OOB16 Broken Formations

[AMX]

I noticed some formations that are available before there are any units for them:

Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le)
Available 10/34
Should be 11/34

Formation 16 JagdPz Zug/4
Available 2/35
Should be 4/40

Formation 17 Panzer Kp (le)
Available 9/34
Should be 11/34

[DRG]

Originally Posted by AMX

I noticed some formations that are available before there are any units for them:

Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le)
Available 10/34
Should be 11/34

Formation 16 JagdPz Zug/4
Available 2/35
Should be 4/40

Formation 17 Panzer Kp (le)
Available 9/34
Should be 11/34

The short version of a long story is formation 16 was given what should have been formation 17's start date in error. I discovered that 45 minutes after the patch was released.


So, those three formations should be........

Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le)
Available 11/34

Formation 16 JagdPz Zug/4
Available 7/43 ( NOT 4/40 )

Formation 17 Panzer Kp (le)
Available 2/35 ( NOT 11/34 )

I have already corrected the master and I would advive anyone who plays early war battles with the Germans use the changes I noted as well.

Don

[BigDuke66]

Maybe I misunderstand something here but lets do it step by step:

"Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le)" uses Unit 002 PzKw II C but that one is available from 5/37 so isn't 11/34 still too early?

"Formation 16 JagdPz Zug/4" uses Unit 043 LaS 762 that is already available from 5/42 on so isn't 7/43 a bit too late?
If so maybe other formations that use this vehicle must be checked too:
JagdPz Kp /14
JagdPz Kp /9

"Formation 17 Panzer Kp (le)" has the same problem as "Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le)" it used PzKw II C (5/37) too, additionally the PzKw I is available from 9/35, so isn't 2/35 too soon?

[DRG]

Originally Posted by BigDuke66

Maybe I misunderstand something here but lets do it step by step:

"Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le)" uses Unit 002 PzKw II C but that one is available from 5/37 so isn't 11/34 still too early?

"Formation 16 JagdPz Zug/4" uses Unit 043 LaS 762 that is already available from 5/42 on so isn't 7/43 a bit too late?
If so maybe other formations that use this vehicle must be checked too:
JagdPz Kp /14
JagdPz Kp /9

"Formation 17 Panzer Kp (le)" has the same problem as "Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le)" it used PzKw II C (5/37) too, additionally the PzKw I is available from 9/35, so isn't 2/35 too soon?

Yes, what you are misunderstanding is a fundamental aspect of the game.

Formation 9 Panzer Grp (le) "uses" Unit 002 PzKw II C as a placeholder for the unitclass " light tank". It does NOT have to be the earliest unit in the OOB.

We do include the tools to learn this with MOBHack

Click on FILE -> Database Check Utilities - > Unit checks - > 12-Light Tank

and this is what you find......

Searching for Units of class 12 Light Tank
001 - PzKw I B - Available 09/035 to 12/041
002 - PzKw II C - Available 05/037 to 12/040
003 - PzKw II F - Available 03/041 to 12/042
004 - PzKw II Luchs - Available 10/043 to 12/046
005 - PzKw II J - Available 05/042 to 07/044
215 - PzKw II D - Available 05/038 to 03/040
388 - PzKw II C - Available 01/041 to 03/043
570 - PzKw I A - Available 11/034 to 12/039
573 - PzKw I C - Available 10/042 to 12/044
834 - PzKw II A / B - Available 10/036 to 12/039
838 - PzKw II F - Available 01/043 to 12/043
951 - Aufklarer 38t - Available 02/044 to 12/044


......... that there IS a unit in the light tank class that the game can find and offer as a choice for that formation. Had you made the change I suggested and loaded the game you would have saw that.

Here's what's available for Units of class 19 Tank Destroyer



042 - JPz I - Available 04/040 to 12/040
043 - LaS 762 - Available 05/042 to 12/042 044 - Marder II (Sf) - Available 06/042 to 12/042
045 - Marder I 37L - Available 07/042 to 12/042
046 - Marder III H - Available 12/042 to 12/042
047 - Marder III M - Available 05/043 to 01/044
048 - PzJgr 38(t) - Available 04/042 to 12/042
049 - Nashorn - Available 07/043 to 12/046
050 - JPz38(t) Hetzer - Available 07/044 to 12/046
053 - Jagdpanther - Available 06/044 to 12/046
054 - Ferdinand - Available 07/043 to 12/043
055 - Elefant - Available 01/044 to 12/044
056 - Jagdtiger - Available 12/044 to 12/046
200 - Sfl.Sturer Emil - Available 02/042 to 01/043 *has X3 Radio Code*
282 - StuG III Ausf.G - Available 07/043 to 01/044
380 - StuG III Ausf.G - Available 02/044 to 05/044
385 - Marder III M - Available 02/044 to 12/046
386 - Marder II (Sf) - Available 02/044 to 12/046
387 - JPz I - Available 01/041 to 03/042
480 - SdKfz 10/5 PaK - Available 06/040 to 12/041 *has X3 Radio Code*
481 - SdKfz 10/5 PaK5 - Available 07/040 to 12/041 *has X3 Radio Code*
503 - JPz IV/48 F/1 - Available 03/044 to 09/044
504 - JPz IV/48 F/2 - Available 06/044 to 12/046
507 - JPz IV/70V - Available 08/044 to 12/046
510 - JPz IV/70A - Available 09/044 to 12/046
555 - StuG III Ausf.G - Available 06/044 to 12/046
578 - Jpz 35(f) - Available 06/041 to 12/042
840 - Jagdpanther (+) - Available 01/045 to 12/046
856 - Jpz 35(f) - Available 01/043 to 09/044
960 - Marder I 37L - Available 01/043 to 12/044
961 - Marder I 39H - Available 06/042 to 12/042
962 - Marder I 39H - Available 01/043 to 12/044
963 - LaS 762 - Available 01/043 to 05/044
964 - Marder II (Sf) - Available 01/043 to 01/044
977 - PzJgr 38(t) - Available 01/043 to 06/044
980 - Marder III H - Available 01/043 to 01/044

NOW click on

FILE -> Database Check Utilities - > FORMATION checks - > 19 Tank Destroyer

AND YOU FIND THIS

016 JagdPz Zug/4 - Available: 07/43-12/46
044 Jagdpanzer Grp - Available: 04/40-12/46
072 JagdPz Kp /14 - Available: 01/44-12/46
158 JagdPz Kp /10 - Available: 10/42-06/43
191 JagdPz Zug /3 - Available: 04/40-06/43
192 JagdPz Kp /9 - Available: 07/43-12/46
6 formations found using UC 19


The earliest a JagdPz formation starts is 4/40..... now refer to the list of Tank Destroyer units and you will see that there are units that cover from 4/40 - 12/46 and everything in between and that should answer all your questions


Don

[BigDuke66]

Thanks for the clarification, is that generally so that the formations use units as placeholders so that a specific unit can't be forced into the formation instead only a unit class?

[RVPERTVS]

How do I correct this issue?

[Imp]

2nd post down in this thread

[BigDuke66]

I think he means how not what.
Use MOBHack OOB Editor that comes with the CD version, watch that you save any change on each page to memory(use the little red checkmark at he top bar) or the are lost and after doing all changes save the OOB itself(go to file menu and use "Save current file").

[RVPERTVS]

Thank you! that´s what I was looking for.

So please correct me if Im wrong, does this mean that if playing a PBEM game my opponent should also correct this?

[BigDuke66]

Well if the formations listed here are used in your game I guess you should but I got no clue if changing the OOB in a running game is OK, I guess DRG can tell for sure.