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  #21  
Old September 19th, 2010, 12:43 AM

RERomine RERomine is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

Turn 19

Four enemy units on Alpha's front are Pinned. The rest are running. One popped out this turn out of nowhere, so there might be some others unseen up there. The only units I have close and up top are my light tanks and they aren't the best spotters. They can clobber what they do see, however and they have been doing that.

Pressure building on Bravo again. A new enemy platoon has appeared heading through the pass between the hills. My mortars are shifting that way and three of my four tanks are in position to provide support. Most of the enemy in the slot are running.

Scooted my tank and armored car around so they can shoot at some enemy on the hill that are visible. I'm pushing them back slowly. I managed to turn two of the flags in the south group, so it attracted the attention of a near by enemy squad. He got peppered from a number of directions.

Casualties

Friendly: Estimated 10 casualties.

Enemy: Estimated 20 casualties.
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  #22  
Old September 19th, 2010, 01:10 AM

RERomine RERomine is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

Turn 20

I moved all of Alpha up and am pushing the enemy back. My forces may take more casualties this way, but it will get rid of them quicker also. I did "find" a sniper, who dropped five of my men before my light tanks zeroed in on his position and took him out. My troops also found two scouts, one of which has gone on a personal visit to the war gods. The enemy have a few units holding, but most are running. My troops will help inspire them to run.

Bravo is still holding fast and the enemy coming up the slot are starting to break. Not so much because of my infantry, but because of my tanks and mortars.

Pushing remnants of Charlie forward, too. They are spotting a few enemy survivors on the hill and my armor is taking care of them. Threw back the enemy squad near the objective group and turned four more flags. I only have one to recover.

Casualties

Friendly: Estimated 10 casualties.

Enemy: Estimated 25 casualties.
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  #23  
Old September 19th, 2010, 01:26 AM

RERomine RERomine is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

Turn 21

Most of the enemy infantry is running on all fronts. The main problem this turn was incoming mail. Both Alpha and Bravo were hit and took casualties.

Last flag turned, but the enemy doesn't appear to be completely done yet or this battle would be over. I'm going to spend time raking the units I can shoot to try to bring this to an end.

Casualties

Friendly: Estimated 10 casualties.

Enemy: Estimated 20 casualties.
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  #24  
Old September 19th, 2010, 02:30 AM

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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

Decisive Victory!!!!

Turn 22

Alpha cut lose at everything in range, which wasn't much. There were a few pinned units, including an FO. Destroyed the FO and a scout. A few squads in range were sent running to the rear. My light tanks on the left side had LOS of a few units the main line didn't and tore into those. The only response from the enemy was a little artillery on and behind the line.

Repositioned a couple of tanks along Bravo's line so everyone could shoot. I didn't fire my infantry because there were still a lot of enemy in sight. Most were on the run, but Bravo is basically shattered and I didn't want to lose the rest of a squad for the loss of one man. I did swing my light tank south on Bravo's hill so it had a better view of enemy retreating on the low ground. It laid into some and hurt them badly.

All the enemy on Charlie's hill was retreating or routed, so I pushed them forward a little more. I also moved my tank and armored car again to get more shots. The only fire the enemy put on the hill was by one squad the Kosmolets down south had kept pinned. That little track did well at delaying the enemy from that sector.

Mortar fire continued to pound the slot, hastening the enemy departure.

The Germans decided they had enough.

Casualties

Friendly: Estimated 5 casualties.

Enemy: Estimated 20 casualties.

Total Casualties

USSR

Men: 243
Artillery: 1
Soft Vehicles: 0
APCs: 0
AFVs: 4
Air Transports/Helos: 0
Aircraft: 0

Germany

Men: 513
Artillery: 0
Soft Vehicles: 0
APCs: 0
AFVs: 31
Air Transports/Helos: 0
Aircraft: 0

Score

USSR: 5143
Germany: 411

Final Comments

This battle was everything I expected it to be. I faced basically four German Infantry Companies and two German Tank Companies. They were as tough as I expected.

The fire support that the enemy was able to employ helped them some, but not as much as it could. Too much of it was spent targeting isolated targets instead of massed targets. It finally got around to massed targets near the very end, but it was too late by then.

I'm still not convinced that my infantry can stand alone without armor support. A total of 29 armored vehicles were destroyed. Of those, my infantry accounted for two; one tank and one already immobilized and damaged armored car. They also immobilized one other tank. Of the remaining 27 AFVs destroyed, my mortars accounted for three and my tanks, armored cars and ATGs for 22 and two were classified as destroyed because they were abandoned at the end of the battle. While I didn't keep track, I believe only 20% of my assaults resulted in any positive result. This is mainly due to the fact that they have no integrated AT weapons. An assault with grenades can work, but it is almost a last resort. If I can't beef up my infantry AT capability, I need to do it some place else.

My defense worked about as well as could be expected. The enemy hit me in a seam in my defenses. Bravo and Charlie were not in contact. This is where they hit me. My armor defense was spread out to handle attacks along the front and they concentrated all their tanks in this one area. I stopped them, but at the expense of having Bravo and Charlie mauled. Maybe that is the nature of the game and in the end, I won.

