Screenies!

[Nerfix]

Scorpion men!

[Kristoffer O]

> "The Scorpion Man is the most frightening beast that wanders in the desert. It is said that when a Scorpion Man looks at a mountain, the mountain shivers in fear."

Hmm, that sounds like an old description. I'd better take a look.

[Endoperez]

Kristoffer O said:
> "The Scorpion Man is the most frightening beast that wanders in the desert. It is said that when a Scorpion Man looks at a mountain, the mountain shivers in fear."

Hmm, that sounds like an old description. I'd better take a look.



It's the spell's desription.

[Kristoffer O]

Aha. I guess the Gilgamesh reference is lost in the spell then. Pity.

[Nerfix]

Show uuuuus, or I will post eldritch horrors on this thread.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Show uuuuus, or I will post eldritch horrors on this thread.



Uuuuus? I don't know him. Is he a Caveman? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif


One vote for Devourer, one vote for Scorpion Man, and one of you has already confessed of hogging up all the requests. I'd better wait for few more opinions now. In fact, I could go to sleep and give everyone a fair chance of vote.

BTW, Nature has interesting summons nowadays. You know Swarm, right? Did you notice the strange new creature on the very end of the Dom2 unit lists? I'll give you two more hints: 2 gems and 70+ effects.
Also, was there a 100-animal version of Summon Animals in Dom2?

[Nerfix]

Hmm, no.

[JaydedOne]

I say you post both the scorpion man AND the Devourer. It's Wednesday. Splurge a little. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:
I say you post both the scorpion man AND the Devourer. It's Wednesday. Splurge a little. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



I'm tempted to wait an hour and tell you that it's Thursday.

[Nerfix]

Ok I change my vote to Devourer. I expect to see something new here when I come back from shower or I'll post my RO pics here.

[JaydedOne]

Well, if you DO wait an hour, then that'll mean that you've posted NO screenshots for Thursday. Meaning you could easily kick off the day by posting TWO shots. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Endoperez]

<font color="purple"> Zzzzzz </font>

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445253-temp.jpg

[JaydedOne]

If that's the last post for the night, you're a cruel man.

[Meglobob]

Enjoying those screenshots of Dom3. Each one, makes me want the game more! Keep up the good work.

I am going to vote for the Devourer too, just so u show it to us... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

As someone who is new and just discovering the power of summon spells, I would love to see more on the 100 animal version of animal summon and 70+ effects for 2 gems!

[BigJMoney]

Devourerer or Scorpion Man, I could not care less for, but I am curious about the Warrior Smith in EA Ulm when you get around to it. I'd like to compare them to the other smitties.

=$=

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:
<font color="purple"> Zzzzzz </font>

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445253-temp.jpg



Ahahha! Nice little spell. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Shmonk]

Ok, I'll make a request, something EA, commander type, little magic skills with potential thug capability (any race).

[quantum_mechani]

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/5577/lordzu9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Cainehill]

Kristoffer O said:
Aha. I guess the Gilgamesh reference is lost in the spell then. Pity.



Mmm, Gilgamesh, Enkidu, Babylonian or was it Sumerian mythology? ( Weren't Babylonian &amp; Mithraism based on Sumerian? )

Hmmm. Was the Visitor the spell that had a Gilgamesh reference? Only one I noticed that might've been it, but that concept comes up pretty often in legend/myth/SF.

[Endoperez]

Cainehill said:
Mmm, Gilgamesh, Enkidu, Babylonian or was it Sumerian mythology? ( Weren't Babylonian &amp; Mithraism based on Sumerian? )

Hmmm. Was the Visitor the spell that had a Gilgamesh reference? Only one I noticed that might've been it, but that concept comes up pretty often in legend/myth/SF.



I don't know about the myth, but I thought the spell in question was Scorpion Men.

Thanks, Meglobob! One Devourer of Souls coming in!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445366-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

BigJMoney said:
Devourerer or Scorpion Man, I could not care less for, but I am curious about the Warrior Smith in EA Ulm when you get around to it. I'd like to compare them to the other smitties.



Here's one Warrior Smith, I'll post a Caelian Ice Crafter in a minute.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445367-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

An Ice Crafter coming up. They are available from MA onward. I'm not sure if they were intentionally left out from EA, but it's hard to know with some of these things. Yes, the Palace of the Eagle Kings was an Air site, and the Citadel of Frozen Crystal was only built for MA, so I quess there wouldn't have been a use for Ice Crafters before that, but there must've been some crafters of ice in EA... They could've been Spire Horn Seraphs, or the common Seraphs, or maybe an inventive Eagle King...

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445370-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

And here's mr Master Smith himself. Sadly, he wasn't updated for Dom3. Compared to Warrior Smiths, he's just a faceless hammerman. Well, other than the unchanged graphics, I rather like the change.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445371-temp.jpg

[Taqwus]

Hmmmmm. What's the eye icon I've been seeing in a few screens?

[Endoperez]

Taqwus said:
Hmmmmm. What's the eye icon I've been seeing in a few screens?



If the center of the eye is black it's Darkvision. The unit operates just as well under Darkness, and in Cave Cities, and being underwater might also give the penalties. If the center is white, the unit is blind, and doesn't use its sight to orient itself, and is unaffected by darkness and by loss of eyes and other things like that.

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:


http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445366-temp.jpg




Ah nice looking sprite. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Endoperez]

DominionsFan said:
Ah nice looking sprite. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif



All the JPG screenshots lose surprising amount of detail. You did notice when I claimed that the image size had been doubled again, didn't you? All the fantastic sprites like this one are the reason.
EDIT:
In case someone DIDN'T notice, the resolution has stayed the same. The units look much better, but the tools haven't changed. That means we've got one extremely talented artist working for the game!

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

DominionsFan said:
Ah nice looking sprite. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif



All the JPG screenshots lose surprising amount of detail. You did notice when I claimed that the image size had been doubled again, didn't you? All the fantastic sprites like this one are the reason.



Endo what is the biggest allowed sprite size in Doms 3.? I thought that 128x128, or is it 256x256? That would be fantastic.

[Endoperez]

DominionsFan said:Endo what is the biggest allowed sprite size in Doms 3.? I thought that 128x128, or is it 256x256? That would be fantastic.



128x128

That's what the modding manual states, and since the boundaries haven't changed, I'd think that 256x256 creatures couldn't fit on the description window. Imagine something like the Devourer of Souls, but twice as big.

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

DominionsFan said:Endo what is the biggest allowed sprite size in Doms 3.? I thought that 128x128, or is it 256x256? That would be fantastic.



128x128

That's what the modding manual states, and since the boundaries haven't changed, I'd think that 256x256 creatures couldn't fit on the description window. Imagine something like the Devourer of Souls, but twice as big.



Yeah, I guess that 256x256 would be a bit too much.

[Nerfix]

Interesting stuff.

[Agrajag]

Endoperez said:
I'll have to give you something non-national. I hope Hidden in Snow, WWWD and 55 gems for a full-fledged tribe of super-Ötzis, is cool enough for you.


That's really cool, one unit I'd be looking forward too, thanks!

So... How about something high up in Conjuration and takes fire gems? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif
Oh, and the Scorpion Man sounds kind of like a reference to Chuck Norris http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Nerfix]

Agrajag said:Oh, and the Scorpion Man sounds kind of like a reference to Chuck Norris http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Mountains better be afraid of Chuck Norris.

[Meglobob]

Endoperez said:
Thanks, Meglobob! One Devourer of Souls coming in!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445366-temp.jpg



Wow! I am currently playing C'tis (my favourite nation so far), my god needs a pet, the devourer would do nicely. I think I would call him 'fluffy', then again, perhaps not... :grin

Cheers.

[Nerfix]

Sorry, but that is Devourer of Souls. Fluffy is a Destroyer of Worlds. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[BigJMoney]

Interesting that the master smith gets a 10% chance to be exceptional; even a 5% chance to get Astral or Air magic. "Smithing has become equivalent of making a sacrifice to the Lord"... I wonder if that's just flavor text.

=$=

[Fate]

Gilgamesh is a Hittite (?) legend, the first legend ever recorded (on stone tablets in cuneiform "triangle" alphabet). Gilgamesh had a close friend (I forgot his name) who died, so Gilgamesh (who was 1/2 deity, like Hercules, except not immortal) went to heaven to see if he could get his friend back/attain immortality (he failed both).

At the gate is two "Scorpion Men" who stand guard over heaven, and who's glance alone is enough to kill any mortal (Gilgamesh survived because he had some heavenly blood). They were some pretty nasty pieces of work. No wonder the mountains shudder.

[JaydedOne]

So, Endo... Scorpion men perhaps? Any changes at all to Oceania?

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:
So, Endo... Scorpion men perhaps? Any changes at all to Oceania?



The shapechangers, the national spells, the other spells, the whole different era... Quite a bit. Nothing that can't wait, of course. I'd have to test and see how things were like in that Dom2 mod, though, and thus posting pics would be a bit more complicated. I'll post some, though, if no one else has any other (non-Scorpion Men -related http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif) ideas.

