Spell list for CPCS v0.9

[Aezeal]

Steamvault: Creating steam in UW would likely create a hot air bubble and that damages opponents, but why does it give Haste? I like the concept, thought. A damage spell that buff's opponents if they manage to survive. You have given me a lot to ponder..

---> wouldnt'it be more like a self buff that damages.. 2 damage isn't that much.. haste would be worth that I think especially underwater with out ranged combat. I'd not use that spell on the enemy I think (script the effect switched around or they might cast it as a damage spell.. (no idea how the AI works with spell like this though..))

[Burnsaber]

Originally Posted by Aezeal

Steamvault: Creating steam in UW would likely create a hot air bubble and that damages opponents, but why does it give Haste? I like the concept, thought. A damage spell that buff's opponents if they manage to survive. You have given me a lot to ponder..

---> wouldnt'it be more like a self buff that damages.. 2 damage isn't that much.. haste would be worth that I think especially underwater with out ranged combat. I'd not use that spell on the enemy I think (script the effect switched around or they might cast it as a damage spell.. (no idea how the AI works with spell like this though..))

With 2+ damage and AoE 2+? So that the more skilled mage you have the more likely this "buff" spell is to kill your own troops? I'm not sure I agree.

The AI working on spells is pretty straightforward. It reads the main spell code and figures out on that what the spell does. It does not care what the nextspells do. If I have a damage spell that has #nextspell buff, the will think that it's a pure damage spell. If I have a buff spell that has damage spell as #nextspell, the AI will think of it as a buff spell. That's why these spells need to cost gems, so that the AI doesn't cast a buff-damage spell over and over on your troops, killing them.

[VENT]
It's quite annoying really. I'm not really limited by the modding tools, they're quite excellent. The casting AI is my worst enemy on this project. For Example, let's take "Enforce Natural Order" a "Dust to Dust"-type spell that damages also Demons and Magical Beings. Should be easy, right? Brrrrr, wrong answer! Since you can't make a spell that targets Only Undead, Only Demons and Only Magical Beings you need to nextspell 3 effects. But the AI will only target based on the first one! If I make the demonsmiting spell first, the AI will refuse to cast it if the enemy army has no demons to target (even if there are like over 1000 undead). What I have now is a makeshift workaround, until I figure out something better. I'm thinking of making it battlefield wide (affecting like 5-10% of squares in the battlefield).
[/VENT]

Originally Posted by Aezeal

Hey you know what I think would be nice. A spell to give ALL units (yours and enemy all BF) high strenght, high armor and high att, def (is that possible?) so all troops will be more equal (stoneskin sort of caps in the end) ti will end up in a massacre where elites aren't as elite anymore will be fun. Also SC would be hurt more easily and be less important for that battle at least.

A high end fire earth spell I'd say.

Yeah, spells to make chaff more useful could be nice, that's why I try to keep my buff AoE's as large as possible. But this mod is about those A1N2S1 mages who have really don't anything more to contribute in combat than a N2 mage. High end spells with high path reguiements won't help them.

But that's a nice mechanic, I'll also make the buffs MR negates (so that those pisky elites, mages and SC's would be rarely affected, Long live Cavemen!). Now I just need a theme. Why/How would all the soldiers in the battlefield be buffed?

[Aezeal]

Blood for the Bloodgod. All troops get battlecrazed and blessed by Khorne and fight with more strenght than ever (also put a BF wide berserk in it is SWEET so ALL TROOPS WILL FIGHT TILL THEY DIE, and chaff will be more more on par with elites and SC.) ow and don't make it MR negates then so everyone will really fight till the death (no fleeing sc's ).

I'm thinking blood or fire blood, or blood nature.
5 gems and 5 in path needed to cast. (or blood/holy since it's somewhat religious in nature) (or Blood for the wargod and make it holy/fire)(Or blood for the deathgod and make it D/H) or Primeval power and let it be nature

no it's not for those useless crosspaths but.. whatever
personally I think those worthless leftovers from training mages to get the right combination of paths (usually get a high number in one of their paths) should be worthless else the balance will be ruined. Instead of 75% worthless mages a nation will get 100% usefull battlemages.. balance will be gone..

but that is probably not what you want to hear in this thread

[Maraxus]

"All troops will go berserk" sounds like a mage-killer.

[Burnsaber]

Originally Posted by Aezeal

Blood for the Bloodgod...
...
no it's not for those useless crosspaths but.. whatever
personally I think those worthless leftovers from training mages to get the right combination of paths (usually get a high number in one of their paths) should be worthless else the balance will be ruined. Instead of 75% worthless mages a nation will get 100% usefull battlemages.. balance will be gone..

but that is probably not what you want to hear in this thread

Actually, that is excatly the stuff I want to hear. Criticism is always good to hear. If I didn't listen to critics, I'd be nothing but a mere troll.

But I'm kinda confused by your argument. Are you saying that a nation can only have 1-2 useful battlemages and rest have to be crap? This mod doesn't allow you to recruit any more mages than normally, you just might be sometimes tempted to recruit Celestial Masters for their combat ability (seriously, in vanilla, they're just researchers and item forgers, in combat they're W2 mages.. Now that's seriously lame for 6 pick mage).

Besides, all of my spell are mid and low level, since I don't want to touch the late-game balance, not even with a 10-foot laser pole. It's a castle made of cardboard and make-believe. Your E4 mages are still awesome, even if there happens to be some more cross-path spells.

