OT: I just caught some punk

[Atrocities]

No crap while I was typing my Last message I heard something odd out side and when I flicked on the side light, one of those big barn lights, this punk went running away and jumped into a beater POS car and speed off into the back..... DUH theres only one place to go back there and thats the druggy house..... I am talking to 911 now..... BRB.

[Ruatha]

You do seem to live in an "interesting" neighbourhood, didn't you have some "lively" neighbours some time ago?

EDIT: Ahh, the druggy house, now I get it, thought it was some kind of ****house.
But I guess it's where those previous "lively" neighbours lived..

[ June 17, 2004, 08:47: Message edited by: Ruatha ]

[Atrocities]

The 911 operator said there have been a rash of calls about prowlings in our area tonight. They will send a car out to look around.

Look around, the little tweaker was trying to steal gas out of my truck......! His hose and can are still next to my truck...!!!!

I told here that I thought he was armed, so I did not confront him, just yelled at him... I hope they take it seriously as this crap is getting out of hand.

Do any of you know anything about setting up your computer to work as a security station.... IE motion sensors attacked to small digital video cameras or web cams?

The cops won't do jack about these druggy low life tweakers who keep coming around and stealing stuff. Hell Last week we cought one trying to sell one of the horse.... Seriously he told this lady that he had a horse for sale and was all shocked and stuff when we asked him WTF he was doing on our property..... The lady told us he was selling her his horse.... HIS horse... Hell the cops didn't even come out to take a report on it... That was a clear signal to these POS that its ok to do what they are doing... We had to move the horse into the secure pasture and cancel our trip this weekend because of it. We need to move them to a boarding stable while we are gone, and the owners don't have the money to do that. (So we are stuck here watching them.)

Now this skinny hobo tweaker SF looser druggie attempts to siphon gas out of my truck! And once again the COPS won't do a GD thing about it.

[Atrocities]

Originally posted by Ruatha:
You do seem to live in an "interesting" neighbourhood, didn't you have some "lively" neighbours some time ago?

EDIT: Ahh, the druggy house, now I get it, thought it was some kind of ****house.
But I guess it's where those previous "lively" neighbours lived.. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">same ones. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif The jerk they busted Last year around this time is still in jail. She moved in a new one and all his low life trailer trash druggy punk friends. And this guy is a real looser let me tell you. I mean he is a creepy SOB. He looks like that ape from Any Which Way You Can, not the ape ape, but the bold biker ape looking guy. What a dog faced age reject thing he is. What are the odds that his parents would meet and spawn such a thing, and how astornomical are the odds that he would find a women willing to over look his ... well him and have sex with him thus producing the little bare foot theiving varmits that now infest this once peaceful neighborhood. Hell I can't even get a date unless she weighs 800 pounds and this ape managed to get in with the druggy women. (Sick but true.) BRB Cop Car....

[Atrocities]

The Cop went back and talked to them and they all said that they were asleep. However the care that I described was listed as stolen so its going to be impounded. Since it was not on their property they can deny knowning anything about who was driving it.

Oh loddy whoopi de F'in doo.

I guess I get to keep the gas can and hose those, the COP did not take them.

I wish it was legal to shoot people like that, you know like you buy a tag and when you catch them stealing from you, boom - tage and bag. But alas it is not, and the law is unwilling to do anything about them until someone hurts them and then that person is going to jail and the low life trailer trash druggies get to sue you.

I tell you it is simply not right.

(The officer told me that if I would have attempted to detain the individual I cought, I could have been arrested for assualt. WTF kind of FU criminal system do we now live under???

WTF is the world coming too when a low life druggy has more GD rights than someone like me? Oh I get it, its because they are a low life druggy, they are a minority and thus are protected or something. Like the spotted owl.

Unless the COPS catch them or I can prove who it was, I am SOL. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[ June 17, 2004, 09:11: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

[narf poit chez BOOM]

It might make the neighborhood safer if you installed the camera's and took pictures till you had a pile of evidence to take in.

Also, buy a gun.

[Ruatha]

You could a get a cheap motion detector connected to the barn lamp, not that expensive.
Then set up a web camera to your PC with a security program that starts recording when something moves.
there are some freeware I belive.
The problem is that movement occurs often outside without it being a thief. But I belive the sensitivity can be adjusted so that it only starts when the light switches on.
And a webcam, altough cheap isn't the best quality to try to identify someone with.
Better is a digital video camera connected to the PC so that it starts the camera, a bit more expensive.
And cameras directed outside isn't legal (Here we are again) everywhere.