[JaydedOne]

How about, of all things, any cool new mercenary leaders or unit-types? I'd love to see a surprise or two there.

[thejeff]

Or some of the new indy types? Anything interesting there?

[Nerfix]

Show us your Toad Tribes.

[Endoperez]

thejeff said:
Or some of the new indy types? Anything interesting there?



Toad Tribe, for one. And the Jaguar Tribe. And Wolf Tribe, and Deer Tribe, and Bear Tribe. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif Those are all tribes I can remember at the moment (I don't think Vanaras were named Monkey Tribe, but there are of course some poptypes for the new races). And of course, the indeps are categorized by the ages. The animal and amazon tribes are more common in the earlier times, good armor becomes common in later ages, etc. There could be Cavemen, too, but they'd have to be EA only, as I haven't seem them yet. Or then they're just really rare in later ages.

Of course, the indy mages lost most of their power, so while those tribal mages offer easy access to very low-level Nature magic, getting other types is much more rare. Compared to a N1H1 Druid, N1 with a 10% chance for something else isn't that bad, but it's much less than we were used to. Or you are used to. Any way, in a month it'll be the past tense for all of us.

P.S. I almost wrote "Beer Tribe" in there. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[thejeff]

With the loss of Indy mage power, are sages still around?
Weak, but diverse, and there seems to be an attempt to reduce access to that diversity.

[Endoperez]

thejeff said:
With the loss of Indy mage power, are sages still around?
Weak, but diverse, and there seems to be an attempt to reduce access to that diversity.



Sages are still around, in all their S1 glory. Other than they, they are their old selves. A bit more noticeably old than before, but that's not important, is it? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[JaydedOne]

I'll bump the question about new mercenaries. Any interesting ones?

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:
I'll bump the question about new mercenaries. Any interesting ones?



I don't remember any. As with Dom2, I'd expect that there are new merc groups for various new nations. You know, like there was the Green Horde of Tien Chi cavalry. Probably not for all, because e.g. Agarthans seem to be pretty scarce during all three ages.

[Caduceus]

Endoperez said:
P.S. I almost wrote "Beer Tribe" in there. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif



(Imitates Homer Simpson)
Mmmm... Beer Tribes... /threads/images/Graemlins/Barrel.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/beerglass.gif /threads/images/Graemlins/Barrel.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/beerglass.gif

[Cainehill]

Any items that prevent or slow down aging on the wielder?

[st.patrik]

yes, several http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[DominionsFan]

st.patrik said:
yes, several http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



Nice. Btw speaking about this, [maybe this was mentioned already but I missed it then..] are there any spells, that can slow down aging?..or any spells what can make the targeted unit younger? [example: rejuvenation]

[Endoperez]

DominionsFan said:

st.patrik said:
yes, several http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



Nice. Btw speaking about this, [maybe this was mentioned already but I missed it then..] are there any spells, that can slow down aging?..or any spells what can make the targeted unit younger? [example: rejuvenation]



Pretty good example.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/445883-temp.jpg

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

DominionsFan said:

st.patrik said:
yes, several http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



Nice. Btw speaking about this, [maybe this was mentioned already but I missed it then..] are there any spells, that can slow down aging?..or any spells what can make the targeted unit younger? [example: rejuvenation]



Pretty good example.



Oh haha, so there is a spell called rejuvenation. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Nice! Thanks for the info Endo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Endoperez]

DominionsFan said:Oh haha, so there is a spell called rejuvenation. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Nice! Thanks for the info Endo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif



The one time I don't double-check the post... I upload a wrong pic, and don't remember to show it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

See my above post.

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

DominionsFan said:Oh haha, so there is a spell called rejuvenation. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Nice! Thanks for the info Endo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif



The one time I don't double-check the post... I upload a wrong pic, and don't remember to show it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

See my above post.



Ah thx for the screenie!
Nice little blood spell. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[Nerfix]

Indeed. It's 100% Ebil.

[Wick]

I havn't seen any screenshots of Sauromantia or any hints of the difference between EA and MA Pangaea. Please?

[Endoperez]

Wick said:
I havn't seen any screenshots of Sauromantia or any hints of the difference between EA and MA Pangaea. Please?



Sauromatia: archers, horse archers, poisoned arrows... all with composite bows. Further, all of this is in Early Age, where heavy armor is very rare. A tribe of Jade Amazons has joined forces with the nation in the past, and they had a great impact on the Sauromatian society. Sauromatia uses three kind of mounts: most use horses, Jade Amazons use their lizards, and cannibalistic tribe of Androphags ride Serpents Pythium will use on later times. They can also recruit Hydras. They have access to all sorcery paths and Water, but Water and Astral are very weak.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446219-temp.jpg

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

Wick said:
I havn't seen any screenshots of Sauromantia or any hints of the difference between EA and MA Pangaea. Please?



Sauromatia: archers, horse archers, poisoned arrows... all with composite bows. Further, all of this is in Early Age, where heavy armor is very rare. A tribe of Jade Amazons has joined forces with the nation in the past, and they had a great impact on the Sauromatian society. Sauromatia uses three kind of mounts: most use horses, Jade Amazons use their lizards, and cannibalistic tribe of Androphags ride Serpents Pythium will use on later times. They can also recruit Hydras. They have access to all sorcery paths and Water, but Water and Astral are very weak.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446219-temp.jpg



Very interesting. I have a Pythium deja vu. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Endoperez]

DominionsFan said:Very interesting. I have a Pythium deja vu. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif



One of Sauromatia's starting sites is Swamps of Pythia... Pythium is later founded to the same area. Serpent mounts and Battle Vestals are probably the last bits of Sauromatian culture left in Pythium. No cannibalism, no man-flaying, no standards made of human skins... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

DominionsFan said:Very interesting. I have a Pythium deja vu. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif



One of Sauromatia's starting sites is Swamps of Pythia... Pythium is later founded to the same area. Serpent mounts and Battle Vestals are probably the last bits of Sauromatian culture left in Pythium. No cannibalism, no man-flaying, no standards made of human skins... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif



Ah I see. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

PS.

My next wallpaper will be the Pythium theme. Pythium fans.. prepare your desktops! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[JaydedOne]

You know what, I'm easy.

Just show me something cool and undead. Or something big and scary. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:
You know what, I'm easy.

Just show me something cool and undead. Or something big and scary. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



I'm tired. I'll try to post some Oceania tomorrow, but as for now, you'll just get the first new, updated Doom Horror. Agon is the one you lot have already met.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446328-temp.jpg

Weapons (all are magical):
Soul Leech: AN AoE life drain, MR negates, 0 damage (+str)
Life Drain: AN life drain, 0 dmg
Consume Soul: Death, MR negates
Astral Claw: AN, 0 dmg, increases Horror Mark
Curse Luck: special AoE something, length 4 so allows for repel. I don't know what it does.

Fear has changed. Agon still has Fear (+15). It's scary.

[Nerfix]

Ohhh boy. But do the different Doom Horrors look different from each other?

[Wick]

Very cool! I'm guessing Sarmatia, just across the Black Sea from Byzantium (but almost a thousand years too early for Constantinople), provided the inspiration for both the name and the amazons. I will be playing them.

I'm noticing that while a Scale Mail Hauberk and Helmet used to be 9+1=10, a Scale Mail Cuirass and Helmet used to be 7+1=8, and Scale Mail Hauberk, Full Helmet, and Round Shield would have been 9+2+3=14 they are now 12, 11, 13 (with Iron Caps, a Half Helmet, and a Shield).

If shields aren't added to protection, what do they do? Just add to defense or is there a block mechanism?

I've read that helmets are needed to protect the head, is that just for affliction checks or is there an actual hit location system?

As long as I'm being greedy, I'd still like to see something representative of the difference between EA &amp; MA Pangaea. I do really appreciate your attitude, I'd also appreciate your work but you claimed it was easy!

[Endoperez]

Wick said:
Very cool! I'm guessing Sarmatia, just across the Black Sea from Byzantium (but almost a thousand years too early for Constantinople), provided the inspiration for both the name and the amazons. I will be playing them.

I'm noticing that while a Scale Mail Hauberk and Helmet used to be 9+1=10, a Scale Mail Cuirass and Helmet used to be 7+1=8, and Scale Mail Hauberk, Full Helmet, and Round Shield would have been 9+2+3=14 they are now 12, 11, 13 (with Iron Caps, a Half Helmet, and a Shield).

If shields aren't added to protection, what do they do? Just add to defense or is there a block mechanism?

I've read that helmets are needed to protect the head, is that just for affliction checks or is there an actual hit location system?



