Mod: Ulm Reborn v.1.7b - Updated 14th June 2009

[Sombre]

That's another very helpful response. I especially appreciate you finding the numbers for the forts - I'll add it in just as you posted (I really suck at forts for my mod nations for some reason - I either forget them or enter the wrong numbers).

The penitent is sacred, disease free, flail armed and just as throwaway and swarmy as ever in v.05. I'm actually a bit suspicious of whether domsummon works the way I thought it did (does the white priest attract more than the black priest?). Maybe something to balance and alter for 0.6?

White Priests get S1 in 0.5

The national summons are a bit odd. They're not super powerful, nor are they that expensive and they don't require researching. They're more like extra units in the regular Ulm lineup that you can get (possibly via alchemy) once you have a gem income. The Sternheld has A3 S1, so he opens up a lot of magical options for Ulm (possibly a bit strong actually). They are sacred undead, so I think I'll put in the doctor's bless fix (so you can bless undead).

In 0.5 there are two priest spells - one healing at H1, one lightning bolt (sort of) at H2 - I'm not sure how balanced they are since you don't need to research them but they didn't seem awesome in testing, just a nice addition.

0.5 will be up tomorrow for sure. For now I've attached a graphic preview (also good for people who are considering trying the mod out). I've gone for a fairly unified graphic feel to the whole mod.

[Sombre]

0.5 is up. I think the national summons might not be balanced and the hoch hammer might need to be cheaper and less of a killing machine. I had 4 of them in one squad last game and they racked up a crapload of kills.

0.6 will be balancing changes, maybe add a national hero or two. I might add a penitent farming 'Black Shepherd' commander, or he might be one of the aformentioned national heroes. If you think the nation could really do with something or needs a balancing change please do chime in.

Happy blessings and may the Aufklarung reward ye.

[Sombre]

I'm sticking up v0.6 earlier than anticipated because I found various bugs in playtesting that were pissing me off. I'm hoping there should be less of a tide of penitent in this version, because I've figured out that domsummon didn't work the way I thought it did. In v0.5 you could amass a silly number of them.

Also added a penitent spawning national hero 'The Grey Shepherd'.

[SlipperyJim]

Sombre said:
I'm sticking up v0.6 earlier than anticipated because I found various bugs in playtesting that were pissing me off....

The attachment for the first post is still v0.6.

[Sombre]

Did you mean 'still 0.5' ?

It's 0.6 now. I was having trouble uploading.

[SlipperyJim]

Sombre said:
Did you mean 'still 0.5' ?

It's 0.6 now. I was having trouble uploading.

Ummm ... yeah. That's what I meant.

I started another test game with v0.6. This time, I picked an imprisoned Oracle with E9S4N4 and five candles. Scales were Order 1, Productivity 3, Cold 1, Growth 1, Luck 1, and Drain 3. As before, I picked the Silent Seas wraparound map and one Easy AI opponent.

More thoughts:

• I really like the two new Holy battle spells. Smite the unbelievers! Heal the faithful!
• I love the new national summoning spells, but I think they might be a bit overpowered at Level 0. That much oomph should require a little research first. Perhaps they should be Conjuration 4 or 5?
• Sternheld make great archers. A lucky random event gave me a Storm Bow, which I promptly gave to my Sternheld. ZOT!
• Hoch-Hammers are extremely impressive, especially if you prophetize one of them. Actually, I'm worried that they might be a bit overpowered. However, those killer hammers only get two shots, and then they're basically just overpriced Hochmeisters....
• I really like the division that you made between the three priest commanders. Each one has his own role now. Black Acolytes for stealthy preaching, Black Priests for summoning hordes of chaff, and White Priests for Divine Blessing & magic support.
• Speaking of hordes of chaff ... three or four Black Priests accompanying your army make for a neverending supply of free Penitents.

Pretender suggestions:

• Please make the Forge Lord (id #1230) an available pretender for Ulm Reborn. Forging & Ulm go together like coffee & donuts!
• The Divine Glyph (id #1025) and/or the Sacred Statue (id #472) might also be thematic.
• The Scorpion King (id #655) might not be thematic, but he'd sure be a great chassis for a killer F9E9 bless.

Iron Faith Ulm is really shaping up to be a great nation. You've done an excellent job in keeping the theme, while still making a nation with some interesting playability and potential.