EDIT Quick google search
Thief jailer (http://www.totalshareware.com/asp/detail_view.asp?application=15564)

[ June 17, 2004, 09:28: Message edited by: Ruatha ]

[Atrocities]

Originally posted by narf poit chez BOOM:
It might make the neighborhood safer if you installed the camera's and took pictures till you had a pile of evidence to take in.

Also, buy a gun. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The camera idea.

Around here a gun would just get you shot. The cops here consistantly get away with blowing inocent people away. They plant evidence or a weapon to make it a "rightous" shooting. (Look up how many officer related fatal shootings have occured in Portland since 1990 - its amazing)

No the guns stay locked up. Better to just get them on tape and go from their. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Atrocities]

Originally posted by Ruatha:
You could a get a cheap motion detector connected to the barn lamp, not that expensive.
Then set up a web camera to your PC with a security program that starts recording when something moves.
there are some freeware I belive.
The problem is that movement occurs often outside without it being a thief. But I belive the sensitivity can be adjusted so that it only starts when the light switches on.
And a webcam, altough cheap isn't the best quality to try to identify someone with.
Better is a digital video camera connected to the PC so that it starts the camera, a bit more expensive.
And cameras directed outside isn't legal (Here we are again) everywhere. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Its legal to use video cameras to record for security purposes. The government uses them on signals, we now have video cell phones, and people often record events and other things out side. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I think what is illegal is if you attempt to illegally record someone with a hidden camera while they are undressing or something.

I like the idea about using a motion sensor light. Thanks for suggesting it. We have one up by the barn and it would not take much to put another by the vehicle park way. Right now all I have is the 10k Protable hand held lamp. (Very bright indeed but runs out of juice quickly.)

I found a place on the web that sells the digital camera systems for around $1,000.00 so I might go that route.

[dogscoff]

If you're going to install floodlights, be careful.

Many thieves & prowlers *prefer* houses with high-powered motion-triggered halogen spotlights. These lights are so bright that they cast very dark, very deep shadows, and the sharp contrast makes it very difficult to spot someone hiding in those shadows- more difficult than if the whole area remained in half-light.

Therefore, make sure you position the lights so as not to create any shady hiding places for the bad guys.

[Ruatha]

Originally posted by dogscoff:
If you're going to install floodlights, be careful.

Many thieves & prowlers *prefer* houses with high-powered motion-triggered halogen spotlights. These lights are so bright that they cast very dark, very deep shadows, and the sharp contrast makes it very difficult to spot someone hiding in those shadows- more difficult than if the whole area remained in half-light.

Therefore, make sure you position the lights so as not to create any shady hiding places for the bad guys. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The clientel in AT's neighbourhood house doesn't sound as smart as that.. I mean.. the horse... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

[Thermodyne]

We had some junky type riff-raff living in our town. With lots of thefts and home invasions taking place, and all kinds of vandalism. They were living in an old farm house that belonged to some rich Arabs that were just speculating the property. The owners basically didn’t give a damn about our concerns when we contacted the rental agent. The cops tried to help, but the laws are stacked in favor of society’s trash. Then one night Last winter the house burned down! Riff-raff moved on and the crime wave stopped. Fire is really an amazing thing………

[Nostalgia For Infinity]

I think you need to douse the house in petrol, no one will care, apart from the occupants of course!

Just don't get caught!

[dogscoff]

I really can't believe I've just read those Last two Posts...

[primitive]

Originally posted by dogscoff:
I really can't believe I've just read those Last two Posts... <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Burn down their house so they move to the next county. Now there’s a creative solution http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

[AMF]

Don't shoot people. Don't kill people. That is bad, for everyone involved, and society.

There are many other things to do, all of which involve a bit more effort. But, humans and animals are different, and it takes effort to behave in ethical ways and be part of a community.

I have found that economic pressure works very well in my neighborhood. You say they live in a house? Get the city to put a "nuisance tax" lien on it. Most municipalities have that provision and it forces the owner of the house to deal with the problem in a way that hits them where it hurts - the pocketbook. Plus, you can keep piling them on to a certain point.

