Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Well, as I'm the one that translated the KO interview for Cyber I maybe can post the original English text http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif
Will ask permission to everyone involved and come back.
See ya soon ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

There are ads in magazines?
Actually I always divided buzz into two things, publicity and marketing. The publicity side (press releases, contests, word of mouth, articles, screen shots) takes time to do. The marketing (ads, attending conventions, boxed sets) tends to take money. One of the reasons that I thought Shrapnel appealed to independent publishers is that Shrapnel does more "we will take the time" stuff and not so much of the "this chunk of money has to be paid back before profits" stuff. Just my opinion though.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

We announced our involvement over a year ago.

A few notes:

Computer Games Magazine, in their February 2006 issue, listed Dominions 3 (half page write-up) as one of the Most Anticipated Games of 2006.

Word of mouth. A number of you in this thread mentioned word of mouth as an important marketing tool. It is THE MOST IMPORTANT marketing tool. Every game we have had that has had a huge following, has gotten there not by advertising, reviews, interviews, etc, but by fans word of mouth. It is the most effective form of promotion. So talk up Dominions 3 and Dominions II!

You must remember we are still selling Dominions II and although there has been a slow down in recent months, it is still usually one of our top 3 or 4 sellers. Selling Dominions II is the best way of promoting Dominions 3. No?

Much more coming v-e-r-y soon. Awakening soon...

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

I am very excited about Doms 3. I was playing Doms 2 with a few of my friends, like 20-30 hours all week, however I wasnt playing on the net with you guys. We gonna change for Doms 3. Me and my friends will all buy Doms 3, needless to say, and will play on the net as well. The only thing why we was not playing Doms 2 on the "net", thats because PBEM is kinda slow, if you dont know the rest of the players very well. Is there a possiblity for Doms 3, to add additional MP part? Like a game lobby, and the ability to host games from there? I know that doms 3 will be a slow paced game, like Doms 2, its like chess. However the same is true about Civilization 3-4, 1 turn can take 3-6 mins even, or more if the game is big. There you can save the MP game, and all players just load it back, and continue playing.
So all in all a game lobby -> hosting/reloading games directly would be a better option then a PBEM system. I am pretty sure that it would work flawlessly. Tim or anyone can post some opinion about this, also may I ask, that in the vanilla game we only gonna have PBEM MP system like in Doms 2?

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Browsing through the Archive of Arcane Lore (okay, so it was Google), there was indeed a press release to this effect back in October 2004. Well, I guess I was sleeping back then.

I stand corrected and withdraw my point. What Shrapnel should do is, really, imprint souls so that information isn't overlooked (or, worst of all, forgotten!).

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

i would just like to remind some people of something: there is a large number of people who follow this game and dominions 3 on these forums that dont talk to us

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Do you recognize yourselves? This is a mad cultist: http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
http://ulm.illwinter.com/cultist.jpg

Dominions 3 is coming along nicely. JK is sitting beside me at our new Mac and experimenting with a random map of 1500 provinces. Not that 1500 provinces is a setting I would reccomend, but it is good for testing purposes. His Ageless Olm pretender is apparently missing a description.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

1500 provinces? ARE YOU MAD!?!?!

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Hey there Kris! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif
1500 provinces?! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

OMPG! It's a spittin image of me! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Probably only Gandalf and perhaps Boron (IIRC) would play with 1500 provinces http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

JK reports that scrolling is a bit slow with 1500 provinces, but otherwise it seems to work fine.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

May I point out that with Dom2, turns sometimes take hours? The civilization games, all you do is build a tile for each city, pick a unit to make, move your units, bang you're done - I can't imagine a Civ turn taking more than 5 or 10 minutes, ever, and that's mid-to-late game - the opening turns are more like ... 5 seconds.

Dom2, I've seen people take 10 minutes a turn in the first 5 turns, and by turn 15 or 20, there's always someone taking 15-20 minutes, and occasionally half an hour or more. Scripting and positioning mages, determining items to forge, what to research, watching at least some of the battles, changing the scripts for 5-20 mages, etc.

And this is in the blitzes organized on IRC, where everyone is defintaly there and present. If you're one of the ones who can manage to get a turn done in 5 turns (perhaps because it's a turn of all the mages researching), it's no fun waiting 25 minutes for everyone else to get their turns done.

