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-   -   Counter battery fire question (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=51712)

raginis October 3rd, 2017 05:35 PM

Counter battery fire question
 
I checked the manual (Ctrl+F "counter") and did a search on the forum, but I still have a question about counter battery fire:

1. On-board artillery
a) Does it ever counter-battery fire against other on-board artillery (or is the player expected to plot those missions)?
b) Does it ever counter-battery fire against off-board artillery (and does it matter if the on-board artillery has the 200+ range)?

2. Off-board artillery
a) Does it ever counter-battery fire against on-board artillery?
b) Does it ever counter-battery fire against off-board artillery?

The answer to the last two seems to be yes, but I'm asking just to have 100% clarification.

I understand the rules about leaving the artillery idle, having high enough experience etc. as those are spelled out in the manual.

Aeraaa October 3rd, 2017 05:47 PM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
Off map artillery can CB other Off map artillery. On map artillery can manually CB other on map artillery (in other words, if the player plots a bombardment onto the enemy artillery. Anything else and the answer is negative (that means that on board artillery cannot CB enemy off board artillery and vice versa).

Mobhack October 3rd, 2017 07:15 PM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
Off map arty can counter other off map arty, if the range is >= the target battery and its skill is high and it is not plotted to fire.

On map arty is a target for both on and off map arty.

On map arty does not fire counter battery at off map arty.

raginis October 4th, 2017 12:14 AM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
Thank you for the quick response, but there are discrepancies in the two answers. Just to clarify, because the two answers are slightly different on these points:

On-map arty CAN fire counter battery fire (that is, fire on its own, as long as certain conditions are met) against on-map arty, or does it have to be plotted by the player?

Off-map arty CAN fire counter battery fire against on-map arty?

Aeraaa October 4th, 2017 02:48 AM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
ΟΚ, I did a slight mistake on my first reply so I'll answer to your second post:

1-The CB fire of On-map artillery is actually the case of the player (or AI) plotting bombardment on enemy (on map) artillery, NOT automatic CB fire like when off map CBs another off map.

2-Technically it can, but in the same way as case 1 above.

FASTBOAT TOUGH October 4th, 2017 03:14 AM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
1. On map arty has no ability to "counter battery" either on map or off map artillery units. On map arty relies solely on the ability to have the target spotted, whatever the target is, though also you can "shoot in the blind" where you suspect the enemy is located. Concerning arty units you might not see the actual piece of artillery/mortars etc. but, possibly one of your units might just see smoke on the map somewhere. This is a good indication in relation to your units that closer in might be an unseen ATGW team(s), medium distance possibly a mortar unit(s) and further out either field or SPA/SPAA units as a very general rule of thumb. Note what you can figure out in this way so can an opponent whether human or AI. Speaking about this from the AI point of view, it does this very well on it's own.
So yes, it all has to be plotted.

2. Counter battery is totally in the realm belonging to Off Map Arty and then only if you have enough Off Map Units that are not committed to any other fire mission. This applies to all players including the AI.

3. All artillery attacks against On Map Arty has to be plotted whether in the blind or spotted.

Hope this clears it up for you.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Imp October 4th, 2017 07:22 AM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
Counter battery fire only happens agains off map units & is only initiated by off map units that are idle.
The firing unit must have a range equal or greater than the target.
Experience is a major factor, 80+ units are good at CB fire, below 70 normaly need to be idle for several turns & may never fire.
CB always uses all tubes even if some are turned off manually.
Use these criteria to select the best unit(s) to reserve for CB fire.

On map units do not CB fire & all attacks versus them must be plotted by you, smoke puffs give them away & are easy to see with the CD version.

Imp October 4th, 2017 07:23 AM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
against off map

DRG October 4th, 2017 07:57 AM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
I'll add to this

Quote:

Originally Posted by raginis (Post 839728)

1. On-board artillery
a) Does it ever counter-battery fire against other on-board artillery (or is the player expected to plot those missions)?

ANSWER: THE PLAYER IS EXPECTED TO PLOT ON MAP VS ON MAP CB

Quote:

Originally Posted by raginis (Post 839728)
b) Does it ever counter-battery fire against off-board artillery (and does it matter if the on-board artillery has the 200+ range)?

ANSWER: NO THE AI WILL NEVER AUTOMATICALLY CB OFF MAP ARTY USING ON MAP ARTY ASSETS

Quote:

Originally Posted by raginis (Post 839728)
2. Off-board artillery
a) Does it ever counter-battery fire against on-board artillery?

ANSWER: NO, OFF MAP ARTY WILL NEVER AUTOMATICALLY CB ON MAP ARTY

Quote:

Originally Posted by raginis (Post 839728)
b) Does it ever counter-battery fire against off-board artillery?

ANSWER: YES IF LEFT IDLE...IT IS NEVER A CERTAINTY THAT IF YOU DO NOT TARGET OFF MAP ARTY IT WILL BE USED AS COUNTER BATTERY---THERE ARE A NUMBER OF RANDOM FACTORS....RANGE, CREW EXPERIENCE AND MORALE AND SOME OTHER GENERAL RANDOMNESS TOSSED IN SO THAT NOTHING IS 100% CERTAIN

Don

scorpio_rocks October 4th, 2017 11:29 AM

Re: Counter battery fire question
 
A quick follow on question, if I may?

My CB fire seems MUCH more effective on its first salvo, (usually 30+ hits and Battery destroyed) than subsequent turns (around 4 "hits") - Is this normal / intentional?


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