|
Re: Blood?
Quote:
In Dom1 Ice Devils and Illearths were great SC's but the others weren't really set up for SC. In Dom2 with only 1 Illearth and 7 Ice devils its not exactly a huge pool of SC's to go after - especially if other players are also looking at demons. Cheers Keir |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
However, I don't think it's a glitch that scouts are good blood hunters, as they've always been that way (worse with dousing rods). I'm not sure whether/how to rebalance them, as most of the races with blood magic rely upon them to get anything out of it. Besides, IMHO Scouts themeatically make sense for the job. One thought is to only allow blood mages to hunt for slaves -- or anyone with a dousing rod. This makes more sense to me thematically, but is a very drastic change. |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
|
Re: Blood?
Quote:
|
Re: Blood?
No I used Arco. So I had access to Paralyze as well. Arco is probably my top pick for survivable units with the combination of high hit point Elephants, high protection and shield using Hypsists (for 2 movement with elephants) and a priestess for heal.
I used my pretender (3 Turns) and a scout population to field the slaves and my cheap researchers were mystics. Another bonus is that Arco doesn't need to use it's mage base to expand like others (for quickness, raise skeletons, etc) to expand as they are powerful later as opposed to right away. Another one that worked very well was C'tis I had a IDevil at turn 20, then 21 I got the sword and boots (this is my favored way to equip an ID for owning provinces) as well as my alteration. I also had Enchantment 3. So by and large, it can be done if you really force yourself. But I've found more to my liking, casting 2 Hordes from Hell, as it allows multiple armies nearly as effective as the ID as well as patrol force. I'd have to play with it more; but it does come with certain costs and isn't for every race. I never played the Dom1 ID rush; but this is perfectly acceptable timing for me to have or fight against an ID. Turn 10 would be hard, but nearing 20 it's more copeable. |
Re: Blood?
And yes, I'm saying SCs are not all that. They were the first direction I moved in - I love building magic items. Then I learned the hard way that any decently large army will mow a SC down, if by no other process than statistical probability. Wounds, the chance of running into ugly spells - a SC strategy is no better than any other. And Ice Devils? I've looked them over. Good stats. If you want to go the SC direction, they're as good as anybody else for the job, I suppose. Don't come crying to me when a bunch of knights lance your killer demon to death and you have to rebuild, though.
Now, there is ONE thing here that might change my mind. Up until today I had never heard of this 'using scouts to blood hunt' thing. If there's a trick to make blood slaves much more accessable, especially to traditionally non-blood races, the balance of power shifts towards demons considerably by sheer ease of access. After all, the *potential* for blood slave income and efficiency as a source of magic is tremendous, but in my experience it's always taken too long to get going unless you're a blood magic race - and if you are, you're generally magically restricted enough that making good uber-equipment is hard. So by all means, convince me. Tell me this blood slave reaping trick. Although I still might just stick to demon knights. They're tremendously efficient themselves. |
Re: Blood?
Jasper I read what Illwinter siad on what they were trying to do with blood and in my opinion the scout thing is a major gliche. Thats why Alex made a big deal of pointing it out - so they could correct it. With scouts blood hunting its back to anyone having access to blood.
I have been playing blood hard for the Last few days, I have summoned Ice Devils, Arch Devils, Fallen Angels and every sort of little blood summon and my honest opinion is that blood is the worst path of magic. I have done worse in the games I have used blood than using Tien Ch'i Barbarian Kingdoms. I do better with Mictlan when I largely ignore blood and go for mass protection instead. In PBEM I aim to play in games with a high level of experiance and the pace is generally fast and cut throat. This is not a style question but a survival question. In this sort of game I think blood is crap. Playing SP, for me, blood is crap because I do so much better when I ignore it. So for me blood is crap and thats very sad. I think people got carried away on the whole anti-blood thing in Dom1 and there was alot of miss information around about what the problem was - many seem to think the blood SC's in Dom1 are simply overpowered as opposed to overpresent. My experiance using fuly equipped ID's is that they are very expensive and somewhat vunerable - and that was before paralyse. Jasper have you played blood much? Your comments about blood SC's are just so wrong. Sure Ice Devils and Illearth are good SC's - thats one Illearth and some of the 7 ID's. The other big demonic summonings are not great for the job. In general ID's are nowhere near as good as people think. I used them as suggested in Dom1 and lost them. I learnt and used them in packs after that. A good army (including mages generally) will crush a small number of fully equipped SC's in my experiance. And this isn't even taking paralyse into account. SC's have fallen along way in Dom2 and I suspect that even if you could still summon theorericaly unlimited numbers of ID's it wouldn't be a problem in practice. Blood used to be the mid/late game SC path but now mid/late game SC's are vastly weaker and blood is much weaker. The combined affect is under impressive. When is blood good then? On a big map, in a slow paced game, using the dodgy (MM intensive) scout hunting trick. I have tried really hard to make blood work. In the process I have managed to make Mictlan work ok but I still haven't got blood to work. Blood the only thing worse than Mictlan? Nah Abysia using blood is still better than Mictlan. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif Cheers Keir |
Re: Blood?