Some other examples of ways to deal with this situation have already been mentioned. Motion sensors, pictures, cameras, etc...here are a few others off the top of my head:

* Mace/pepper spray
* A dog
* You can buy halogen flashlights that are so powerful they can temporarily "blind" someone if you shine it in their faces. Use that next time, get 'em in their face, then get a few good pictures? Or something else...

Just off the top of my head.

Good luck,

Alarik

[Gandalf Parker]

If you want to personalize the security of your home and make the computer part of it then go might want to go to www.SmartHome.com (http://www.SmartHome.com)

But be warned. I usually dont recommend that site without first telling the person to hide their credit cards or hand them over to a spouse. This is MAJOR hacker/geek toy country. Everything you need to make your house do everything you have ever seen in any movie.
The guided tour is fun to look at.
http://www.smarthome.com/gtour/guidedtour.html

[ June 17, 2004, 14:11: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

[Combat Wombat]

Don't shoot then with a rifle or a pistol. Get a stungun and shoot them till they are squirming uncontrolablely on the ground. Then call the police. It's non-lethal, so it cool.

[Baron Munchausen]

Originally posted by Katchoo:
I thought the good thing about living in the U.S.A. was that if someone tresspassed on your property, you had a legal right to blow their head off with the highest caliber automated rifle you own.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

I did a search and found this: Electronic Yard Fence (http://www.familydefense.com/electronic-yard.htm)
It's a motion detector that emits light and ear piercing noise when set off. It's only got a 15 foot range though, so you might need quite a few if your property is big.

Better yet, put in some Electric Fencing: Electric Fencing (http://www.mepsef.com/securityfencing1.html)
So far the highest voltage I've found is in the above link (10,000 Volts), although most seem to average out around 4,000 to 5,000 Volts. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Actually, that's a matter of state laws, not federal. In W's Texas for example, yes, you can shoot someone on your property after dark and if they die it's just too bad. This seems to be a relic of the days of cattle rustling. Someone's 'property' used to be hundreds of square miles of grasslands so if you found someone well inside your property after dark you pretty much knew what they were up to and could save the sheriff the trouble of hunting them down by shoooting them yourself. Other states are very different. Gun laws in New York are not very far from the UK model. A few of the wealthy and powerful can buy themselves private mercenaries for protection but Joe Average will be prosecuted and put in prison for years if he dares to even carry a gun, let alone use it.

Other sorts of laws are not even state, but local matters. I'd be surprised if communities in Oregon (isn't this where Atrocities lives?) don't have some 'nuisance' laws for dealing with derelicts and squatters.

Do these people even have the right to be living in that house? Or is it an 'abandoned' property? If so, you'd better find the owner of the property and 'persuade' him/her to get them evicted.

The attempt to sell the horse is obvious fraud. You can get a lawyer and sue them yourself even if the cops won't follow up. Yes, it's expensive but how expensive will it be to install and maintain all of the security equipment you are contemplating?

[AMF]

That's an extremely good point. Check state laws before doing anything like getting mace, etc...lassst thing you want is to get busted. There are websites that will tell you what you can and can't get away with. I think the NRA does that at least in part, maybe just related to guns, but there are some restrictions on mace/pepper spraw as well in some places.

Originally posted by Baron Munchausen:
Actually, that's a matter of state laws, not federal. ...Other states are very different. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">

[EvilGenius4ABetterTomorro]

Yes, make a log. Not lay a log! I had a Meth house across from me and still do. But Portland Drugs & Vice do drive by more often and actually stop and let them know they are watching. Write down times and take license plate numbers. Do they own that house? If not, contact the Land Lord. If you still can't get good taxpayer quality service you should act crazy while talking to the police, make vague threats about those people. When your at the end of your options acting crazy is a good one. Works for N. Korea.

"When the going get weird, the weird go pro"

[tesco samoa]

OT - Evil Genius nice sig.... One of the best lines ever written by Hunter

[Thermodyne]

Originally posted by Combat Wombat:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by dogscoff:
I really can't believe I've just read those Last two Posts... <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yeah, I'm alittle concerned too. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hey back off, I didn't burn the house down. My point was that by removing the crap housing, you remove the riff-raff.

The house burned down because they were burning old roof shingles in the wood stove.

