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  #1  
Old October 24th, 2018, 05:02 PM

Aquila Aquila is offline
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Default Arab vs Israel Campaign

Recently started this campaign and build a tank strong core like recommended.

First scenario I´m facing buried in tanks and sure I can imagine that they´re harder to hit but I brought up some tanks and ATGMs up to 200m and they still have an horrible hit chance and miss the most time or can´t pen. Visibility is 70.

I know I am probably supposed to punch trough a small front area but still, the hit chances are not very predicable for me and sometimes don´t make sense from a realism standpoint.

Are there probably some issues with older campaigns?
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Old October 24th, 2018, 07:05 PM
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Mobhack Mobhack is offline
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Default Re: Arab vs Israel Campaign

ATGM at 200m? - fat chance there, they will hardly have sped up to full control speed and so are not at their best. Under min range, no shoot. from there to about 2x min range, not very good. It's why the BMP-1 has the 73mm as well as sagger i.e. to cover out to 1000m with a weapon that works at close quarters.
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Old October 24th, 2018, 08:44 PM
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Default Re: Arab vs Israel Campaign

As a rule-of-thumb you're best firing ATGMs at about 50% of their maximum range and no closer then around 25% (there are OF COURSE exceptions).

As to tanks, if your opposition is dug in try to find a position atop a hill where you can fire down at them, makes their cover less viable. Penetration problems? Gang up on then, have one unit attack from their front to gets their attention then have another shoot them in the flank, MUCH thinner armor.
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Old October 25th, 2018, 02:41 AM

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Default Re: Arab vs Israel Campaign

I meant up to 200m, and not just ATGM´s but also Sabot rounds. I´ve started from aprox. 800m away.

While for a old MCLOS AT-3 system there are lot of reasons why they´re not that precise it wonders me more why the T-62 tanks miss their SABOT rounds on a knifefight 200m range against a completely static turret target most of the time. From a realism standpoint it makes not much sense for me but there is probably something I am are missing (terrain, conditions etc.).

Last edited by Aquila; October 25th, 2018 at 02:56 AM..
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Old October 25th, 2018, 02:47 AM

jivemi jivemi is offline
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Default Re: Arab vs Israel Campaign

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suhiir View Post
As a rule-of-thumb you're best firing ATGMs at about 50% of their maximum range and no closer then around 25% (there are OF COURSE exceptions).
Really. Just blew up an Abrams with a Kornet at 250 meters! Usually they're junk under 400 meters but this brave team managed to get another hit on another tank in the same hex but did no damage. Alas they didn't survive the subsequent half-turn as the stunned survivor came to and vented its fury on the temporal heroes.
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Old October 25th, 2018, 09:47 AM
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Default Re: Arab vs Israel Campaign

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquila View Post
I meant up to 200m, and not just ATGM´s but also Sabot rounds. I´ve started from aprox. 800m away.

While for a old MCLOS AT-3 system there are lot of reasons why they´re not that precise it wonders me more why the T-62 tanks miss their SABOT rounds on a knifefight 200m range against a completely static turret target most of the time. From a realism standpoint it makes not much sense for me but there is probably something I am are missing (terrain, conditions etc.).
I started a 73 LC as Syria and for the first 3 battles the troops arent that good due to low experience.

Once they survived 3-4 battles and racked up a few kills, the tanks are adequate as experience is gained.

I also always try to get the tanks to one position where they will shoot stationary at oncoming enemy (e.g. behind a ridge-line). Low experience troops that move have the hit chance lowered - and that includes having moved far in the previous turn. They need a full turn stationary to be fully halted. So get them to the firing position ahead of time and wait.

In addition I treat a soviet-style tank company as if it were a platoon - all 10 tanks lined up in adjacent hexes 6 front, 3 + commander 1 hex in the rear, 3 attached BMP a couple of hexes behind that. On the initial advance, I marry up a rifle co and some RPG teams on the tanks as riders then try to drop those off 200m behind the objective clusters and let them work forwards - these take care of the pesky Israeli bazooka teams. Concentrated fires help a lot against AI troops that arrive in platoon packets, and especially so when the AI manages to advance as a company sized lump. T-5X and T-62 don't really want to be manoeuvring in even little 3-packs spread all over the shop, they need to be in 10-packs to survive. And my battalion of 3x10 packs tends to move as a single elephant herd of 30. Plus each 10-pack has a section of ZSU-23-4 trailing it. And there is a platoon of BRDM missile shooters overwatching the whole herd, filtered for 9 armour so they plink tanks and not the pesky APCs. Plus the arty and mortars automatically "mow the lawn" in front of the thundering herd as well in order to deal with bazookas and also reduce visibility for the enemy armour so they have to close to engage.

Keep 60s style Soviet equipment in one solid armoured fist, and they do well. It is the way they were envisioned as being used in their doctrine after all.
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Old October 28th, 2018, 09:23 AM
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Default Re: Arab vs Israel Campaign

ATGMs generally best engagement range is between 30 - 90% of their range, my prefrence is to engage at range in the hopes of staying hidden. That said firing at max range is fine for a lot of ATGM,s, top attack are the exception if you need it to penetrate the target as top attack is less likely to occur at extreme ranges.
If an ATGM is part of a platoon don’t normaly set it up with them, set up well back if terrain allows LOS they can screen with RPGs if enemy gets to close.

Versus the dug in tanks with yours it’s hard but you should be firing at them with consecutive fires so your accuracy increases.
Alternate fire with your furthest units to draw fire, they can target anything useful the chances of them hitting are minimal then switch to your closer units.
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