A Special Thanks to Atrocities..

[David E. Gervais]

AT, You are by far the most prolific ship builder I know. The amount of work you have put into your Star Trek Mod is absolutely astounding.

I made you this montage as a special thanks for all the shipsets you have made for SE4.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/321620-BirdOfPrey1.jpg

I hope you like it, Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Aiken]

Holy ... picture!
Any chance for 1600x1280 edition?

[luke_slovakian]

i have to say that is really really nice

[Atrocities]

Holly great houses of the Klingon Empire..... I had no idea that you could do this with those models. I am hyperventalating as I drool over your work. Very impressive and they even look like Klingon K'Vort BOP ships.

Awsome, simply breath takingly awsome.

Some how saying thank you is not enough. I am very uplifted now. A true master peace David, a genuine work of art.

[Caduceus]

I can hear the music now...

Buh bah buh bah buh bah!

[Timstone]

Wow!! Very cool!
Congrats David and AT!
I was just in the process of collecting data for a nice K'vort model for picture purposes, but now I see this I think I be better off putting it away...

[Randallw]

Timstone said:

I was just in the process of collecting data for a nice K'vort model for picture purposes, but now I see this I think I be better off putting it away...



ah, but are they K'vort cruisers or B'rel frigates http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Timstone]

Oh yeah, that's the one. B'rel.
I wanted to make a super detailed model. Just for kicks.
Maybe I'll go ahead and make another Version of it for use in SE V.
Due to time constraints and the B5 mod, I'll stick this project into the freezer.
The first shipset I would like to make for SE V is (are?) the Borg.

[Randallw]

It's an easy mistake since they look practically identical (apart from the size). I have been thinking of modding and set making but am leaving the effort till SEV comes out. Then the Draka will conquer the galaxy.

Edit: is it just me, or have the page borders shrunk?

[Timstone]

Randallw:
About the borders, hmm... I thought it was my computer at work. Guess not then. I'm glad you noticed.

I think it's very unrealistic (if you can use this word here) that the K'vort and the B'rel look the same, but the K'vort is about twice (or more) the size.

[Randallw]

My technical manual has a single picture for both of them

Type: Scout (B'Rel); Cruiser(K'Vort). Common planform, scaled up 4.3 times for cruiser.

The B'Rel has a crew of 12, and the K'Vort 1500.

You'd think the difference would be that the K'Vort has more decks and more windows on side. Of course, in DS9 they just shrank the model when they wanted the difference within a fleet.

[Timstone]

of course...

It's lame to see those kind of shortcuts. Ah well, there are plenty of people who didnt noticed it or don't care about it.

[David E. Gervais]

Did someone request a 1600x1200 (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/321680-BirdOfPrey1600.jpg) Version?

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

P.S. Oh, and AT,.. how many times have I said we make a great team? I suck at model-making but can manage a few good textures.. you (pardon my french) stink at textures but are a fantastic model-maker. I am proud and honored to count you as one of my friends.

P.P.S. Think of it this way, your ship models are like actors to me, and when I direct a scene, the end result will only be as good as the actors. Sure the stage can be pretty, but when the actors suck that's the only thing people notice.

..babble babble, babble, sorry for the digression.. but,. but, but,.. you really do make great ship models.

Cheers! again http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Timstone]

Damn, David. Cool comment. But I'm beginning to feel a little bit sad here.
I think it's great that AT and you are getting along so good. This is especially good for the community.
But the thing that makes me a bit sad is my lack of time. Because I think I'm pretty good at modeling too, and also suck with textures (getting better at it requires a lot of time). I wish I could supply you with cool models too.

Sorry for this litte bit of sadness. I wish, I wish, I wish...


"Okay, people nothing to read here. Be on your bussiness."

[Slynky]

Very nice models "arrayed" very nicely. Good job guys! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[Raging Deadstar]

So the Main question is....

Who's about to get their butts kicked http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif That's a pretty menacing Fleet.

