.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

BCT Commander- Save $6.00
World Supremacy- Save $8.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > The Camo Workshop > WinSPWW2
Notices


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old January 5th, 2020, 10:24 PM

krmiller krmiller is offline
Private
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pittsburgh, Pa
Posts: 2
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
krmiller is on a distinguished road
Default AI Air Strikes awfully good

Playing US against German AI in the Round Up Campaign.

Seems like my airstrikes often go astray, they often come in the wrong area and even when in the right place they will hit an infantry target when I've plotted them to take out a tank or gun.

Meanwhile the AI Air Strike will often hit a unit I just moved into that position when it was nowhere near there the previous turn, like it plotted the air strike after I moved and it came in the same turn.

I realize this is '43 and not '44 but the German having 6 airstrikes that always hit something, along with twice as many units, while I can normally only afford to buy 2 or 4 planes that often completely miss their target is ridiculous.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old January 6th, 2020, 08:49 AM
DRG's Avatar

DRG DRG is offline
Shrapnel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: GWN
Posts: 10,080
Thanks: 2,133
Thanked 3,233 Times in 1,621 Posts
DRG will become famous soon enough
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

I assume you mean the RoundHammer campaign. "Round Up" is a weed killer.

Go to the Game guide "Frequently Asked Questions" subsection ( the second item on the left list ) and look for "My aircraft seem useless, and cannot hit things with guns/rockets."

You don't specify a particular scenario in the campaign but the campaign runs July-Aug 1943 but generally for that time period German Pilot EXP and MOR will generally be a bit higher making them more effective and the AI is much more aware of visibility/smoke/dust etc than most human players are and that can make a big difference in how well an airstrike goes. That and any flak encountered also effects how things are resolved.

Airstrikes for both the human player and AI will pick out targets of opportunity so in the case of " I just moved into that position when it was nowhere near there the previous turn" the AI may have already plotted an attack close by but your units that you just moved in are a more tempting target and that can make the AI seem to have magical abilities it just does not have
__________________
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to DRG For This Useful Post:
  #3  
Old January 22nd, 2020, 10:02 PM

krmiller krmiller is offline
Private
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pittsburgh, Pa
Posts: 2
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
krmiller is on a distinguished road
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

You were right I meant RoundHammer, I was just so frustrated I didn't proofread my post.

I've reloaded the same turn several times as a test.
No matter what I do the AI airstrikes always manage to hit something, even when they are out of sight of any enemy spotter and regardless of cover. It has come in at different locations depending on where my units are and always gets a hit destroying or immobilizing a vehicle and/or routing an infantry unit. Meanwhile my airstrikes seldom hit the intended target hex much less any targets of opportunity.

It doesn't matter anymore, going to put this one on the shelf. Really was intrigued with this campaign but it's just not worth the frustration.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old January 24th, 2020, 11:36 PM
Imp's Avatar

Imp Imp is offline
Lieutenant General
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Uk
Posts: 2,991
Thanks: 69
Thanked 432 Times in 342 Posts
Imp is on a distinguished road
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

You are giving them really good targets of opportunity if you are expecting an airstrike that turn do not move important vehicles.

Moving vehicles are really easy to spot so there is a good chance they will be targeted. Move them in-between the airstrikes & remain stationary the turn before you expect the strike.
If there is a lot of air I will even give up ground & retreat towards my AAA assets between strikes to fool it into attacking the wrong place. Also means you are not engaging ground forces who can take advantage of any suppression etc they cause.

Remember the AI normally plays far better if it has air units due to the recon information it gathers. Its very good at acting on that info with air & arty so even spotter planes make the fight harder.
__________________
John
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Imp For This Useful Post:
  #5  
Old January 25th, 2020, 10:26 AM
DRG's Avatar

DRG DRG is offline
Shrapnel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: GWN
Posts: 10,080
Thanks: 2,133
Thanked 3,233 Times in 1,621 Posts
DRG will become famous soon enough
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

As well the other elephant in the room is AA. If there was none bought for the US side then the AI has a free ride. I know the AI has AA in the first scenario in that campaign but strangely enough, the two Warhawks I targeted both hit close enough to the target hex that I asked them to hit and the next pass I made with the one Warhawk that hadn't taken damage on the first strike was targeted to attack the 2cm AA gun that had annoyed me the first pass and it staffed the hex the AA gun was in exactly as I asked it to and caused four crew casualties and since it had not been hit on the second pass was able to make a third pass and that finished that AA gun and since it had not been hit on the third pass I was able to target a pesky AT gun that was annoying my armoured infantry AND destroy it without taking damage so was available to make another pass.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old January 25th, 2020, 11:02 AM
Mobhack's Avatar

Mobhack Mobhack is offline
National Security Advisor
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dundee
Posts: 5,403
Thanks: 116
Thanked 1,350 Times in 929 Posts
Mobhack is on a distinguished road
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

I played a PBEM in SP2 ages ago, bought a few Hawker Hunters. My opponent forgot to buy any sort of AAA, and the tanks he chose were the early T-62 that had no commander's 12.7mm. Needless to say, my hunters roamed free and caused him fits.

