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Old June 10th, 2010, 03:10 AM
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Default "A Song of Ice and Fire", veterans-only game, MA. In progress, midgame...

Greetings all – friends, old allies and opponents and many of you whom I haven't had a chance to meet yet.

I am coming back after more than a year long break from Dominions3. Back then I was feeling burned out after finishing 3 very long MP games. But recently to my own surprise I have been feeling an increasingly strong urge to come back to Dominions. And here I thought I was free from Dominions addiction, at least until Dominions 4 would come out.

Anyway, it's good to be back. I've already joined a MP Dom3 game (on Quarter To Three forum). However I have enought time on my schedule for one more MP Dom3 game.
But it looks like here on this forum all current MP games seem to be either ongoing or in the process of being started all spots already taken.


I've waited for some time, but I wonder if perhaps I should consider starting a new MP game and see if there is enough interest among local players to get it on the road.

With few important exceptions I am very flexible about proposed rules for the game. Here are the some vague guidelines that I would like to propose for your consideration. Let me know if you would be interested in such game. Also any suggestions or comments about rules are most welcome. Especially about mods, since I've been mostly playing vanilla with few simple mods in the past, with some houserules fixing most glaring exploits, but I haven't used mods too much.


So here are some bullet points about potential rules and setup for the new game.


1. The proposed game is *veterans only*. This is the only rule that is none negotiable. Please only consider joining this game if you have strong MP Dom3 experience behind your back.

2. Only join if you have enough time for a long and deep MP game with challenging opponents. Please keep in mind that unless you are eliminated, the game might last 4+ months.

3. No early quiters. Even if you are losing the war please stick with your nation as long as you can before going AI.

4. Posting in character/Roleplaying when posting on the board is highly encouraged, although not necessary of course. From my personal experience some of the best Dom2 and Dom3 games I have played were those where people posted amazing AARs and tried to stay "in character". Although of course there will be no roleplaying nazi police in the game, so you don't have to do it if you don't like it.

5. Mod selection - open to suggestions. As I've said I've been away from Dom3 MP for a more than a year, and even before that I didn't use mods too much. Two mods that seem to be interesting and popular, and which maybe a good idea to use in this game (depending on how you guys feel about them) are CBM 1.6 and recent EndGameDiversity mod. However any comments, feedback and suggestions about these and other mods are highly appreciated.

6. Map, game settings - open to suggestions.

7. Number of players - open to suggestions. Not too few certainly, but perhaps not overly many, to speed up the game in these first 15-30 turns.

8. Hosting time - open to suggestions. I've been thinking about 24h hosting time for the first 20 or 30 turns, then switching to 48h hosting. But we could start with 48h, if 24h in the beginning will be too fast for some players.

9. Host type. I would prefer regular dedicated server if we can arrange one. But if not, PBEM Llamaserver would work too.

10. Nation selection. Personally I would prefer system where each player throws one nation into the hat, and then get one randomly assigned to him. I think it will stir things up a bit, forcing players to play with nations with which they may have not played too much in MP before. But we can do standard nation assignment, depending on players preferences.

11. Diplomacy. Now here is a tricky one. I am really torn on this. On one hand Machiavelli tactics, trade, alliances and backstabbing, propaganda wars and disinformation - are all parts of what can make some Dom3 MP games such fantastic experience. On the other hand - it can sometimes get out of control.

Perhaps we should consider choosing one of these types:

1. Normal diplomacy game
2. Normal diplomacy but no trading in gem, items, blood slaves.
3. No diplomacy or trading whatsoever.
4. Some other diplomacy model?...

Like I said I am torn on this issue. So what do you guys think? Which game type would you prefer and why? Or would you suggest something else? And is it a dealbreaker for you, or you don't care about it too much? (of course the last case doesn't mean that your opinion on this subject will be disregarded when choosing the game type, I am just testing waters here and gathering feedback)

12. Houserules. Totally open. Anything that makes game more fun or stops some cheese or exploitive tactics is welcome here. Any suggestions? Personally I've been thinking about prohibiting one or two overpowered globals (unless CBM 1.6 has taken care of it already, need to check it up)


Please let me know what you think.