This is why a fair quantity of the blitz-players get antsy by around turn 15-25 - the amount of time sometimes required to do a turn, and the amount of time conversely required to wait, both get to be too much, unlike the 24 hour server & pbem games.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Yes you are right, it can take enormous amount of time in certain games. However on small maps the games are much faster, imo those could be hosted nicely from a game lobby rather then playing those games PBEM.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

10 mins a turn in the first 5 turns of Dom2 means they don't know what they should do. You just have to fill a recruiting queue, change a couple tax sliders, modify one or 2 armies, possibly a couple scripts, and move your 1-2 armies.
Less than 2 minutes for me since after my first 20 games http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Hey, PDF, did you get permission to post the interview?

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

I was waiting for someone to ask http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif !
And the answer is ... Yes ! I'll let some more heat accumulate and post it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif - no seriously I'll do that in a couple hours http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

While I would personally agree, and have about the same speed taking those first few turns, these are experienced players, regulars on the forums and in the blitz games. I have pretty much no clue why the first turn or two could possibly take so long, but... shrug It's like they're scripting their mages before they have any. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

*Deploying decoys

*Arranging the rest of the troops to one side of the map and usually as far forward as possible (just slightly farther back than the decoy)

*Rescripting them depending what indies you are facing (for instance vs. barbarians or lizards you usually want to set all your troops halfway back, and have your melee troops on hold while your ranged support whittles them down a bit)

*Setting plain military commanders in the back to(hold)(hold)(hold)(hold)(hold) Stay behind troops

*Optimizing taxes and patrolling

*Setting research

*Optimizing resources and gold to come as close to zero each turn as possible

*'Scout probing' indies

*Scripting prophet/priests (and rescripting them and all the troops each time you hit an undead province)

*Scripting and possibly equipping pretender

*Planning the best order in which to take indies, reevaluating it based on losing a battle or taking heavy losses

*Deciding how much to bid on what mercs, and where to place them

*Recruit indy commanders to shuffle new troops to your expanding armies

*Checking the graphs and HoF (optional)

*Watching battles (optional for most)

I must admit for me what probably takes me the most time is evaluating indies. It can be very complex to deploy the minimum force to take the best provinces, and then also have it planned out how the army should move and be resupplied with troops in order to continue to take new provinces every turn with no breaks for the maximum amount of time.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Here's the full, uncut original version of the interview granted by Kristoffer O. for Cyberstratege, the French strategy game mag (go see us at www.cyberstratege.com !).
With kind permission of Kristoffer and Théophile Monnier, Cyberstratege founder/chief redactor http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Screenshots to come soon ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Cyber - We've had Dominions:PPP in 2000, Dominions II in 2003, now Dominions 3 : what keeps you continuing to develop this title ?

KO : The fun of it. Positive feedback on our games. When I hear that people
like what I do I feel inspired and want to add more stuff.


Cyber - Tell us briefly what will be the main changes/new stuff in Dom3 !

KO : Dominions 3 is called the Awakening. Awakening? Yep. When ou create your pretender he/she is dormant, bound or imprisoned by the previous pantocrator. With his departure the demigods and spirits of the world are awakening to don his mantle. When you design your pretender you must choose whether your god is already awake or if he/she is still asleep or bound.

There are new pretenders, new spells, new items and approximately 1500 units. New national summons for several nations. There is a random map generator that generates nice maps with mountain ranges and special sites. Some nations build cave cities. Modding will be easier and more elements in the game will be accessible to modding. Nations, recruitment queues, special dominion effects etc will be moddable. Graphics are better with nicer battle fields. The AI builds forts. Super combattants are nerfed, or rather life drain is. The economy is more generous to allow bigger armies. We have also tried to decrease micromanagement and make the UI more accessible.

Cyber - We've heard of the new nations and the era concept replacing Dom2 themes... Who are the newcomers ? How will eras work ?

KO : Nations and themes are remade and organized in three eras. The first one is a more mythological/low tech/magic rich era. Most of the old nations had themes that are now remade into nations of the three eras. For example Jotunheim changed into the three nations Niefelheim, Jotunheim
and Utgård. No big change here. Other nations do not exist in all eras. Marignon emerges in the middle era. Another nation named Marverni could be viewed as their predecessors. Marverni is a nation of tribes led by druids and vergobrets. The nation is influenced by the celts as described in Caesars war commentaries. Early Ermor is not at all what
they will become in later eras. It is a nation before the fall, with pontifices, flamen and augurs. There are also nations influenced by hindu and japanese history, myth and folklore. There are about 20 nations in each era.

Cyber - Beginners to Dom2 were hurt be the steep learning curve and lack of tutorial and in-game advice : has anything been done for them ?