Always buy AAA - it can make the difference.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old January 25th, 2020, 01:04 PM
wulfir's Avatar

wulfir wulfir is offline
Captain
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 882
Thanks: 57
Thanked 252 Times in 129 Posts
wulfir is on a distinguished road
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

Quote:
Originally Posted by krmiller View Post
...while I can normally only afford to buy 2 or 4 planes that often completely miss their target is ridiculous.
You can easily edit - a matter of seconds really - the aux build points and number of air strikes available to the US player if you go into the Edit Campaign function and select Roundhammer.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old January 25th, 2020, 04:54 PM
DRG's Avatar

DRG DRG is offline
Shrapnel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: GWN
Posts: 10,080
Thanks: 2,133
Thanked 3,233 Times in 1,621 Posts
DRG will become famous soon enough
Exclamation Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

Quote:
Originally Posted by wulfir View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by krmiller View Post
...while I can normally only afford to buy 2 or 4 planes that often completely miss their target is ridiculous.
You can easily edit - a matter of seconds really - the aux build points and number of air strikes available to the US player if you go into the Edit Campaign function and select Roundhammer.
Funny you should mention this. I am currently looking at the early campaigns in both games for purchase and support point issues the very early one were bought and assigned build and/ or support point allotments based on the early cost calculations we used and in some cases that has changed and in some cases significantly. Each campaign and each scenario in the campaign needs to be checked and that is "oh so much fun". I did find though that some may have already been adjusted. Stalingrad factories core points alloted let you buy what was suggested and there is no way the original gave that many points as at that time the German infantry was 2.5 x cheaper than it is now so each one needs looking at and I'm going to aim for one per day.

However, that does not change the fact the air in roundhammer worked as I expected it would and that has nothing to do with the points but the number of points allotted *may* need to be adjusted upward but I won't know that until I can look at the entire thing in it's totality.

That said what you suggested was exactly what Dick Burleigh wrote in the Iwo Jima Campaign intro.---------

Quote:
I strongly encourage all players to get into the Campaign Editor and edit this and other campaigns to their own liking. Take a look at the simple instructions for the User Campaign Editor in the WinSPww2 Game Guide. Editing the campaign build and support points, node sequence and final victory conditions is much easier than it looks. Add a few more battles or replace existing ones with those that you like better


so if anyone has played any of the early ones and thought they were unbalanced let me know and I will look into them
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old January 27th, 2020, 02:32 PM
wulfir's Avatar

wulfir wulfir is offline
Captain
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 882
Thanks: 57
Thanked 252 Times in 129 Posts
wulfir is on a distinguished road
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRG View Post
That said what you suggested was exactly what Dick Burleigh wrote in the Iwo Jima Campaign intro.---------
It's good advice, for sure.

Then there is the case of player experience too. I find balance to be extremely tricky. A challenging setup for RetLT is a near superhuman effort for us mere mortals...
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old January 27th, 2020, 05:32 PM
zovs66's Avatar

zovs66 zovs66 is offline
Second Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ohio
Posts: 489
Thanks: 462
Thanked 344 Times in 169 Posts
zovs66 is on a distinguished road
Default Re: AI Air Strikes awfully good

Quote:
Originally Posted by wulfir View Post
A Challenging setup for RetLT is a near superhuman effort for us mere mortals...
Ah but when you get a play test report back like:

"801 Four Courts: Very tough. I took the last v hexes on the final turn through sheer weight of numbers..."

Or:

"799 Freebooter's Relish. Very tough scenario.
I was brought to a dead stop for about 10 turns by the last set of HMGs and the sniper. It was only when the sniper ran out of ammo and my AOP team got a lucky hit on one of the HMGs that the tide turned. I had to use the sleds in direct fire to push on since most of my units were too chewed up to move. "

Then you know you done good!
__________________
ASL
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to zovs66 For This Useful Post:
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2020, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.