Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">In what way is pop killing dominions not a rational concept? If you are trying to point out a flaw or suggest a change your cause would benefit from presenting it in a polite way.

[ April 30, 2004, 13:02: Message edited by: johan osterman ]

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Powerful does not mean overpowered. If AE or SG Ermor is overpowered it is not from the pretenders, these have been this way since dom 1 and Ermor certainly wasn't overpwered in MP then, perhaps it has become so after income reduction etc in dom 2, but the cause of any imbalance is not that their pretenders have more magic than other pretenders.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Putting things back on topic with Marignon ... I'd say almost half the nations in the game at least have themes where it doesn't hurt them at all to build up the priests to fight Ermor.

Marignon : Priests who can cast Holy Pyres, who are very solid mages, or who only have Fire-1 but can cast fanaticism.

Vanheim : Priests who are mini-SCs with the right equipment, who can also cast lightning and other air spells.

Pangaea : Dryads who are stealth preachers which also have nature magic and are the nations most cost efficient researchers.

Pythium, Serpent Cult : Mage priests. Base Pythium is even better with its _huge_ combined priest / mage commanders.

Atlantis : Very beefy fairly cheap combat Consorts, and beefy fanaticism casting Coral Queens.

Abyssia : Anathemants and Demonbreds - priests with good fire magic, flying, etc.

Arcos : Priestesses with nature magic, research, and healing.

Man : Last of the Tuatha theme has great commanders with priest abilities, Sidhe and Tuatha.

C'tis : No one ever got crucified for hiring a Lizard King (Priest 4). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Caelum : Stealthy flying priestly Seraphines.

Jotunheim : Huge Jotun Herses / Godes : Sacred Priestly mini-SCs. And Neifel Giants are obscene, with their theme.

R'lyeh : Priest 3s with Sorcery _and_ a random magic pick? What's to regret building?

Mictlan : Ouch! I've never played them - but good level (P3/P4) priests, most of whom have blood, and who additionally have lvl 2 Fire, Water, Astral, or Nature magic?

T'ien C'hi : Their mages are priests. All Ermor does is get the mages into the HoF.

That's an awful lot of nations / themes that don't lose anything in the long run for having to recruit priests to combat Ermor, imo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">All but 1 of the national commanders of Mictlan are priests. They can throw absolutely massive numbers of holy 2 priests at Ermor.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Never played Mictlan. Seems kinda boring when you need blood summons to make an effective army.

Oh, right johan osterman, I forgot about the magic sites, which are basically the most important thing in the game because who needs a mundane army when you can have a summoned one?

<==== is an angry little man http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Why would that be boring?

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'm not sure what you are complaiming about. There are very few effective armies that can be built out of summoned troops only.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Well, when I played my first Mictlan game, I kept thinking to myself. Why didn't I use any other blood nation instead? The ones that have troops that can actually stand up against the enemy and compliment my demonic divisions of doom.

And on that second part, I meant that an enormous percentage of your armies can be made of summons and your nation soldiers just become support. Looked like I meant armies made completely of one type or the other, my bad.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Try Mictlan with a Fire 9 Moloch. Sun & Eagle warriors are quite good for their cost, and Jaguar Warriors can be build in all castles.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Are jaguar warriors sacred? I was under the impression that they weren't

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">So the little icon on the unit description that says "Sacred" is just a big trick by the Ilwinter guys?

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Note to self: completely and utterly destroy Yossar.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

That is a good trick. I wonder how many other units have the icon but are not actually sacred.

Frankly if I was unit I would definetly paint that little icon on me. I'm sure the sacred units can demand a lot more respect out of the average peons.

I wonder if priest are sacred?? hmm...

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">What would give you that impression? You have actually looked at the units they have?

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

'twas a long long time ago. I thought Marignon was the only nation with holy units everywhere, but I thought wrong, and no, you don't have to tell me that 3+ times.

Edit: I just lost 20 sages out of 26 to a barbarian attack in my library province. Never put all your eggs in one basket, or should I say nerds in one lab. I don't know why I'm posting this here, but it pissed me off and I thought I should put it SOMEWHERE.

[ May 02, 2004, 03:19: Message edited by: HotNifeThruButr ]

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Never put your sages in a province that doesn't have a fortress. Either move them or build one.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Well, I noticed by gaming experience that all thos stats of units, are totally worthless.

Mid-Late games ruled by Pretenders, SCs and powerful mages.

Only the Last thing is included in the Nation Choose. And a little for SCs ... for National Heroes or something big you can recruit.

The game later is all "summons, spells and forging items" which are a common base for all the Nations.

Far better how to say:
Vampire Queen, AllFather, Carrion Dragon!

Or something similar...

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Respect, yes. But you also get paid less proportionally to your hiring/build cost. Recall upkeep for sacred units is 1/30 of hiring price, and 1/15 for normal units.

So on the same cost basis, your non-sacred collegues are earning twice as much salary as you, lol.

-Gateway103

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Cohen, I'm curious what kind of games you play that would give rise to your viewpoint.

I'm willing to believe that perhaps regular units are completely obsolete by the end of a long game on a huge map, but my (somewhat limited) experience has been that top tier national units continue to be useful throughout the entire game on many maps.

- Matt L. :->

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

A very good point http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

So maybe it would be better to be the Tower Guard with a nice coushy pension than the blessed Lava Warrior waiting to be trampled by routing elephants.

Of course with the paint you could simply pretend to be sacred when situation would benefit from it.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Respect, yes. But you also get paid less proportionally to your hiring/build cost. Recall upkeep for sacred units is 1/30 of hiring price, and 1/15 for normal units.

So on the same cost basis, your non-sacred collegues are earning twice as much salary as you, lol.

-Gateway103 </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">

[ May 03, 2004, 00:06: Message edited by: Maltrease ]

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yes, but then you get reported as bugged, and people would stop recruiting you. Then you'd be COMPLETELY unemployed.

Re: Paper, Rock, Marignon!
 

Nah, you'd be an exploit and be abused.