Cheers,
Corwin


UPDATE: 7/10/2010 The players list is closed, game rules are finilized, the map has been created. The game will start as soon as pretenders are uploaded to llama server.


Final list of players and their nations(after assignment):

1. Baalz - Shinuyama
2. Aethyr - Ulm
3. Squirreloid - Pangeya
4. Dimaz - Vanheim
5. Fakeymcfake - Abyssia
6. Lingchih - Tien Chi
7. DrPraetorious - Jotunheim
8. PriestyMan(FL) - Machaka
9. Graeme Dice - C'tis
10. Ghoul31 - Agartha
11. Corwin - Pythium
12. Executor - Ermor
13. Iainuki - Bandar Log


Mods used - CBM1.6, EndgameDiversity mod 1.1
3 banned spells (Forge, Arcane Nexus, Astral Corruption)
Game Settings: MA, Magic 55. Graphs are on, HOF 15, renaming allowed.
Diplomacy and trading allowed.
Victory conditions - 1 VP for each capital, to win the game you need to get 50% of total VPs(rounded down) + 1.
Hosting - 24h for the first 10-30 turns, 48h later on.
Host - llama server
Map used - specially modified for our game Cradle of Dominion map

No chese stuff, which includes:
- Bogus orders
- lab filling
- suiciding mages/priests intentionally to turn them undead
- giving up without fight

Nation assigments is semi-random. Each player will submit one nation to the pool, and then each player will be randomly assigned a nation from that pool. Note that the are no limitations in the assigment process, so you can be assigned the nation you have picked, depending on the random dice. This is important to prevent players sumbitting weak nations to the pool, since there is a reasonable chance (1/n, where n number of players) that you will get your nation of choice.

Last edited by Corwin; September 15th, 2010 at 06:40 PM..
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Old June 10th, 2010, 03:32 AM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

I'll play. The only point I have too much of an opinion on is that we use CBM. Virtually every MP game nowadays uses it, particularly the vet games. It really opens up a hell of a lot of units/spells/pretenders/items that are impossible to justify using in a competitive vanilla game. It also adds "good" national heroes to every nation so getting them is actually an event, and removes gem generators (clams, fetishes, bloodstones) which is a massive change to how the endgame plays - in a good way.

Oh, and welcome back! You were the first guy to beat me up in my first dom 3 game.
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Old June 10th, 2010, 04:31 AM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baalz View Post
I'll play. The only point I have too much of an opinion on is that we use CBM. Virtually every MP game nowadays uses it, particularly the vet games. It really opens up a hell of a lot of units/spells/pretenders/items that are impossible to justify using in a competitive vanilla game. It also adds "good" national heroes to every nation so getting them is actually an event, and removes gem generators (clams, fetishes, bloodstones) which is a massive change to how the endgame plays - in a good way.

Oh, and welcome back! You were the first guy to beat me up in my first dom 3 game.
Thank you Baalz. It's very good to see you again. Oh, and by the way, that game, as well as the last game of mine, in which you and me have also played together, were a blast. I just finished re-reading some of the awesome AARs people were writing for that game.

I can see that you have been very busy on Dom3 scene since then, writing a large host of nations guides, a "Good player pledge" (very well written btw, I fully support it!) and undoubtedly becoming extremely formidable opponent. It would be great to play with you again.

Also it is nice to see that many other players of the last Dom3 game I've played ("Figment", http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=37917 ) are still around and active in Dom3 community. Perhaps we could get some of them as well...

Regarding CBM - I agree, even based upon my limited experience with it CBM is what I am very inclined to use myself. Thank you for the feedback.
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Old June 10th, 2010, 04:33 AM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

Welcome back. I would be interested in playing, depending on start time, final settiings, etc.