[rdouglass]

I read recently that someone had similar problems and started putting up signs stating that the property next to their house was a suspected drug house. According to the article, activity virtually stopped soon after and the neighbors moved on to "greener" pastures.

Don't know anything about any sort of liability / slander but according to what I read, it was extremely effective and non-violent.

Personally, the violence approach appeals more to me, but the non-violent approach is always more socially acceptable... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

If I can find the article again, I'll post a link.

[sachmo]

Originally posted by Combat Wombat:
Don't shoot then with a rifle or a pistol. Get a stungun and shoot them till they are squirming uncontrolablely on the ground. Then call the police. It's non-lethal, so it cool. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It's still assault, and illegal. You better have damn good reason, and preferably a witness or two.

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally posted by rdouglass:
I read recently that someone had similar problems and started putting up signs stating that the property next to their house was a suspected drug house. According to the article, activity virtually stopped soon after and the neighbors moved on to "greener" pastures.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Attention can do alot. Thats always part of the plan with "neighborhood watch" or "subway guardians" or "taking back the neighborhood" programs.

I think Im in 5 different police reports credited with forestalling what could have been nasty situations just by having a determined tourist attitude. The Last one was a guy who left an argument and came back with a shotgun. I stood out on the sidewalk watching it all like it was some sort of TV show. He got mad and tried to order me away. I didnt get into an argument but I wouldnt leave.

As far as this situation, maybe you can arrange with neighbors to provide more lighting in that direction at night. Get manikins and put them in the windows. Put in motion-sensor lights which are pretty cheap and set them too sensitive so that even pets and bats make them turn on. Accidently set your car alarm off alittle too often. Get the neighbors to park their cars nearer to that house and space them just barely too close for someone to park between them so that some of the visitors cant just pull up and do a quick park-n-go right in front. All of this would make the neighborhood seem like its no longer one that someone can quietly enter and leave without being noticed.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

Originally posted by sachmo:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Combat Wombat:
Don't shoot then with a rifle or a pistol. Get a stungun and shoot them till they are squirming uncontrolablely on the ground. Then call the police. It's non-lethal, so it cool. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It's still assault, and illegal. You better have damn good reason, and preferably a witness or two. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">'They were skulking about my property at night' seems to me a perfectly good reason for bodily harm. And as for proof, that's what the camera's are for.

[Puke]

have you ever been hit with a stungun or pepper spray? it mainly serves to piss you off. sure it hurts, but it does not take very long to figure out that its not killing you, and after that you have an angry person with alot of adreniline on your hands.

and like the man said, its illegal to assault someone with a non-leathal weapon. if you dont want to risk retaliation and incarceration for vigalante actions, starting a joint action program with your neighbors is probably the best thing to do. police or sheriffs departments usually support or sponsor such things.

and there are popup adds for those x10 cameras all over the f-cking internet. I hate to endorse popup ad spammers, but they are the most widely known, cheap, effective spycam type thing. there are probably similar things from all sorts of different vendors, web-cam sorts of things.

[Combat Wombat]

Originally posted by dogscoff:
I really can't believe I've just read those Last two Posts... <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yeah, I'm alittle concerned too.

[ June 17, 2004, 12:15: Message edited by: Combat Wombat ]

[Katchoo]

I thought the good thing about living in the U.S.A. was that if someone tresspassed on your property, you had a legal right to blow their head off with the highest caliber automated rifle you own.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

I did a search and found this: Electronic Yard Fence (http://www.familydefense.com/electronic-yard.htm)
It's a motion detector that emits light and ear piercing noise when set off. It's only got a 15 foot range though, so you might need quite a few if your property is big.

Better yet, put in some Electric Fencing: Electric Fencing (http://www.mepsef.com/securityfencing1.html)
So far the highest voltage I've found is in the above link (10,000 Volts), although most seem to average out around 4,000 to 5,000 Volts.

[sachmo]

Originally posted by narf poit chez BOOM:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by sachmo:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by Combat Wombat:
Don't shoot then with a rifle or a pistol. Get a stungun and shoot them till they are squirming uncontrolablely on the ground. Then call the police. It's non-lethal, so it cool. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It's still assault, and illegal. You better have damn good reason, and preferably a witness or two. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">'They were skulking about my property at night' seems to me a perfectly good reason for bodily harm. And as for proof, that's what the camera's are for. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Try to explain that to the jury. You'll probably get sentenced to more time than the guy slinking around in the shadows.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

Yes, well, that's one of the problems with jury's. Anyone skulking about is a) up to no good. b) A potential killer.

