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-   -   Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92 (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=48291)

legowarrior January 29th, 2012 07:38 PM

Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
So, I'm trying out the newest CBM 1.92, after not playing Dominions for a number of years. One of the things that is important to the Jomon is a good SC for a god or good scales. I went with good scales, with an enchantress, but I have a few questions about tweaking it.

The Dormant Enchantress with
Dominion: 5
Production: 3
Magic: 1

Fire: 2
Air: 4
Earth: 4
Astral: 4
Death: 3
Nature: 1

And the total left over points is 0.

But there is more for tweaks, and concerns.
I could go with turmoil 3/luck 3 and hope that I can make enough money through luck events for new castles,
Or I could go Order 3/Misfortune 3 and hope my fortune Teller abilities can stop the worst of them, and with the extra cash buy more castles.
I could also go neutral and leave it as is.

The second concern is the magic. Air, Earth, Astral are set, as is death (3 death is all I'll need to get the Dai Oni with a skull staff),
but should I have enough points to put 1 in Fire, nature and water, or 2 points in one, and one of the others. I'm pretty sure I'll take fire no matter what, so the question is, what is more useful, water or nature?
One my shugjenga I have a decent chance of 2 nature, and if I get one sea province, water is taken care of?

Any other suggestions are cool too.
Thanks.

Kobal2 January 29th, 2012 10:10 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
1 Nature is pretty useless on your god - it's no better than what your recruitables have and site searching at 1 is not good. I'd also question the purpose of taking a rainbow for a nation that already has such awesome site searchers, esp. considering you're pretty vulnerable early game and could do with some help there.

I'd suggest a dormant Lord of Plenty instead of the Enchantress. Air 4, Astral 4, Earth 4, Death 3 (for Shuras). He's much tougher than the Enchantress and brings you more gems to boot. Your Onmyojis and Shugenjas should find you enough F income to empower him in Fire should you get to the stage where you get to summon Dais.
You could also go with a Titan I suppose, since he starts with 2 Air it comes down to the same price. Or a Great General if you're just dying for some mapmove 1 infantry.

You might want to consider Death to pay for it, your mages are pretty long lived and the income loss of 1 point of Death is pretty negligible. Or you could take 1 Misfortune and hope the RNG doesn't decide to hate you.

Not sure I'd really take Production over Order. For early expansion, Yamabushis backed by Ashigarus are pretty solid provided you give them either some indep shield dudes to catch arrows, or an Air monk. A couple of ninjas can also do some damage on provinces other nations would have a hard time getting, like Elephants). Later on, you can count on having enough gold and castles to just vomit Aka-Onis. Even with Prod 3, people seem to believe you won't be able to make enough Samurai Archers fast enough that they'll be more efficient at shooting stuff than indy shortbows en masse would be, esp. in the armour heavy late age.

Morla January 29th, 2012 10:24 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
DonĀ“t forget death, you have no old mages so a little bit of death is a good choice, remember that you can build castles underwater, and recruit a nice good mage, but he is coldblooded.

My recomendation is an awake rainbow, i usually choose the crone/enchantres and focus on manual site searching, THE KEY to JOMON is gems a lot of gems.

Scales: order is a must, also a little bit of production helps a lot with expanding, but 1 or 2 no more. Heat is good for points and it works with your underwater mage. Death is a very good choice for Jomon, no oldage, i usually take 1-2 death. Magic/drain depends on luck scales, i usually go for magic 1 and neutral luck/misfortune. You can tweak these sacrificing magic paths and get order 1/prod 3/heat 2/death 2/ luck 3 and magic 1 or drain 2.

For the magic paths: remember that you have natural acces to all but death and blood paths so you can remote sitesearch easy and free your pretender from manual site searching once you get good death income. Focus your pretender:
-A4 for boosters.
-D4 manual site searching and national summons, Dai oni is good BUT Ghost generals AKA Shura are really cheap good thugs undead/fear/ethereal for 6D gems.
-F1 Skull of fire and Dai oni and if you feel generous F3 for flaming helmet.
-S 3-4 rings
-N 3-4 Mother oak/regeneration to your holy spirits AKA Kenzoku. Or nature 0.
-E 1+ dai tengu
-W 1+ well you are manual site searching anyway.