You win a medal! [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon44.gif[/img]

[Sombre]

The reason the summons got lvl 0 was to make them more like additional holy spells. I put them in the conjuration school rather than divine so that they'd be easier for people to spot. I could raise them up a couple of levels, but I'm not going to put them too high up because Ulm Reborn isn't exactly flash when it comes to researching and the summons aren't exactly superpowered (although the sternheld is a pretty impressive mage considering).

I really don't want to make an overpowered nation,.. at the moment I see the potential problems as the hoch-hammer, the sternheld and the domspawning. I don't want to swap the domspawning for #summon or call allies if I can help it, but the problem is I can only give the priests domsummon, domsummon2 (half as effective) or domsummon20 (a twentieth as effective). Domsummon20 is useless for penitent, but it seems domsummon2 might be too much (right now the white priests have domsummon2 and the blacks have domsummon2 and summon1. I think what I'll do for now is give the blacks domsummon2 with no extra summon and the whites summon1 or summon2.

I like to use summon or domsummon because the AI does better with it than call allies.

The hoch-hammer does initially seem like it might be overpowered, but for 400 it's not /that/ good. If you get a group of them together they can give low morale armies a real shock and of course they tear through undead like crazy,.. but I don't want to nerf em. They're a fun unit after all. I'm tempted to give them only one ammo for the spirit hammers and reduce their cost to 350 or so.

I'll sort some pretender options out in the next version for sure. Maybe even make a new one. That's probably a little while away though - I want to let the balance sit on this one for s bit, see what's what and work on the other two mods (both near final).

One thing that I've decided while making this mod and vaettihiem SE is that nations based on or replacing vanilla sides are just as interesting, if not more so, than completely new concept, art etc mod nations (like my first, Avernum).

[SlipperyJim]

I'm not calling it overpowered. Please don't think that!

Ulm Reborn v0.6 is powerful. It combines traditional Ulmish strength with some powerful priests and sacred units. Several of the recruitable commanders are very thuggy. Free Penitents can be very nice -- even though they're not great units -- because they're free. The additional Holy spells are just icing on the cake.

Then again, Ulm still has its limitations:

• Lack of magic flexibility. The White Priests are strong in Earth magic with a smattering of Astral. The Sternheld can use Air magic. And ... um ... that's it. Any other magic schools will have to come from the pretender and/or independents.
• Resource-heavy units. Those Reborn Guardians and Black Templars are really nice, but you can only crank out so many of them per turn.
• The best units are capitol-only.
• The almost-mandatory Drain dominion (to give you enough points for other cool stuff) will seriously hinder your magic research. No easy access to research boosters (especially Skull Mentors) will make your research even slower.
• Unless you're making an all-cavalry army (and how many resources would that need?), you'll be limited to a strategic move of one. All of that armour makes Ulm slow....

So, yeah, please take my posts as compliments. I really like Ulm Reborn, and I'm only trying to help. If I'm annoying you, please feel free to ignore me.

[Sombre]

No your responses have been very helpful. Far from annoying. In fact I'd like more people to chime in with opinions on mods, even if it's to say "This is horribly overpowered" or "This unit is thematically dodgy and not worth the gold". There's a perception that mod nations are all hugely overpowered and I think it's generally better to be cautious - after all if most people just use them for single player they probably wouldn't mind an extra bit of challenge.

Re: Drain. White priests are drain immune (I hope) which makes the drain scale less of a,.. well,.. a drain. Plus magic research isn't as important with UR as sheer priest and troops power. At least until late in the game.

One thing Ulm Reborn does do as advertised is crack unbeliever skulls. For a human nation they have really, really heavy guys, including thuggy commanders. There's nothing they like better than just slugging it out and slowly grinding through enemy territory. Free penitent (although they cost a lot of upkeep for spawns) and very survivable troops means once the juggernaut starts moving it's very hard to stop.

[BandarLover]

I like this mod, a lot Sombre. I don't really have anything to add or suggest to make it better. And I do like all the penitents, personally. Making more appear the stronger your dominion seems to fit as well. The stronger your god, the greater the pull to attract those who are fanatical for your cause.

Hoch-hammers are great too. Maybe make their hammer a one hit wonder, kinda like a lance maybe.

That's pretty much it. Keep up the good work.