KO : We are trying to make the game more accessible. The manual will be a lot better (not written by us) and more game mechanics will be explained.

Cyber - Again for newcomers, there is no real "campaign" in Dom2 (as for example in the HoMM series), allowing a more easy way to play solo and learn the game. Why that ? It's a difficult work but gratifying for solo players (and a commercial argument !). Is something like this in Dom3 ?

KO : Not currently, but if we decide to make a campaign for the game it is something that will be added when the game is nearly finished I believe.

Cyber - On the other hand Veterans rumbled about the AI weaknesses : poor recruiting choices (hordes of cheap ineffective troops starving eventually, no castle building), reliance on buffs and cheap summons in tactical battles : did you improve the AI ? One thing that I would have seen is the possibility to give specific AI advantages (x% more gold/ressources/design points/supply...) on a "game" basis without having to resort to map editing

KO : There have been some changes. The AI now builds castles. I'm not sure what other changes are implemented.


Cyber - Another frequent issue was the huge micromanagement in middle-end game, when it was very hard to properly keep track of item and gems allocation : something new here ?

KO : I barely remember what changes has been made here (I haven't played dom2 for almost 2 years). There are changes, but there will probably still be some issues left when beta testing starts. Dominions is a complex game and some micro management will always be there. Hopefully Dominions 3 will not scare too many players away. Hmm, I just remembered a nice feature. All commanders has small icons representing items in his possession.

Cyber- Dominions 2 is a mostly-MP game, yet has no provision at all for diplomacy between players, even at its simplest form (AI nations can be declared allied though). It can be seen as a feature - after all the pretenders are all enemies- but some players play team games, and in nearly all games there are temporary alliances...

KO : The feature remains at the moment. I'm not certain about how this will develop.

Cyber - Fans did make serious rebalance work (spells, scales, creatures and items) through mods, did you take that as an input (or at least an influence) for Dom3 ? In particular, there's the question of the nearly-complete domination of big blood summons in the end game, has it been addressed or do you consider it a "feature"?

KO : It might have been considered a feature, but dom3 features another story. Blood summons will not be as dominant as in dom2.

Cyber - Speaking about mods and map editing, what will be the new features ? Will it be possible to create new spells and items ?

KO : The modding part is not yet finished, but the code has been remade so that modding will be easier to implement. Nation modding will definitely be more developed. Creation of new spells and items seem unlikely.


Cyber - What is the plan now for Illwinter ? Dominions 4, CoE 3, something else, or will you fall into slumber as the Rimtursar did ?

KO : Sleep seems fine. Actually I have no idea. The last couple of years have been incredibly fun and rewarding, but I'm not sure where to go now. I work as a teacher and that is also quite rewarding from time to time.
I'll probably continue having fun. Fun might lead to another game title.
Who knows?

Cyber - Lastly, will we still get "Nagot Gick Fell" in Dom3 ?

KO : Always http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

I agree with quantum_mechanic. There's a lot of important stuff to do in the first turns. Evaluating indies, planning future army movement and scripting for the battles are probably most time consuming for me.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Thanks, PDF!

Seems Lace didn't do half-bad. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Stardock is not really an indy company. Games are just not their main focus. So they have existing customer base from non-game products. This makes it hard to compare Stardock with purely game companies...

I don't think so. Dom2 is (and thus, I suppose Dom3 will be) hardcore strategy game while Civ4 or GalCiv2 are more like "strategy light" games. They have sandbox aspect (like building large cities, developing them and seeing the empire grow) which attract casual players. Dominions is much more strategy-centric which probably is interesting for much fewer people. So I would think Dominions is very much a niche game (and I like it to stay that way - as a strategic game it is much better than Civ4 or GalCiv2 :> )

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Hmmm, nation and spell modding would be nice, but oh well.

Sounds good so far.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

How come that Kris aint sure that what AI changes has been made? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif
This should take a very important part in Doms3, I mean a reworked AI. We all know that the MP part is very important, but regardles, even myself was playing a lot against the AI on the hardest settings, but the challenge what was offered wasnt enough there sadly, after a period at least. Imho a decent AI castle building/recruiting/summoning algorythm is what was missed in Doms2 first of all.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

I think you meant ITEM and spell modding. Nation modding was said to be "more developed".

Thanks for that, PDF! I quess I should thank KO and Théophile Monnier as well. Theophile is an interesting name, BTW, if 'théo' is the same as 'theo' in 'theology'. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Ah, yes, indeed. Item modding.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

> How come that Kris aint sure that what AI changes has been made?