Very good! In the whole thread, you're the first to comment that! Here, these are the spesifics of
1) Sauromatian Cataphract's protection
2) defense and
3) Shield descriptions.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446339-temp.jpg

Shield in short:
Shield has a parry value. If your shield's parry value made the difference between a hit and a miss, your protection is increased by the shield's protection. Even a Buckler on a def ~10 units makes a huge difference. Bandar Warriors armed with maces and bucklers are much better in melee than Bandar Archers with maces and (long? composite?) bows.



As long as I'm being greedy, I'd still like to see something representative of the difference between EA &amp; MA Pangaea. I do really appreciate your attitude, I'd also appreciate your work but you claimed it was easy!



I mentioned EA Pan's spesific paths in a different thread, but I quess I could post few more pics as well. The main difference is that EA Panii have E1N4B1, a 100%EB random and a 10%ENB random. That s, they always have either E2 or B2, and sometimes one of their paths is further increased by one.

[JaydedOne]

Holy cow. I'd love to know the mechanics on what determines a head vs. a body hit. And a parry stat besides? I had no idea that they'd added that kind of complexity to the combat system.

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:Holy cow.



Besides the Great White and Great Black, I haven't seen any. It'd fit the monkey people, though. Also:


Have you heard the story about the crusading bull? It granted the remission of sins.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif




I'd love to know the mechanics on what determines a head vs. a body hit. And a parry stat besides? I had no idea that they'd added that kind of complexity to the combat system.


On Head vs Body: size, perhaps mounted status even further, perhaps weapon length; I don't know, I'm not the manual guy.
For shields, see the edited post above.

[Wick]

So instead of 3 pro and 2 def a shield is now providing just net 3 def -- unless the attacker has a Gate Cleaver, in which case the shield is just in the way? I'm happy with the concept but the practice seems to make shields, the most historically important piece of armor, less important. Unless the parry is the part applied against arrows? So my shield now has a better chance of intercepting that Gift of Heaven? I could definately like this.

Did you hear what the Hoburg Champion said to the dwarf who cast Gifts of Heaven at him? "I'm flattered."

Hey, I bet routing troops don't get to parry. Troops attacked from behind probably still do?

[Nerfix]

Well, I sure do hope the shields parry arrows!

[Wick]

Regarding the head to body ratio, it should be weighted 1:4 to make the 17 &amp; 12 = 13. Hoever, with rounding anything from 1:3 to 1:9 works so...

[Wick]

If it weren't for cursed luck I'd have no luck at all, doom, gloom, and Agon-y on me!

Sorry, I apologize, I didn't mean it, it was my evil twin.

[quantum_mechani]

Trust me, shields are extremely important, lightly armoured troops without them can get decimated by archers.

[Endoperez]

quantum_mechani said:
Trust me, shields are extremely important, lightly armoured troops without them can get decimated by archers.



Also, as I said, even a Buckler makes a huge difference. Just try Bandar Log or Patala, and try Bandar Warriors against Bandar Archers, or the Vanara Chakram Throwers against mace-and-buckler wielding Vanara. I think the latter are Vanara Warriors, but I'm not sure.

[Fate]

So let me see if I have the shields correct. Say that unit A has 10 defense (not including the shield), and 12 with the shield.

Unit B attacks unit A and has 5 attack and rolls a 6 (for 11). That might miss, except that instead it goes to a normal attack + the shield defense. So, if unit A had 8 protection, they would as if they had 10?

But, if unit B rolled an 8 they would score a 13 and bypass the shield, thereby striking at onle 8 protection?

Do shields still give protection (or is it just this defense system now)?

[Wick]

Close, but per Endoperez's description above, if the parry makes the difference then the entire protection of the shield is added. So 15 protection, not just 2.

So shields are less useful in melee but better against missiles. Which, considering the likely importance of sacred troops who mostly don't have shields, makes combined arms more attractive.

If there's really no interesting differences between EA &amp; MA Pangaea, then how about something revealing how Barbarian Kings now has a chance?

[BigJMoney]

Guys, there are two pretty apparent reasons why this mechanic was added when you think of the implications. #1 It means that, regardless of their defend or parry value, shields no longer provide any bonus whatsoever against Armor Penetrating attacks; in fact, most shields will be a handicap. This is a good thing. #2 It means that Armor Piercing attacks are not quite as lethal against a shield wielding opponent. I think this is also a good thing.

There are probably more implications, but so far, I really like it. I bet flails versus shields has been altered too. If I had to make a guess, I'd say that flails simply don't allow the parry bonus, thus negating the parry, too.

Just to go ahead and clarify things, I think we should use the term "shield hit(s)" for when someone's defense roll successfully lands in that parry zone. Ie. When someone parries with a shield, they take a shield hit, which is an attack that must beat Protection + Protection, Shield. Example: Using the unit above, when he takes a normal hit (to the body) he has protection 12. When he takes a shield hit, he has protection 27. For now, I'm going to assume missile weapons also have to beat this protection. In a way it makes sense, but it also sounds like missile troops will be pretty useless against shielded enemies.

@Endo
It seems like there could be other items/weapons that will add parry bonuses as well. Have you seen anything like this? Would these same weapons then also have a "Protection, Parry" or does it just use the weapon's attack bonus for this?

=$=

[Daynarr]

Shields work nice in game. They feel different, their presence is felt (most notably when under archer fire) but they aren't overpowered.

[BigJMoney]

I hope all missile projectiles in the game were slightly increased in effectivity, or else this new shield protection functionality will only mean a nerf across the board for every projectile in the game. Well, all things will be worked out through patches, eventually.

=$=

[Wick]

Against AP attacks the shield still has 15/2= 7.5 protection. That's seriously useful. It's against armor negating attacks that shields are a handicap.

Also, from v2.88: "* Flail and morningstar new mechanic (+2 att vs shields)"

[Endoperez]

EA Pangaea recruit screen. Few new units but they're mainly just unarmoured versions of old stuff. As said above, Panii are E1N4B1, always have either E2 or B2, and have a chance of increasing any one of their paths further.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446504-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

Barbarian Kings... You really make good choices! 3 new caster-types for Barbarian Kings, with strange combinations of Death and other paths, and all of them old. I won't show them, of course. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

But any way, here you have an Ancestor Vessel. Howling Bow is a Composite Bow with a Lesser Fear effect.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446507-temp.jpg

[Nerfix]

Looks very cool. I wonder what sort of a bless would be best for them. Perhaps fire if it aplies to missile weapons too...

Or Water.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Looks very cool. I wonder what sort of a bless would be best for them. Perhaps fire if it aplies to missile weapons too...

Or Water.



Fire is melee only. Water would give them more ranged attacks as well, so that could work. Fire or blood would work for increased attack and/or strength, which would affect all their attacks. Death would make them cause more afflictions, which would give them a use as slightly anti-SC, or at least anti-thug, force.

[Nerfix]

More afflictons? so That's the mysterious "Death Weapon" effect. What does lvl 9 death bless do?

Water/Death could work.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
More afflictons? so That's the mysterious "Death Weapon" effect. What does lvl 9 death bless do?

Water/Death could work.



Death 9: some AN damage. I don't know the details, either; I'm not the manual guy. I don't remember what the icon and its description tell of the Death 9 effect, either. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[okiN]

Wait, so Death bless has been changed and it causes afflictions instead of fear?

[Endoperez]

okiN said:
Wait, so Death bless has been changed and it causes afflictions instead of fear?



Yes. Morale system was redone, and Death bless was changed.
http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446537-temp.jpg

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

quantum_mechani said:
Trust me, shields are extremely important, lightly armoured troops without them can get decimated by archers.



Also, as I said, even a Buckler makes a huge difference. Just try Bandar Log or Patala, and try Bandar Warriors against Bandar Archers, or the Vanara Chakram Throwers against mace-and-buckler wielding Vanara. I think the latter are Vanara Warriors, but I'm not sure.



Awesome. Light armoured troops with shields will have a chance to survive against archers now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[PDF]

Endoperez said:

okiN said:
Wait, so Death bless has been changed and it causes afflictions instead of fear?



Yes. Morale system was redone, and Death bless was changed.
http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446537-temp.jpg



Note also how Nature bless has changed ! In fact the effects have been swapped : now you get Regen at N4 and berserk at N9. Rather weird balance-wise IMHO (N4 becomes a no-brainer and N9 useless...)

[Nerfix]

The AN damage for Death 9 is fitting, but it also make fire less unique in the game. I would rather rather seen some more, hmm, creative effect.

As for Berzerk, it's nott useless, it's just useful in certain situations. And 5% regeneration is too small to be a real no-brainer.

[PDF]

Nerfix said:
The AN damage for Death 9 is fitting, but it also make fire less unique in the game. I would rather rather seen some more, hmm, creative effect.

As for Berzerk, it's nott useless, it's just useful in certain situations. And 5% regeneration is too small to be a real no-brainer.



Yeah I was putting it too abruptly : Berserk at N9 is not "useless", N9 it's just too big an investment for a Berserk2 effect.
As for 5% regen it's rather powerful on any thug-like sacred, such as Neifels, Agarthan Ancients, Cel Soldiers or even Demonbreds or such. This nearly make them immune to afflictions and diseases, and even 2 hp/turn is still very useful for creatures that are usually not killed in one blow : on a 10 turn battle they get +20 hp ...