I'd move to Texas, but I don't like sweat.

[Azselendor]

About ten years ago, the house next door to me was taken over by some druggies and hobos. The place got trashed and there were little petty thefts (food, penny jars, and stuff).

The lady on the corner tried to use her leverage on the city council to force them out to no avail, but the problem solved itself eventually.

The tree behind the house was dead and lightening hit it during one storm. The tree then collapsed on to thier propane tank triggering an explosion that blew out nearly every wall in the house.

Then to top it off, the property owner tried to collect insurance on it. The insurance company somehow, magically, stupendously learned about it's prior condition to the explosion and promptly terminated the insurance policy citing that it was "Preventable". By the time the notice for that arrived, City Code Enforcement fined him 50,000 dollars and placed a lien against his holdings.

As for security, I always found broken glass sprinkled on top of my wall effective. Sometimes mixed in with the cement too.

Naturally, if they get over that, the rose bush is waiting for them.

[LonghornXtreme]

I can't believe how scary some state's gun laws are...

I don't think Portland and I would mix very well...

Yes I have used a gun to defend my apt, as well as my parents house when I still lived there 4 years ago. The amazing thing about Texas is that the thieves KNOW you can legally shoot and kill them without legal repercussion if they're on your property (mortgaged or not). I have had the satisfaction of watching the thief who was trying to steal my truck with a crowbar get cuffed and carted away from my house. Because my truck was parked behind my house and with nowhere to run... he accepted the fact that he was going to sit on his hands in the middle of my drive way until the cops showed up... the thieves also know that the "he shot me in the back" excuse doesn't work as long as the body falls on your property in a Texas court.

I've never pulled the trigger but I do know when it comes to my family and property and the possiblity of harm to either...

I know many people think us Texans are crazy... but i beg to differ. Threat of force is an important concept that most of ya'll should understand just from playing this game. Taking guns away from law abiding citizens has to be one of the worst possible moves for the integrity individual freedom this country claims to love so dearly.

Numerous times all its taken when a prowler is around is a simple "clack clack" of my good ol remington 12 chambering a cartridge that sends the prowler hauling butt to get off your property.

I don't cary a concealed weapon. I don't keep one in my truck. But there is one in my safe and there is one in the closet with a trigger lock...

[gregebowman]

I think the law in Florida is that they have to be physically in your house and there is a fear of imminent damage to you or your loved ones before you can pull the trigger. So if the perp is leaving the house you can't shoot him in the back, especially if his body would fall outside of your house. Also, IIRC, you can't booby-trap your house like MacCauly Culken (?) did in those movies. I think most states have laws against that, even if someone is breaking into your house with guns and knives. Which is a shame, because it would be funny to seem some of these scumbags tarred and feathered like Joe Pesci and Daniel Stern were http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[narf poit chez BOOM]

In ancient isreal, you could only kill them if it was at night.

Which is logical, because medieval cities would be incredibly dark and you would have no idea if their armed and about to kill you or not. In the daytime, it had to be self-defence.

[vanbeke]

Fascinating topic -

I used to live in Detroit, with several independent pharmaceutical entrepeneurs living in the neighborhood. Our home was broken into 4 times, twice while we were home. Sometime after the first, but before the Last, we put up bars on the doors and windows. The Last time, some clown with a crowbar and a BMFH was trying to break down the door. I grabbed my shotgun and ran down to the door. My wife was screaming like crazy and the guy ran off, leaving his implements on our porch. Although it was after midnight, there were some people sitting in the garage across the street (they said they were getting their smoker set up for the church barbeque the next day).

The one good thing about all of this, is that we were not broken into after I appeared with the gun.

we left the neighborhood after my wife got preggers - wasn't where we could bring up a child - and we discovered another aspect of the life of crime. I always though that they would steal anything that wasn't nailed down, but they stole the vanity and toilet out of the batchroom (along with all of the appliances and the hot water heater) while we were waiting for the sale of the house to be completed. At least they turned off the water before doing that.

With all of that, I eventually ended up in Portland, where for the first time, my car was stolen. We got it back, but it made my new wife vary nervous.