Just had a minor break through - easy research. I'll be playing with this for the next period as in general I find mundane approaches overpowered in Dom2 - see thread on subject.
Cheers Keir |
Re: Blood?
>many seem to think the blood SC's in Dom1 are simply overpowered as opposed to overpresent.
No, they were very overpowered, although it wasn't just the ID's, it was the ID's in conjunction with easy hunting and the Blood Fountain. >My experiance using fuly equipped ID's is that they are very expensive and somewhat vunerable - and that was before paralyse. In Dom1... they kicked butt every which way. There was no downside. >In general ID's are nowhere near as good as people think. Obviously, but you must be missing something. >I used them as suggested in Dom1 and lost them. Nobody said they were invincible, just too powerful for the costs. >I learnt and used them in packs after that. In Dom1? Where you equiping them well? They should only be sent in packs if naked. >A good army (including mages generally) will crush a small number of fully equipped SC's in my experiance. And this isn't even taking paralyse into account. In Dom1? You'd better cross your fingers on those mages. Good luck on massing enough before the ID's showed up. That was the issue. In Dom2, things are MUCH more sane. The Blood Fountain is no longer absurd, SDR's are weaker, and the ID more expensive. I would never want to go back to the Dom1 path of blood, as it was crazy overpowered. >Blood used to be the mid/late game SC path but now mid/late game SC's are vastly weaker and blood is much weaker. The combined affect is under impressive. In Dom1 it wasn't mid/late game at all. Often there would be ID's roaming about before turn ten. In Dom2 they have been relagated to later in the game. Rightly so. All the summonable supercombatant "chassis" should be relegated to the mid game at the earliest. >When is blood good then? On a big map, in a slow paced game, using the dodgy (MM intensive) scout hunting trick. Playing on small maps has biased your impressions. Play in longer games and you'll get an idea of why high level magics including blood are critical. |
Re: Blood?
ID anecdote:
I was using a fairly buffed ID (Wraith Sword, Rainbow Armor, Boots of Quickness IIRC) in its vaunted "take provinces by itself" role. I used it to take a couple provinces from C'tis, and then it withstood a counter-attack or two. I then noted that another attack by the Lizards got it, so I watched the battle to see what did him in. Turns out the army that did it had one squad of Manikins. The ID took them out a 2 per round, but the rest were able to hit him enough to put him to sleep. I am of the opinion that SCs are fun, but I think I'd ignore them if I were trying to maximize my efficiency, rather than my fun quotient http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif |
Re: Blood?
Blood magic as a whole is nearly useless in a small map or short game. That is more of a production war.
Where it really shines is the mid to late game. As should be seen. |
Re: Blood?
Alex's opinion mirrors mine exactly, so I won't repeat it. IMHO several of the people who don't think Ice Devils are effective are misusing them (trying to take on large mage backed armies alone) or misequipping them (missing regeneration rings or antimagic amulets). These details make all the difference.
In response to Keir, no I haven't played Ice Devils competitively myself, but I have faced them. Without paralyzation it was not so easy to fight them as people suggest. Large mage backed armies are fairly easy for IDs to avoid -- but cost more than IDs and are less mobile. Such armies are also severely curtailed once Murdering Winter is in use. |
Re: Blood?
I guess what I'm getting at is that IMHO IDs were clearly the most powerfull tactic in Dom 1, and the burden of proof IMHO is heavily upon those who would claim they're ineffective in Dom 2.
