.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

The Falklands War: 1982- Save $7.00
War Plan Pacific- Save $7.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > Shrapnel Community > Intel Forum Bar & Grill

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old June 25th, 2005, 01:26 AM
Mindi's Avatar

Mindi Mindi is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Lancaster, OH, USA
Posts: 1,250
Thanks: 28
Thanked 74 Times in 49 Posts
Mindi is on a distinguished road
Default Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=59697

I can't decide which is more unconscionable, the fact that a child died because of this sort of neglect or the implied comment that if they had only left their 4 month old daughter home alone for 1 to 2 hours, like usual, it would be okay.
__________________
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

For those looking for with this forum, please see Annette as I am retired.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old June 25th, 2005, 05:47 AM
FJ_MD's Avatar

FJ_MD FJ_MD is offline
Second Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Italy
Posts: 447
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
FJ_MD is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

Sad news indeed, but you cannot left a 4 months baby all alone! I think the baby have the priority above all other things...
__________________


Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old June 25th, 2005, 10:00 AM

Leslie Leslie is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 71
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Leslie is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

Their time in court would be short.

I would sterilise both and tell them both after they got out of jail they could forget adoption as well.

Even an idiot can get an equally stupid woman pregnant.

But it takes brains to be a parent.
__________________
Just my humble forum
http://lesliesplace.net/index.php?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old June 26th, 2005, 04:01 PM
Mephisto's Avatar

Mephisto Mephisto is offline
Brigadier General
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
Posts: 1,994
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mephisto is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

If we judge the situation with fewer emotions I think we will come to much more founded judgment. Let’s see:

1.) A baby has died by suffocation.
2.) It did happen without the environment noticing.
3.) The parents were away playing a computer game.

Regarding 1.) Quite a number of babies die by suffocation, less in the last years. A reason for this was because parents were told to put their babies to sleep in the stomach to reduce the risk of sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS). But as newborn babies are mostly not strong enough to move their head from one extreme position to the other they rest their head quite in the middle in the pillow and suffocate. It’s an accident and happens from time to time. There is not much you can do besides putting the baby on the back (but even then some babies roll).

Regarding 2.) Babies are often left without observation for hours – every night when the parents are asleep. Total control over the baby is not achievable and not realistic.

Regarding 3.) Playing the computer game was irrelevant to the fact the baby died by suffocation. It would have even if the parents were were just watching TV next door. One who suffocates does not cry – he has no breath to do so.

So, all in all, we have a baby who died a horrible and tragic way because – most probably, but we don't really know – the parents were not observing the best way to put a baby to sleep. In the end, the baby died to an error many parents do and an accident, that the baby tried to move its head and wasn't strong enough. The parents neglected the baby not more or less then millions of other parents did, including our own parents. Ask them if they were watching you 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year without pause. I doubt it. "Let him who is without guild cast the first stone". My 0.02$.
__________________
For, in the final analysis, our most basic common link is that we all inhabit this small planet. We all breathe the same air. We all cherish our children's futures. And we are all mortal. - JFK
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old June 26th, 2005, 04:09 PM
FJ_MD's Avatar

FJ_MD FJ_MD is offline
Second Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Italy
Posts: 447
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
FJ_MD is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

What you say, Mephisto, is right but I still think that the baby must have the priority.


I don't want to judge the parents, but some errors in this case were made.
__________________


Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old June 26th, 2005, 05:15 PM
Mindi's Avatar

Mindi Mindi is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Lancaster, OH, USA
Posts: 1,250
Thanks: 28
Thanked 74 Times in 49 Posts
Mindi is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

Mephisto,

Addressing your points:

1. They actually have specialized pillows so they can't roll over now and accidently suffocate as this poor child did. There are other methods that people use to make cribs and sleeping in general safer for a baby. Of course there are no guarantees.

2. Babies should only be left for hours during the night when parents are sleeping. I would think at 4 months however you would still be using a baby monitor and be getting up during the night to check on the child as well. Granted, this does not guarantee a baby will not suffocate, but they are basic safety precautions that most parents use to ensure they know if their baby is in trouble. And the fact remains that in this case they chose to leave a baby alone for 5 hours with no one in earshot to hear if the child was in trouble or to check on the child. In the states if you did that and the authorities found out, your child would be taken from you and put in foster care until you got some parenting courses and proved you were a fit parent along with dealing with criminal charges of neglect.

3. Playing a computer game is irrelivent, the neglect is not. I purposely said that the baby died from neglect and not a computer game as the computer game did not suffocate the baby, nor could it. I see this as a selfish act in which they are now responsible for the death of their child. What they were addicted to that they chose to put priority above their child is irreleveant--they could have been partying, at a bar, shopping, whatever--that doesn't matter. What matters is that the parents were neglectful and negligent in their daughter's death by leaving her, a 4 month old baby, in a house by herself for 5 hours. The implication from the parents that it would have been okay if they left her for only 1-2 hours by herself as usual completely boggles my mind. It shows that their parenting is lacking as is their judgement. Especially considering there was someone living right upstairs that could have watched the infant, but they chose to leave her alone anyway.