Holy **** i should write a guide :D. Remember your national summons(conjuration school) the Oni general requires 2d to summon and he comes 1D +1F/E/D100%.

legowarrior January 30th, 2012 12:02 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
So, an awake leader for site searching. I guess that could work, but death scales and heat. I hadn't thought of that. If I take death, I'm not taking misfortune.

SsSam January 30th, 2012 12:32 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
Playing as Joman you're first choice is how are you going to survive the first 30 turns.
High resources for your troops...that's one way.
Put a decent bless on your sacreds.....that works too.
Get a killer SC and let him rip....that's just classic.

Once you are past those first 30 turns....You can't have enough money.
You just can't. Those 500 GP underwater mages are GREAT but...well, they cost 500 GP.

If you get past the first 30 turns......You will be money and gem limited. I'm just saying...In the current game where I am Joman, boy do I wish I had taken more order.

Now, as Joman unless you are really lucky with mercs, trades or sites, the only way you'll get into death and your best summons will be with your pretender, but that's a pretender build issue, not a scale issue.

Squirrelloid January 30th, 2012 07:28 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
P3G3L3Mg1 is my standard scales build, using temperature extreme of choice 3 to offset, and i've used everything from O3 to T3. I would definitely go scales on Jomon. Its worth noting that P and G are very good in CBM 1.9x.

Lord of Plenty or other gem-producing commanders are great for Jomon.

A pretender with specifically tailored magic to make use of key spells can also work.

Pure scales is perfectly playable for Jomon. (O3 and possibly taking Mg3 or dropping the temperature scale entirely).

I would not take a generic rainbow (you get plenty good magic diversity). I rarely take an awake SC (too much invested in the early game).

legowarrior January 30th, 2012 08:38 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
So, scales are really important, Bless is less important, and diversity is not as necessary.

What about this

Lord of Plenty
4 Earth/4 Astral

Dominion 6
T:3
P:3
H:3
G:3
L:3
M:1

I can build many units with my production.
The awake Lord of Plenty can produce gems for me, and act as a research, and later produce some of the better magic items there are. I get a minor bless for my sacreds to boot.

I can trade my lord of Plenty for a Lady of Fortune, and build an army I can take under the sea (50 Samurai might do it).

Quick question = What determines how many gems and what kind the lord of plenty produces. All I seem to get in 6 turns against the AI is Earth and Astral.

shatner January 30th, 2012 10:09 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by legowarrior (Post 793740)
So, scales are really important, Bless is less important, and diversity is not as necessary.

What about this

Lord of Plenty
4 Earth/4 Astral

Dominion 6
T:3
P:3
H:3
G:3
L:3
M:1

I can build many units with my production.
The awake Lord of Plenty can produce gems for me, and act as a research, and later produce some of the better magic items there are. I get a minor bless for my sacreds to boot.

I can trade my lord of Plenty for a Lady of Fortune, and build an army I can take under the sea (50 Samurai might do it).

Quick question = What determines how many gems and what kind the lord of plenty produces. All I seem to get in 6 turns against the AI is Earth and Astral.

The gems a pretender produces are hard-coded. No matter what paths a Lord of Plenty has, he'll only ever produce 1 astral and 1 earth a turn. Still, that's pretty good because the only pretender that produces more types of gems is the Lord of Rebirth who creates 1 earth, 1 nature and 1 death/turn.

Bwaha January 30th, 2012 10:51 PM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
I went for a master lich with f2 and d4 in a game I'm playing...

Good scales too...

I'm happy with it... :)

Soyweiser January 31st, 2012 06:01 AM

Re: Scales for the Jomon in CBM 1.92
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by shatner (Post 793750)
The gems a pretender produces are hard-coded. No matter what paths a Lord of Plenty has, he'll only ever produce 1 astral and 1 earth a turn. Still, that's pretty good because the only pretender that produces more types of gems is the Lord of Rebirth who creates 1 earth, 1 nature and 1 death/turn.

Well, not hard coded, mods can change the amounts of gems units give. But it is static and only depends on the unit type.


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