More expensive? Less Effective? Sure. Ineffective? IMHO hardly. |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
Alex I have a fairly good idea how to use ID's in dom1 and have used them just as you say (I was following your advice) and early on I followed your and others advice that they were insanely poweful and you only needed one to kill an enemy army/conquer a province - only it didn't work. After losing my first 4 in PBEM I used them in packs and they kicked butt. I think there was a good degree of sensationalism about ID's based on peoples very real and horrible experiances facing 4+ in one army. I have never found single SC's to be a signifcant threat to a main army. They are more use raiding and even then can die to bad luck. Just having two makes it a heap safer. You posted your ideas on what a killer SC was Alex and people wrote back saying they tried it and did ok for awhile and then got unlucky. I tried your ideas in Dom1 Alex and kept losing the pretender. I remember one idea you had for a quick start using the Earth Mother and some black plate. I tried and and she died relatively early. I have always though you must be a dedicated, and skilled, gambler with your love of SC's. As the game goes on it becomes easier and easier to get unlucky and I'm not prepared to take that risk. I tried and others tried against me and I am convinced its not worth the all your eggs in one basket risk involved. Give your opponent a heap of threats and targets is my approach and was in dom1. Its just alot more flexible. As for having plenty of mages in armies I generally did this in Dom1 - HI are gold cheap mages are resource cheap. Basis of much dominions play. I remember being told how nasty Lammashta's are just before an opponent tried them on me and guess what - they got bLasted off the battle field and only did damage when he found my scout - damage to him. A well balenced army in Dom1 or 2 is the best thing and ss the game goes on that can include multiple SC's. If you want you can run around with single ultra expensively equipped SC's but opponents I have played doing this have mainly been gifting me magic items though they often take a few provinces before I nail them. I got to kill an equiped Moloch twice in one game and helped equipped my ID's from the loot. Sure Blood is good in a longer MM intensive game suited to those younger, or with more stamina or whatever it takes, than me. However I miss blood. It used to be useable from very early and I wish it still was. Sure this is my experiance and others playing slower games have a different experiance. You pay for those blood skills even if you don't get any use out of them. What I want is to be able to get use out of blood playing Dom the way I do. This is a natural enough desire to want to get to make the most of my bag of toys. Cheers Keir |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
I played the ID's before turn 10 races in Dom1 and they were nowhere near as powerful as the other races I played. Its just not worth the expense until you can equip the ID's so you need to get your gem income going by searching etc. Same as the mages need to get protection but in the meanwhile the mages are still great helping conquering indies and don't need protective items for this. I'll just repeat the point in my other post - want Dom1 fast monstrosities then look no furhur than Seasonal spirits and Air elemntals. ID's didn't compete in that role - however later they rocked. The big problem with ID's in Dom1 was not the power of 1 ID but the power of 1 ID a turn - and that was achievable by about turn 20. That is why I stress the issue of quantity. Cheers Keir |
Re: Blood?
>Air elementals
>Seasonal spirits These certainly were two other very potent Dom1 paths. Both got ripped to shreds in Dom2, so what is your complaint in relation to ID's in Dom2. All three strong strategies got nerfed. I don't see what you are complaining about. >could end the game before you could get enough ID's to do much. Not in my experience. >ID's were only good with magic items and that takes time to get. They were good without items... just BETTER with. >Alex I have a fairly good idea how to use ID's in dom1 and have used them just as you say (I was following your advice) and early on I followed your and others advice that they were insanely poweful and you only needed one to kill an enemy army/conquer a province - only it didn't work. If you didn't get ID's to work then you were doing something wrong (in Dom1). I'm sorry, you can complain until blue in the face, but it won't make them any less abusive in Dom1, nor will you convince people to make them cheaper in Dom2. Feel free to try, but you're just spinning your wheels. >After losing my first 4 in PBEM I used them in packs and they kicked butt. If you were losing ID's often, then you either had outragously bad luck, were putting them into bad battles, or were under equipping them. >I think there was a good degree of sensationalism about ID's based on peoples very real and horrible experiances facing 4+ in one army. The bad experiences with them went well beyond that. >I have never found single SC's to be a signifcant threat to a main army. "Main Army"? As in