I agree with Baalz re: CBM and consider this a must. I'm also highly in favor of Llama's end game divserity mod.

Gregstrom used a random nation assingment process a while back (can't remember the game) in which each player nominated a nation for the "pool". Players were gauranteed that they would not receive the nation they had nominated; this seemed to produce some interesting results.

I prefer PBEM on Llamaserver.
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Old June 10th, 2010, 04:40 AM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

I would certainly be interested in the game.

I support both CBM and Endgame Diversity.
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Old June 10th, 2010, 06:46 AM

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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

I'll join. Vote for no diplomacy.
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Old June 10th, 2010, 03:28 PM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

Thank you for your response and your interest in this game guys. Based upon your feedback, it looks like CBM and Endgame Diversity Mod will almost certainly be used in this game, unless other players will strongly object and would offer convincing arguments against their use. My own gut feeling - I like both of these mods, they should make things more interesting and balanced.

To Baalz: I've just re-read "Figment" game thread to refresh my memory. I take back what I said about you becoming extremely formidable opponent during the time I was away - I forgot that you already were such opponent even two years ago, since you were the brain and the voice behind cunning Marveni nation. I still remember your bold globals and cunning teleporting blitzkrig from across the huge map, and how much I've struggled to fight you - first through proxies, and then in direct violent confrontations across the globe. You and AdmiralZhao were my most brutal opponents in that game.

Man, that was a great game. Good times.

After re-reading that thread I am now more inclined toward allowing full diplomacy in the new game I am trying to orginize. According to many players in that Figment game (which was great fun for everyone based upon players numerious posts on the subject), diplomacy and cunning plots and counterplots were part of what made that game so much fun for all people involved. And (partly because of it) it was still surprisingly balanced until the very last turn. Even the final outcome was very much in question - Mictlan had surrendered to me, but after reading his final AAR I think he had at least 50% chance of winning that game, based upon what I remember of my own position.

Last edited by Corwin; June 10th, 2010 at 03:41 PM..
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Old June 10th, 2010, 06:02 PM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

Hehe, Figment was indeed a fun one but you've got to go back a good deal further for the one I was talking about (my first mp dom3 game)

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=30896

Gah, rereading that thread reminds me how nice it is to have the llamaserver now.
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Old June 10th, 2010, 06:06 PM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

Wow. That game is old, and that server computer that I was running it on doesn't even exist anymore. The power supply was dying at the time, and caught fire one morning when I turned it on. So yes, I'm very happy that Llamaserver exists.
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Old June 10th, 2010, 07:36 PM
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Default Re: Veteran Dom3/2 player returning; New veterans-only MP game proposal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baalz View Post
Hehe, Figment was indeed a fun one but you've got to go back a good deal further for the one I was talking about (my first mp dom3 game)

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=30896

Gah, rereading that thread reminds me how nice it is to have the llamaserver now.
Yes, I know, I remember that one as well. 2006, huh? Man, it's been a while...
You did very well there as well, for your first game, surviving to the endgame. I have also re-read parts of that thread after you've posted a link to it here. I have to say that you tend to write great comments and AARs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baalz
...Baalz said (back in 2006):
Hmmm, for some reason the rest of my scattered jaguar warriors have all chosen the martyr's path as well. They seemed...uncomfortable with the idea of returning to report a cowardly retreat to the red god. Nonetheless, I will heed your advice and withdraw. Unfortunately I seem to have misplaced all my leaders in the area, so I have no way to recall my wayward troops. Pay no attention to the large army marching towards your capital, this is just the honor guard of the king I sent to collect these troops, and he is VERY honorable.


To Graeme Dice&Baalz: How is this Llamaserver working for you guys? Unless I am mistaken, this is essentially PBEM with some simple webbased UI showing you which nations have submitted their turn and which not, right? Can you automate email turn submission somehow?
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