I don't program the AI.

On the other hand JK is unaware of some of the new monsters and nations.

Our ignorances completes each other. We are certain that there are always thing we cannot answer. If we talk we might conjure a picture of a special feature or mechanic, but it will probaby be only partially right. Therefore we have betatesters. They might give us answers to some of our questions. They both play the nations and fight with the mechanics.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Ah ok, I see Kris.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Yes, it's the same "Theo", and if you know your Greek somewhat note that the second term of "Théophile" is derived from "philos", meaning "loving".
In fact his name means "God loving"... But I can tell you he sucks at Dom2 ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/stupid.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

So, what about those screenshots? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Word of Mouth will only get you so far, and for the most part with new products your mining your current customer base. My company used word of mouth for the first 15 years, and it did well enough to support my Grandma and Grandpa. When my father took over, the growth of the first year and a half was more then all 15 years combined...and that was only a minimal marketing budget.

It takes me 2-3 previews before I remember a game. I got really hyped about spore when I saw the video demo of it, but it took someone mentioning the article for me to remember I had already seen it. The preview in CGW was one screenshot and a couple paragraphs. IMHO your going to need multiple magazines, with more screenshots (the masses love screenshots) to generate a buzz outside your current fanbase.

PS. It took the Vs article in CGW for me to buy Dominions II. And as much as I love it, I can't sell it to any of my friends.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Here they come, Nerfix (and the other too http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif )!
Links to pics (images hosted elsewhere to preserve forum reading, and I don't know how to make thumbnails here) :

http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/agarta.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/angel.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/bandar1.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/bandar2.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/burning.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/burning2.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/caelum1.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/ctis.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/ctis2.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/ctis3.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/ctis4.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/ctis5.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/ctis6.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/ctis7.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/deep_o...talantis_1.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/deep_o...talantis_2.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/hydra.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/hydra2.jpg
http://pascal.difolco.free.fr/mainscreen_agarta.jpg

Isn't all that nice ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

awesome thx for the screenies!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

SQUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE...!

*dies from lack of air after he has squeed his lungs out*

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

The mainscreen/overland map looks awesome!

And so do the battle pics! What's that big angel? The grass looks awesome too!

I mean...this is...this too many wonderful things. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Yeah Boron will be insane enough to try such a game probably http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif.
More important than the province limit is though the unit limit, may i ask how large it is in Dominions 3?
Imho the unit limit was the biggest flaw of both former Dominions. If you tell me that Dominions 3 has a unit limit of 1 million units or even higher i am happy and will buy Dominions 3 immediately when it gets released http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

nice that you can see what gems the commander is carrying just by looking at the front of the unit... hopefully this includes magic items - no more endless searching for that missing hammer, I'm guessing http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Hmm, snowflakes falling in the deep sea and still no signs of obstacles on the battlefield. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif The overview screen looks nice and seems much more informative/useful: Scale strengths without mouse hovering, army type overlays, gem pouch displays,.. Neat! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Two important screenshots are still missing though: The tactical setup and the keyboard shortcut infoscreen...

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Dammit, now I want it even more.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

me likey (especially those ctisian chariots)

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Yay! Pictures!!!

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

i think we can all thank pasha for that enlightening post *claps*

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

This looks like a very important improvement to me - just yesterday I've found the hammer lost couple of years ago http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Unit limit on main map or unit limit on battlefield?

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

He's talking about the unit limit in the game, period. On huge maps like Faerun, especially with themes with auto-spawns, a limit is exceeded around mid-game - all of a sudden, scouting starts to work very erratically, you can't even always see the troops in a province neighboring your own.

At some point I understand the game can also crash, but haven't seen that - the invisible troop side effect has been bad enough for me to avoid large maps since knowing of it. ( As if the micro-management and 3 hour turns weren't bad enough http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif )

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

That's fixed.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Very nice! Thanks PDF.

The thing I find most important are the reasons the devs contd. to work on Dom, those reasons (the fun factor and the supportive feedback from fans) make it less likely that they will drop Dom.
I find Dom to be *the* best strategic game and I hope it will retain its uniqueness. Here is to the longevity of Dom http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image.../beerglass.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Great, now we get monkeys as sacred units !

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Damn douple-post.

Re: What the hell is up with Dominions 3???
 

Post#387916

Ha! " Bandar means 'monkey' and log means 'people'" indeed! There's a divination for you! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

The screenshots with monkeys were titled bandar_1 etc.