what? The biggest enemy stack including mages? Of course you don't send the ID after that. Use some common sense. >They are more use raiding BINGO! >and even then can die to bad luck. As can most anything. >You posted your ideas on what a killer SC was Actually I have never posted any "killer SC's", I have only posted SC ideas to help others get started or gain some insight into how to make their own. >and people wrote back saying they tried it and did ok for awhile and then got unlucky. Some. What do you expect? I never said that supercombatants were invincible. In fact I have gone out of my way to help people deal with them. >I tried your ideas in Dom1 Alex and kept losing the pretender. You lost a pretender! Shocking! Seriously Keir, I'm pretty clear when describing my suggestions. Did I say "Do this and your pretender will be invincible"? Or was it more like "Try this and it will aid your initial expansion"? >I remember one idea you had for a quick start using the Earth Mother and some black plate. I tried and and she died relatively early. Try again. I never suggested black plate. It would fatigue the Great Mother too much, which is already an issue for her. The Great Mother doesn't need armor since she can cast ironskin or invulnerability. >I have always though you must be a dedicated, and skilled, gambler with your love of SC's. In Dom1 there was no gamble. In Dom2 there is more danger, but it's still worthwhile. >I tried and others tried against me and I am convinced its not worth the all your eggs in one basket risk involved. I never put all my eggs in one basket. SC's are just one of many tools. >Give your opponent a heap of threats and targets is my approach and was in dom1. Its just alot more flexible. Hrm... you mean something along the lines of flying 7 ID's into my enemies territory? I assure you that my play style is all about the "heap of threats". >I remember being told how nasty Lammashta's are just before an opponent tried them on me and guess what - they got bLasted off the battle field and only did damage when he found my scout - damage to him. I'm not sure why you are mentioning this... however Lammashta's are tricky to use. Sometimes they can be used to tremendous effect. Other times not. If I were you I wouldn't dismiss them so quickly. >If you want you can run around with single ultra expensively equipped SC's but opponents I have played doing this have mainly been gifting me magic items though they often take a few provinces before I nail them. Have I or anyone else every suggested that anyone set-up a "single ultra expensively equipped SC"? You are reading more into what has been written than was there. >What I want is to be able to get use out of blood playing Dom the way I do. While I have no issue with players making suggestions, you can't expect Illwinter to alter the game just to accomodate a playing style that is near unique to you. I suggest that you wait for the mod software, and make yourself a "Blood magic works fast, so I can play quick games abusing that one facet of the game" mod. |
Re: Blood?
I just want to say: Truper, I couldn't have put it better myself.
|
Re: Blood?
Quote:
IMHO Air elementals and Seasonals were in practice only really nasty against new players who hadn't considered their effectiveness. Their window of effectiveness was brief, whereas Ice Devils were effective for the rest of the game. Moreover, equipped Ice Devils were only a few turns slower than Seasonals due to ramping research totals. IMHO your claim about "the game being over" before IDs is exaggeration. Equipped Ice Devils cost roughly as much as two castings of Summer Lions, and would mop the floor with them -- plus they could lead, cast spells, and generate gems. Well worth waiting a bit for IMHO. |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
In particular Wraith Swords don't work against 0 encumberance undead, Ice Devils can cast Quickness without needing 10 gems for boots, and one can expect the possibility of Mandragoras from C'tis and prepare with higher MR. Even still it looks to me like he lost due to bad luck, as his Magic Resistance and defense should have been high enough to be mostly immune to Sleep Vines. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">IMHO its worth pointing out that Bowlingballhead was probably referring to "I am of the opinion that SCs are fun, but I think I'd ignore them if I were trying to maximize my efficiency, rather than my fun quotient" when he said that he couldn't have put it better. Wraith Swords work particularly well against the various sorts of lizards C'tis could be expected to, and did, send along with its Manakins. Having boots saves a round (or half a round depending on how you look at it) and 20 fatigue, both of which are valuable if the ID does happen to face the 0 encumberence undead before anything else. Rainbow Armor increases magic resistance, as well as providing reinvigoration, and so is quite valuable preparation if facing sleep vines. The only real point to the anecdote was to provide an example of the many cheap and effective counters to large and expensive monsters which abound in Dominions. [ January 08, 2004, 14:58: Message edited by: Truper ] |
Re: Blood?
