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-   -   Mod: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen - v0.75 minor update (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=38038)

Valandil March 16th, 2008 08:40 PM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
Not totally sure about your saurus stats. In WH they have ws4, giving them above average attack and defense. You're values do not reflect this adequately, in my opinion. In fact, in WH, saurus warriors, especially blessed ones, are probably in the top five infantry units. Your version would be in the bottom third, especially compared to eg. Panpiper's chaos warriors.

It occurs to me that these lizards will actually have MORE Slann, and flying ones at that, than most nations can field high mages. Being recruitable everywhere, AND summonable via ubiquitous astral, they will likely be massed. With native s5+, basically any army in the game will disingtegrate against lizard magic after about turn 45.

I honestly, if it wer my nation (and it isn't,) would shift the focus more towards the elite saurus infantry and monsters, and away from massed Slann.

By the way, Sombre, do you remember the old edition, when Slann Lords were fully capable combat toads? Otherwise known as the "flaming sword of rhuin" era?

Sombre March 16th, 2008 09:08 PM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
Uh,.. I don't see how being recruitable everywhere and summonable (these are different units mind you) will lead to Slann being 'massed'. They're going to be expensive both to recruit and to summon, which will prohibit massing them. The idea with restricting them to cap in order to restrict numbers is fine if you're accepting people will basically build 1 a turn because they're such a great deal. That isn't how I'm planning on doing things. I'm restricting their numbers by making sure they aren't a no brainer deal. Very powerful very expensive. It's a particularly weird that you're basically calling them overpowered when you have no idea of their cost and only a rough idea of their magic. People would mass them if they were an amazing bargain or something, sure, but they won't be and the regular units will be priced in a balanced way, so you won't end up ignoring their troops to recruit just commanders.

As for the Saurus - I have the lizardmen army book here and they have WS3, I1. Possibly they have WS4 in some ealier/later edition, but I haven't seen that. WS3 = roughly att 10, I1 = deduction to fighting skill in my book. But believe me with the bonus bite attack they will offensively be plenty dangerous. I'm willing to put their prot higher, but I really think you're overrating them in WH. They rarely break but they are MUCH worse than chaos warriors. Chaos Warriors have far better weapon skill, initiative and armour and everything else is pretty even. Compare the points costs. I'm not going to balance the dom3 versions against panpiper's chaos warriors either, because I have my own system and I'm not really familiar with panpiper's mod.

Temple Guard have WS4 and I2 and in dom3 terms I'll probably give them 12 att and 10 def or something.

Valandil March 16th, 2008 11:28 PM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
Sorry, I didn't mean to sound so hostile. In the newest book, saurus are WS4 I2. According to my lizardman player friend. He might be cheating me.

I have no idea whether slann will be overpowered, probably not given your reputation as a modder, but, in my extremely limited experiance, gold is not really an obstacle to mage produciton late game, and astral pearls are crazy common.

Kristoffer O March 17th, 2008 05:34 AM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
Hi I would probably make WH S4 = Dom Str12-14

So with the Saurians being cool I would go for Str 13 and perhaps increase the HP to 15.

Wardens and Black Lords have something like that in str (perhaps12) and HP IIRC and I guess they would translate as S4 T4 WS4 units.

Kristoffer O March 17th, 2008 05:37 AM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen

Cool of you to make the mod.

JK has an Lizarman army. My brother has a Skaven army. When you have finished this you have to make a dark elf army!

Although, I agree, both Skaven and Lizardmen are cooler http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

HoneyBadger March 26th, 2008 01:29 AM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
I'm really, really excited about this mod. Lizardmen are my favorite Warhammer nation. I don't care for the "look" of them as much as some of the other nations, but I definitely appreciate the theme and the units themselves.

YAY WEAPONS! YAY MAGIC! YAY DINOSAURS! ok there's my inner 10 year old.

Plus, I trust in Sombre's ability to create masterpieces of pixel art.

It's all good http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

Sombre March 30th, 2008 12:05 PM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
Slow going so far. Mostly been working on stats, but I should have a unit graphic or two to show in a little while. The Saurus are like slightly bigger, spikier, blue Ctis slave warriors.

Lizardman armies are very blue overall.

Valandil March 31st, 2008 05:32 PM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
I have a crazy friend with a yellow and red lizard army, but in general, I suppose that's true.

Any hope of implementing something like drain magic into dominions? I can't think of a way, but I'd love to see it. One of my favourite spells.

Sombre March 31st, 2008 06:23 PM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
I think the only way I could simulate drain magic is probably with a national mr buffing spell. There isn't much else I could do. I suppose I could give them an anti magical creature spell as well.

Valandil April 3rd, 2008 02:57 AM

Re: Warhammer Nation: Lizardmen
Yeah. That's about what I concluded too- dispel is ritual only, etc.

Hmm. That's fine, though. Slaan will probably have plenty of other stuff to do anyways.

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