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  #11  
Old October 5th, 2011, 10:23 AM
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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

I'm afraid you guys are right. I can't find a formula that would work.

By the pricing used in other Dominions nations the units should be a touch more expensive than they are for their skill, but I guess the reduced hitpoints give an excuse to ignore that.

I've adjusted the prices like this:

samurai: 11 gold (veteran troops, defence 11, morale 11)
(should be gold 12)

O-ban: 14 gold (11 / 11 skill, mor 12)
(should be 15 gold)

Go-Hatamoto 17 gold (att 12 / def 11, mor 13)

Aka-Oni Samurai: 20 gold (att 12 / def 12, mor 14)

***

They get a progression of +3 gold each which is nice and consistent. I'm gonna leave the Aka-Oni samurai as generic tough guys. Too bad, but I just can't find a way to fit any ability with their description.

An updated 1.01 version will be out in a few hours.
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  #12  
Old October 5th, 2011, 10:29 AM
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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

Skrattir in wolf form no weaknesses? Have you even played with them in MP? They have enough weaknesses. (ps, I think CBM reduced the HP a bit). Sure they are powerful, but removing the hand slots really takes away they usability as thugs. 250gold is way to expensive for a unit without shields, or the ability to hold shields, or a head slot. Against any opponent even with shields and head slots they usually die like flies. (They do not have a lot of MR for example, without hand slots they are stuck at reasonably low damage and attack (for thugs/sc anyway), defense and only normal damage, not AP or AN. Which removes large swaths of jotun and urdheims midgame strategies). And without head or hands you cannot even give them enough resistances against attacks. Using them against a skilled opponent is now a big mistake.

Nobody will ever use them in wolf-form anymore. As you get more mage bang for your buck in normal form. (Fallen frost spam for example, blood gives easy access to communions).

Fear on recruitable units is a big no no. Fear is way to good massed. That is what makes the demon knights so good. The massed fear on the super heavy cav. Also the nightmare is not recruitable in the base game, and I think they have never been balanced for ingame use. (The 15 enc is a bit strange for example).

Other stuff you could try with the samurai, give them patrol and pillage bonuses. Make them auto remove unrest. (Doesn't work on troops iirc).
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  #13  
Old October 5th, 2011, 10:45 AM
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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

Also, without gemgens, the monkey nations (except lanka, which is more an ape nation anyway ). Are a lot weaker. As all require a lot of S gems. Same for LA R'lyeh.
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  #14  
Old October 5th, 2011, 01:12 PM

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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

What nations are you using as a baseline for this pricing scheme you have going on for Jomon? Gath? Because those troops are largely overcosted themselves and have thematic reasons for their costs(see: Asherite Soldier).

As an example: LA Arcosephale. 10 gold for utterly average Peltasts. 11 gold for 11 hp, 12 morale, 11 str, 11 attack, 11 defense Phalangites/hoplites. Hypaspists are 15 gold but only different from Phalangites etc. by 14 morale instead of 12.

LA Man has 11 HP 12 morale 11 attack 11 def 11 precision crossbow-wielding Tower Guards for 13 gold. 15 gold to bump hp and morale to 13 and def and precision to 12.

Gath: 13 gold for 13 morale, 11 attack 11 def on Zebulunite Soldiers, 15 gold for Asherite Soldiers with *worse* stats than that for thematic reasons. The only troops so far priced similar to yours--and at least they have shields.

I'm also very confused about increasing the gold cost of the sacreds--were you finding people using them too much?

Overall, it feels like instead of making the various weapons more unique or fitting, they are all homogenized. For instance, all of Jomon's weapons are more or less the same. You can use a Katana for 7 damage 2 attack...or a No-Dashi for 8 damage 1 attack. Not enough of a difference to recruit one over the other for different situations. Or the Naginata, which used to be a good option for dealing with high-protection targets. Now it is no different from a No-Dashi damage-wise. Everything is either 7 or 8 damage and...boring. Your changes have reduced the amount of strategy that you can use recruiting Jomonese troops.
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  #15  
Old October 5th, 2011, 01:23 PM

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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

Oh, and the Hammer change only affects two things: it makes Claymen super-powerful and makes MA Ulm not purchase any other kind of infantry. I suppose there's also one mercenary band of heavy infantry that is now really good too.
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  #16  
Old October 5th, 2011, 01:30 PM

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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

The hammer change also affects hoburgs and siege golems iirc but yeah, the main change is to make ulm's hammer troops the only unit they ever use.
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  #17  
Old October 5th, 2011, 01:48 PM

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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

Nightmares are bollocks. One or two death mages or a swarm or two and they're gone.

Anyway, I was wondering how an axe is superior to a sword historically?
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  #18  
Old October 5th, 2011, 02:25 PM
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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

Executer, never heard of the axe wielding samurai then?

Or the knights of the round axe.
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  #19  
Old October 5th, 2011, 03:53 PM
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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soyweiser View Post
Skrattir in wolf form no weaknesses? Have you even played with them in MP?
Heh, indeed I have, and they are a royal pain in the arse. Way too good for their price. Shields you say? I say etherealness, luck and as many attacks as you can pile on them... like this, with cheap early game magic items: (The etherealness and luck come from vaetti hags buffing them at start of battle).




Other stuff you could try with the samurai, give them patrol and pillage bonuses. Make them auto remove unrest. (Doesn't work on troops iirc).[/quote]
Pillage bonus could be a good idea for feared troops. For now I think I'll just leave them as straight elite tough guys.
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  #20  
Old October 5th, 2011, 03:57 PM
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Default Re: Adept's Balance Mod 1.00 ready

Quote:
Originally Posted by Executor View Post
Nightmares are bollocks. One or two death mages or a swarm or two and they're gone.

Anyway, I was wondering how an axe is superior to a sword historically?
You think it's superior form the stats here? No, it definitely isn't. What it does is do _more_ damage than a sword.

Compare:

Broadsword. dam 6, len 2, def +1
Axe dam 8, len 1

The sword is definitely the better all around weapon, but at least the axe has something going for it. If you manage to get into range 1 and land a hit, it will hurt more. It's "point" is the low resource cost. Compared to a sword an axe is a low tech affair.
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