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Old February 19th, 2019, 02:29 PM

Pibwl Pibwl is offline
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Default Romanian OOB - a few notes only

I've restrained myself from reporting corrections for past several moths, and have largely lost interest in improving the accuracy (luckily for you ). I decided only to write a couple of simple improvements for Romanian OOB, that I had in my notes before. It's mostly to keep icons consistent with other OOBs, plus some research on armoured cars, plus some dates... Not more, than half an hour of work. I had researched Romanian artillery and trucks as well, but I know you don't even want to hear about it


02 Renault R-35/45 - "Thirty pieces were converted and assigned to the 2nd Armored Regiment in June, 1944." according to https://thearmoredpatrol.com/2017/01...l-de-care-r35/ and https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%A...l_de_care_R-35 - now starts at 1/44. Would need change in formations 18 and 19.

82 Melaxa UE - should be Malaxa UE http://www.worldwar2.ro/arme/?article=245

127 SdKfz 251/9 - photo is ordinary 251/1, should be 20607

187 Panzerschreck - photo is Piat

318 Ehrhardt E-V/4 - a dedicated icon, from Polish OOB, is 3444 or 3445 (now it's something with open turret).
However, I've found no information, that Romania used any Ehrhardt at all (eg. in "Trupele blindate din Armata Romana 1919-1947" book, which mentions Austins, Peugeots and Renaults).

319 Austin-Putilov - dedicated icons for this specific vehicle are 2712-2716

There were also used ordinary Austin armoured cars, with transversal turrets, in early 1930s at least - there might be copied Polish unit 651, with armament change.

320 Peugeot 1918 - correct icons are 3466-3468

321 Wz.34 - no Polish wz.34 cars are known to be withdrawn to Romania in 1939, and there's no sign of such vehicles in Romanian service either.

322 OA vz 27 - they survived until 1944 at least (two were destroyed during American bombing raid on Ploesti in summer), although they were rather used for security duties only.
Speed should be 12 like Czechoslovak one

BTW: basic icon of Czechoslovak unit 50 OA vz 27 should be definitely grey 4023, not green - they were unique in Czechoslovak Army, being painted grey all the time (confirmed by Kliment & Francev books)

323 OA vz.30 - main armament was just single vz.26 LMG (like Czechoslovak one).
Speed should be 20 like Czechoslovak one.
Most likely it should be used as above, since they were more numerous.

BTW: basic icon of Czechoslovak unit 51 OA vz 30 should be camouflaged 179, not green - Romanian probably as well (there is a camouflaged photo at https://www.worldwar2.ro/forum/index...pic=4645&st=15 ).


Aircraft


340,481-483 PZL P-37 Los - according to Polish monograph, 300kg bombs weren't used in Romania, but 250kg.
They have too much bomb load, because in Romanian documents 1200kg is quoted (2x250kg + 8x50kg + 3x100kg; or 8x100kg + 8x50kg; probably also 12x100 kg or 2x250kg and 6x100kg would be used) - it seems, that they did not use its maximum load 2500kg, possibly due to flight restrictions?

BTW: according to Polish monograph, in Romanian documents they were named PZL.37 Loos A or B (with double "oo". Not P-37, because it was restricted to fighters).
(In fact, there's little sense to keep different early variant PZL.37A, since there were only 4 of them, including only one with a single tail, and they had no smaller bomb load)

344 PZL P-11b - this early variant of P.11 couldn't take bombs at all (introduced in P.11c)
Delivered from 7/34 (now 1/34)

(Photos of P.11b, which was a bit different: https://i.pinimg.com/236x/37/ab/a8/3...olish-army.jpg
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...l05Hb80w3l6_rT )


358 PZL P-11c - they couldn't carry 50 kg bombs - only up to 4x12 kg.
It's better to change it to licence-produced P.11f, delivered from 2/37 (now 5/41).

347 Ju 87B-2 Stuka - Romania used only (or mostly) Ju 87D-3 (http://wp.scn.ru/en/ww2/b/29/12/0 ) - even the photo is Ju-87D.


Artillery - simple things only


140 105mm howitzer - proper icon (German) for leFH 18 is 2128 (twin tails)

142 122mm Howitzer - proper icon from Soviet OOB is 2115 (now it's long-barrel shieldless piece)

147 76mm Howitzer (Soviet ZiS-3 M.42 FG) - proper Soviet icon is 8026

151 107mm Howitzer (mle.10/12) - it's Russian M.1907, in Romania designated Mod.13/17. Icon should be single-tail 2117

191 37mm AT-Gun (Bofors) - proper new icon should be 8000.