Wonderful work you two http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Atrocities]

The models are K'vort class Birds Of Prey. The B'Rel class has a much shorter neck. (Or at least my Version does)

Believe me when I say this is entirely Davids work. All I sent him were the models. He did the rest. OMG what a wonderful job he did do too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Those textures are spot on.

I wish I had the artistic eye and ability that David has. Making a model is one thing, but making it a work of art is something entirely differant.

[Urendi Maleldil]

As Napoleon Dynamite would say,

Sweet. That looks awesome.

[XenoTheMorph]

Best poster yet David, it is wonderfull http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[pathfinder]

WoW!

VERY nice! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[David E. Gervais]

I couldn't resist playing with the composition,..

BoP Take 2 (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/321852-BirdOfPreyDestroyed2.jpg)

hmmm, could that be a Borg beam hitting the BoP?

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Atrocities]

Written Words cannot do this latest digital poster justice.

Sweet Mercyful CRAP. (http://www.astmod.com/music/bigmonkey.wsimpsweetcrap.wav)

[Caduceus]

Laughed out loud on that one AT.

[Kamog]

Beautiful! Absolutely spectacular! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Renegade 13]

Totally awesome! Or as Narf would say, "Shiney!!"

[NarfsCompIsBack]

Indeed, it is shiney. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[boran_blok]

David, just a little something, (not wanting to nitpick etc but I'll do it anyways http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif)

I know you might just have added the beam later on, but the ship that's being hit should at least be thrown a bit out of course (say tilted and slower) now it's still nice in formation despite getting hit. just a little item to think about for the next one you make.

I suck at both modelling AND textures, but I'm good at placing the two together and making things fit http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Raging Deadstar]

Also you missed off the SEIV Gold logo http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

Lol, Other than that, You've done another incredible piece of art. The backgrounds for these are incredible and give the ships a realistic feel

[David E. Gervais]

Boran, I did actually 'ungroup' the pieces in the model and then had them slightly disperse in one render.. Sadly with even the slightest dispersal it failed to look like a BoP anymore. So I opted to manually chop off one of the wings instead. So this latest image has a bit of post-production done on the render.

Note two: I didn't 'forget' the se4:Gold logo, I chose not to add it. There is a difference.

All in all I think it turned out well. I will do better with my next render, it's the natural order of things,.. you know what they say, practice makes perfect. (Only I would change the word 'perfect' in the old phrase to 'better'.)

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

P.S. I don't strive for prefection, that is a lost cause persued by fools.. I just want to gobsmack people and have their jaws bounce a few times off the floor or keyboard. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Raging Deadstar]

David E. Gervais said:
Note two: I didn't 'forget' the se4:Gold logo, I chose not to add it. There is a difference.



I was curious about that, Will these be used as the opening intro image for the star trek mod? It's a shame you can't have randomised intro screens, then you could use both http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Karibu]

Very Nice pictures David! *clapping hands* /threads/images/Graemlins/MusicalNote.gif I am interested how do you make them? Does it require hours of work managing all the little details or is it more simple than I think? Anyway, that picture is way over my abilities (well, not if I spend next 6 weeks making something like that...). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[David E. Gervais]

How I do it! (and a new pic for effect..)
http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/321972-KlingonTOS2.jpg

1) these renderings are made with Bryce 5.
2) I have a pre-built scene where there is a 2D panel in the background (I simply apply a new background texture as the mood strikes me.)
3) I simply import the model then apply a texture (which I make)
4) I hit the render button. Voila! I now have it basically all done.
5) add spfx elements like engine glow, beams explosions etc (as the mood dictates)
6) Render the tweaked scene.. and save.
7) load it into ArtGem and do a bit of post production.. Add the boarders, text, se4 logo etc.
8) resave the image.
9) boot up PSP and load the original .bmp.. then save it as a low loss .jpg to save bandwidth when I upload it.
10) post it here if the mood is right again.