You could have done better than the situation you described. For example seizing rather than yielding the initiative, skipping the Boots of Quickness, having an Antimagic Amulet, a Regeneration Ring, and/or a Luck Pendent. Facing C'tis I'd also consider replacing the Wraith Sword with some one handed weapon and either a Vine|Char|Luck shield.
Everyone makes mistakes, no big deal, but IMHO subpar play doesn't make for a good example of the (supposed) weakness of Super Combatants, nor does it support your opinion that SCs are not efficient. As a side note, casting quickness costs an Ice Devil much less than 20 fatigue, and is well worth the 10 gem savings. Winged or Messenger Boots are much better for IDs than Quickness boots. [ January 09, 2004, 02:17: Message edited by: Jasper ] |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
In particular Wraith Swords don't work against 0 encumberance undead, Ice Devils can cast Quickness without needing 10 gems for boots, and one can expect the possibility of Mandragoras from C'tis and prepare with higher MR. Even still it looks to me like he lost due to bad luck, as his Magic Resistance and defense should have been high enough to be mostly immune to Sleep Vines. |
Re: Blood?
Keir,
I think you need to try them more in an MP situation instead of test-runs. Things take on a totally different light when dealing with living, breathing opponents. A 10 turn test run is all I'd ever take any credibility to tests, as it gives you a shaping of whatever strategy/tactic you're using more often than not tainted by MP experiance. After turn 10 most of what can be conjectured is hypothetical and dependant on circumstance(s) so it's irrelevant to make broad generalizations until you have quite a few games under your belt. Which with this game is more difficult than your standard twitch game. Especially since you'd have to play a single nation repeatedly against a diverse swath of opponents. Scout blood hunting is the only issue I think needs to be addressed. Whether it was intended or not; I'd prefer to know. Because it seems that the 'added benefit of blood magic' nations don't have any sort of edge with it. the scouts ease of getting slaves and low requirements for getting the 'good' blood spells (HfH and ID's) lets any race early (if they have mages or find some) or later use blood magic just as effectively. Maybe an added bonus to searching for an entire nation (Like Mictlan or Pangaea) could represent some sort of difference. |
Re: Blood?
I like the idea of varrying the effectiveness of most units blood hunting according to the controlling faction!
A similar thought is to varry the effectivess of hunters depending on the power of blood mages present. So mundane units couldn't find slaves without blood mage present to tell them where to look, and hunting efficiency would increase (but taper off) as more/more-powerfull blood mages are added. This way nations with access to blood mages would have an advantage, without hard coding it. It would also give you some reason to recruit blood mages beyond the few needed to summon demons. |
Re: Blood?
Ok, I suppose I could add my two cents here since the topic is sort of close to my heart.
First, I seriously dislike trampling supercombatants mainly due to fatigue issues. They're just too darn easy to lose. Also, high mr and some reinvigoration are a must with any supercombatant, wraith sword or not. Boots of the messenger is especially good for ice devil since he doesn't really need the slot for anything else. Getting hit by sleep/stellar cascades/sleep vines and such can otherwise really ruin your day. Antimagic amulet is bare minimum mr boost you should get. I'd consider starshine skullcap mandatory, however. As people mentioned before, supercombatants should be used with an army because they're just too easy to lose - spells like wind ride and mind hunt, for example, can put hurt to single commanders no matter who they are. Also, with an army you usually have access to Relief which really helps to keep your SC alive. EQ I use with Ice Devils. Weapons: wraith sword, blood thorn (low dmg but allows for a shield) Shields: Not a big issue since they're nowadays downgraded but with blood thorn I'd probably use the lucky coin/lead shield (vine shield and eye shield are also good for special occasions). Helmets: spirit helmet, horror helmet, starshine skullcap (again, depending on how much mr I need, usually the latter) expensive gemwise 99,9% of the time, however). Fire helmet and wraith crown are also ok if you're _really_ swimming in gems. Armor: elemental hauberk, rainbow armor, hydra skin armor or alternatively shadow cloak/bless shirt if you got no prot issues or invulnerability cloak if you got absolutely no other uses for gems :PP Boots: boots of the messenger, flying boots (again, unless I'm using rainbow armor I often get the messenger boots) Misc: regen ring, antimagic amulet, luck pendant (all these are pretty standard, if I get regen through hydra skin, for example I replace regen ring with luck pendant but consider the first two mandatory unless the SC already regens). EDIT: decided to add example ID for early game (all items const 4) Weapon: wraith sword Helmet: horror helm Armor: elemental hauberk Boots: boots of the messenger Misc1: regen ring Misc2: antimagic amulet The result is a bit weak in the mr department (22) but otoh it got full elemental immunity, high prot and some reinvigoration to fend of extra fatigue from the hauberk. Later in the game you should really try to upgrade him to stand up to nasty summons and such. Later game ID: Weapon: blood thorn Shield: lucky coin Armor: elemental hauberk Helmet: starshine skullcap Boots: boots of the messenger Misc1: regen ring Misc2: antimagic amulet mr is slightly higher. Use of shield increased prot and defence and introduced luck with only a slight reduction in damage. If facing magic-heavy nations you could consider exchanging either the armor or shield for the mr Versions (lead shield, rainbow armor). [ January 09, 2004, 05:32: Message edited by: Windreaper ] |
Re: Blood?
