Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Viajero · #1 April 22nd, 2009, 03:04 AM

I know this is a rock/paper/scissors kind of game so I am sure there is a counter to Marble Oracles.

Any ideas? I am playing with MA Ermor (research levels currently at around 5-6) so if those ideas can be applied by MA Ermor, even better.

The Marble Oracles that I am dealing with in particular, additionally carry boots of behemoth and protection bracers etc.

The thing is that they seem to be all around perfect units:
80+ HP, 22+ prot, 50 moral, 16 base magic resistance (!!! with a few buffs or a good bless this can easily be increased to almost 20!!!), 22 str... the only weakness seem to be a relatively low attack at 12 but with the said behemoth boots or a decent weapon the problem is solved. On top of it they are sacred units benefiting from bless etc etc

They are mindless, lifeless, stone being and magic. I know there are some spells to hurt just magic beings but they do not seem to hurt much... at least at levels 5-6 of research which is where we are + or - at the moment.

I was planning to use my Banes (overall good protection, defense and atack) against them but not sure now as they might get just trampled by the boots?

any other weakness you guys may know of I can exploit? Would paralyze work (although with those 16+ magic resistance levels not sure how productive...)

Kuritza · #2 April 22nd, 2009, 03:15 AM

They are magic beings and constructs, so elf bane axes, smashers etc are your friends here - equip some counter-thugs. (Bane lords, for example)
MR 16 is not that great; set up a (reverse) communion and spam control and opposition. In CBM control and opposition are also easier to cast/research, making contstructs much more vulnerable to mind-affecting astral spells than undead/demon thugs (which is ridiculous, but that's another story).
As a desperate measure, make some mr-penetrating items (spell focus, eye of the void), put these on your h3 priests (I believe MA Ermor has them) and just spam smite. Maybe set up a communion beforehand. I am not sure just how effective that may be, but if you send a BIG communion with penetrating trinkets, you have a chance to stop these Oracles. After all, they are rather expensive.

Viajero · #3 April 22nd, 2009, 03:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuritza

They are magic beings and constructs, so elf bane axes, smashers etc are your friends here - equip some counter-thugs. (Bane lords, for example).

Wouldnt Bane Lords also get trampled by the boots of behemoths these opracles are carrying?

JimMorrison · #4 April 22nd, 2009, 03:27 AM

As Ermor, you want to spam Nether Bolts or Nether Darts at them until they are Feebleminded. This reduces MR by 5. It's evil, and it works, and I hate it.

Once that is accomplished, destroy at will with your favorite anti-construct spells.

If the Nether Bolt doesn't Feeblemind like the Darts (I can't recall for sure, never use it!), then some Black Bows can do the job just the same, and are cheap to produce.

Viajero · #5 April 22nd, 2009, 03:34 AM

Which ones are the anti-construct spells? I read above "control" and "opposition"?

Endoperez · #6 April 22nd, 2009, 03:49 AM

Shatter, E3 Alt 5, is construct-only.

Could the marble oracle kill a tough size 6 unit, such as a Behemoth?

Casting magic-resistance-negates spells doesn't work against high-mr units every time, but the trick is using spells that HURT when they get through, and casting them until that happens. Soul Slay only has to get through once...

Viajero · #7 April 22nd, 2009, 04:44 AM

Would Paralyze work against Marble Oracles? or is just for living units or units with a mind?

Redeyes · #8 April 22nd, 2009, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viajero

Would Paralyze work against Marble Oracles? or is just for living units or units with a mind?

Sadly, it won't work because of mindless.
But you could use Stellar Cascades & Ghost Grip to great effect.

Turns out you'll need to scratch stellar cascades at least, went into a test-game to try it and it didn't work. I know it works against mindless Undead however since earlier games, it must be an effect of their lifeless tag.

chrispedersen · #9 April 22nd, 2009, 09:30 PM

Banefire (53+ ap damage) is ea ermors traditional answer to SC's.

I haven't played MA ermor in awhile...

Psycho · #10 April 22nd, 2009, 04:52 AM

Trampling is a lousy attack. I think it has only attack 10. So high defense helps a lot. Also luck and eternalness. Give your bane a good shield to boost his defense (gold shield - 9 parry, shield of the accursed - 11 parry) and couple him with an astral mage to cast luck and body ethereal on him. Also give him ring of regen to heal those 1hp damage hits he'll get from trampling.