Simple eh? And this process takes about 15 mins. Plus the render time that can be as much as 2 hours if there are alot of SP/FX in the scene.

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

EDIT: P.S. With this latest model I have taken the time to go through the different 'pieces' of the model and give them their own textures. I think it turned out ok, what do you all think?

[Timstone]

Another very nice pic you created. Me like it.

A question not very much related to this subject, but does anyone have a nice pic/design in his head for a reactor?
A friend of mine supposed to draw a few, but I don't like his designs very much.

[Ed Kolis]

I imagine a reactor would look something like a cylinder with a second cylinder superimposed which is narrower but taller, and with coolant tubes coming out near the top of either cylinder and going back in near the bottom of the fat cylinder... if you want I can whip up a quick model when I get home and have access to Wings...

[Timstone]

Ed:
Oh please do.
Since my Last post I've "brainstormed" two different reactors. Keep 'em comming. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
Thanks for your help Ed.

[Rasorow]

<amazed, speechless>

I like that!

Rasorow

[David E. Gervais]

Is this close to what you imagine a power reactor to be?..

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/322014-ReactorCore1.jpg

I have the 128x128 and 36x36 .bmp Versions made. If you like this tell me where to send them.

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Timstone]

David:
Oh yeah! Now, that's nice!!!!
I plan on doing stuff like that too, but without the shiney surfaces, I don't like shiney surfaces.
Very cool pic.

[mottlee]

My Hat's off to the two of you....VERY nice work! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Atrocities]

Its all been said before, but I will say it again, I am speechless. Excellent work David. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[David E. Gervais]

Attached is the zip with the 128 and 36 pixel sized reactor cores..

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

..all these compliments are making me lightheaded http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Timstone]

Don't "drink" too much of it... hehehe.
Maybe this pic is a good addition to the image pack?

David:
Could you make a few more (5 in total), with the same feel? They will be ised in the comming release of the B5 mod.

[Karibu]

Heh, that stuff in the engine looks much like the drink I had thid new year (we Finnish like hot stuff http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif ). I think you could undoubtly make nice pictures for SEV (or SEIV, for that matter) component pictures.

[David E. Gervais]

Timstone said:
David:
Could you make a few more (5 in total), with the same feel? They will be ised in the comming release of the B5 mod.




Grrrrr, I'll think about it....Grrrrrr http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[David E. Gervais]

Ok, this one is not for the Star Trek Mod, But the model is still by Atrocities.. I took the liberty of giving it a title with a bit of a nostalgic feel..

I miss the old joint (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/322042-Shipyard1.jpg)

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Timstone]

Hahahaha!!!! LOL!!

Fantastic pic David! The days of old are reliving. I'm feeling at home again. The text you gave it is hilarious, great stuff.

[Ed Kolis]

Which reminds me... the Phong were notoriously absent in the Last SE5 teaser pic... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Intimidator]

All is already said the Last 3 pages, but once again :

Great job David.................. and ofcourse Atrocities, but I already told him that more than once............

[David E. Gervais]

This is more fun than making avatars! .. o,m,g,.. I made over 1000 of those... (warning eyecandy overload is a very real danger.) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Fyron]

Timstone said:
Could you make a few more (5 in total), with the same feel? They will be ised in the comming release of the B5 mod.

There are a number of cool reactor images in the latestet Versions of the Image Mod. Have you seen them yet?

[Timstone]

You dirty crossposter! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

Edit:
So this is how you get that abnormally high post count...

[Fyron]

No. I posted it here, then realized you had made a new thread. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Timstone]

Doh! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[NarfsCompIsBack]

If this thread keeps growing, some kid named Jack is going to climb it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Hey, wait a minute, we have a Jack here! Everybody, watch out for a giant!

[Atrocities]

Fantastic sense of humor. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif I come with big ship so I get the outside left docking station... any arguements?

