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  #101  
Old September 11th, 2006, 05:29 PM

Arker Arker is offline
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Default Re: Artificial stupidity

Quote:
Graeme Dice said:
Now you're claiming that they _do_ act as ordered.
Not at all. I'm claiming the same thing all along, and you have posted numerous times agreeing with it.

When there are no enemies in range of their spells, and no buffs are applicable, they go to 'stay behind troops.' Even when that's NOT the order they were given.

Quote:
"Actually, that's the point, they DON'T just do what they're ordered to do." If that's not calling something a bug, then nothing is.
Not really. If it was intentionally designed to work that way, it wouldn't be a bug per se. It would still be annoying, and perhaps a design decision that, in retrospect, wasn't optimal. It might be a good thing to reconsider. That doesn't really make it a "bug."

Quote:
Then you haven't run very many test games. I certainly hope you're not using Saber Cherry's combat simulator.
Never used it.

As far as the minotaurs vs centaurs thing, look, that's a pointless discussion. You use what you like, I'll use what I like.

But I think that IF what you were saying about the Minotaurs, and the entire light infantry line, were true, that would be every bit as close to a 'bug' as the problem with mages I started the thread about. What's the point in having different troop types if the combat engine is so silly that your best tactic is a big pile of one troop type in the centre of the screen?

Fortunately the combat engine isn't as bad, in my experience, as you seem to think. It does have some rough spots, some things that could be improved, of course.

Quote:
Quote:
Light infantry are less effective than they should be, which is why I suggested a modification to the AI that would improve the situation, yes, but if you think they're useless you're just not using them right.
If you spend 1000 gold on light infantry, and I spend 1000 gold on heavy infantry, you will end up losing, since I'll have about 75% as many troops as you, yet each one can kill two or three (or more) of yours.
I don't doubt that at all.

I wouldn't do that, though. I'd spend perhaps 700 on the heavies, the last 300 on the lights, and deploy them to screen or flank. I think I'd win, and again, if I wouldn't, that would seem to be a 'bug' at least by your standards.

Quote:
Quote:
IF you set them up on the battlefield right, right for Dominions that is, not right in any realistic sense, then yes, you can get that out of them. If they're foot troops, at least.
It's not hard to set them up right. You put them in a single block in the middle of the field on "fire closest".
If that's the extent of your tactical thinking, I guess a lot of this makes more sense now

Quote:
Since foot archers can reach across nearly the entire battlefield, what possible advantage do you hope to gain by using mounted archers? You aren't going to do significantly more damage by having them move closer, the combat model isn't detailed enough for that.
No, actually, it's definitely not that bad. Archers hit a LOT more at close range than all the way across the battlefield.

They could also be used to 'pull' enemy squads into disadvantageous positions.
  #102  
Old September 11th, 2006, 05:33 PM
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KissBlade KissBlade is offline
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Default Re: Artificial stupidity

Buying 25-30 minotaurs is just about the biggest waste of gold ever. Also I wonder wat you mean by "cheap support" since 25 - 30 minotaurs are very expensive. Also I assure you, unless you plan on your "cheap support" doing all the gruntwork, 25-30 minotaurs cannot wipe hundreds of troops. Plus at that stage of the game, the centaur's faster movements will prove much more useful at reaching the backline of casters that will wipe your minotaurs easily.
  #103  
Old September 11th, 2006, 06:12 PM
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Graeme Dice Graeme Dice is offline
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Default Re: Artificial stupidity

Quote:
Arker said:
But I think that IF what you were saying about the Minotaurs, and the entire light infantry line, were true, that would be every bit as close to a 'bug' as the problem with mages I started the thread about.
Bugs are things that don't work as designed, not problems with the design.

Quote:
I wouldn't do that, though. I'd spend perhaps 700 on the heavies, the last 300 on the lights, and deploy them to screen or flank. I think I'd win, and again, if I wouldn't, that would seem to be a 'bug' at least by your standards.
I highly doubt that you'd win. The lights won't do anything to the heavies, and will be killed in a single hit each.

Quote:
If that's the extent of your tactical thinking, I guess a lot of this makes more sense now
Tell you what. I'll set up a game on the battle simulation map where we can each send 1000 gold worth of non-sacred troops with no mage support into a province with neutral dominion. You can pick any nation, and any troops you want, then set them up however you want. I'll pick 1000 gold worth of purely heavy infantry from any nation that you don't want and stick them in a single block as far forwards as possible. We can see which wins the battle. It won't be the army that wasted gold on low protection troops.
  #104  
Old September 11th, 2006, 06:52 PM
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Default Re: Artificial stupidity

Don't forget the obligatory two or three advance militia as arrow catchers =).
  #105  
Old September 11th, 2006, 08:46 PM
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Strider Strider is offline
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Default Re: Artificial stupidity

Moderators have sent PMs to some of the posters in this thread. It hasn't had enough of an effect. I'm locking this one up.
  #106  
Old September 11th, 2006, 10:19 PM
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Mindi Mindi is offline
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Default Re: Artificial stupidity

I’d like to make a statement here and I hope everyone is listening. When a moderator asks you to cut out some unacceptable behavior, you cut it out, it’s as simple as that. I don’t care who started it, but a moderator’s intervention should be the end of it.

We’re pretty relaxed around here, I don’t have to step in often and in general I think we have a pretty good community that knows how to act like adults and police their own posts. HOWEVER, I want to be clear here and say that the type of behavior posted in this thread will not be tolerated. Neither will childish behavior like “well he started it!” as an excuse for retaliation or taking an argument to another area of the forums after a thread lock. I will not hesitate to reward childish behavior with childish punishments, such as time outs! This is probably a good time for everyone to familiarize yourself with the Board Rules again. Consider this your reminder of the rules and a final warning.

We’re about to have an increase in traffic and community activity with the much anticipated release of Dominions 3. Lets remember to treat one another with respect so that these forums can be enjoyable for all.
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