[Nerfix]

I'm not sure if +5% Regeneration is enough to save them disease and afflictions. 4 Nature can be a good investement, no doubt about that, but not everybody has troops that will benefit from it or those that benefit from it might find better options.

But perhaps Nature 4 has opened more strategies. And that is good.

[Endoperez]

PDF said:
As for 5% regen it's rather powerful on any thug-like sacred, such as Neifels, Agarthan Ancients, Cel Soldiers or even Demonbreds or such. This nearly make them immune to afflictions and diseases, and even 2 hp/turn is still very useful for creatures that are usually not killed in one blow : on a 10 turn battle they get +20 hp ...



Regeneration isn't as good at preventing afflictions as it used to be. Regeneration also has the limit of not rising hp of the creature above his base hp; he won't heal until he's already hurt. Regeneration can make a tough unit who is goot at surviving on his own (e.g. a Niefel Giant) tougher to kill, but won't make a tough unit with low defense and low-to-mediocre (on Dom2 standards) protection invlunerable.

Also, Berserk is now useful in making the units and commanders unroutable. Commanders can now rout even before all units are dead, and often will.

[PDF]

Endoperez,
Even with the changes you mention, I can't see how investment in N9 blessing can be justified for just Berserk2... As you said morale/rout rules have changed, and in fact normal units rather stand better than before!

[Endoperez]

PDF said:
Endoperez,
Even with the changes you mention, I can't see how investment in N9 blessing can be justified for just Berserk2... As you said morale/rout rules have changed, and in fact normal units rather stand better than before!



I'm not an expert on blesses. Berserk isn't as important as regeneration, but I might go for Berserk if I already wanted high Regeneration. It probably won't be as good as the best level 9 blesses, though.

[Kristoffer O]

I can't remember all reasons for the switch of regen - berserk. I'll try to remember some.

Niefelheim and many other nations always had nature 9 blessing. That didn't feel right. Especially when there are new nations with big sacred summonables.

Now berserk might seem unattractive, but the increasing effect of regen might compensate so that people takes higher lvl nature at times.

It feels a bit strange that the rather magical powers of regeneration is easier to get than common battle rage. So this is more of a balance change then a thematic change and I'm not entirely fond of it. It works, but I can feel a bit annoyed at times.

I felt more concerned with thematically boring pretenders. It would not sit well with me if every pretender of Yomi took Nature 9 to make the Dai Oni regenerate. Few variations on pretender design combined with unthematic gods is not attractive. I do like unthematic gods, but not if they are always the same.

[PDF]

@Kristoffer,
Sure the N9-frenzy for Niefelheim was a boring "exploit"/combo.
Problem is that now Niefelheim and Yomi will take N4-6, which is quite less costly...
And berserk was in fact a liability sometimes (for sacred mages !), not getting it at N4 will just make the choice even more obvious...
Personnally I would have kept Berserk at N4, get rid of regen at N9 and given Recuperation + some Reinvigoration instead.
I've always found strange that Reinvigoration was an Earth bless effect (plus the E9 bless is not spectacular...) : for Earth having some protection effect at E4 and "weapon of sharpness" (AP weapon) at E9 would have been cool ...

Just my 0.02

[Nerfix]

Besides the idea of Dai Onis trampling forth led by an Earth Mother is pretty terrifying in a completely wrong way.

[Nerfix]

Actually, PDF has a good point. Now many people will just pick Earth Mothers is with E9/N4 or N6 and save some points.

Recuperation wouldn't work for a bless effect since it does it's thing on the overland map. Reinvigoration + Regeneration at the highest level could have worked...or then we would have reinvigorated Niefel jotuns trampling around.

As for Earth, Earthpower gives reinvigoration, but I do agree that +4 protection is not much to cheer about. It's helpful but not worth 9 levels in Earth. Considering Earth doesn't have all that much going for it the bless also feels a bit "meh". It is helpful, but 9 in Earth isn't necessarily worth it.

I don't know what Earth 9 should have given. Weapons of Sharpness would have been, well, stupendously powerful.

[PDF]

Nerfix,
You're right about Recuperation, it's not a combat effect, I didn't think of it ! Well I've to find a new idea .. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Weapons of Sharpness as E9 bless doesn't look more powerful than Fire weapons (F9) or Death weapons (D9), why do you thonk so ?

[Manuk]

Niefelheim giants are expensive, they better be good!

[JaydedOne]

Perhaps we should start a new topic for discussions of blessings and their balance? In fact, I think I will...

[Nerfix]

PDF said:Weapons of Sharpness as E9 bless doesn't look more powerful than Fire weapons (F9) or Death weapons (D9), why do you thonk so ?

WoS scales up with the power of the blessed unit. You could slap weapons with high damage (Demon Bane, Moon Blade, Halberds of Strenght) on sacred commanders and have them do obscene amounts of AP damage.

[Twan]

Personnally I like regeneration at nature 4, but I think having a regeneration bless is more balanced if you can't have regen without berserking (your sacred troops regenerate but won't survive a defeat in most cases, and your sacred mages die often after a berserking crisis).

Why not giving regen + berserking (0) at nature 4, then for example a 80% poison resistance at nature 9 ? (after all air 9 just give a 80% resist). Nature 4 won't be a no brainer in this case, after seeing two or three times their berserk prophet or best sacred mage charge alone after recieving one arrow, players won't use nature 4 in all games.

[WraithLord]

Kristoffer O said:
I can't remember all reasons for the switch of regen - berserk. I'll try to remember some.

Niefelheim and many other nations always had nature 9 blessing. That didn't feel right. Especially when there are new nations with big sacred summonables.

Now berserk might seem unattractive, but the increasing effect of regen might compensate so that people takes higher lvl nature at times.

It feels a bit strange that the rather magical powers of regeneration is easier to get than common battle rage. So this is more of a balance change then a thematic change and I'm not entirely fond of it. It works, but I can feel a bit annoyed at times.

I felt more concerned with thematically boring pretenders. It would not sit well with me if every pretender of Yomi took Nature 9 to make the Dai Oni regenerate. Few variations on pretender design combined with unthematic gods is not attractive. I do like unthematic gods, but not if they are always the same.



I agree it does feel less thematic. Maybe its possible to change this so that with regen at N9 also comes a vulnerability, like fire prot -50 (this will serve the Niefel giants quite well I suppose http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif )

[Endoperez]

Nerfix expressed sadness about the fact that Nagas are no longer available on pretender creation. This is due to the fact that naga exist as a recruitable race in LA Patala (late era monkeys), which is rather limiting for even the greatest specimens of their race. Golden Naga is gone, or at least I haven't yet noticed her anywhere, but there are few new hybrid creatures, and I have had this strangest feeling of having met some of them before...

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446648-temp.jpg

The feeling is rather disconcerting, especially in her case, as I'm sure I could never forget such a meeting.

[JaydedOne]

Under her special abilities, is that weird little green/black icon the indicator for her +lamias ability or is it something else? It's not ringing any bells.

She's a nice little pretender. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Nerfix]

Awesome.

I believe that the dark green icon is icon for Poison Cloud.

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:
Under her special abilities, is that weird little green/black icon the indicator for her +lamias ability or is it something else? It's not ringing any bells.



Indeed, it's poison breath/aura. There were few "accidents", so a new icon was added.


She's a nice little pretender. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



Not so little any more. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[BigJMoney]

Wow, the D9 blessing was changed. How about B9? I sure hope that was changed...

=$=

[JaydedOne]

Does size factor into combat calculations at all? I can't recall if that's the case either. If it does, I know there's already a ton of information on unit screens, but I'd love to see size indicated somewhere. Hey, it might be redundant with the icon, but still, I like numbers. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

I think I promised some Late Age Arco a while ago.

A Great Conqueror left forth from Arcoscephale... and died. Astrologers were killed because they weren't good enough to keep him alive. Ancient Sibyl seeresses have come to guide the kingdom in these new times. They are skilled in Astral and Nature, and can get Death via randoms. Much has stayed the same (Hoplites, Hypaspists, Heart Companions, Priestesses), but there are few new things.

Finally, some cavalry:
http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446665-temp.jpg

[Nerfix]

Interesting stuff. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

A new order of soldiers is being formed. An interesting combination of Hoplites and Hypaspists, or perhaps Peltasts and Hoplites, or perhaps they are something completely new.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446672-temp.jpg

To answer a question asked elsewhere: their spears have a counter-balance. See, there's metal in both ends of that spear!

[Endoperez]

I'm sure you aren't interested in the latest development of armored elephants or gorillas clad in cerulean blue, so I'll give you a pointer to the mystic power the Sibyls wield:

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446674-temp.jpg

This is their whole starting gem income, BTW. In Late Age, 4 is the new 5! It's hard to argue with the Magistrates of Man: if a Magister of Mathematics grows bored with you, he'll call the Magister of Theology to "purge" the heretic! It's hard to argue with inquisition.