[David E. Gervais]

Who was it that always parked his ship just outside the cantina door? Was it Raging_Dreadstar? or someone else?

LoL,.. Aaah the good old memories of the infamous cantina.

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Timstone]

I hope there is a proper parkingplace for my timetraveling gearbox. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Raging Deadstar]

David E. Gervais said:
Who was it that always parked his ship just outside the cantina door? Was it Raging_Dreadstar? or someone else?



Adds another to the list, First Deathstar, now Dreadstar, confused with Ragnarok a lot. These are grounds for declaring War on if I get diplomatic Messages addressing my name wrong!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

'Fraid Not David, I always travelled in a Large Transport with my cargo... You have any idea how potent 29 cargo bays smell after storing alcohol for several months http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif And it certainly wasn't rightoutside the door, if it was parked there my PDC Cannons couldn't take down Taxi Escorts. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[David E. Gervais]

Raging Deadstar said:
Adds another to the list, First Deathstar, now Dreadstar, confused with Ragnarok a lot. These are grounds for declaring War on if I get diplomatic Messages addressing my name wrong!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif




It was a typo, honest. I didn't mean to offend you Ranging_Deadstar, hmmm, did my finger slip again? Muahahahahaha

There is a good side to these typo's.. when people know who you are in spite of misspelling, it means you're almost famous. (just be glad you don't have a handle like Swartzandedgar. hmm, now that looks really wrong. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif )

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Timstone]

David:
I have a question about the texture you used for the magnificent Cantina.
How did you apply them?
Last evening I build a simple model of a reactor. I wanted to apply a nice texture to it, but it did look very cool. It wasn't the fault of the texture, but it was the way the program (Max 7) placed the texture onto the model. I have another way of doing it, but I wanted to hit the sack...
This evening I'm going to try and re-apply it onto my model. I hope it will work out.

Also another question. What kind of colours do you suggest I use for my reactor?
Damn, I really have no artistic feeling! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/Sick.gif

[David E. Gervais]

Answers:

1) I use Bryce 5 to create the renderings.
2) I import the model (in this case one of AT's)
3) I enter the 'M'aterials lab and change the texture from the default 'procedural' to 'bitmap source' and then load the desired texture and hit 'apply'
4) If the texture looks odd, I return to the Materials lab and tweak the scale and orientation until it looks good.

Note: In the Materials lab is also where I add color tint and other effects like reflection, ambiance, diffusion transparency etc.

It's prety much a trial and error aproach, but after doing this for so many renders it's now second nature and I generally only need to re-enter the mat lab once or twice to get the texture the way I like it.

There is more than just texture mapping involved in making a render look right, there is the bump-map, the backgrounds, the lighting (I often use a negative light to cast shadows). and it can get complicated, but I tend to learn one new trick at a time, until my 'bag of tricks' is capable of seeing me through most renders.

I'm sorry to say that I have no experience with 3DS Max so I can't tell you how their system works. I have on occasion watched my friend work through Max to build models, but my brain went numb by the sheer number of 'variabls' that needed to be addressed prior to rendering. I'm sure you're aware the the 'default' settings are only good for basic scene rendering in 3DS Max. The learning curve for Max is about 1000 times more involved than Bryce.

Anyway, have fun playing with textures.

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Atrocities]

Timestone you use 3ds Max?

[Raging Deadstar]

Looking at that Cantina image again I can just picture two ships in the background exchanging weapons fire because one forgot to indicate http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Atrocities]

Star-Rage -

[geoschmo]

David, that Cantina picture is cool, but it's all wrong. Where's the 50 foot dinosaur in the parking lot for one thing. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[David E. Gervais]

Just for you Geo, I made this update... (well, for the fun of it too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif )

Phong's Cantina Update (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/322420-Shipyard1.jpg)

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Atrocities]

David you must post this latest Version to Renderosity and other. IT IS GREAT>

[geoschmo]

ROFL David. Only, maybe he (Wasn't his name Barney?)would have a problem being out in the vacuum like that? Maybe put one of those fishbowl space helmets like in the old-timey space cartoons. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Fyron]

Nah, it was Barry.