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Puke:
have you ever been hit with a stungun or pepper spray? it mainly serves to piss you off. sure it hurts, but it does not take very long to figure out that its not killing you, and after that you have an angry person with alot of adreniline on your hands.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Ya, these aren't very good for home defense unless you are prepared to hightail it out of the house and leave it to the badguy. They aren't designed to really stop someone, only slow them down long enough that you can get away.

[Atrocities]

I will just use my paint ball gun next time I catch one of these SOB's lurking around the property. I have it set to 400 ft per seoond with stain balls. When they get hit its non leathal but will hurt like a son of a gun. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[Will]

Originally posted by Atrocities:
I will just use my paint ball gun next time I catch one of these SOB's lurking around the property. I have it set to 400 ft per seoond with stain balls. When they get hit its non leathal but will hurt like a son of a gun. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">And you can just tell the authorities that the offender will be covered in green paint splotches. Even better if you can find some glow-in-the-dark varieties.

[EvilGenius4ABetterTomorro]

Good idea, I still have my old Nelspot 007 and some really old and hard grease based paint! I think you can freeze paintballs too. I'd like to mark some of my neighbors "customers" but would be a little scared of return fire or maybe they'd come over and wipe scabies on me.

[Puke]

toy guns are a real good way to get shot by people with real guns. including cops.

i sometimes carry a collapsable baton when walking through a bad neighborhood or when out on a long ride, but thats illegal as all heck too.

its a pretty ghetto thing to do, but broken glass on top your wall is a sure-fire way to keep most people out. if its clean, it almost looks artistic. of course, this requires you to have a large concrete wall. and at that rate, your looking at bars on the windows and such.

Once the bars go up, you are pretty much admitting that the neighborhood is unsalvageable. but sometimes thats how it is. everything on the ground level of my neighborhood has bars and security gates, the nicer places have guards.

Me, I just have a top floor window thats better than television.

[Atrocities]

Puke, most druggies have sold or hocked their guns a long long time ago. If they were real criminals, with guns, they would not be lurking around at 2am trying to steal gas out of a parked car knowning full well the owner does have guns and is more likely than not willing to use one of them in self defense.

No these guys are just low life trash who thing that they can get away with anything. The cops don't want to do anything about it because of the paper work and added work load. (A sad day indeed when a cop would rather sight some guy for not waring his seat belt, but won't go near a drug house.)

[Gandalf Parker]

Yes weapons which are not weapons are best. They also are helpful in claiming that you didnt actually go out armed. Dont carry shurikens, however a bycycle sprocket throws real nice. Dont carry nunchucks but if you know how to use chucks then a dog-leash becomes nasty. And of course swords are a no-no but those camping saws can work just as well
http://www.sleepingbagsandtents.com/Secure/ecommerce/details.asp?prdn=104

[Intimidator]

A few years ago I read in the newspaper about a burglary, the Burglar was catched in the act by the occupants but he managed to get away.

The police arived in 15 minutes and lucky for the police it had started to snow 30 minutes ago. So the only thing they had to do was follow the tracks in the fresh snow to the Burglar's house.....

Really isn't a joke has really happened http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ June 19, 2004, 13:47: Message edited by: Intimidator ]

[sachmo]

Originally posted by Puke:
toy guns are a real good way to get shot by people with real guns. including cops.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">True story following...

When I was in high school, we had a school wide watergun game. It was supposed to take place off of school grounds, so we had to get people at home, or at work, or wherever. Anyway, I went out an bought one of those water machine guns. It looked exactly like a real Uzi. In those days, they didn't make them out of orange and yellow pLastic. So we went over to this kids house and ambushed him. We were driving back to my house in the back of my friends Samuari (no top) squirting signs and each other in the car. Next thing we know there is a police car behind us. They pull us over, and we hear a loudspeaker telling us to drop our weapons! Obviously, I did as I was told, and thought they were just giving us a hard time until I see one of the cops come up next to the car with his gun pointed at my friends head! Then I became aware that the second officer was pointing his pistol at MY head!

Needless to say, the watergun was trashed the very next day.

It was creepy.