[JaydedOne]

*chuckle* Way to tease, Endo. You're doing a great job of keeping us interested. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Nerfix]

In Late Era Man is the new Marignon? Ah well, it's only a five letter difference.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
In Late Era Man is the new Marignon? Ah well, it's only a five letter difference.



Not exactly. There are Magister, the scout-engineer-spies who are, pretty often but not always, mages of some kind. Then there are the Magisters Arcane, who are a bit closer to normal mages. Then there are Magisters of Theology. They aren't that good at preaching, but boy do they enjoy a good debate! There are few more interesting commanders as well. Patrol bonus (20) anyone?

In a way, Chelms is the new coming of Golden Era Arcoscephale from the EA.

[Nerfix]

But good sir, does Chelms have flying contraptions?

[Agrajag]

Endoperez said:
*Mother of Monsters*


Someone has been watching too many Hercules re-runs http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Ed Kolis]

Speaking of the MoM, how the heck is she supposed to "give birth" to anything when the lower half of her body is a snake? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Nerfix]

Ed Kolis said:
Speaking of the MoM, how the heck is she supposed to "give birth" to anything when the lower half of her body is a snake? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

As far as I know snakes are perfectly capable of giving birth even if the lower half of their bodies is a snake.

[BigJMoney]

ROFL!!!

[Cainehill]

Technically, I believe snakes lay eggs, which generally isn't considering giving birth.

[Nerfix]

Cainehill said:

Technically, I believe snakes lay eggs, which generally isn't considering giving birth.

True, but some species of snakes (and lizards) hatch the eggs inside of them and that could be seen as giving birth.

[Endoperez]

Cainehill said:

Technically, I believe snakes lay eggs, which generally isn't considering giving birth.



I was going to comment on that and further define that few snake species are also capable of live birth, but it seems there are many snake species that do this:

http://www.szgdocent.org/resource/rr/c-egg.htm wrote:
Do snakes give birth to live young? Some give birth to live young. This minimises the exposure to the elements and predators. All snakes which live in cool climates give birth to live young because laid eggs will not be warm enough to develop properly. Live birth is also common among terrestrial snakes in warmer areas. Tree-dwelling snakes get too heavy carrying eggs and so lay them.

[Nerfix]

See? With a tiny bit of an imagination it is easy to see MoM (...LOL) giving birth. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:But good sir, does Chelms have flying contraptions?


No. They do have Earth and Air magic, though.


Agrajag said:
Endoperez said:*Mother of Monsters*


Someone has been watching too many Hercules re-runs http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



I wouldn't know. Are we are talking about the same Echidna here?

EDIT: I checked Google, and unfortunately, Ekhis is one of the first results in all searches. They even have a picture of her. That's a pity, because I'd have loved to leave someone wondering why I'm talking about small spiky proto-mammals.

g define:echidna
In the most ancient layers of Greek mythology Echidna (ekhis, meaning "she viper") was called the "Mother of All Monsters". Echidna was described by Hesiod (Theogony) as a female monster, who mothered with Typhon every major monster in the entire Greek mythos. Usually considered offspring of Uranus and Gaia, or sometimes Ceto. She had the face of a beautiful woman but the body of a serpent (see also Lamia). ...

[DominionsFan]

JaydedOne said:
*chuckle* Way to tease, Endo. You're doing a great job of keeping us interested. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif




Yeah, thanks for all these infos and screenies Endo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[PDF]

Endoperez said:
A new order of soldiers is being formed. An interesting combination of Hoplites and Hypaspists, or perhaps Peltasts and Hoplites, or perhaps they are something completely new.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/446672-temp.jpg

To answer a question asked elsewhere: their spears have a counter-balance. See, there's metal in both ends of that spear!



Uh, didn't see that, this one is my baby also, I'm very proud ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
I had the idea and put them in my Dom2 ArcoMod to make Arco looks more like Macedonians. Illwinter was nice enough to make the graphics (I'm totally unable to draw anything either buy hand or mouse...).
Now they have been adopted forever ! Thanks IW !

And there is also the Agema Cavalry, same story ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Ballbarian]

offspring of Uranus


Sorry, but it tickled my childish funny bone. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Nerfix]

Endoperez said:No. They do have Earth and Air magic, though.

Then good sir it is not a worthy successor. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[JaydedOne]

It's been too long since the last screenie. I think it's time to resurrect this thread.

T'ien Chi or Caelum would both interest me. Or, heck, more on Bandar Log while we're at it.

[Maltrease]

Caelum please!

[Nerfix]

Show us something from the Raptors...

[Endoperez]

Mmm, chicken... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

It's night in here. Dark outside, too. I took a nap and am awake now, so you'll have your pics before morning here. Probably an hour from this message or less. Late Age, Caelum and/or Tien Chi. Don't expect anything for half an hour, though.

edited for attachment for proper format of a post on the next page.

[Endoperez]

Wow! Return of the Raptors has changed quite a bit since my last venture to the frozen mountains!

All Raptors have mapmove of three. Their Medium Infantry is better than Storm Guards. There are no more Temple Guards. Earthbound are the new sacred warriors.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447936-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

Here are Raven Guards. They might've existed in Dom2 already. There also Iron Crows. They wear only Scale Mail Hauberks, but they have shields.

RotR doesn't have any stealthy leaders apart from the Scouts. I don't know why; it might be that the latest revision broke something.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447938-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

Caelum: RotR also has Earthbound, who are essentially Wingless in tin cans heavier than the plates of Ulm (with reinvigoration and mapmove 2). Anyway, away from the interesting stuff and back to the mechanics:

Shields are good. I'll give you an example.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447944-temp.jpg

The Chakram isn't that good, but an extra 14 damage before the two forces clash should be good, right?

[Endoperez]

For the same money, the only other melee unit you can get is Vanara Infantry.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447946-temp.jpg

The only difference is the Buckler. It's just as if they had two more defense... BUT! It's still just def 11. It's not good. And this isn't normal defense, but a shield, and enemies can just punch through the shield! Effectively, they can overcome the shield with either good attack roll or stat, or high-damage weapon or good strength or lucky roll. Then I tested them. Vanara Infantry survive much, much better than I thought! The buckler, even the buckler, makes a huge difference! I was surprised. It'll take some time to become accustomed to this new shield system. Especially with the new four-handed national summons... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Endoperez]

Here's another Ranged weapon/ Buckler comparison for you.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447926-temp.jpg

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447951-temp.jpg

[BigJMoney]

I predicted bucklers would not be trivial and last time I checked, I don't make foolish assumptions. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif Numbers are everything.

I think it would be nice to see some Ti'en Chi or however you spell them.

=$=

[Nerfix]

RoTR looks very cool!

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:
It's been too long since the last screenie. I think it's time to resurrect this thread.

T'ien Chi or Caelum would both interest me. Or, heck, more on Bandar Log while we're at it.



As we all know, time is relative. For me, who can play Dominions 3 whenever I want, time passes fast, sometimes even too fast. For others, like JaydedOne here, time passes far more slowly. I'm not sure how long, exactly, he waited for an update in this thread. I think it's the most common 24h per 1 beta hour, in which case the 69 hours between Sibylline Caves and his post lasted for over two months! Sorry about that, I was busy playing and forgot how slowly time passes in your position.

Speaking of time, time is a limited resource. It's hard to get, and almost impossible to reverse.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447963-temp.jpg


Which is sometimes a pity. Ancestor Smiths are even better fighters, by the way. 66/50 years old, they have the exact same maluses as the Spirit Masters, but still just as skilled as the best warriors of the barbarian tribes. The best warriors who are possessed by the spirits of the best warriors of the ancestors' time, that is.
They have interesting randoms, by the way, these leaders of the barbarian tribes. Of AENDS, they can get any but the one they already are strong in. That is, Ancestor Smiths have E2 and can't get E3, just as Spirit Masters can't get N3 and Ancestor Guides can't get Death 3.

[Nerfix]

Fascinating.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
RoTR looks very cool!




Nerfix said:
Fascinating.



And you're awake at this time? 0:33 is no time to wait for an erratic poster to post few more pictures of a game you'll have in just a few weeks' time. Begone, Servant of the Sandman! Go back to your master and knock yourself cold! Scamper, lest I release a swarm of ancestors to hunt you down!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447968-temp.jpg

[Wick]

Since we now have so many more national troops who are animals, what is the significance of being one? Aside from the Beast Trainer maybe having animal awe, I can't recall anything.

[Agrajag]

Endoperez said:
Chakram


Someone has been watching too many Xena re-runs http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Nerfix]

Actually, Endo, I was up for other reasons. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/fear.gif

[Nerfix]

I would like to see some national summon. Any nation, any era will do.

[JaydedOne]

Happy 400 posts to the Screenies thread! Yay!