192 45mm AT-Gun - new Soviet icon is 8022

195 47mm AT-Gun - Italian icon is 8029. Probably same for 193 47mm Inf-Gun

196,203 50mm AT-Gun - German icon is 8010

197,204 75mm AT-Gun (Pak 40) - German icon for Pak 40 is 8011.
(BTW: introduced only in 3/43 (now 42) according to "Enciclopedia artileriei române")

198,205 75mm at gun (Resita) - manufactured only from 1944 and used from spring 44 (now 6/43), so the first unit is redundant at all - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/75_mm_...9Ba_Model_1943

Photo is ZiS-3 with its flat shield, should be Resita http://www.worldwar2.ro/arme/?article=300 - possibly pm23046? (better anyway)


200, 206 75mm AT-Gun (Pak 97) - German icon is 8012.

201 47mm AT-Gun - the gun is much too good (pen=8). It wasn't French heavy 47mm L/50 mle 1937, but lighter export Schneider L/44 Model 1936, with 40mm penetration at 500m, something probably little better than Breda
http://www.worldwar2.ro/forum/index.php?showtopic=6517
https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tun_an..._mm_model_1936

470 120mm Howitzer - wrong icon - much too small barrel. The best for ancient de Bange is 2121.

Tractors and cars

223 Praga T-VI-R - speed was only 25 km/h according to Czech book on artillery tractors (now speed 12).
According to Kliment's book on Czech AFVs, ordered only from 1941 (now 1/38)

226 SdKfz 10 has speed 18, in German OOB 22 (correct).

227 SdKfz 11 has speed 16, in German oob - 18 (correct).

237 Stoever Pkw - name should be Stoewer, definitely better icon for these cars is 762 (and green) (current one is used by 222 Tatra 57)


Okay, since this is my last post, I'll add several notes - you'll ignore, if you like.

5 PzKw 38 (t)+ - it was designated T 38 in Romania (http://www.worldwar2.ro/arme/?article=238 )

6 PzKw IIIn - designated T3. According to http://www.worldwar2.ro/arme/?article=240 and http://gmic.co.uk/blogs/entry/532-ro...wen-1919-1947/, existed until 2/44 (now 12/42)

7,8,9 PzKw IVf2 - designated just T4 regardless of version http://www.worldwar2.ro/arme/?article=246 (maybe with additional letters for game purpose?)

13, 17 StuG IIIg - they were designated as TAs - http://www.worldwar2.ro/arme/?article=243 and "Trupele blindate din Armata Romana 1919-1947" or TAs T3 ("Enciclopedia artileriei române")

62 T-60, 63 Bt-7, 64 T-26, 65 M3, 76 T-26 were by no means standard light tanks, and their usage was incidental, so they should be removed from regular formations - maybe apart from T-26 (in fact, there is known only one photo of Romanian T-26 from among these tanks). They all are already present as "captured tank" class. See also http://gmic.co.uk/blogs/entry/532-ro...wen-1919-1947/. Especially there isn't known usage of BT-7 and M-3.

22,64 T-26b (R) - a better photo instead of a sideview is eg. 27809 (there are no photos of Romanian tanks of this variant)

24,76 T-26c (R) - the only known photo of Romanian-captured T-26 is at http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww...nia/t-26-37mm/

83 Komsomolets - their official designation, according to a Romanian page, was "Ford rusesc" (Russian Ford) http://www.worldwar2.ro/arme/?article=247 and "Trupele..."

87 TKS - there aren't known any to be withdrawn to Romania in Polish sources. Photo is German TKS tractor used in Norway.

The End.
  #2  
Old February 19th, 2019, 06:57 PM

Pibwl Pibwl is offline
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Default Re: Romanian OOB - a few notes only

On this occasion, since the thread is not closed yet: I don't want to start a new one, so I only point an attention here, that M-H IV armoured cars in UK and Polish OOBs are waiting for a proper icon, while there is a beautiful one 3933/1212 in SPMBT, and it would be a shame not to adapt it... Sorry for bothering.
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Old February 19th, 2019, 07:22 PM
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Exclamation Re: Romanian OOB - a few notes only

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pibwl View Post

The End.
And I as well .... that is the LAST set of changes I will consider for SPWW2 from anyone. Some of what you asked for had already been done......some not but the OOB's are LOCKED after the release of V12 with only exceptional circumstances considered and nothing here would have qualified.
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