[TerranC]

Originally posted by Intimidator:
Sorry, but about the pepper-spray. You are WRONG !!
When I served in the Dutch Navy, We had some riot training. And all of us had to be hit with that stuff......
Believe me I was out of action for nearly 20 minutes, the only thing I was able to do was to put my head in a bucket of water..........Hell, even when I write this down, the memory of it starts my eyes to water again....... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Inti, <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That's if you manage to get hit straight in your eyes. If it happens to hit the assailant's skin, with CIVILIAN class pepper spray (3 million scoville units compared to law enforcement class pepper sprays which rank at 5 million scoville units), it'll just give him irritated (albeit very irritated) skin.

Stun guns though, I heard that if you managed to hit your target in the right place, it can cause convulsions and even death? Did I hear that right or is that just hearsay?

[Loser]

Originally posted by TerranC:
Stun guns though, I heard that if you managed to hit your target in the right place, it can cause convulsions and even death? Did I hear that right or is that just hearsay? <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Every fe weeks theres another story in the news about some fool getting hit with a Taser(tm) and dieing.

And then their stock goes up.

No joke.

[Intimidator]

Originally posted by Puke:
have you ever been hit with a stungun or pepper spray? it mainly serves to piss you off. sure it hurts, but it does not take very long to figure out that its not killing you, and after that you have an angry person with alot of adreniline on your hands.

and like the man said, its illegal to assault someone with a non-leathal weapon. if you dont want to risk retaliation and incarceration for vigalante actions, starting a joint action program with your neighbors is probably the best thing to do. police or sheriffs departments usually support or sponsor such things.

and there are popup adds for those x10 cameras all over the f-cking internet. I hate to endorse popup ad spammers, but they are the most widely known, cheap, effective spycam type thing. there are probably similar things from all sorts of different vendors, web-cam sorts of things. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Sorry, but about the pepper-spray. You are WRONG !!
When I served in the Dutch Navy, We had some riot training. And all of us had to be hit with that stuff......
Believe me I was out of action for nearly 20 minutes, the only thing I was able to do was to put my head in a bucket of water..........Hell, even when I write this down, the memory of it starts my eyes to water again....... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Inti,

[ June 19, 2004, 12:09: Message edited by: Intimidator ]

[Raging Deadstar]

Personally i would go with the glow in the dark paintball idea. Hell, even just a bright coloured one. You hit the guy all you have to do is call the police and tell them there's a guy who just tried to steal from you and is sporting a luminous green splat on his back http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

The only disadvantage to most of these situations is repurcussions, especially if the police aren't going to do anything about it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif At which point I would just keep a big stick or bat near possible entrances. If it wards them off, good, if not you're not unarmed. If someone wants to harm me and breaks onto my property i sure as hell ain't about to serve them tea and crumpets http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[Azselendor]

Tasers that the police are supposed to have aren't supposed to cause death. The ones that cause death are a model with a higher power rating and typically people who die from tasers have undiagnosed heart conditions.

[Thermodyne]

To change the topic a little, I was at a party where some people were putting on a collar for some invisible fencing, not many of them walked over the wire. But there was this one air head that was not phased in the least. He actually seemed to like it!

[ June 20, 2004, 03:01: Message edited by: Thermodyne ]

[Jack Simth]

Different people are affected by electricity in different ways - I'm told that, as a joke, one of my grandfathers used to put his hand on the tractor's sparkplugs, while the engine was running, and ask someone to hand him a wrench. People started throwing wrenches at him after the first few times they got a taste of the voltage.

[Atrocities]

The problem today I think is that the courts are in the business of making money and that directly puts them in conclift with what they were design for; administering justice.

So it is more cost effective for a cop to sight someone with money for speeding then it is to bust a drug house where they will have to PAY to have it cleaned up.

If the courts are in the business of making a profit, then justice is no longer blind and it all comes down to the mighty buck.

How much justice are you willing to pay for. In this case none. It is not my job to bust the drug house, all I can do is keep reporting it, and do what I can within the law to protect my stuff from theft.

Today I put up four signs along the road, they all read; This property is monitored by survlance video.

I wonder if that will have an effect.