[Renegade 13]

Raging Deadstar said:
...I always travelled in a Large Transport with my cargo... You have any idea how potent 29 cargo bays smell after storing alcohol for several months http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif



Bah, that's nothing! Wait till you smell the 29 cargo bays when a handful of drunks get into them for the length of your several months....Just imagine the smell of stale alcohol, sweaty dirty drunk, puke, old puke, rotting puke, decaying puke, and puke-so-old-it's-powdered-into-a-dust-like-substance-that-clogs-your-nose-with-foulness!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[David E. Gervais]

Geo, I tried placing a fishbowl type glass helmet on him, but it was virtually invisible due to the glare of the sun behind him. So I removed it, heck, if you couldn't see it anyways, then there was no point in having it. Besides, SE is a high tech universe, Barry could have some sort of oxigen generating implant that serves that same function as a helmet. hmmm, maybe I should make a bio-implant component just to back up this theory http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif Nah, it's the thought that counts.

Anyway, I'm glad you all like this latest edition of the Phong's Cantina Rendering.

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Timstone]

AT:
Yup, I use 3ds max 7. Last month I bought a full Version. Not very cheap I might add.
I use it to render... when I'm capable enough to render something the right way. I can do planets, those are second nature to me, but components are other things. They require an other approach.
I use SolidWorks 2005 to make my models in. I use a *ahum* legal Version of Okino to export my models. I've discovered that Okino produces very good exported models.

David:
Thanks for the advise. The system in Bryce is more or less the same as in max 7. But like you said, the system in max 7 offers a thousand fold more options to mess up.
If your friend uses max 7 to model things with I declare him a lunatic. He should use Lightwave, much more user friendly. Althoug the two programs are almost the same when you're modeling faces (NURBS and splines).
I want to use Lightwave too, but I simply don't have the time for it.
That's also a reason I want to change my carreer. I would like to do more with my modeling skills. Any suggestions on where to search?

Edit:
David:
Great pic! I love what you've done with Barry. Now all we need is a neon sign outside and a rotating Phong head on the top of The Cantina. Hehehe....

[Raging Deadstar]

Renegade 13 said:
Just imagine the smell of stale alcohol, sweaty dirty drunk, puke, old puke, rotting puke, decaying puke, and puke-so-old-it's-powdered-into-a-dust-like-substance-that-clogs-your-nose-with-foulness!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif



Leave Puke out of this http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Atrocities]

Timstone

I would love to ask you a few questions about the program, like how do you import X. format - what plug in you use and how much is costs.

How easy was it for you to learn to use?
How do you map textures onto surfaces?

Things like that. Generally I just need some incuragement that I can use it without killing myself.

Thanks.

[Timstone]

.X export/import:
To export to .X format I use this (http://www.andytather.co.uk/Panda/directxmax.htm).
To import .X I use my le*ahum*al Version of Okino NuGraf.

Ease of learning:
It is a horrible program to learn. Like David said, it has a learning curve like the slope of mt. Everest and the Babylon Tower combined.
You have to spend quite some time with the program to learn it. Especially the modeling stuff is ver, very complex comapred to SolidWorks. ALso there are tons and tons of options to mess around with, this can be very confusing.

Mapping textures on surfaces:
Or you let the program do it, or you take the long route.
When you let the program do it, you end up with very uncool textures (when you apply them to a very complex model). The positive side is that you have full control over the other options, like bumpmapping, opacity, reflection, etc..
When you do UVW mapping, you can control the whole process yourself. It's a great way of doing things, you can place the texture right where you want it. I must admit I haven't played around with UVW mapping enough to point out weaknesses or particular strengths compared to the other method.


In one sentence:
It's expensive, it's hard to learn, but when you can handle it you can make magic.