Like Maraxus said, EVERYTHING GOING BERSERK WITHOUT SAVING THROWS IS UNBALANCED. That sounds like a spell for Chaos warhammer mod. Besides, there already is that nature spell that makes units go berserk. But I made this based on our discussion. Astral weapons makes melee weapons AN.

S/N: Blessings of Fortuna: The caster calls for the god of fortune to meddle with outcome of the battle. She will bless some troops on the battlefield by powerful astral protections. The caster has no power over who the Fortuna decides to bless, but she is known to take liking to helping the meek underdogs to prevail against powerful foes. Or the other way around. (battlefield wide, affects both enemy and opponent, costs a gem, MR easily negates!, gives Astral Weapons, Luck, and Twist Fate)

Since it's MR negates easily, it's most powerful when you have a chaff horde and the opponent just has some elite high mr troops.

[Aezeal]

hmmm that one is nice too.. but berserk would make sure one army would be gone in the end.. and that is fun .. maybe berserk but with MR negates then.. so you loose some of your mages but the other still do something. And lets be fair with spells like MoD, SHimmering fields, MASTER ENSLAVE, undead mastery etc etc you can't really call any army killing spell overpowered... this one will hurt your army too remember.

btw your spell is also very powerfull and having that as midrange spell will still be.. game changing.. late game too, only now it starts earlier This because you can easily make and army that takes full benefit of it (and it will be cheap) when opponents will only get 50% or less benefit... at least my idea was less about buffing yourself

[VedalkenBear]

Aezeal: You have hit exactly on what I was trying to illustrate: specifically, that Steamvault can be either a buff or a debuff depending on what you need.

The Insanity one was also in the same vein; if I have magic weapons, what do I care if I give my opponent etherealness? Etc. etc.

For another spell with a 'drawback', try

Quickening Venom
NW
Range: 20+
AoE: 5+
Effect: Cloud that grants Quickness to those within it.
SecondaryEffect: Poison (Probably at least Strong)

For a high-level alternate...

Shocking Rage
NNNAA
Effect: Whole Battlefield, every unit gains Berserk(+2)
SecondaryEffect: Battlefield-wide 1 AN lightning damage.

[Burnsaber]

Originally Posted by Aezeal

hmmm that one is nice too.. but berserk would make sure one army would be gone in the end.. and that is fun .. maybe berserk but with MR negates then.. so you loose some of your mages but the other still do something. And lets be fair with spells like MoD, SHimmering fields, MASTER ENSLAVE, undead mastery etc etc you can't really call any army killing spell overpowered... this one will hurt your army too remember.

btw your spell is also very powerfull and having that as midrange spell will still be.. game changing.. late game too, only now it starts earlier This because you can easily make and army that takes full benefit of it (and it will be cheap) when opponents will only get 50% or less benefit... at least my idea was less about buffing yourself

Yeah, I made it bit less good. It now covers only 25% of the battlefield.

X2 ---------- 3S1N: Blessings to the Meek: The caster calls for the god of fortune to meddle with outcome of the battle. She will bless some troops on the battlefield by powerful astral protections and the ability to always strike on the opponents weak spot. The caster has no power over who the Fortuna decides to bless, but she is known to take liking to helping the meek underdogs to prevail against powerful foes. (Affects both enemy and opponent, costs a gem, MR easily negates, gives Astral Weapons (all weapons get AN), and Luck)
Alt lev 6, Fat:100 (1 gem), AoE: 25% of the battlefield, MR++, UW+

Originally Posted by VedalkenBear

Aezeal: You have hit exactly on what I was trying to illustrate: specifically, that Steamvault can be either a buff or a debuff depending on what you need.

Actually, that's not possible.

The AI working on spells is pretty straightforward. It reads the main spell code and figures out on that what the spell does. It does not care what the nextspells do. If I have a damage spell that has #nextspell buff, the will think that it's a pure damage spell. If I have a buff spell that has damage spell as #nextspell, the AI will think of it as a buff spell.

Originally Posted by VedalkenBear

Quickening Venom
NW
Range: 20+
AoE: 5+
Effect: Cloud that grants Quickness to those within it.
SecondaryEffect: Poison (Probably at least Strong)

That is very good idea. Nice theme and mechanic. I have a N/W spell already, thought. Screw that. I'm making this, I hereby evoke the master rule of Awesome!*

Originally Posted by VedalkenBear

Shocking Rage
NNNAA
Effect: Whole Battlefield, every unit gains Berserk(+2)
SecondaryEffect: Battlefield-wide 1 AN lightning damage.

Global berserking is kinda covered by that N spell. Besides I already have N/A spell.

* = Master rule of awesome can break all other rules in the name of awesome

[JimMorrison]

Originally Posted by Burnsaber

* = Master rule of awesome can break all other rules in the name of awesome

So the Master Rule of Awesome could create a F/S spell like Howl or School of Sharks, that spawns hordes of kittens, instead?

[Aezeal]

Astral fire kittens to the rescue!!!! But they'd have to be miniature giant space hamsters.

Go for the eyes Boo, GO FOR THE EYES!! RrraaaAAGHGHH!!!

Butt-kickin' for goodness!

Make way evil! I'm armed to the teeth and packing a hamster!