Good example! Interesting that you consider the Starshine Skullcap mandatory, although with the new power of Paralyze I can begin to see why.
IMHO you can still use Ice Devils solo for raiding or taking on small forces (just not full armies). The trick is to move lots of scouts with them, which you then unstealth as chaff. Now if only we could draw Wendigo into the discussion... I'd love to hear his thoughts on Super Combatants, especially in Dom 2. |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
An idea that might be worth trying: give your IDs Bone armors (those with builtin Soul Vortex) - they're expensive but as long as there's a living creature in the vicinity you've got fatigue recovery even if unconscious. And that might win you a battle even if paralyzed. |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
Interesting post - must study it at my leasure. On the SC topic I've been having fun with Utgard Jotun Herses and Jarls and high nature (10) and some fire(4). What I like about it is you can try out heaps of different arrangements of magic items. Seems to work alright and having a big number of cheap weak to medium SC's means less vunerability to nasty spells. I'm enjoying this approach more than the limited SC angle of blood. Still a bit of tweaking to go but a race with a heap of SC's (even if they aren't flash) gives much of the pleasure of old SC races. Are Jotun Herses the SC's of the future? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif Cheers Keir |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I see your point there and to quote myself: "Boots: boots of the messenger, flying boots (again, unless I'm using rainbow armor I often get the messenger boots)" Still, getting nailed by a single quickened arch seraph casting orb lightning kind of sucks so I'd take survivability over strategic mobility in this case. It's a matter of taste however. Rainbow Armor/Flying Shoes might be better if you wish to take part in smaller combats with less mage power in play. Jasper: Good point, you just don't want to unstealth your scouts. If they happen to get attacked and you lose a scout the whole army retreats, ugh. Never tried it this way so I'm not 100% sure of this, however. OTOH, you could always keep some mock troops with your ID to prevent this from happening. |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Re: Blood?
The part I like about the flying boots is you can send out your ID out only partially equipped (without the Elemental Hauberk for example) with flying boots as you choose provinces that have less likely of a chance of getting attacked by anything except provencial defenses. Hurting your opponent faster or while you don't have as many gems as you need. Then when you get your new equipment forged you can just jump back to a lab like Nagot said and equip him. Also I have alot more success with killing retreating armies by boxing in provinces with IDs.
Even with Starshine Cap, Lead Shield, and AMA the poor guy will still get hit by spells, especially if the casters have any sort of penetration. That's why I think that Windreaper considers the cap *required* because it is basically a 'free slot' with MR on it. [ January 09, 2004, 21:11: Message edited by: Zen ] |
Re: Blood?
Quote:
You do have to be a bit carefull, for as you allude this scout tactic is vulnerable to teleport attacks (before you leave the scouts), especially if your retreat provinces are simultaneosly cut. Still, this is less of a risk than Wind Ride. [ January 10, 2004, 05:22: Message edited by: Jasper ] |
Re: Blood?
My main knock against the Starshine Skullcap and to an extent even Winged Boots is that they aren't strictly neccesary, yet significantly increase the IDs cost. Then again, you can't mass produce IDs as you could in Dom 1, so it makes more sense to stack a few extra items on.
|
Re: Blood?
Quote:
|
Re: Blood?
Quote:
cheers Keir |
| All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:21 AM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2025, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.