[BigJMoney]

Is there anything groudbreaking going on with the Jotuns or the Vans?

=$=

[Endoperez]

Let's continue with Caelum for a bit. Spentas! Google it. As with almost everything that has to do with Dominions, you'll find interesting stuff.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448151-temp.jpg

[BigJMoney]

Hm, emanations of Ahura Mazda that represent seven holy ideals. Also possibly interpreted as messengers or angels. Knowing Caelum, I'd have to go this route. Are these national summons? Interesting how, even in Zoroastrianism, they are broken up into things like fire, water, earth and plants. That means they will no doubt have a good variety of magical cpabilities if you can "collect all six"

=$=

[Endoperez]

From the highest mountain-tops we go inside the mountains, the the forgotten land of Agartha!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448153-temp.jpg

When Agarthan race started to wither and die, the Golem Crafters were tought how to keep their memory alive.

[Endoperez]

... Unfortunately, the statues broke down. Much of the lore of the Golem Crafters was forgotten, until the Ktonian Necromancers came, and the Agarthans themselves could be reanimated... "as guardians or company".

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448156-temp.jpg

The ancient race, the long-gone, was never forgotten. I find the concept of Agartha touching - it's one of the only races where humans and non-humans live side-by-side, respecting each other, only for the ancient ones to die. Even in death, they are respected, the tombs taken care of, the bodies reanimated to tell of the old times.

[Endoperez]

Also, for once, the humans weren't at fault. Early Age Agartha has few secrets of its own...

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448161-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

Japan has a rich mythology. Use the Google, dude!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448163-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

Here's one more national summon. I'm not giving away the paths and costs and research levels of these spells, to leave you something to wonder about.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448165-temp.jpg


Any other wishes? More summoned creatures, more info about a spesific nation?

[Nerfix]

Endoperez said:
Let's continue with Caelum for a bit. Spentas! Google it. As with almost everything that has to do with Dominions, you'll find interesting stuff.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448151-temp.jpg

Oh my Umor! That's wonderful. &lt;3

Great stuff Endo.

[Nerfix]

AS for requests, hmmm, I wonder what I should ask for. I am interested in seeing an early Agartan mage, or perhaps a Marverni druid.

[JaydedOne]

Trampling toad! Trampling toad! Bwahahaha!

[thejeff]

Can you summon the Umbrals that the Seal Guards guard?

Unique imprisoned gods sound cool!

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
AS for requests, hmmm, I wonder what I should ask for. I am interested in seeing an early Agartan mage, or perhaps a Marverni druid.



Here are two Marverni mages.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448183-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

The random is 100%WESN. The actual Druids specialize in S and E, and have 2x100%WESN and 10%WESN, or unlinked 210%WESN, or however is should be shortened. Druids are also the most powerful of the mediocre priests of Marverni.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448184-temp.jpg

[Nerfix]

Interesting, Maverni doesn't seem very strong magicaly.

[Endoperez]

thejeff said:
Can you summon the Umbrals that the Seal Guards guard?

Unique imprisoned gods sound cool!



Umbrals aren't that special, they are just ethereal, life-draining wraiths of unfamiliar giants. Umbrals are just a by-product of the Seal. The Seal Chamber itself, well... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/firedevil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Nerfix]

I bet it's something like an Olm pretender with D4 locked in there. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[JaydedOne]

Nerfix said:
Interesting, Maverni doesn't seem very strong magicaly.



Indeed. That 1 Astral stargazer with no other special abilities or randoms seems... Well, pretty weak by comparison to most other buys...

[JaydedOne]

Endoperez said:
The Seal Chamber itself, well... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/firedevil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif



You're a bad person, Endoperez. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Nerfix]

JaydedOne said:Indeed. That 1 Astral stargazer with no other special abilities or randoms seems... Well, pretty weak by comparison to most other buys...

He's only 80 gold though.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:Interesting, Maverni doesn't seem very strong magicaly.



Oh, you of poor faith.

[Endoperez]

JaydedOne said:

Endoperez said:
The Seal Chamber itself, well... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/firedevil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif



You're a bad person, Endoperez. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif



This time, I have a very good reason for the confusing ending.

[Nerfix]

Endoperez said:

Nerfix said:Interesting, Maverni doesn't seem very strong magicaly.



Oh, you of poor faith.

Show more then. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:

Endoperez said:

Nerfix said:Interesting, Maverni doesn't seem very strong magicaly.



Oh, you of poor faith.

Show more then. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



I've already shown lots of Marverni. If I showed Druids too, you'd only have the five martial tribes to discover, and what's the fun in that?

[Nerfix]

Show us something else then, like an early or middle Agartan mage. Anything will do Endo, I'm not a picky man.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Show us something else then, like an early or middle Agartan mage. Anything will do Endo, I'm not a picky man.



Okay.

EDIT: I'm in an unimaginative mood. A Marverni Druid is ready for you to see. Happy now?

EDIT2: BTW, the above edit should be read literally. The image has already been posted. It's not my fault if your eyes have built-in spoiler filter.

[Nerfix]

Yes. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

Damn you and your quick fingers!

The image has already been posted. It's not my fault if your eyes have built-in spoiler filter.

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:
Here's one more national summon. I'm not giving away the paths and costs and research levels of these spells, to leave you something to wonder about.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448165-temp.jpg


Any other wishes? More summoned creatures, more info about a spesific nation?



Monster toad. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
This is a funny monster. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[okiN]

Endoperez said:
Here's one more national summon. I'm not giving away the paths and costs and research levels of these spells, to leave you something to wonder about.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448165-temp.jpg


Any other wishes? More summoned creatures, more info about a spesific nation?


Why is it so slow? Shouldn't it be able to leap great distances? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif

As for requests, I'd like to see some more Enigma of Steel, or possibly something interesting relating to LA Man.

[Morkilus]

Endoperez said:
Japan has a rich mythology. Use the Google, dude!




Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle Mod can't be too far behind... any Rat/Nezumi people yet?

[Meglobob]

Endoperez said:
Here's one more national summon. I'm not giving away the paths and costs and research levels of these spells, to leave you something to wonder about.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448165-temp.jpg




Ahh a giant toad. Can it swallow units whole? Remember playing a game where giant toads swallowed my dudes whole. Can't remember the name however.

Hoburgs especially should live in terror. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif

[Daynarr]

Meglobob said:
Ahh a giant toad. Can it swallow units whole? Remember playing a game where giant toads swallowed my dudes whole. Can't remember the name however.

Hoburgs especially should live in terror. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif



Age of Wonders 2?

[Blofeld]

okiN said:

(monster toad)


Why is it so slow? Shouldn't it be able to leap great distances? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif




Toads can't leap IIRC - too weak hind legs. Only frogs can.

[Endoperez]

Congrats to the two people who found the Druid!


No rats, but there are tengu.

I've already shown lots of Enigma of Steel, so I quess it's LA Man. When I saw a new Longbowman for the first time, it was quite a shock! The new look is great!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448320-temp.jpg

[okiN]

I agree - quite stylish. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

More! The mob clamors for more!

[Endoperez]

okiN said:
I agree - quite stylish. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

More! The mob clamors for more!



More what? More archers? More merry men glad in green? More frogs? More time between the updates? Just ask!

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

okiN said:
I agree - quite stylish. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

More! The mob clamors for more!



More what? More archers? More merry men glad in green? More frogs? More time between the updates? Just ask!




Endo, show us some new undead unit[s]. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Agrajag]

Endoperez said:
Kappa


Ninja Turtle!

Show us a size-6 unit please http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

DominionsFan said:Endo, show us some new undead unit[s]. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif



More undead? Hmm... I think the Ancestor Spirits already existed in DomII, so I can't show them. Of the big three, Behemoth is old and you all saw Ziz, and I'd rather leave Leviathan out. I don't want to ruin a surprise so I'm not showing any more of the Unfrozen. Then there are those iron-studded corpses LA Agartha creates. Oh, and that exploding one. Boron might use them in his AAR, though. I don't think Umbrals are labeled as undead, but even if they were Agarthan undead don't seem to be good enough for your mob. I'm not sure which of the C'tis Desert Tombs undead are new... Hey, the Lizard Chariots would all be new, wouldn't they?

Just a moment!

[Endoperez]

Here, a warrior ready to serve his reborn king.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448367-temp.jpg

[okiN]

I enjoy that.

Could you perhaps show us some neat new summonables?

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:
Here, a warrior ready to serve his reborn king.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448367-temp.jpg



Hell yeah! Go my chariots! *in berzerk* http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Nerfix]

Ohhh cool! Argitoth would dig that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Boron]

Nerfix said:
Interesting, Maverni doesn't seem very strong magicaly.


That is only because Endo is such a good teaser/misinformer.
Endo are you sure you never worked for the KGB or CIA? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

In early era there is much powerful stuff, so i am not sure how to rate Maverni, but they are at least not weak.