Just my $.02
__________________
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

For those looking for with this forum, please see Annette as I am retired.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old June 26th, 2005, 07:42 PM

Leslie Leslie is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 71
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Leslie is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

I find Mephisto's post a bit weird to be honest. No offense.

Yes accidents happen, that's why they are called accidents.

When my son was an infant though, I was unable to NOT contiuously check the lad. And I only slept when it was my turn. My wife and I basically didn't sleep normal for about 3 years.

In that time, yes accidents might have occurred, hence the term.

And yes, I had a baby monitor going.
I often held my son as he slept. He slept many sleep times while I held him safe. I would watch TV and would not be concerned about my son, as I was holding him.

Parents come in all manner of varieties. And I won't cut any slack for those that should have opted for oral sex the time their child was conceived.

Newborns face so many challenges when they are born. And the first 3 years are just one long challenge. Not that your 15 year old son is much safer. Might not die from crib death, but he still has to pass through being a teenager

The facts are, the parents were not present in the room, they were not present in the home and they were not making a hurried dash to a very close store to get something utterly essential.
No, they ABANDONED the child. And all so they could go out and play a %$#@%# online video game.

For starters, they should have their fingers broken, made incapable of ever using a mouse or keyboard.
They should have their pictures displayed so all could see them for the fools they truely are.
Warning, don't make the mistake of leaving your kids in the care of this couple, their own offspring wasn't safe, and neither will yours be.

Excessive you say, nope, I don't think I am being excessive at all.

The baby suffocated.
The baby could have burned in a fire that the parents would have been oblivious to. The baby could have been stolen by a thief.
The manner of harm that might have befallen the child is hard to estimate, because let's face it, the parents would not have been there to do anything about it.
__________________
Just my humble forum
http://lesliesplace.net/index.php?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old June 27th, 2005, 04:01 PM
Mephisto's Avatar

Mephisto Mephisto is offline
Brigadier General
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
Posts: 1,994
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mephisto is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

No problem. I'm a bit weird.
You are all right that the baby should have the highest priority. There is no debating that and no one did. But let’s not forget that not all people live the way you and I live.

Yes, there might be pillows that prevent the rolling and suffocation. But not everyone has access to them. The medical standards of the US are not met by most of the world.

Yes, there are monitors. “Real” monitors – not baby phones- are expensive and will not be covered by insurances if no hint for a higher risk for SIDS is diagnosed (talking for Germany, of course). Baby phones make you feel save but you aren’t. If a baby suffocates, it doesn’t cry any more. It has no breath for it [Hence the “first” rule for a paramedic: The one who can cry is treated last, he has enough breath. The ones not crying any more are the severe patients.]. I had my share of SIDS as a paramedic and the parents were sleeping right next to the child.

Yes, I wouldn’t let my child be alone for any length of time. However, we all do not know when the baby died. It could have been 2 minutes after the last person left it or 2 minutes before they returned. Before calling for punishment we should convince ourselves if they could have done anything about it. Just because they were not there did not necessarily killed the baby. That’s my main point.

Leslie, I admire your resolution to sleep in shifts and have a constant watch over your child. But I stand to my point that not very many parents can do this, neither physically nor economically.
__________________
For, in the final analysis, our most basic common link is that we all inhabit this small planet. We all breathe the same air. We all cherish our children's futures. And we are all mortal. - JFK
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old June 27th, 2005, 05:44 PM

Leslie Leslie is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 71
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Leslie is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

My key point though, remains that the parents, through entirely screwed in the head logic, figured they actually could leave a child alone, with them not even being remotely close at hand, so that they could go and stroke an obvious obsession.

These two parents are not in the same category as any other parent that has had to suffer the grief of finding their loved one dead through a cruel act of fate.

Damn it but I hope it makes them grieve. I hope they suffer for the rest of their lives.

They didn't even make the attempt to even try to ensure the safety of their child. They didn't even make the effort.
__________________
Just my humble forum
http://lesliesplace.net/index.php?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old June 27th, 2005, 06:21 PM
Mephisto's Avatar

Mephisto Mephisto is offline
Brigadier General
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
Posts: 1,994
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mephisto is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Baby dies while parents play World of Warcraft

Leslie, on this we agree.
__________________
For, in the final analysis, our most basic common link is that we all inhabit this small planet. We all breathe the same air. We all cherish our children's futures. And we are all mortal. - JFK
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.