[Puke]

a solid shock can certainly make your muscles spasm. the tasers that shoot two electrodes into you and send a periodic shock will certainly bring you down, but the trick there is getting them to hit squarely, not deflect off a jacket or clothing, and let them be effective enough so that the target cant just yank them out.

ive been subjected to a steady pulse of shocks that physically prevented me from closing my hand. It didnt hurt that bad (shock isnt really as painfull as you thing, its just a supprise if you are not ready for it) and i certainly had the WILL and DESIRE to close my hand, but the muscles just ZAP wouldnt ZAP do ZAP it.

anyway, the little 9volt and D-cell battery powered hand tazers and stun guns / stun batons are good for about jack squat. having been hit by them, i can say that they hurt a little bit, definitly can leave a burn and potentially scarring, but dont disrupt your muscular function and aside from being really annoying, are not very effective.

I dont know what to tell you about the pepper spray, maybe the extra two million scovilles in the military **** makes a difference. but i sort of doubt it. When I had it in MY eyes, it stung like a bastard and I couldnt see anything through the squinting and tears, besides a vague sense of light and dark. But I could sure as **** move and swing my arms. technically, i could hear too, but I was distracted enough by the burning pain that it didnt help so much. not the best fighting form i admit, but certainly enough to threaten anyone who is hiding behind a bottle of pepper spray.

I guess the morale of the story is that pepper spray is great, if you intend to run away after using it. and tasers are great if and only if you have bizzare kinky sex habits.

pink and tender fillet mignon, well, thats just great all the time. especially with brine soaked capers and a nice pinot.

[Randallw]

I sort of got shocked once. I turned on a lamp and felt a strange tingling feeling through my hand for awhile. Once I turned on a lamp and the bulb blew up showering glass outwards. Luckily I was behind the lamp as I turned it on.

[dogscoff]

Today I put up four signs along the road, they all read; This property is monitored by survlance video.

I wonder if that will have an effect.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Dunno, depends whether they can red or not=-)

[Gandalf Parker]

From a conversation in the white-hat hackers newsGroups on the subject of cracking in the real world....
Having security is good. Having signs that say "secured by" is good. Having security and a sign saying secured by but it says some OTHER security is better.

[Azselendor]

A company I did work for didn't have much money so they relied on subterfuge to keep thier store (not saying what kind) secured.

Basically they had an alarm on the door - that was connected to a broken down volkswagon car alarm in the back. They had a phone system that would default to radios incase power was cut or the phone lines damaged. They also had three 4000 pound safes - filled with molds of merchandise not actual merchandise. The molds were donated by the styrofoam company next door.

Then to top it off, none of the outer doors had security alarms. Only the inner doors which connected the vw bug out back I mentioned before.

[psimancer]

i ran a business something like that but we actually had no alarms at all

however since we had neighberhood kids running around at night i staed late a few times and went out snd smoked a few cigs with them they wondered how i knew they were here i told em about the (fictious) webcam security system i had that kept uploading a 2hrs worth of pics to a web site and had a cellphone and internal powersuply so it can kee3p running for an hour after both landline and poweer loss plus with internal and hidden external cameras its like perfect to get pics of any malefgactors

the kids (15 or so )were duly interested (lots of probing questions) i even pointed out a box on the side of the warehouse as a camera point (just a standard elictrical box about 26 feet up in the air with a opening hole in the bottom) in 5 years of running my computer business there i never had any attempts yet the body shop that was there before and now around a corner had at least 2 atempts a month average

prevarication in the right ears is always more effecient than reality with no money

[gregebowman]

Originally posted by Atrocities:
The problem today I think is that the courts are in the business of making money and that directly puts them in conclift with what they were design for; administering justice.

So it is more cost effective for a cop to sight someone with money for speeding then it is to bust a drug house where they will have to PAY to have it cleaned up.

If the courts are in the business of making a profit, then justice is no longer blind and it all comes down to the mighty buck.

How much justice are you willing to pay for. In this case none. It is not my job to bust the drug house, all I can do is keep reporting it, and do what I can within the law to protect my stuff from theft.

Today I put up four signs along the road, they all read; This property is monitored by survlance video.

I wonder if that will have an effect. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">WEll, AT, I see it from the other angle. Most of our offenders violate because they either can't make their payments, or in some cases, refuse to make their payments. So the judges can impose all of the court payments and restitution payments they want to, but if the offender isn't paying, then no one is making money. And sometimes, the judge will dismiss the person's probation, while teh scumbag may still owe thousands of dollars yet! Sometimes they'll impose a lien, but not always. So it's not always a profit making business like you think it is.