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/1117/ohnetitel2kopieyf4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

The price is a bit heavy, but he is sacred and he is not capitol only.
And the druid is exactly my taste how a battlemage should be (expect for the weak hp, but you can't have everything http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif).

My favourite random pick would be if he picks an earth and a nature random or two earth randoms. Then i could script him to summon earthpower, eagle eyes, and then 3x gifts from heaven or for the dual earth random summon earthpower and 4x bladewind.

Note that his precision is 12, so 17 with eagle eyes. Gifts from heaven is -3 precision, but that would still be 14 precision http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

I would not want to use SCs versus Maverni http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif.

[Boron]

One more, the imho coolest new national summon:
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/3830/ohnetitel5kopielp1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

He is Mictlan only http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif.
You get the jaguar fiends via 2 spells:
Blood 4
Bind Jaguar Fiends , 2B 2F
Summons 3 Jaguar Fiends for 13 Blood!

Blood 8
Rain of Jaguars, 6B 2F
Summons 14+ Jaguar Fiends for 40 Blood.
Mictlan still has the high priest of the sun, well at least early Mictlan, he is 3B 2F.
So the investment of making 3 blood boosters for him is well worth it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.
Then you save ~ 21 Blood per casting of Rain of Jaguars compared to summoning them with the level 4 spell.

Mictlan is really awesome now. If you liked Mictlan in Dom2, you will loooooooooooooooooooooooove Mictlan in Dom3.

P.S.: Also notice the jaguar fiends faaaaaaaaaast mapmove. This means that you cannot counter them with storm neither since they are faster than cavalry!

[Nerfix]

Neat, but the Ozelolz, er, Ozelotl was already shown. Hmm, does Mictlan have any other national summons than the 'lotl and the Toad?

[coobe]

WOW ! that undead chariot, druid and ozelot look awesome !! if it was possible i would be even more looking forward to dom3 now

[Boron]

Nerfix said:
Neat, but the Ozelolz, er, Ozelotl was already shown. Hmm, does Mictlan have any other national summons than the 'lotl and the Toad?


Jup, at least 5 more.

Conjuration:
Summon Jaguar Toad
Summon Jaguars
Summon Monster Toad
Contact Coatl
Summon Tlaloque

Blood:
Bind Beast Bats
Bind Jaguar Fiends
Contact Civateteo
Bind Tzizimitl
Contact Tlahuelpuchi
Contact Onaqui
Rain of Jaguars

I won't mention any details about these spells or show pictures, i will try to copy Endoperez instead and practice my teasing skills as well http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif.
Some of these other spells are very cool too imho.
I like e.g. the Tzizimitls. Maybe if you beg Endo enough he shows them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif.

Hm ok one little detail i will mention: The blood bats also get freespawned by one Mictlan commander summon http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Neat, but the Ozelolz, er, Ozelotl was already shown. Hmm, does Mictlan have any other national summons than the 'lotl and the Toad?



Yes, monsters and mages from somewhat less monstrous frogs to four unique Tlaloques of the four cardinal directions. They have powers over Water and Blood, and each also knows a bit of the things he rules over, e.g. Death and pestilence.


A Druid image was also attached to my "Oh, you poor of faith." post. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif Some people (probably 4 in total) found it, even though I didn't mention it!


There are lots and lots and lots of new mages who can change shape. From Ghost Cats to Swamp Serpents, through ghost forms of the EA Oni and some really special heroes to Naginis who are better mages in their own form but become stealthy seducers when disguised as Yakshini...

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448387-temp.jpg

He's lucky despite that name: Nahualli have only 10% chance of getting a random.

P.S.
I used Google to check that I a term I used means what I thought it means. This is the first result of the search "define:cardinal directions":
noun - A direction toward or away from either planetary rotation or the planetary poles. Bionian planets only have east and west; trionian planets additionally have north and south; tetronian planets have two more, marp and garp.
tetraspace.alkaline.org/glossary.htm

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif
Seriously, why does that come up first!

[Nerfix]

Mesmerize?

[Nerfix]

Boron said:Hm ok one little detail i will mention: The blood bats also get freespawned by one Mictlan commander summon http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif

Yes, Onaqui domsummons bats. It is in the dev log. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Mesmerize?



Nothing major.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448404-temp.jpg

[Endoperez]

Oh, here's the new game creation screen. It's all defaults. Multiples range from 50 to 300, and there's one new victory point setting, but I don't think there's anything else you wouldn't be familiar with.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448410-temp.jpg

[Nerfix]

Endoperez said:

Nerfix said:
Mesmerize?



Nothing major.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448404-temp.jpg

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/eek.gif

[Agrajag]

Endoperez said:
Oh, here's the new game creation screen. It's all defaults. Multiples range from 50 to 300, and there's one new victory point setting, but I don't think there's anything else you wouldn't be familiar with.


Aren't the defaults different for different ages?

Anyway, cool stuff, thanks again http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Maybe show us a new watery summon?

[Endoperez]

Agrajag said:Aren't the defaults different for different ages?

Anyway, cool stuff, thanks again http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Maybe show us a new watery summon?



Late Age has less magic sites, and Early Age more. It might be directly affected by having different event setting for different ages, or it might be some hard-coded thing having an effect behind the scenes. I haven't really payed attention to that. I can check it if you really want.
There are new Water/Nature and Water/Death summons. The Unfrozen that've been mentioned a lot are a Water/Death summon. There's also another new W/D spell for summoning mages. Quantum Mechani defended the merits of Water (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showthreaded.php?Number=442391) in times you lot have probably forgotten already. If you thought these Naiads were good, you're in for a treat. Quantum also mentioned Streams from Hades... There are Naiads in other rivers as well.

Kokythos.

Cocytus.


Mortals, meet Kokythiai.


http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448467-temp.jpg

[BigJMoney]

What are the different ages of the Jotuns? Is there anything we haven't seen, there?

=$=

[Taqwus]

Hm. Between the trampling Monster Toads, Dreamlands causing commanders to act oddly, and turkeys with a death-gaze, this installment seems to come with even more weirdness than the last. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[JaydedOne]

I am a huge fan of the death-turkeys.

[Taqwus]

Musing... on the 'death turkeys', I'd have to wonder if that's not an Enslave Mind attack. My memory's telling me that the Enslave Mind attack in Dom 2 also showed up as 'death' in the damage section, and mental enslavement would be more consistent with the 'mesmerize' name than obliteration.

[Endoperez]

BigJMoney said:
What are the different ages of the Jotuns? Is there anything we haven't seen, there?



Niefelheim, Iron Woods and Utgård. Different randoms offer a few more options for some of the mages, but nothing major. Few more units, like Jotun Skinshifters for Niefelheim. Nothing major.

[Nerfix]

Did Water get any new combat spells?

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Did Water get any new combat spells?



Some. They are mostly quite spesific. As has often been with Water, there are good low-path spells high in the research tree. Both of these are Water 2, but take a long time to research.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448547-temp.jpg

[DominionsFan]

Quickening looks very interesting. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

Endo could you post about some new death spells? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Nerfix]

Quickening is already in Dom 2. Actually, it was in Dom 1 too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:Quickening is already in Dom 2. Actually, it was in Dom 1 too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif



Actually, this Quickening is totally new spell. There used to be spell of the same name, but it was used to boost mages, not units. This Quickening has bigger AoE, and range.

DominionsFan - Perhaps. I don't remember any new Death spells at the moment, besides some summons I've already mentioned. Would knowing that Ashen Empire can research spells for summoning larger numbers of national undead, like Wailing Ladies, be enough?

[PDF]

I like Arcane bolt http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Please someone put a screen ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Endoperez]

PDF said:
I like Arcane bolt http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Please someone put a screen ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif



http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif Arcane Bolt? What's that? *checkitycheckitycheck*

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif

I like Arcane Bolt too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif I hadn't realized there was a new Level 1 Evocation.

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

DominionsFan - Perhaps. I don't remember any new Death spells at the moment, besides some summons I've already mentioned. Would knowing that Ashen Empire can research spells for summoning larger numbers of national undead, like Wailing Ladies, be enough?



Anything will do it. I am always focusing on death magic [I am playing with Ermor ~10/8 times] in the MP games, so this is why I've asked for some new spells. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Nerfix]

Endoperez said:I like Arcane Bolt too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif I hadn't realized there was a new Level 1 Evocation.

LOL Is It: Magic Missile ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:

Endoperez said:I like Arcane Bolt too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif I hadn't realized there was a new Level 1 Evocation.

LOL Is It: Magic Missile ? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif



No. It's best of the bolt spells, but only works against magical creatures.

[Nerfix]

I see.

So...how about those middle-Agartan mages?

[Ighalli]

I'd like to see any new blood spells that don't involve summoning.

[Endoperez]

Ighalli said:
I'd like to see any new blood spells that don't involve summoning.



Good choice!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448601-temp.jpg

Blood (school) 8,
BBB

[okiN]

Ooh. SCs beware!

[DominionsFan]

Endoperez said:

Ighalli said:
I'd like to see any new blood spells that don't involve summoning.



Good choice!

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/448601-temp.jpg

Blood (school) 8,
BBB



Eh, nice spell. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif

[KissBlade]

Endoperez said:

JaydedOne said:
It's been too long since the last screenie. I think it's time to resurrect this thread.

T'ien Chi or Caelum would both interest me. Or, heck, more on Bandar Log while we're at it.



As we all know, time is relative. For me, who can play Dominions 3 whenever I want, time passes fast, sometimes even too fast. For others, like JaydedOne here, time passes far more slowly. I'm not sure how long, exactly, he waited for an update in this thread. I think it's the most common 24h per 1 beta hour, in which case the 69 hours between Sibylline Caves and his post lasted for over two months! Sorry about that, I was busy playing and forgot how slowly time passes in your position.

Speaking of time, time is a limited resource. It's hard to get, and almost impossible to reverse.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/uploads/447963-temp.jpg


Which is sometimes a pity. Ancestor Smiths are even better fighters, by the way. 66/50 years old, they have the exact same maluses as the Spirit Masters, but still just as skilled as the best warriors of the barbarian tribes. The best warriors who are possessed by the spirits of the best warriors of the ancestors' time, that is.
They have interesting randoms, by the way, these leaders of the barbarian tribes. Of AENDS, they can get any but the one they already are strong in. That is, Ancestor Smiths have E2 and can't get E3, just as Spirit Masters can't get N3 and Ancestor Guides can't get Death 3.



200 gold?! That's the poorest excuse for a mage I've ever seen for that price tag!

[Nerfix]

He's a Late Era mage, he gets 4 magic picks, possibly even 5 if he gets lucky. Doesn't seem that pricy to me. *shrug*

[Endoperez]

KissBlade said:200 gold?! That's the poorest excuse for a mage I've ever seen for that price tag!



All of the Barbarian mages, all 200 gp, give Tien Chi access to a new path. Celestial Masters of LA Tien Chi can only get Nature 2 if they get both their 100% random (AESD) and 10% random (AWSD) in Nature. Celestial Masters can only get Earth 1 with a random, and can't get Death at all. The three Barbarian mages aren't limited to the capital.

LA Tien Chi has 3 paths at level 2 outside capital. One more (Water) 25% of the time via Masters of the Way. The Celestial Masters in the capital always have Water 2 and 55% chance of at least Air 2 or Astral 2. In Late Age, only Mictlan has similar width of magic without randoms, and unlike Mictlan Tien Chi has random paths as well. They are expensive, but I think you can't afford not to buy them as LA Tien Chi.

EDIT:
Spirit Masters have one 100% random, which can't be Nature. They have 25% change of getting D2, and 75% change of getting first level in some path Tien Chi has easier access to. That makes them somewhat weaker than most Dom2 mages, and more expensive.

[Nerfix]

Speaking of Master of the Way and Initiates of the Deep, have they changed or did they get nerfed to oblivion with the change to Quickness?

[ioticus]

The more I think about quickness not helping spell casters the more I dislike it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[Daynarr]

You will get used to it as soon as you start playing.

[JaydedOne]

ioticus said:
The more I think about quickness not helping spell casters the more I dislike it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif



Disagree entirely. Quickness in Dom2 was too good, much as Haste in D&amp;D 3.0 was too good. A spell should never be a no-brainer. Quickness for Mages was. It was -always- among the first things I researched in Dom2 if I was using a mage-heavy strategy as doubling a mage's efficiency early in a battle could be huge. Yes, you'd rack up fatigue, but if that meant inflicting such heavy casualties early on that you routed the opponent's units before taking much damage on your own end, the fatigue was well worth it.

Now Quickness isn't a no-brainer. It retains utility without being a must-have. Personally, I prefer it that way. If the utility is too low, perhaps it can be boosted a bit, but doubling spellcasting rate was too good.

[Nerfix]

Well, I'm just afraid that 1 Water mages that are in Atlantis and TC are utterly useless now.

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Well, I'm just afraid that 1 Water mages that are in Atlantis and TC are utterly useless now.



Like E1 crafters of LA Caelum and F1 initiates of Marignon and the cheap Nature independent mages and lots of other cheap mages?
E1 gives some basic protection spells for the caster, Flying Shards, few weak spells and the basic bread and butter of magic items.
F1 gives Fire Darts, few items later in the game (Lightless Lanterns or something) and few nice spells (Blindness, Will'O'Wisps)
N1 gives Vinemen, Tangle Vines and Vine Arrow, Maggots, and Endless Vineskins.

W1 gives Slime, more things underwater thanks to Water Power, some nice items (Water Bracelet, Boots of Quickness are still good, anti-demon items, items for water-breathing), and Frozen Heart.

All the elements get Lesser Elementals as well.


The stakes are now even. If W1 casters were powerful before, then something was wrong.

[Nerfix]

Thing is, Marignon doesn't get only Initiates out of their capital. Tien on the other hand...

And E1 gives quite possibly the best trinkets in the game.

[Wick]

KissBlade said:200 gold?! That's the poorest excuse for a mage I've ever seen for that price tag!



You didn't see the screenshot of the Warrior Smith, did you? 170g for 2.5 points of magic!

[Endoperez]

Nerfix said:
Thing is, Marignon doesn't get only Initiates out of their capital. Tien on the other hand...

And E1 gives quite possibly the best trinkets in the game.



Trinkets are still just trinkets.

A nation only being able to recruit one one-path mage outside of its capital doesn't mean that one path is weak. It means that that nation cannot field as many skilled mages as other nations. It has nothing to do with the power of Water.

I think you just haven't realized how much gold is available.

[Nerfix]

So are you saying that having a one-path mage as the only recruitable mage outside of capital isn't a cripling disadvantage? Especially since the Quickness-FH combo is no longer avaitable.

[quantum_mechani]

Nerfix said:
So are you saying that having a one-path mage as the only recruitable mage outside of capital isn't a cripling disadvantage? Especially since the Quickness-FH combo is no longer avaitable.

There is no nation I know of with only 1 path mages outside the capital in dom3. Also, consider that this was the case for Man in dom2 and yet they were not considered incredibly weak.

[Nerfix]

Not even Tien? It's all good then.

[DominionsFan]

JaydedOne said:

ioticus said:
The more I think about quickness not helping spell casters the more I dislike it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif



Disagree entirely. Quickness in Dom2 was too good



I agree with JaydedOne also.

[curtadams]

KissBlade said:
200 gold?! That's the poorest excuse for a mage I've ever seen for that price tag!



Look at the combat stats. 12 HP. 10 Armor. 15 Morale. 15 MR. That's pretty tough for a recruitable mages. Plus he's a priest.

[Endoperez]

curtadams said:

KissBlade said:
200 gold?! That's the poorest excuse for a mage I've ever seen for that price tag!



Look at the combat stats. 12 HP. 10 Armor. 15 Morale. 15 MR. That's pretty tough for a recruitable mages. Plus he's a priest.



15 hp, 13 att and 13 def before old age, and a magical sword with pretty good stats but no actual powers. Unfortunately, they're still too old and weak and expensive to use as thugs. Others of the 200 gp barbarian mages occassionally suffer from much less old age; they could be thugs. Spirit Masters survive stray arrows better, but 200 gp would still be a streep price to pay for such a mage. IMHO, it works out in Late Age with more gold around and thanks to the versatility of the three mages.

[Ighalli]

Thanks for the awesome blood spell!

Can you show an age-reducing spell from a school other than blood?

[KissBlade]

curtadams said:

KissBlade said:
200 gold?! That's the poorest excuse for a mage I've ever seen for that price tag!



Look at the combat stats. 12 HP. 10 Armor. 15 Morale. 15 MR. That's pretty tough for a recruitable mages. Plus he's a priest.



If it's the armor and hp I'm paying for, you can keep it. Heck I'd rather take 9 p and zero armor of the old for a price cut. Compared to the Argatha Necros I saw earlier, these guys are seriously lame in the battlemage department. I guess their only hope is what? Nether darts?

[Endoperez]

KissBlade said:If it's the armor and hp I'm paying for, you can keep it. Heck I'd rather take 9 p and zero armor of the old for a price cut. Compared to the Argatha Necros I saw earlier, these guys are seriously lame in the battlemage department. I guess their only hope is what? Nether darts?



Oh, of course these aren't battlemages! Tien Chi also has Earth and Death based ancestral barbarian mages, and Celestial Masters.
Also, LA Agartha has access to: Earth 2 (3), Fire 1 (2), Death 2(3), Astral 0 (1).
LA Tien Chi has access to E2, D2, N2, W2(3), S1(2), A1(2).

The numbers in parentheses is the best level a mage can reach with a 100% random. In theory, 10% randoms might increase these further, but you can't count on them. There are N1 tribal mages and druids in the wild, and S1 sages, but anything besides that will be hard to get.