During the repair and refit stage, I'm going to have to seriously look at my force and see where it can improve. I lost three tanks and will have to consider my options. Realistically, there probably wouldn't be any replacements early in the war. I'm not going to allow my core, which has already been gutted, be totally destroyed. It will take some thought. I might have to start using more of my support points as well. They may end up being cannon fodder, but could be used to dull the German blade while my core breaks it in half.

I've attached the save just before I ended my last turn. Enjoy!
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File Type: zip Saved Games.zip (202.0 KB, 133 views)
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  #25  
Old September 19th, 2010, 04:59 PM

RERomine RERomine is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

Doing a touch of research to determine how I can realistically upgrade my force, it seems there is no way to really do it. Given the location that my last battle took place, Bialystok, USSR, the vast proportion of the Soviet forces didn't make it out. The 3rd Army was capture; the 10th Army was captured; the 4th Army survived, but units were starting to be transferred by the end of 7/41. I've also found that all Soviet mechanized corps were destroyed early in the war and none were created again until 8/42. My next battle is in 7/41.

Based on this information, I will have to deviate from reality sooner or later. First off, I'm generally defying history by surviving. This can't be helped, since I'm not going to lose to be realistic. For the most part, the parent units of all Soviet units in the Bialystok area ceased to exist shortly after the battle. There were survivors, but those were parceled out to other armies. I have no idea which ones did survive and where they went. This gives me something of a blank check as to where I want to be. From what I read, I won't get that blank check until after 7/41.

All that said, I'm going to compelled for sake of realism to stick with equipment similar to what I already have, at least with respect to armor and ATGs. My infantry, I can upgrade since it generally involves changes in small arms. While I don't have any integrated AT options until 10/41, I can incorporate SMG teams into each of my platoons. I'm also going to make sure all of my engineers have flame throwers and satchel charges.

The only thing I have left to decide is should I replace my lost armor. In the June-July time period, it is highly unlikely line units were receiving replacement tanks. More than likely, it was repair and get them back on the line. I'm going to leave my four destroyed armor units (two medium tanks, one light tank and one armored car) out of action during the next battle. If needed, I'll use support points for next battle. During the reassignment after 7/41, I'll replace based on my new parent unit.
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  #26  
Old September 19th, 2010, 05:48 PM

Brian61 Brian61 is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

Your battalion is within a regiment/division/corps/army that is historically pretty much wiped out but, a surviving battalion out of a corps means the corps *is* pretty much wiped out from the operational perspective. So you're the surviving battalion

That line of thought opens up the question: What happened to survivors from sibling units? You could draw a parallel to what happened with the Black Brigade (Polish 10th mechanized) in that campaign; they replenished many of their losses by picking up strays along the way - that included some armor. (What finally killed their armor was lack of gas not direct enemy action.)

So it wouldn't be unrealistic I think to pick up a replacement tank or two (as well as personnel or crewed weapons such as an ATG) from otherwise wiped out units within the same regiment/division/corps. The tanks might be odd ducks, different than what they're replacing (BT's for example), and maybe, just maybe, that might give you an excuse to pick up one 57mm ATG which would make your life quite a bit easier vis-a-vis german armor.

While the late war German TOE's were the most blatant example of wishful thinking, it was rare for any unit in any army during WWII to have exactly the gear their TOE called for. They all picked up useful things along the way, accepted different equipment as replacements when there was little other choice, and discarded things that were useless (when no one was looking of course).

Just a thought
Brian
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  #27  
Old September 19th, 2010, 06:07 PM

Ts4EVER Ts4EVER is online now
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

You could even make a little "scenario" out of that. Say you have a delay mission. In that case you could buy a heavy tank, but play it as if it was broken down and immobile, to simulate ad hoc defenses and units that were left behind etc.
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  #28  
Old September 19th, 2010, 06:09 PM

RERomine RERomine is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

All valid thoughts, but I don't think I have to worry about it much. My next battle turns out to be an advance, so I can expect to run up against 25% of what I just saw.

After this battle, my battalion will find itself attached to a tank brigade This will allow me more realistic options and excuses during later battles.

I've attached one .PDF that I use as a guide for my TO&E. It helps, but I don't take it as gospel. I've got a whole bunch of these .PDFs for different nationalities and time periods. They are handy
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File Type: zip russianob.zip (81.3 KB, 139 views)
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  #29  
Old September 19th, 2010, 06:27 PM

Brian61 Brian61 is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

Interesting document, any idea where I could lay my hands on a set? I'm always on the lookout for more information sources.

Thanks,
Brian
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  #30  
Old September 19th, 2010, 06:30 PM

RERomine RERomine is offline
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Default Re: DAR: USSR vs Germany

I can't remember where I got them, but I downloaded a whole bunch. Send me an email address in a private message and I'll send you all that I have. I've got a lot for post WW2 also, so they can be helpful with WinSPMBT as well.

Cheers,

Ray
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