ways.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I wasn't planning on naming my pretender after a kohan. Feel free to dork it up tho! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/stupid.gif

@Niarg - My noob opinion for start is to try to take control of all provinces your capital borders asap to maximize income. Of course if there are a couple of really strong indies it'd be better to take less defended provinces further out than to waste troops.

Pretender choice can also make a big difference. For example I was originally going to pick a certain pretender and play to it's strengths. For fun I tried another pretender, which I thought was inferior, and have come up with an almost entirely different strategy based on it's strengths.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Niarg, you've played other strategy games.

In those other games, did you prefer the small but deadly elite force of warriors? Or did you prefer overwhelming hordes?

Do you prefer defeating your enemy by forcing a confrontation with their army and destroying them in the field, or do you find yourself avoiding direct conflict, raiding and attacking their infrastructure instead, leaving them incapable of victory despite their superior forces?

One common rule of thumb is to average one province a turn for your first year. For some nations, the number is higher. Don't feel compelled to attack an indie immediately, if another turn of recruitment well cut down on your recruitment. If not taking one now means taking two later, instead of taking one now, heading back for reinforcements, then moving out again...

Another guideline people go by is the number of provinces per player. If there are 10 land provinces per land player, try to get those ten by the end of your first year to be on an even footing. More is better, of course.

Attacking provinces adjacent to your capital is very important because it increases production. But after that, gold is a more important factor than resources- until you get other forts up or find very nice independents.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I know there are so many ways to play the game and that is what is making it so overwhelming at the moment, especially as I don't have a manual until my copy arrives.

My favourite startegy would be one based on troops (magic is way beyond me at the moment), they should be fairly strong but I'm not bothered about supercombaters (I get way too attached to individual units in really small armies and just don't care enough about units in large armies). A head on confrontation is most to my liking, especially if there are a few different types of armies I can use.

I've looked on the Dom3 wiki and I was thinking of C'tis or Ulm.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Well, it's a good thing you're not being Agartha then http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Their troops kinda suck and without strong magic support and heroes they kinda get owned big time.

basic infantry holds up ok for it's weight class, but can't hit a wall, trog's do good damage, but die really easy and everything else is expensive AND still doesn't hit anything (but if you get lucky they will at least kill most things in 1 hit when it lands) plus they suffer from outnumbering on their already low defense.

You need some good casters to ruin the opposing armies as Agartha. At least that's my initial impressions.

I guess I'll be sticking with the Agarthans.

I do so love the atmosphere of that race. So grim. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Ctis is a great race. The early era host a distinct lack of archers and scouts, however. You can get those in independent provinces, and I recommend doing so. Defenders usually match the pop-type, so you can find archers that way. Scouts are a bit more of a hit-miss affair, so you'll want to summon undead scouts, i.e. a Black Servant. You have more than enough death gems to do so, and its a low-level spell. You can use them for other things later. As well, your nationals are all coldblooded. This won't effect you much in your own territory, but it does mean you'll have trouble invading (and they'll conversely have trouble invading you) colder nations such as Caelum and Niefelheim.

Ulms a nice race, lacks cavalry, but has quite a few archery and stealth options. No experience with them.

For both these races the resource cost per unit is fairly affordable. But you will want a lot of them, they're good and not high in gold cost. You'll need to put some care in the placement of your forts and the resulting resource production. Blesses can be useful in battle, but will not be central to your strategy. You have some useful sacreds, but you cannot (or should not) produce them in large numbers.

I don't know if they're right for you, but you may want to give Sauromatia a whirl. They've got plenty of unit choices, as long as what you're looking for is not infantry.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Their primary magic type is blood, however, which is fairly newbie-unfriendly.

You might really like T'ien C'hi, actually. They've got decent front line troops, access to almost every path of magic, and some of the best archers in the early age. I might be switching nations again anyway.

And yes, I'm planning on naming my pretender (and important units, probably) after a Kohan from the game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I'll choose C'tis for now, there's quite a good wiki on them and they seem to be what I'm looking for.

Just need to wait for the game to arrive now, it's taking ages http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I've just had to reorder the game, so I won't have it for another week or 2.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rant.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Reorder??!

Please, do tell.

What happened? You sat on the cd and broke it before you had a chance to install it?

Or you received an e-mail from Gamer's Front that they do not sell to uncleanly persons?

Why would you have to RE-order?

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Well I ordered Dom3 via Ebay early November hoping I wouldn't have to wait for the delayed shipping through gamers front.

Having yet to receive my purchase I got in touch with the seller who said that his stock had been recalled for some defect and it would be a bit longer to get the game from him.

In the chance this 'recall' was shinanigans I cancelled with him and ordered from gamers front. It's shipped as of last friday, so I hope it comes soon.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Also I'd like to change to Helheim.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

I've now *finally* got my copy of Dominions, so I'll start practicing with C'tis.

So now I guess we're just waiting for Slobbys copy to arrive and me to understand what's going on.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Yep. Just let us know when your copy arrives, Slobby, and I'll get the game started up.

I'd also like to discourage Uber-bless rushing, because some players are quite new to the game and it's just no fun when your first experience is getting hosed on turn 3 by Vanheim's tri-9 blessed berserkers. I know this from experience. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Also, having never played tbs online before, could someone explain what the format is going to be?

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

It will be play by e-mail. Llamaserver will send you a turn file each hosting cycle, and everyone will have ~24 hours to do their turn and send the .2h file back to llamaserver.

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

HEllo people.

Kag is still the best http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
and i do have to say, the community is much much more relaxed, with the exception of ever tense tinuva.
RE E/R: yes it can be a bit of a pain buut zeph still manages to roll people using just good strategy and macro management. he almost never gets involved in micro duels.

sooo... while you wait for your turn to come up, load up kag http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

i got DoM3 demo. looks pretty fun, tho not sure if ill spend $50 on the game. maybe in a few weeks time or so.

Hope to see ya'll online.

http://www.urbanyte.com

Re: The Dominions of Khaldun
 

Slobby,

Any news on when your game will be arriving? I'm itching to start this one up http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif